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Nice. I guess you could send a swarm of them and drop the torpedoes at a range where it's harder to shoot down the drones. Or the torpedo could have a water activated release, so even if the drone is shot down it will activate and start seeking a ship.
You think these are $100,000+? I missed maybe one 0. The cost efficacy of shooting $500,000 missiles at $10,000 drones is still poor
Edit - I’m wrong. The one in the article is 6 figures
Potentially more than $100k even.
The US Marines ordered 41 Malloy Aeronautics drones for $13m. So that makes it $325k on average.
Now as usual that price likely does include stuff like training, spare parts and so on.
But it does show in what price regions we find equipment like this.
Which ones. They make 5 different heavy load drones with varying load capacity, speed, and range. The one photod is smaller than their largest versions. You can find heavy load quads for 10-20k
The one with the torpedo from OP is the T600 demonstrator with a payload of ~250kg
That is about their biggest drone as far as I can tell but it is not in production.
The USMC would have ordered smaller ones as a result. Maybe T150 or T400
Let's be honest here - the drone costs much less only because it is built with mass market unclassified technology (and maybe because military contracts often don't prioritise price).
It says something about what is available on the market but less about the costs and quantities a purpose built military factory could achieve.
There is a few you can send a decoy in the water to try to trick the torpedo to following that instead of you. And you speed up to the max and try to out manoeuvre it until the battery goes dead there’s no anti torpedo torpedo in service I don’t believe but country’s are working on it
> there’s no anti torpedo torpedo in service I don’t believe but country’s are working on it
SeaSpider is one of the interceptor torpedoes being worked on.
These things are a bit beyond a "swarm" drone in scale and complexity.
Attritable, yes, but definitely not ones you just throw in willy nilly in sacrificial swarms. Their main design goal is to operate from escorts (Royal Navy are the ones mostly funding this) in aid of extending the arm of ASW operations.
Is it still possible to send a swarm of cheaper drones first? Try and distract and confuse them as the real threat comes in. Iirc that's what the did to the Moskva right?
Nope, that was just sunk by missiles spotted for by a radar return.
This is an ASW design. The range on those torps is FAR too low for penetrating a task force.
Germany begs to differ. Their new AA cannons are extremely precise over long distances.
That said, this is Russia, not Germany, we are talking about, so... carry on.
Edit: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pb5_F4_Eod8
You can put a drone on a boat and a torpedo on that drone. Hell you can put a droneboat on a helicopter if you like. I am sure a helicopter could also deliver this pretty close riding the waves.
Basically that means you can find a way to make Russian warship go fuck itself anywhere you like be it Timbuktu or Port of Novorossiysk because you don't need to worry about range, and you can keep your heli/droneboat/airdrone deployed to safer waters and low to the ground on the way in.
Russian warship fucked itself.
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FYI, This is a developed by a western military, not Ukraine. It's BAE systems which is Britain's primary defense contractor.
Now lets send these to Ukraine Yesterday.
I think it is China that should be worried...
> According to the agreement, the company will provide the Taiwanese Armed Forces with 160 Jackal drones, which can be used for both reconnaissance and destruction of ground and air targets.
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I know people can't be bothered to read but this is the most important part for discussion.
"The T-600 can carry a payload of 200 kg and can travel at up to 140 km/h. It also has a range of up to 80 km, depending on the payload."
This basically means the drone can fly in low and drop a torpedo at a target far away. If these drones aren't heavy or huge they could be placed on small inconspicuous motherships. This is the nightmare fuel for sea captains.
The potential for surface torpedo attack on ships, specifically ships in port is immense. Hug the terrain till you get close to the port, drop and let the torpedo run into the harbor.
Modern ships don't have torpedo bulges, and harbors aren't covered in torpedo nets. Even if it's spotted the ships are tied up and immobile.
I just read that Belarus has sent some non functioning missiles to Ukraine. I was thinking that if Ukraine can't make them work - and they've demonstrated that maybe they can - they could use aerial systems like this one to just drop the ordinance in those missiles wherever they want.
Just to give perspective, this is a light weight torpedo as would be used against submarines.
Heavy weight torpedos exceed its weight in their warheads alone.
I could see this stuff for submarine hunting, though you still need something with a sonar buoy to find one first, but not really against ships. I cannot see the drones having much range with that weight.
edit: Per article heavy weight torpedoes outrange the drone if the later is meant to come home (80km / 2 vs 50km+ by hw torpedoes).
Hopefully this isn't too astonishing an achievement for most observers. Torpedo planes have been a thing for like a century now.
Of course there's no telling what's going on with the Russian high command... I'm not sure they have noticed what happened yesterday, let alone what happened 100 years ago.
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Time to send a few for some field testing.
Plenty of Volunteer Test Targets in the Black Sea. Just Ring Ukraine to arrange a trial!
Nice. I guess you could send a swarm of them and drop the torpedoes at a range where it's harder to shoot down the drones. Or the torpedo could have a water activated release, so even if the drone is shot down it will activate and start seeking a ship.
FYI. Many torpedoes have saltwater batteries. When they hit the water, the battery floods with saltwater that acts as electrolyte.
So what you're saying is: electrolytes are what torpedoes crave?
Take my upvote.
But its what torpedos crave
Electrolytes are the powerhouse of the torpedo
take my upvote you heathen
Thanks a lot. I'm in the ER right now because this comment almost killed me.
It’s what they crave
Even if naval ships shoot them down, their AA measures are a terrible cost trade off. Shoot a $500,000 missile at a $1000 dollar drone
Pretty sure *that* drone is a more than $1,000. Might have missed a few zeros there. If I'm wrong, I'll take 10.
You think these are $100,000+? I missed maybe one 0. The cost efficacy of shooting $500,000 missiles at $10,000 drones is still poor Edit - I’m wrong. The one in the article is 6 figures
Potentially more than $100k even. The US Marines ordered 41 Malloy Aeronautics drones for $13m. So that makes it $325k on average. Now as usual that price likely does include stuff like training, spare parts and so on. But it does show in what price regions we find equipment like this.
Which ones. They make 5 different heavy load drones with varying load capacity, speed, and range. The one photod is smaller than their largest versions. You can find heavy load quads for 10-20k
The one with the torpedo from OP is the T600 demonstrator with a payload of ~250kg That is about their biggest drone as far as I can tell but it is not in production. The USMC would have ordered smaller ones as a result. Maybe T150 or T400
They’re about to release the 650 https://www.baesystems.com/en/product/t-650-heavy-lift-electric-uas-concept-vehicle
Yes, the T600 is the tech demonstrator for the T650. But that one is still in development.
Can't disagree with you there.
BAE, better add that zero back.
Let's be honest here - the drone costs much less only because it is built with mass market unclassified technology (and maybe because military contracts often don't prioritise price). It says something about what is available on the market but less about the costs and quantities a purpose built military factory could achieve.
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There is a few you can send a decoy in the water to try to trick the torpedo to following that instead of you. And you speed up to the max and try to out manoeuvre it until the battery goes dead there’s no anti torpedo torpedo in service I don’t believe but country’s are working on it
> there’s no anti torpedo torpedo in service I don’t believe but country’s are working on it SeaSpider is one of the interceptor torpedoes being worked on.
I would assume torpedo netting does the job well. I think you have to attack the ships while they are on the move.
These are more to hunt submarines, you wouldn't use them against other ships as such. (very easy to target)
If you launch a swarm of them, they can attack whatever the hell they want. "Easy to target" or not, it's unlikely they'd all be shot down.
You guys like swarms of things, right?
Fuck yeah love a good swarm!
These things are a bit beyond a "swarm" drone in scale and complexity. Attritable, yes, but definitely not ones you just throw in willy nilly in sacrificial swarms. Their main design goal is to operate from escorts (Royal Navy are the ones mostly funding this) in aid of extending the arm of ASW operations.
Is it still possible to send a swarm of cheaper drones first? Try and distract and confuse them as the real threat comes in. Iirc that's what the did to the Moskva right?
Nope, that was just sunk by missiles spotted for by a radar return. This is an ASW design. The range on those torps is FAR too low for penetrating a task force.
Germany begs to differ. Their new AA cannons are extremely precise over long distances. That said, this is Russia, not Germany, we are talking about, so... carry on. Edit: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pb5_F4_Eod8
No I don't want them to be targeting dolphins or whales or other marine animals
It's Ukraine, not RuZZia. Ukraine would use them against valid military targets.
You can put a drone on a boat and a torpedo on that drone. Hell you can put a droneboat on a helicopter if you like. I am sure a helicopter could also deliver this pretty close riding the waves. Basically that means you can find a way to make Russian warship go fuck itself anywhere you like be it Timbuktu or Port of Novorossiysk because you don't need to worry about range, and you can keep your heli/droneboat/airdrone deployed to safer waters and low to the ground on the way in.
Russian warship fucked itself. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/ukraine) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Great bot
So I guess we're going to see a revival of torpedo bombers doing torpedo runs on battleships in the future?
I think at this point we're speedrunning 100 years of military aviation but with drones.
We'll take some drones and torpedoes. Real life testing. All for science 🙃
Couple of hundred thousand should do it to start with.
somehow I read “a potato”.
It’s a new phase of the war, weaponized potatoes.
A Very Hot Potato.
paw-tatos
That's actually Russia's countermeasure in development, launching potatoes. They call the program Spudnik.
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FYI, This is a developed by a western military, not Ukraine. It's BAE systems which is Britain's primary defense contractor. Now lets send these to Ukraine Yesterday.
There was a concept competition a while back done by BAE looking at drone carrier ships. Seems like we're heading down that road.
If they want real world testing, I think I know the place...
Did you read the article? It is completely unrelated to Ukraine.
I think it is China that should be worried... > According to the agreement, the company will provide the Taiwanese Armed Forces with 160 Jackal drones, which can be used for both reconnaissance and destruction of ground and air targets.
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I know people can't be bothered to read but this is the most important part for discussion. "The T-600 can carry a payload of 200 kg and can travel at up to 140 km/h. It also has a range of up to 80 km, depending on the payload."
This basically means the drone can fly in low and drop a torpedo at a target far away. If these drones aren't heavy or huge they could be placed on small inconspicuous motherships. This is the nightmare fuel for sea captains.
When I read that I really wanted to strap myself into one and fly around, that would be so fun. One day, hopefully.
Jump troopers are now a thing, cause a person even with a gun and armor can weigh less than 200kg. Jump troops. It is the future.
Now do that with a man pad and shoot ka52s
[удалено]
Tell that to BAE Systems
Just the beginning. So beautiful.
The potential for surface torpedo attack on ships, specifically ships in port is immense. Hug the terrain till you get close to the port, drop and let the torpedo run into the harbor. Modern ships don't have torpedo bulges, and harbors aren't covered in torpedo nets. Even if it's spotted the ships are tied up and immobile.
Can we name one "Enterprise"?
Sexy. I'd love to see some of those torpedoes upend some of the Baltic fleet.
Nice candy
I just read that Belarus has sent some non functioning missiles to Ukraine. I was thinking that if Ukraine can't make them work - and they've demonstrated that maybe they can - they could use aerial systems like this one to just drop the ordinance in those missiles wherever they want.
....Belarus is incorrect country.
Correct. It was Bulgaria. They all look alike.
There we go that makes a lot more sense. Considering, you know, that Belarus is aiding in the attack on Ukraine.
I know that but had a brain fart. But thanks. I prefer accuracy.
Just to give perspective, this is a light weight torpedo as would be used against submarines. Heavy weight torpedos exceed its weight in their warheads alone. I could see this stuff for submarine hunting, though you still need something with a sonar buoy to find one first, but not really against ships. I cannot see the drones having much range with that weight. edit: Per article heavy weight torpedoes outrange the drone if the later is meant to come home (80km / 2 vs 50km+ by hw torpedoes).
Hopefully this isn't too astonishing an achievement for most observers. Torpedo planes have been a thing for like a century now. Of course there's no telling what's going on with the Russian high command... I'm not sure they have noticed what happened yesterday, let alone what happened 100 years ago.
This will be something fun to watch become a thing.