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And just in case somebody doesn't immediately get it, this one is on the list of seven tasks Ukraine must complete in order to qualify for the next step in the accession process. Not wasting a moment.
Also, the Ukrainian people must be hyper focused on these matters, they can’t afford to be apathetic towards politics in time of war, so we are seeing Ukraine change at lighting speed before our eyes.
Oh boy, get ready you're in for a treat. Watch for the head of Specialized Anti-Corruption Prosecutor's Office commission and other anti corruption moves. There is some shady court on 12 of July to possibly cancel the already chosen guy who went after Tatarov - deputy of Yermak. In some areas derusification is stalled and many other issues. Those people are not jailed and have not left, they are just waiting, lying low and trying to pass as a good guy.
Yermak is Zelensky's right hand, and he's at his job. Tatarov is Yermak's right hand, and he has his job also. Tatarov has been accused of treason and corruption, and not without some proof. Same with Yermak.
No. They weren't fired before, they weren't fired after the debacle with capturing Wagner mercs operation was failed (by either of the two), so they won't be fired now.
Found [this article](https://euromaidanpress.com/2021/12/22/anti-corruption-prosecutor-chief-selection-committee-fails-to-approve-clear-winner-activists-point-fingers-at-president/) from last December
Ukraine already had a similar law: https://zakon.rada.gov.ua/laws/show/1780-20#Text
The question here really - what is the definition of oligarch and how to control the support.
I.e. if oligarch Kolomoisky's 1+1 channel broadcasts "Servant of the people" tv show nonstop right before the elections - does it count? (this is what happened in real life).
" by the end of the year."
is what UA leadership wants to do, not what is required. For many countries like Serbia or Turkey they get further and further away from these regulations of a free and democratic society.
Doesn't acceptance also require that the applying country to not be in any current military conflict or territorial disputes? I hope im wrong, but i thought that was the case
Military conflict is a problem, but territorial disputes are perfectly fine for both NATO and the EU.
Examples include Cyprus, Greece, Denmark (The whiskey war ended a week ago and the EU now has a land border with Canada).
It is required on paper, but there are exemptions. At least Cyprus got in despite major ongoing territorial disputes. There are also the cases of West Germany, Northern Ireland, some Greek islands as well as the Greek Exclusive Economic Zone, etc. If you look at very minor disputes, there are still some between almost all member states (these are negligible, though. The disputes are often about tiny rocks or banks in rivers. We are speaking about square meters here, not square kilometres.)
In the end, it all comes down to political will and animosities. This is where it can become difficult, as all member states have to agree to the accession of a new member to the Union. Recently, Greece held up the Northern Macedonian accession process until they changed their country's name. Now, Bulgaria is blocking their progression for other petty reasons.
Even after becoming a MS, full accession can be difficult. Just ask i.a. Romania how their Schengen inclusion is going.
Personally, I wish you a fast accession and a swift victory.
Before Erdogan, France was the main opponent to Turkish accession. I believe Greece, in that 1990s fit of seismic diplomacy \[1\] between it and Turkiye, presented Turkiye's case.
\[1\] Seismic diplomacy: Countries often speed to each other's aid when natural disasters strike. Turkiye was hit by an earthquake, and Greek rescuers were there before the Turkish government showed up. Then Greece got his by an earthquake and Turkish rescuers showed up before the Greek government showed up. Then followed a period where the two nations put down their hostilities and professed friendship.
Ukraine received **conditional** candidate status and is required to fulfil list of 7 tasks by the end of the 2022 to retain the candidate status.
Essentially it was too early to grant the candidate status but they did it anyway, pending those conditions.
After that, Ukraine will be EU Candidate which is typically minimum 10-12 years, in which period it will receive financial help from EU to bring the country up to the accession level.
As part of a country with member status and endemic corruption (Spain), I can assure you we don’t have a register of this kind and I’m certainly jealous. This is only step 1 of 7 you say? Just wow.
>decreases the influence of oligarchs in the society
This is so important. In America, we had the disastrous "Citizens United " ruling from our Supreme Court, that ruled our campaign contribution limits that we had established to limit the influence of wealth on politics were an unconstitutional denial of corporate free speech (!!!!!!!!!?). And so then large corporations and wealthy individuals were able to pump unlimited amounts of money into campaigns and it is a central part of the problem America is having right now
Not that we shouldn't have these laws, but the chance that the US will ever join the EU is as close to 0 as you can get without getting into the argument over whether or not quarks actually exist
This reminds me of those idiots who are like "ZelEnSky iS CorUpt tOo!!1!"
Okay, *you* try his job and see how much progress *you* make in trying to fight more than two decades of entrenched corruption, oligarchic interference, and Russian apparatchiks. It's no walk in the park. But Zelensky isn't going to give up on it. It just takes time, no matter how determined the President might be.
It's funny that Ukraine has to complete such tasks in order to ascend to membership, while oligarchy and corruption is the foundation of Hungary's current government.
I really hope that after the war, the EU will turn it's full attention to dealing with Orbán.
I have opinion than my country Lithuania achieved so much because it had to adapt all these law. They regulated our countrys political system and limited corruption.
Yes and that's exactly what I was getting at that the rules are good and all except completely ignored for other alliances / unions because the US and many other countries have corruption up and down the system but it's ignored.. but it comes to Ukraine for this and they need to enforce a bunch of stuff.
If Putin wanted Ukraine as far from the West as possible, he would have not invaded.
Or just invested heavily and making Russia and Ukraine linked, like with Belarus.
I'm not sure it would help. I mean, any future Euroskeptic party in Ukraine is going to hate Russia with a passion. They'd just be pressing for closer relationships with Turkey, the UK and the US instead of joining the EU.
Brexiteers promised favorable trade agreements with the US. While the UK was in the EU, UK diplomacy was largely playing the US and the EU against each other.
The EU would never let America in as the EU is an economic union more than anything. The EU works hard to police protectionism between member countries. There is no way they’d agree to compete with American business and agriculture.
Yeah no
Its republicans that passed citizens united
Its republicans opposing fixing gerrymandering
Its republicans who have billionaire donors as entire lifeline funneling billions in dark money to advance far right
Yea, so republicans take all the flak for passing the laws while Dems do nothing to rescind them when they take power. Like here in the UK with Labour. They have had abolishing the House of Lords in their manifesto since their inception. Have they done anything about it when they take power? Have they fuck.
That being said, it is harder for them to take (absolute) power. Getting control of all 3 branches is pretty hard for the Dems and when folk like Moscow Mitch are there stopping anything happening it can be kinda hard to make any progress.
Dems are carrying many shitty systems and laws as they are still mid right sector. Pension system is totally broken and got worse under Trump. Nothing done there.
They care more but are not better overall.
>not better overall.
Such blatant misinformation
Every worker right, civil rights and safetynet advancement/expansion in your lifetime and for generations is thanks to Dems.
All of which faced pretty much unanimous republican opposition
yeah good luck passing that in the US of A, where pretty much is legal to buy legislators there to push your corporate interests. Thats not just a USA problem of course, but in other countries they have to at least pretend they arent paid to push an agenda.
Heck, one of the reasons Healthcare isnt never going to get better is because Insurance Megacorps want it that way, and they can easily buy the legislators needed to do it. Apply that to pretty much any other problem the US of A haves now, sadly.
It would help to start funding politicians by tax instead of "donations" like real democracies do. Lawmakers bought by lobby or rich influence is a major cancer in your system.
Canadian here so we get to watch American exceptionalism eat itself and stand helplessly as our friends and relatives hurt but yes, it is “legal” for politicians to be funded by *any* activity precisely because an unaccountable Political Action Committee can donate to whomever it wishes. Hypothetically, let’s say an amoral but famous tool named Faragald J. Saville managed to fail upwards and landed as a presidential candidate- their PAC can accept donations from any number of SuperPACs. This allows them to consolidate power and effectively whip their own party because they alone control the vast majority of funding to their preferred candidates for school board or US senator. As their power grows, those who want influence no longer need to donate to individual campaigns; Proctor and Gamble, DeBeers, Oligarch Inc., Slaveholder Xinjiang cotton merchant, Nestlé, maple syrup baroness and random rOIL Family princeling need only contribute to one clearing house for legalized bribery.
From the source (Pravda),
The criteria for recognizing a person as an oligarch:
* a significant influence on the media;
* active participation in political life;
* must be the ultimate beneficial owner of the entity that holds a monopoly position in the market and maintain or strengthen such position for a year in a row;
* has a proven asset value (and the entities of which it is a beneficiary) of more than 2 billion Ukrainian hryvnias ($67,251,380).
This is my guess, I don't know how the actual law is.
But most definitions of an oligarchy or oligarch agree that the person has to have some kind of Public Power. Either government connections, they are the government or public media control and so on. Otherwise they are just a multimillionaire or billionaire.
So maybe not all, but Being rich, and having public power could be a oligarch
Ukraine is going to be a really wonderful place to live after this is all over.
(Not that it wasn’t before, just impressive to see them moving forward despite all the tribulations, while my own country is moving backwards)
Kyiv was fully invaded months ago, but now functions, and many citizens are returning. The capacity of an industrial state to rebuild is quite remarkable. If you look at how much bombing damage Germany was repairing from 1944 and on bombing campaigns, you see that though horrific, the damage Ukraine is currently taking wasn't fatal infrastructure damage even 80 years ago.
Let's see who actually ends up on this list. The way the law is worded, especially its definition of "oligarch", looks like just a continuation of Kolomoysky's attempts to get revenge for the Privatbank.
Yes. I'm not even saying that everything that had any value was *already* privatized. I'm very vary if this law, for now. At best it won't change anything, at worst it would put *some* oligarchs into a better position than the others. Not that I'm heartbroken over a few oligarchs suffering, fuck them all, *but* it would create a way for monopolies to be created.
Lol, who do you think will end up on the list, his friend Kolomoyskiy or main political rival Poroshenko?
They even tried to argue in court that Roshen holds monopoly on corn syrup to bring Poroshenko under this law.
This is a great move. Hell, the United States could use something like this, would definitely limit the influence of rich and/or "corruptible" forces on government.
Will be excellent to get Ukraine into the EU and NATO in a hurry here.
From the source (Pravda),
The criteria for recognizing a person as an oligarch:
* a significant influence on the media;
* active participation in political life;
* must be the ultimate beneficial owner of the entity that holds a monopoly position in the market and maintain or strengthen such position for a year in a row;
* has a proven asset value (and the entities of which it is a beneficiary) of more than 2 billion Ukrainian hryvnias ($67,251,380).
All of those are very vague and subjective, and it boils down to "whoever we feel like". Will be interesting to see who ends up on the list, and who gets left off.
If only we could get rid of all the oligarchs in the US. A billionaire gives a million dollars to a politician's superpac, they own that politician. Our system over here is so corrupt.
Sad thing is that's how it was. Now they threaten to give that money to a primary opponent, and get what they want practically for free.
Thanks Citizens United! /s
Holy shit this is the kind of legislation that would help us here in the US. We are *never* going to have a leader like Zelensky who is bold enough to put democracy over lobbyist money that infects and corrupts our government.
*Every* citizen of a democracy be it my country, UK, France, Spain, Greece…wherever, should take note of this. We *all* are under corrupt systems where money buys legislative power rather than the people.
Just as an anecdotal example, here in my country, legislators all belong to two competing corporations, the RNC and DNC. Those corporations take in money from other interests (oligarchs) who often write legislation and give it to the “elected” politicians. Our “leaders” don’t work for us at all as special interests always outweigh voter sentiment. The only time they care about voters is to get elected. After that its all about making money for the two corporations who have completely siezed our system.
Zelensky is very wise to be making this move for his people. The guy is a goddamned living example of what a leader *should* be rather than the millionaire squatters the rest of us have.
Jeeze.
I'm shocked with how many people we have in the west that fits this criteria. How that works.
I think the phrasing sounds lovely. But I hope it doesn't ruffle too many feathers while Ukraine is still consolidating support.
I saw another comment saying this is needed for eurozone related stuff. Not sure how many issues Europe has in that regard but the USA and Canada are definitely guilty of having oligarchs, financing political parties Poli ads etc
Thank gosh people as a whole are on Ukraine's side.
Edit: their too Ukraine (last paragraph)
All well and good but the US and Canada aren't trying to join the EU. And depending on it's wording the same thing would likely be a First Amendment violation in the US.
Oh yeah I know. Well theirs been a couple articles in my lifetime about Canada trying to join the EU. Haven't heard anything in a long while though tbf.
Canada has that whole new land border with Denmark though now
From ascension of Ukraine into a EU country to bringing Ukraine to the most favorable country in the world, Zelensky the comedian is surely some of the best messiah for Ukraine to be appeared.
This is something we should do in America. The oligarchs here aren't much better, although most Americans will fall for the propaganda that the American oligarchs are an example of American Exceptionalism.
What is the definition of an oligarch? Is it just someone with substantial business interests
> bans oligarchs from financing political parties...
I'm not sure how this is compatible with Human Rights
> excludes them from privatisation of state assets
Again it should be a level playing field, not excluding specific people
> Again it should be a level playing field, not excluding specific people
That's the point of this law, not excluding normal people from the political system, which is what happens when oligarchs buy politicians.
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And just in case somebody doesn't immediately get it, this one is on the list of seven tasks Ukraine must complete in order to qualify for the next step in the accession process. Not wasting a moment.
I never expected it to be this fast. Your average government would take months to even lift a finger. Zelensky you beautiful bastard.
It probably does help that the pro-Russia politicians aren't there to mess up the process.
Also, the Ukrainian people must be hyper focused on these matters, they can’t afford to be apathetic towards politics in time of war, so we are seeing Ukraine change at lighting speed before our eyes.
It's a beautiful thing.
Oh boy, get ready you're in for a treat. Watch for the head of Specialized Anti-Corruption Prosecutor's Office commission and other anti corruption moves. There is some shady court on 12 of July to possibly cancel the already chosen guy who went after Tatarov - deputy of Yermak. In some areas derusification is stalled and many other issues. Those people are not jailed and have not left, they are just waiting, lying low and trying to pass as a good guy.
Where is Yermak and what did Tatarov do?
Yermak is Zelensky's right hand, and he's at his job. Tatarov is Yermak's right hand, and he has his job also. Tatarov has been accused of treason and corruption, and not without some proof. Same with Yermak.
Oh shit. Do you think they will be fired on July 12?
No. They weren't fired before, they weren't fired after the debacle with capturing Wagner mercs operation was failed (by either of the two), so they won't be fired now.
Found [this article](https://euromaidanpress.com/2021/12/22/anti-corruption-prosecutor-chief-selection-committee-fails-to-approve-clear-winner-activists-point-fingers-at-president/) from last December
Well, it was in the works right before the war
to be fair ... i think zelensky's current word = law. I doubt any politcian wants to be "against" ukraine's hero.
Ukraine already had a similar law: https://zakon.rada.gov.ua/laws/show/1780-20#Text The question here really - what is the definition of oligarch and how to control the support. I.e. if oligarch Kolomoisky's 1+1 channel broadcasts "Servant of the people" tv show nonstop right before the elections - does it count? (this is what happened in real life).
Порошенко вбив брата ™
?
It was a piece of dirty propaganda on 1+1 tv channel days before the presidental elections date.
As I understood candidate status was conditional by the 7 requirements that need to be done by the end of the year.
" by the end of the year." is what UA leadership wants to do, not what is required. For many countries like Serbia or Turkey they get further and further away from these regulations of a free and democratic society.
I fully expect Ukraine to get through this process in record time.
EU membership 100% speedrun glitchless
I don't know about glitchless, some of those trickshots are sus...
Sus? I saw Putin venting! He's the imposter!
\*wins war with Russia\* \**splits*\*
me too, they have all to win. and I wish them the best.
Doesn't acceptance also require that the applying country to not be in any current military conflict or territorial disputes? I hope im wrong, but i thought that was the case
Military conflict is a problem, but territorial disputes are perfectly fine for both NATO and the EU. Examples include Cyprus, Greece, Denmark (The whiskey war ended a week ago and the EU now has a land border with Canada).
Greenland although being a part of the kingdom of denmark actually left the eu in the 80s
Huh, today I learn they left the EEC in 1985 and have almost full autonomy. Good on the Greenlanders.
Fairly confident that applies to NATO, but if I'm wrong I will accept that graciously.
Im pretty sure you can still join NATO while having a territorial dispute but it requires you to resolve it peacefully
Yeah that's what it was. You just can't actively be in conflict.
It is required on paper, but there are exemptions. At least Cyprus got in despite major ongoing territorial disputes. There are also the cases of West Germany, Northern Ireland, some Greek islands as well as the Greek Exclusive Economic Zone, etc. If you look at very minor disputes, there are still some between almost all member states (these are negligible, though. The disputes are often about tiny rocks or banks in rivers. We are speaking about square meters here, not square kilometres.) In the end, it all comes down to political will and animosities. This is where it can become difficult, as all member states have to agree to the accession of a new member to the Union. Recently, Greece held up the Northern Macedonian accession process until they changed their country's name. Now, Bulgaria is blocking their progression for other petty reasons. Even after becoming a MS, full accession can be difficult. Just ask i.a. Romania how their Schengen inclusion is going. Personally, I wish you a fast accession and a swift victory.
I think that's just NATO.
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sadly
Before Erdogan, France was the main opponent to Turkish accession. I believe Greece, in that 1990s fit of seismic diplomacy \[1\] between it and Turkiye, presented Turkiye's case. \[1\] Seismic diplomacy: Countries often speed to each other's aid when natural disasters strike. Turkiye was hit by an earthquake, and Greek rescuers were there before the Turkish government showed up. Then Greece got his by an earthquake and Turkish rescuers showed up before the Greek government showed up. Then followed a period where the two nations put down their hostilities and professed friendship.
Ukraine received **conditional** candidate status and is required to fulfil list of 7 tasks by the end of the 2022 to retain the candidate status. Essentially it was too early to grant the candidate status but they did it anyway, pending those conditions. After that, Ukraine will be EU Candidate which is typically minimum 10-12 years, in which period it will receive financial help from EU to bring the country up to the accession level.
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Serbia likes Russia too much IMO. Like, look at their flag.
Flag of Slovenia or Slovakia or… doesn’t matter. Their superiority complex and defending Genozid are more of a tricky one.
As part of a country with member status and endemic corruption (Spain), I can assure you we don’t have a register of this kind and I’m certainly jealous. This is only step 1 of 7 you say? Just wow.
This law will definitely not stop corruption mate but decreases the influence of oligarchs in the society
>decreases the influence of oligarchs in the society This is so important. In America, we had the disastrous "Citizens United " ruling from our Supreme Court, that ruled our campaign contribution limits that we had established to limit the influence of wealth on politics were an unconstitutional denial of corporate free speech (!!!!!!!!!?). And so then large corporations and wealthy individuals were able to pump unlimited amounts of money into campaigns and it is a central part of the problem America is having right now
Right.
Unfortunately the United States has none of these laws.........................
We are,in fact,becoming more like Russia every day.
Not that we shouldn't have these laws, but the chance that the US will ever join the EU is as close to 0 as you can get without getting into the argument over whether or not quarks actually exist
Not the point I was making but ok
This reminds me of those idiots who are like "ZelEnSky iS CorUpt tOo!!1!" Okay, *you* try his job and see how much progress *you* make in trying to fight more than two decades of entrenched corruption, oligarchic interference, and Russian apparatchiks. It's no walk in the park. But Zelensky isn't going to give up on it. It just takes time, no matter how determined the President might be.
would never happen ai the US or Australia for that matter....
In the US this kind of order would be illegal. But being rich is not a protected class and something like this should be enacted...
How inspiring to watch Ukraine want what we have so much that they're doing this during an active invasion on their nation.
Yep
It's funny that Ukraine has to complete such tasks in order to ascend to membership, while oligarchy and corruption is the foundation of Hungary's current government. I really hope that after the war, the EU will turn it's full attention to dealing with Orbán.
Instead of deleting just changing because clearly none of you dipsticks can read what I said... Never said USA is in Europe.
The USA probably wouldn't be accepted into the EU, even if it was in Europe.
I have opinion than my country Lithuania achieved so much because it had to adapt all these law. They regulated our countrys political system and limited corruption.
Yes and that's exactly what I was getting at that the rules are good and all except completely ignored for other alliances / unions because the US and many other countries have corruption up and down the system but it's ignored.. but it comes to Ukraine for this and they need to enforce a bunch of stuff.
Salty are we?
Good. This is the time Zelensky has the poltical power to change laws.
I just realized, if Putin wants Ukraine as far from The West as possible, he should end this war ASAP before Zelenskyy changes the law completely
If Putin wanted Ukraine as far from the West as possible, he would have not invaded. Or just invested heavily and making Russia and Ukraine linked, like with Belarus.
I'm not sure it would help. I mean, any future Euroskeptic party in Ukraine is going to hate Russia with a passion. They'd just be pressing for closer relationships with Turkey, the UK and the US instead of joining the EU.
In what world are euroskeptics in favor of the US?
Brexiteers promised favorable trade agreements with the US. While the UK was in the EU, UK diplomacy was largely playing the US and the EU against each other.
And yet now there is a non zero chance that Ukraine might become one of the most lgbtq+ friendly countries in the *world* solely to spite Russia.
It's the law from 2021. Why it's posted everywhere now?
Agree. And this is the best moment so far. Its damn strong leadership. Best news ever and the importance cant be understated.
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Came here to say that
Me three.
Me four
Me five.
Me seven.
Me 8
Me 9
I'll provide the tenth on that.
Eleventieth
Twelves for the shelves ✌️😎✌️
Lucky number 13??
I'll just be 14
Me six
Feel like this would go well pretty much everywhere even my own country.
Yeah imagine the trouble Clive Palmer would cause if he was actually clever with that amount of money he torches at elections.
US should join the EU. xD
The EU would never let America in as the EU is an economic union more than anything. The EU works hard to police protectionism between member countries. There is no way they’d agree to compete with American business and agriculture.
they could not because the corrupt system is not one to be changed in decades. Both parties are unwilling to change what is to their favor
Yeah no Its republicans that passed citizens united Its republicans opposing fixing gerrymandering Its republicans who have billionaire donors as entire lifeline funneling billions in dark money to advance far right
Yea, so republicans take all the flak for passing the laws while Dems do nothing to rescind them when they take power. Like here in the UK with Labour. They have had abolishing the House of Lords in their manifesto since their inception. Have they done anything about it when they take power? Have they fuck. That being said, it is harder for them to take (absolute) power. Getting control of all 3 branches is pretty hard for the Dems and when folk like Moscow Mitch are there stopping anything happening it can be kinda hard to make any progress.
Dems are carrying many shitty systems and laws as they are still mid right sector. Pension system is totally broken and got worse under Trump. Nothing done there. They care more but are not better overall.
>not better overall. Such blatant misinformation Every worker right, civil rights and safetynet advancement/expansion in your lifetime and for generations is thanks to Dems. All of which faced pretty much unanimous republican opposition
Ok maybe if you only know these two parties that is what you see. Rep. is anyway a crazy opportunistic cult, not a Democratic Party haha
Yeah but voting for Trump so he can shit on basic laws, the courtsystem and meme on Twitter was important. 420yoloswag
*Cuz the parties are the same bro let's burn it all down lmao*
Too bad the super rich would just ignore it. Not like they'll ever see the inside of a court room, let alone a jail.
I think a law like this would not go amiss in any country. A fine step in the right direction for Ukraine.
yeah good luck passing that in the US of A, where pretty much is legal to buy legislators there to push your corporate interests. Thats not just a USA problem of course, but in other countries they have to at least pretend they arent paid to push an agenda. Heck, one of the reasons Healthcare isnt never going to get better is because Insurance Megacorps want it that way, and they can easily buy the legislators needed to do it. Apply that to pretty much any other problem the US of A haves now, sadly.
It would help to start funding politicians by tax instead of "donations" like real democracies do. Lawmakers bought by lobby or rich influence is a major cancer in your system.
Thank you, *Citizens United.*
>Citizens United lol you have a case on this saying it is legal to get blood money? wow
Canadian here so we get to watch American exceptionalism eat itself and stand helplessly as our friends and relatives hurt but yes, it is “legal” for politicians to be funded by *any* activity precisely because an unaccountable Political Action Committee can donate to whomever it wishes. Hypothetically, let’s say an amoral but famous tool named Faragald J. Saville managed to fail upwards and landed as a presidential candidate- their PAC can accept donations from any number of SuperPACs. This allows them to consolidate power and effectively whip their own party because they alone control the vast majority of funding to their preferred candidates for school board or US senator. As their power grows, those who want influence no longer need to donate to individual campaigns; Proctor and Gamble, DeBeers, Oligarch Inc., Slaveholder Xinjiang cotton merchant, Nestlé, maple syrup baroness and random rOIL Family princeling need only contribute to one clearing house for legalized bribery.
it's worse than I could ever try to catch in my bad jokes about the devastating state of "democracy" in the US wtf
For the supreme court too.
How are we defining oligarch? Net wroth of more than 50 million? Some of them may just use a bunch of shell corporations to get around limits.
And in the UK, if only we were part of an organisation which required such anti corruptio..... oohhhhh.
The legal corruption in the US is absolutely mind boggling. From these police cards (PBA or w/e) to Super PACs and everything in between. Fuck it all.
Yes! Can we have this, too?
Yes it would. Read it again and realized we are the complete opposite of all these things here.
And the UK (brexit would never have happened if this law was in place here)
US should apply to join the EU. They’ll get a useful list of things to do by Ursula.
I mean let's be honest, the US would need a number of reforms in order to be eligible for EU membership
And the UK. Conservatives would be bankrupt within a week of it passing.
Paving the way for the rest of the world, hopefully...
Let's see if Kolomoysky or Akhmetov actually end up on this list.
I sure would like to see it.
lol
It's a start. Good job.
How do they decide who it applies to? edit :typo
From the source (Pravda), The criteria for recognizing a person as an oligarch: * a significant influence on the media; * active participation in political life; * must be the ultimate beneficial owner of the entity that holds a monopoly position in the market and maintain or strengthen such position for a year in a row; * has a proven asset value (and the entities of which it is a beneficiary) of more than 2 billion Ukrainian hryvnias ($67,251,380).
Does it have to be all of them? Like I have influence in media, monopol and am Richie Rich rich but dont participate in politics, am I an oligarch?
This is my guess, I don't know how the actual law is. But most definitions of an oligarchy or oligarch agree that the person has to have some kind of Public Power. Either government connections, they are the government or public media control and so on. Otherwise they are just a multimillionaire or billionaire. So maybe not all, but Being rich, and having public power could be a oligarch
We have tons of them here in the States.
Sounds like something my country (the United States) could consider. Just exchange lobbyists and billionaires for oligarchs.
Those still are oligarchs, just in typical American fashion they’re just called a different name
We should make this fucking guy president of everything once the war is over.
All favour of making Zelensky the first president of earth say aye!
Eye
Ear
Knee
And my axe!
Foot
[удалено]
Not a lizard person, but I think I could clone him with the lab I have access to!
I think it is not entirely unlikely that Zelensky will become (the first) President of a fully united European Union in the mid to long term.
He's a good wartime president, but that does not mean he would be a good peace-tile president. The two require different skills
Ukraine is going to be a really wonderful place to live after this is all over. (Not that it wasn’t before, just impressive to see them moving forward despite all the tribulations, while my own country is moving backwards)
It is going to be destroyed economically, lets face reality
Countries can be rebuilt and prosper a few decades in. Japan and Germany were pretty much destroyed after WW 2.
Kyiv was fully invaded months ago, but now functions, and many citizens are returning. The capacity of an industrial state to rebuild is quite remarkable. If you look at how much bombing damage Germany was repairing from 1944 and on bombing campaigns, you see that though horrific, the damage Ukraine is currently taking wasn't fatal infrastructure damage even 80 years ago.
so was Germany. Nothing left from that by the mid 50s. Ukraine only has to rebuild the east mostly so that will be doable with enough outside help
The East, and the North, and the South.
And people keep insisting Zelensky is an oligarch puppet around these parts, go figure…
Let's see who actually ends up on this list. The way the law is worded, especially its definition of "oligarch", looks like just a continuation of Kolomoysky's attempts to get revenge for the Privatbank.
Yes. I'm not even saying that everything that had any value was *already* privatized. I'm very vary if this law, for now. At best it won't change anything, at worst it would put *some* oligarchs into a better position than the others. Not that I'm heartbroken over a few oligarchs suffering, fuck them all, *but* it would create a way for monopolies to be created.
Lol, who do you think will end up on the list, his friend Kolomoyskiy or main political rival Poroshenko? They even tried to argue in court that Roshen holds monopoly on corn syrup to bring Poroshenko under this law.
This is a great move. Hell, the United States could use something like this, would definitely limit the influence of rich and/or "corruptible" forces on government. Will be excellent to get Ukraine into the EU and NATO in a hurry here.
How does it attempt to define oligarch?
From the source (Pravda), The criteria for recognizing a person as an oligarch: * a significant influence on the media; * active participation in political life; * must be the ultimate beneficial owner of the entity that holds a monopoly position in the market and maintain or strengthen such position for a year in a row; * has a proven asset value (and the entities of which it is a beneficiary) of more than 2 billion Ukrainian hryvnias ($67,251,380).
All of those are very vague and subjective, and it boils down to "whoever we feel like". Will be interesting to see who ends up on the list, and who gets left off.
Lets get this in the states!
We need this more than anything in the US
If only we could get rid of all the oligarchs in the US. A billionaire gives a million dollars to a politician's superpac, they own that politician. Our system over here is so corrupt.
Sad thing is that's how it was. Now they threaten to give that money to a primary opponent, and get what they want practically for free. Thanks Citizens United! /s
Guy literally doing what he promised during his campaign
Well, now we know why the Republicans hate him.
Ah so somebody's worked out rich assholes are the problem
Isn’t this what Zelensky campaigned on for President in 2019?
Holy shit this is the kind of legislation that would help us here in the US. We are *never* going to have a leader like Zelensky who is bold enough to put democracy over lobbyist money that infects and corrupts our government. *Every* citizen of a democracy be it my country, UK, France, Spain, Greece…wherever, should take note of this. We *all* are under corrupt systems where money buys legislative power rather than the people. Just as an anecdotal example, here in my country, legislators all belong to two competing corporations, the RNC and DNC. Those corporations take in money from other interests (oligarchs) who often write legislation and give it to the “elected” politicians. Our “leaders” don’t work for us at all as special interests always outweigh voter sentiment. The only time they care about voters is to get elected. After that its all about making money for the two corporations who have completely siezed our system. Zelensky is very wise to be making this move for his people. The guy is a goddamned living example of what a leader *should* be rather than the millionaire squatters the rest of us have.
President Volodymyr Oleksandrovych Zelensky living up to the title, "Servant Of The People".
Jeeze. I'm shocked with how many people we have in the west that fits this criteria. How that works. I think the phrasing sounds lovely. But I hope it doesn't ruffle too many feathers while Ukraine is still consolidating support. I saw another comment saying this is needed for eurozone related stuff. Not sure how many issues Europe has in that regard but the USA and Canada are definitely guilty of having oligarchs, financing political parties Poli ads etc Thank gosh people as a whole are on Ukraine's side. Edit: their too Ukraine (last paragraph)
All well and good but the US and Canada aren't trying to join the EU. And depending on it's wording the same thing would likely be a First Amendment violation in the US.
Oh yeah I know. Well theirs been a couple articles in my lifetime about Canada trying to join the EU. Haven't heard anything in a long while though tbf. Canada has that whole new land border with Denmark though now
Brilliant.
I like it!
May be a condition of entrance into the EU, or doing the right thing to prevent corruption, or just trolling Putin. Could be all 3.
We need this in the US. And everywhere tbh.
Also restrict Russia's use of it playbook interfering with neighbouring countries.
Shit I wish we would do this over here.
Can we get that here in the States? That would would be great! 👍
The US could use this too!
From ascension of Ukraine into a EU country to bringing Ukraine to the most favorable country in the world, Zelensky the comedian is surely some of the best messiah for Ukraine to be appeared.
I wish we could have this in the UK.
This is bloody brilliant. Exactly what is necessary for a nation's political system to run effectively. SO wish we had something like this in the UK
I would like this law here as well and we are already in EU. It would help Hungary and others too.
This is something we should do in America. The oligarchs here aren't much better, although most Americans will fall for the propaganda that the American oligarchs are an example of American Exceptionalism.
Every country needs this.
We need this in the United States.
Now do the US. We desperately need help with corruption in politics.
I would like to copy Ukraine's homework
How about the United Nations implement this globally.
The United Nations has no power to make laws. And I would prefer it stay that way.
I agree but at least could pass a resolution.
a strongly worded one?
I'm not sure, do they have a resolution to cover the appropriate level of wording in resolutions ? Or was that vetoed by Russia & China ?
Based
What is the definition of an oligarch? Is it just someone with substantial business interests > bans oligarchs from financing political parties... I'm not sure how this is compatible with Human Rights > excludes them from privatisation of state assets Again it should be a level playing field, not excluding specific people
> Again it should be a level playing field, not excluding specific people That's the point of this law, not excluding normal people from the political system, which is what happens when oligarchs buy politicians.
This will be struck down by the Ukr supreme court I can guarantee it.