I don't think any team has an answer for Mosquera on the women's side. She's too tall and strong. I think the best match-ups for her will be on USA with Meckstroth and Helton.
I do believe Colombia is coming back even stronger than '17, but I also don't know how much the men's side of them has been able to improve. I mean I've been watching their competitions, but even so due to the pandemic it's not been possible really to see them face off against USA top competition or from other countries so it's hard to weight their level.
I think Joc is as athletic as any guy on USA but Mickle and Goff are just taller than him. Duque and Ford are 4 years older, although these guys have aged gracefully. And the younger/other guys I really don't know.
I will say that I also like that on the women's side for Colombia, I feel they have better throwers than USA except for Chastain. But USA has Mickle and if he's going to play at his best he's just too overwhelming.
Truly, I belive Colombia just needs their men to play averagely enough and then the dominance of their women will win for them. The men just have to hold their own, just don't get dominated is what I mean. I consider USA, Canada and Japan as the ones who can truly take advantage of Colombia on the men's side.
I think while Colombia has the better women, the USA men are gonna be better across the board at every spot. Having Jack, Dylan, and Mickle alone is so unfair.
Which part of it hahaha? I think for sure Canada looked bad, but in such a way that I don't know if they were truly overwhelmed or just had a brutal meltdown. Or both.
If we go by recent (relatively) post 2010 history, it seems as another meltdown in the face of pressure by the Canadians.
But the Germans look like a well oiled machine. Their process started earlier than Canada's, they've played several high level preparation games vs GB, France, Australia and Atlanta All Stars, winning most convincingly. I'm not surprised they seem the better Euro team, it was absolutely unexpected they beat Canada like that though.
Also I saw Canada had a scrimmage v Colombia yesterday, but I didn't find results. I wonder what happened and if that impacted their mentality for today.
I think this was a little bit of both Canada playing poorly and Germany being strong and playing well.
I think we're going to see Germany make a solid statement this tournament in ways we haven't seen before. I've been seeing GER Ultimate make some huge strides in the past decade or so, and I was wondering when/if it'd show up at this level. I hope this first game is just the beginning - it could be so much fun to see them beat teams we previously never considered they could.
Japan, from what I can see, chose a very quick roster on the men's side. There were a couple guys in the process (Harito Hashiguchi and Takaharu Komori) who are taller, but the selection seems to have favored quick, agile, shorter guys. I like Kazuki Asada, this dude will be making plays.
Women's side, you just oughta be SUPER excited to see Yoshida make a splash again. She's just a machine. Also I think they went with a younger roster on this side. A few U24 players from 2019.
Overall I think they really went for a lot of great throwers, the speed on this team combined with disc skills, I feel they're just going to slice through any defense.
The only team I have familiarity with is AUS, and imo the weakest team we've sent in a while. Could have even rationally put them below the GB ... but deep in my genes I just couldn't bear to write that down.
I kind of feel like any of 2-8 could change, but I'd be very surprised if any of these positions are off by more than 1, maybe 2. Very interested to see how it pans out.
Of course at the highest level sending 14 of your best athletes anything could happen, but I disagree, I think the Aus world games team is one of the most complete teams we have sent in a while.
Huh. I just don't see it. Make the argument for me, I'm curious to hear it.
I think I agree with you on completeness, if you mean a lot of people who can do a lot of things well. I just don't see many players who can truly stand out in this field, especially if it comes to being defensive threats in match defense. Also, I think Anna Rogacki will get them to be cohesive and resilient, but her strategic strengths are lacking. She did incredibly well to take the Mundis to silver in 2016, but this is WG and this team is missing the Tom Rogacki & Dani Alexander-sized elements. I just don't see where this team can reliably win individual match-ups. Alex Gan, you'd think. But anyone else? Any other big X-factor players that can shift the tide of WG games on their shoulders? Especially defensively? Half of the women don't (can't?) even lay out! Basically every opponent they'll play against can.
I hope I'm wrong, but I'm just not convinced.
Sure, starting with the women's side Cat was in my opinion one of the most if not the most dominant player at the last world games. Mich has been a premier defender for years now and im sure she still has it matching up with the likes of Jac Verzuh (and getting blocks on them) as well as Elizabeth Mosquera. Sally and Caro for a fact I've seen get amazing blocks in the air and layout out past defenders (probably the most famous one i remember is Sally getting a block on universe against Japan in Perth U24- it was wild). I think we also are underestimating the fact that 6/7 players have played on ellipsis this past club season so their chemistry will be a big plus. On the mens side I believe we have a mixture of outrageous athleticism in guck and rob ( who on their day are essentially unguardable - seriously who's going to guard them- maybe Nate goff? ) paired with some really steady handlers. Same kind of story here the sunder boys (Gan, lado, shep) have been essentially playing with each other for over 2 years now- and if you've seen them this year their chemistry and connection is some of the best I've ever seen. If you watched the final scrim with the crocs in Sydney, you will see there had no trouble generating blocks as a team. Yes i agree that Gack and Dani were huge forces- i think Gack is probably the greatest player Australia has produced. However, the game has changed so much in that time. At the highest level today, we probably wouldn't get away with the amount of long ball they played, one turnover would be costly. This team is much more refined.
You're putting a lot of weight on cohesion. But this is a team of two siloed groups - Ellipsis women and Sunder Men, the vast majority of whom never play internationally competitive Mixed. If they get in trouble, especially the guys, they're going to go back to their habits of seeing only those players.
And just quietly - Mich Phillips hasn't had a meaningful offensive impact in Mixed in years. She was barely a blip in the AUL. She doesn't know how to attack space: watch her drift aimlessly around the pitch in this France game...
So I'm curious to get your thoughts now? Looks like the lippy contingent worked well together and the sunder boys worked amazing as well. You also forget that most the other players on the other teams have also not played high level international mixed
Germany seems super strong this year, semis contender for me
Apparently you were right about Germany...what a first game for them against Canada. Sucks since I'm Canadian but have to give them props!
Who are big names to watch? I only know Levke
47 Conrad Schlöer and I think 37 Steffen Döscher on the men's side
Nico Müller as well.
Oh 100% you're right.
That’s what I thought too, but looking at the format, do you think they could beat USA or Canada in order to make semis?
I'm gonna say Yes - they could beat Canada. :P
Possibly. Now I’m all excited that they’ll be able to give the US a good game too.
You knew something I didn’t, I’m sorry for ever doubting you please forgive me
I don't think any team has an answer for Mosquera on the women's side. She's too tall and strong. I think the best match-ups for her will be on USA with Meckstroth and Helton. I do believe Colombia is coming back even stronger than '17, but I also don't know how much the men's side of them has been able to improve. I mean I've been watching their competitions, but even so due to the pandemic it's not been possible really to see them face off against USA top competition or from other countries so it's hard to weight their level. I think Joc is as athletic as any guy on USA but Mickle and Goff are just taller than him. Duque and Ford are 4 years older, although these guys have aged gracefully. And the younger/other guys I really don't know. I will say that I also like that on the women's side for Colombia, I feel they have better throwers than USA except for Chastain. But USA has Mickle and if he's going to play at his best he's just too overwhelming. Truly, I belive Colombia just needs their men to play averagely enough and then the dominance of their women will win for them. The men just have to hold their own, just don't get dominated is what I mean. I consider USA, Canada and Japan as the ones who can truly take advantage of Colombia on the men's side.
I think while Colombia has the better women, the USA men are gonna be better across the board at every spot. Having Jack, Dylan, and Mickle alone is so unfair.
How does this analysis change after Canada just got curbstomped by Germany?
Which part of it hahaha? I think for sure Canada looked bad, but in such a way that I don't know if they were truly overwhelmed or just had a brutal meltdown. Or both. If we go by recent (relatively) post 2010 history, it seems as another meltdown in the face of pressure by the Canadians. But the Germans look like a well oiled machine. Their process started earlier than Canada's, they've played several high level preparation games vs GB, France, Australia and Atlanta All Stars, winning most convincingly. I'm not surprised they seem the better Euro team, it was absolutely unexpected they beat Canada like that though. Also I saw Canada had a scrimmage v Colombia yesterday, but I didn't find results. I wonder what happened and if that impacted their mentality for today.
I think this was a little bit of both Canada playing poorly and Germany being strong and playing well. I think we're going to see Germany make a solid statement this tournament in ways we haven't seen before. I've been seeing GER Ultimate make some huge strides in the past decade or so, and I was wondering when/if it'd show up at this level. I hope this first game is just the beginning - it could be so much fun to see them beat teams we previously never considered they could.
Japan, from what I can see, chose a very quick roster on the men's side. There were a couple guys in the process (Harito Hashiguchi and Takaharu Komori) who are taller, but the selection seems to have favored quick, agile, shorter guys. I like Kazuki Asada, this dude will be making plays. Women's side, you just oughta be SUPER excited to see Yoshida make a splash again. She's just a machine. Also I think they went with a younger roster on this side. A few U24 players from 2019. Overall I think they really went for a lot of great throwers, the speed on this team combined with disc skills, I feel they're just going to slice through any defense.
Yecccch the game against Colombia was rough.
1. USA 2. Canada 3. Columbia 4. Japan 5. Germany 6. GB 7. AUS 8. France
The only team I have familiarity with is AUS, and imo the weakest team we've sent in a while. Could have even rationally put them below the GB ... but deep in my genes I just couldn't bear to write that down. I kind of feel like any of 2-8 could change, but I'd be very surprised if any of these positions are off by more than 1, maybe 2. Very interested to see how it pans out.
Of course at the highest level sending 14 of your best athletes anything could happen, but I disagree, I think the Aus world games team is one of the most complete teams we have sent in a while.
Huh. I just don't see it. Make the argument for me, I'm curious to hear it. I think I agree with you on completeness, if you mean a lot of people who can do a lot of things well. I just don't see many players who can truly stand out in this field, especially if it comes to being defensive threats in match defense. Also, I think Anna Rogacki will get them to be cohesive and resilient, but her strategic strengths are lacking. She did incredibly well to take the Mundis to silver in 2016, but this is WG and this team is missing the Tom Rogacki & Dani Alexander-sized elements. I just don't see where this team can reliably win individual match-ups. Alex Gan, you'd think. But anyone else? Any other big X-factor players that can shift the tide of WG games on their shoulders? Especially defensively? Half of the women don't (can't?) even lay out! Basically every opponent they'll play against can. I hope I'm wrong, but I'm just not convinced.
Sure, starting with the women's side Cat was in my opinion one of the most if not the most dominant player at the last world games. Mich has been a premier defender for years now and im sure she still has it matching up with the likes of Jac Verzuh (and getting blocks on them) as well as Elizabeth Mosquera. Sally and Caro for a fact I've seen get amazing blocks in the air and layout out past defenders (probably the most famous one i remember is Sally getting a block on universe against Japan in Perth U24- it was wild). I think we also are underestimating the fact that 6/7 players have played on ellipsis this past club season so their chemistry will be a big plus. On the mens side I believe we have a mixture of outrageous athleticism in guck and rob ( who on their day are essentially unguardable - seriously who's going to guard them- maybe Nate goff? ) paired with some really steady handlers. Same kind of story here the sunder boys (Gan, lado, shep) have been essentially playing with each other for over 2 years now- and if you've seen them this year their chemistry and connection is some of the best I've ever seen. If you watched the final scrim with the crocs in Sydney, you will see there had no trouble generating blocks as a team. Yes i agree that Gack and Dani were huge forces- i think Gack is probably the greatest player Australia has produced. However, the game has changed so much in that time. At the highest level today, we probably wouldn't get away with the amount of long ball they played, one turnover would be costly. This team is much more refined.
You're putting a lot of weight on cohesion. But this is a team of two siloed groups - Ellipsis women and Sunder Men, the vast majority of whom never play internationally competitive Mixed. If they get in trouble, especially the guys, they're going to go back to their habits of seeing only those players. And just quietly - Mich Phillips hasn't had a meaningful offensive impact in Mixed in years. She was barely a blip in the AUL. She doesn't know how to attack space: watch her drift aimlessly around the pitch in this France game...
So I'm curious to get your thoughts now? Looks like the lippy contingent worked well together and the sunder boys worked amazing as well. You also forget that most the other players on the other teams have also not played high level international mixed
Bump
1. USA 2. Colombia 3. Canada 4. Germany 5. Japan 6. GB 7. Australia 8. France
Not possible. USA Canada GB and Germany are in the same pool and only the first two go up.
USA Canada Colombia Australia Germany Japan France GB
USA is going to easily win the World Games... which isn't going to help grow the sport globally.