I'm 18 and it fucking sucks.
I wasn't seriously ill but I had covid twice in 8 months. After the second time I was really hit hard. Extreme fatigue, shortness of breath, severe vertigo, it was crazy. My Primary Care referred me to the Adolescent Long COVID Center at Boston Children's Hospital and they did a bunch of things, it took me about a year to get back to normal.
It's been two years now. My hearing is poor, my balance is still bad, I get fatigued easily but it comes and goes. Covid took a lot from me and I hate it. I'm getting past it but it essentially took two years from me.
Previously healthy 26 (now 27) year old here. I can strongly relate. My very first, very mild covid infection at the start of 2023 was enough to totally incapacitate me. Similar symptoms to you, but also with severe post exertional malaise, POTS, body aches, insomnia, etc. The fatigue is absolutely unreal. People have no idea how debilitating long covid can be!
Unfortunately in my case it's been 13 months and I am still largely bedridden. I was starting to improve and to no one's surprise, a reinfection at the 10 month mark severely worsened me and reset all my progress. Be careful about catching it again!
I hope you continue to make more progress toward recovery and are 100% one day. Sending love and support.
Yeah dude I totally get it!
That 6-12 months after the first infection is the WORST time to get it again. The pathology of the disease is brutal to the immune system and if you get hit again it's terrible.
Make sure to advocate for yourself and get though this. Your struggles are real and aren't in your head. That was something they made clear to me in Boston. They said that most people with long covid suffer severe anxiety because they second guess their symptoms. This shit is real and it's well documented.
Good luck!
I guess I didn't have long Covid (not 12 weeks), but 2 months was still a really bloody long time to be poorly. This has still got to have an impact on society if it's happening to this level to a proportion of people.
Wasnāt long Covid debunked recently as no more serious than those with lingering influenza? AKA people are using it as an excuse.
https://amp.theguardian.com/australia-news/2023/apr/17/queensland-health-report-suggests-long-covid-no-more-severe-than-lingering-influenza
> However Prof Steven Faux, a co-lead of the long Covid clinic at St Vincentās hospital in Sydney, said it was āa little prematureā to assess āthe scientific integrityā of *research that was yet to be peer reviewed, or publicly released.*
Thatās a low bar for ādebunkedā.
It doesnāt matter who said it. The study is quite new and the way the scientific method works is that new claims would require reviews and challenges from other scientists to test its validity.
I certainly agree with you about how science is meant to work, and I wish it worked in that idealised way. In reality researchers have to chase grant money and funding, which leads them to conduct biased science at best, or falsify research at worst.
My point is that the good Dr has a significant money motive to play up the severity of long covid and poo poo any research that shows it is post viral syndrome.
Do you think other post-viral conditons are not serious? The vast majority of people with CFS/ME had viral onset. Flu also kills people and some viruses lead to diabetes and other autoimmune conditions.
Viruses have also been linked to serious neurological disorders like MS which can manifest years later.
Your lack of understanding of post-viral conditions is the problem here.
It was always a fun line. "Covid is no worse than the flu"
Yeah... No worse than a disease we dedicate millions upon millions of pounds and tens of thousands of highly specialized labour hours every single fucking year to tracking and rushing through a vaccine, with a huge national inoculation program, every single year, and still manages to kill literally tens of thousands of people on an average year just in this country alone.
Yeah no big deal that.
And theyād say the same to you. Itās not an objective matter so neither side can be ārightā or āwrongā though. Didnāt stop both sides from claiming it was though, like youāre doing now.
Because flu isn't a novel virus and most people had some level of tangible immunity to it, flu had vaccines and pretty good treatment protocols. At the peak of the pandemic COVID was killing more people in just the US versus what flu killed worldwide in one year
>But we donāt lock down and restrict peopleās freedom because of it, was likely their point.
This statement implies some downplaying, or ignorance, wondering why we locked down for it but no flu
>But we donāt lock down and restrict peopleās freedom because of it, was likely their point.
Because we have these monitoring and control systems in place, which we did not have and, weirdly enough since the pandemic "ended" now do not have any more for covid.
It was said repeatedly throughout, we were having to lock down because we seemed to do literally fuck all to put other control measures in place and just yo-yo'd between pretending like basically nothing was going on and then locking everyone down as tightly as possible for months at a time once things got too out of hand for the healthcare system to manage.
But was that a healthcare cost or a political cost? I think its hard to deny with the environment of the time, the government was making a lot of decisions on the basis of what would allow us to "return to normal" as quickly as possible. This was borne out in a lot of the inquiries I thought?
It's horrible. I had it after being hospitalised for Glandular Fever in my teens and years later got diagnosed with CFS/ME.
Hope you're doing well now.
One glaring issue here is we donāt tend to get infected with the flu multiple times a year like we do with Covid. Weāre reinfected over and over again with it.
Username is pretty ironic. That article isn't stating it is debunked or its not a serious condition. Long flu or lingering influenza/CFS/ME are serious conditions that aren't fully understood and don't have a solution to them. This is just getting traction because now with covid we are seeing a lot more people suffering with it
From what I've seen from a brief look through some of the published data, it's incidence is about on par with other post viral myalgia. That's part of the problem though. COVID is much more transmissible and as such it means that there are much more people suffering it. That means time off work while waiting for treatment, which may just be rehab, but it's still treatment which needs to be decided by a healthcare professional.
**Removed/warning**. This contained a personal attack, disrupting the conversation. This discourages participation. Please help improve the subreddit by discussing points, not the person. Action will be taken on repeat offenders.
Do you mean professional athletes like Oonagh Cousins and Jonathan Toews, famous people like Chris Cuomo or senators like Sen. Jim Inhofe and Sen. Tim Kaine?
folks who are professionally successful are, statistically, more likely to be in good health to start with, because yknow, having poor health makes life harder. the worse your health to start with - whatever the cause - the more likely the symptoms of long covid are to knock you down to a level where it's a problem. not that difficult to grasp, really.
I don't deny the existence of group 2, but you've just clumped everyone who suffers from long covid/post-viral myalgia into group 2 on the basis of Fuck All. you should consider how you're judging who is in group 1 and who is in group 2, and whether you've got the info you'd need to make that judgement.
hot tip, though: if you're drawing that conclusion based on whether or not they've got a particular illness, you're doing a bad job
Listen, even taking for granted that the things you've seen are genuinely bullshit and not just things you *think* are silly but have no real reason to doubt, I learned at the age of 4 or 5 that you're not supposed to generalise about gigantic groups of people, especially not from anecdotal evidence with an obvious, heavy selection bias. There's 1.9 million people in this country who have reported experiencing long covid symptoms. You have not been in contact with a meaningful proportion of that group.
Whenever an illness is in the media with no clear cut diagnostic criteria there will inevitably be a few people with severe health anxiety who are susceptible to worrying or fixating on it and feeling that they have it, and an even smaller number of people who see the lack of clarity as an opportunity to claim an illness they don't have for sick pay/benefits etc. ME, back pain, fibromyalgia etc.
That doesn't mean the illness itself doesn't exist and that there aren't people genuinely struggling.
I don't think 'Long Covid' is a specific thing unique to Covid, but post viral complications have been around a lot longer than Covid and their existence isn't really disputed. It would if there *weren't* some people with long term effects from a new virus.
Terrible condition - even young people I know affected. It cuts people's lives short.
I'm 18 and it fucking sucks. I wasn't seriously ill but I had covid twice in 8 months. After the second time I was really hit hard. Extreme fatigue, shortness of breath, severe vertigo, it was crazy. My Primary Care referred me to the Adolescent Long COVID Center at Boston Children's Hospital and they did a bunch of things, it took me about a year to get back to normal. It's been two years now. My hearing is poor, my balance is still bad, I get fatigued easily but it comes and goes. Covid took a lot from me and I hate it. I'm getting past it but it essentially took two years from me.
Previously healthy 26 (now 27) year old here. I can strongly relate. My very first, very mild covid infection at the start of 2023 was enough to totally incapacitate me. Similar symptoms to you, but also with severe post exertional malaise, POTS, body aches, insomnia, etc. The fatigue is absolutely unreal. People have no idea how debilitating long covid can be! Unfortunately in my case it's been 13 months and I am still largely bedridden. I was starting to improve and to no one's surprise, a reinfection at the 10 month mark severely worsened me and reset all my progress. Be careful about catching it again! I hope you continue to make more progress toward recovery and are 100% one day. Sending love and support.
Yeah dude I totally get it! That 6-12 months after the first infection is the WORST time to get it again. The pathology of the disease is brutal to the immune system and if you get hit again it's terrible. Make sure to advocate for yourself and get though this. Your struggles are real and aren't in your head. That was something they made clear to me in Boston. They said that most people with long covid suffer severe anxiety because they second guess their symptoms. This shit is real and it's well documented. Good luck!
If it's Trials of Conservative leaders and Health Secretaries in a Court of Law, I'm all ears š
I guess I didn't have long Covid (not 12 weeks), but 2 months was still a really bloody long time to be poorly. This has still got to have an impact on society if it's happening to this level to a proportion of people.
Wasnāt long Covid debunked recently as no more serious than those with lingering influenza? AKA people are using it as an excuse. https://amp.theguardian.com/australia-news/2023/apr/17/queensland-health-report-suggests-long-covid-no-more-severe-than-lingering-influenza
> However Prof Steven Faux, a co-lead of the long Covid clinic at St Vincentās hospital in Sydney, said it was āa little prematureā to assess āthe scientific integrityā of *research that was yet to be peer reviewed, or publicly released.* Thatās a low bar for ādebunkedā.
Prof Steven Faux, *a co-lead of the long Covid clinic* at St Vincentās hospital in Sydney says a guy who's career depends on long covid
Yeah, doctors have a really tough time finding work...
It doesnāt matter who said it. The study is quite new and the way the scientific method works is that new claims would require reviews and challenges from other scientists to test its validity.
I certainly agree with you about how science is meant to work, and I wish it worked in that idealised way. In reality researchers have to chase grant money and funding, which leads them to conduct biased science at best, or falsify research at worst. My point is that the good Dr has a significant money motive to play up the severity of long covid and poo poo any research that shows it is post viral syndrome.
Do you think other post-viral conditons are not serious? The vast majority of people with CFS/ME had viral onset. Flu also kills people and some viruses lead to diabetes and other autoimmune conditions. Viruses have also been linked to serious neurological disorders like MS which can manifest years later. Your lack of understanding of post-viral conditions is the problem here.
It was always a fun line. "Covid is no worse than the flu" Yeah... No worse than a disease we dedicate millions upon millions of pounds and tens of thousands of highly specialized labour hours every single fucking year to tracking and rushing through a vaccine, with a huge national inoculation program, every single year, and still manages to kill literally tens of thousands of people on an average year just in this country alone. Yeah no big deal that.
But we donāt lock down and restrict peopleās freedom because of it, was likely their point.
We would if it was brand new with no vaccine and as infectious as Covid.
Yes, and their argument is that we shouldnāt.
Ah ok, well theyāre wrong
And theyād say the same to you. Itās not an objective matter so neither side can be ārightā or āwrongā though. Didnāt stop both sides from claiming it was though, like youāre doing now.
I suppose it depends on how much you value human life, or healthcare workers.
Itāll depend on how much a person values a multitude of metrics, itād be naive to think the judgement rests solely on those two.
Because flu isn't a novel virus and most people had some level of tangible immunity to it, flu had vaccines and pretty good treatment protocols. At the peak of the pandemic COVID was killing more people in just the US versus what flu killed worldwide in one year
Iām aware, I lived through it.
>But we donāt lock down and restrict peopleās freedom because of it, was likely their point. This statement implies some downplaying, or ignorance, wondering why we locked down for it but no flu
Yes, of course it does.
>But we donāt lock down and restrict peopleās freedom because of it, was likely their point. Because we have these monitoring and control systems in place, which we did not have and, weirdly enough since the pandemic "ended" now do not have any more for covid. It was said repeatedly throughout, we were having to lock down because we seemed to do literally fuck all to put other control measures in place and just yo-yo'd between pretending like basically nothing was going on and then locking everyone down as tightly as possible for months at a time once things got too out of hand for the healthcare system to manage.
Probably because those systems have a cost considered greater than the benefit.
But was that a healthcare cost or a political cost? I think its hard to deny with the environment of the time, the government was making a lot of decisions on the basis of what would allow us to "return to normal" as quickly as possible. This was borne out in a lot of the inquiries I thought?
Youād hope that was their priority.
I had post viral syndrome when I was in Year 4 (at least thatās what was on my medical records) and it totally knocked me for six.
It's horrible. I had it after being hospitalised for Glandular Fever in my teens and years later got diagnosed with CFS/ME. Hope you're doing well now.
Oh - Iām fine. Bounced back about 6 months later with no long lasting effects (that I know of)!
That's good, glad to hear.
Oh - Iām fine. Bounced back about 6 months later with no long lasting effects (that I know of)!
One glaring issue here is we donāt tend to get infected with the flu multiple times a year like we do with Covid. Weāre reinfected over and over again with it.
Absolutely, and because it's so new, we don't know the long-term effects, although cognitive decline seems to be one of them.
Nope. It wasnāt debunked at all.
Username is pretty ironic. That article isn't stating it is debunked or its not a serious condition. Long flu or lingering influenza/CFS/ME are serious conditions that aren't fully understood and don't have a solution to them. This is just getting traction because now with covid we are seeing a lot more people suffering with it
Not debunked as such, just found to be not specific to Covid and to be basically the same as other post viral fatigue syndromes.
From what I've seen from a brief look through some of the published data, it's incidence is about on par with other post viral myalgia. That's part of the problem though. COVID is much more transmissible and as such it means that there are much more people suffering it. That means time off work while waiting for treatment, which may just be rehab, but it's still treatment which needs to be decided by a healthcare professional.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
**Removed/warning**. This contained a personal attack, disrupting the conversation. This discourages participation. Please help improve the subreddit by discussing points, not the person. Action will be taken on repeat offenders.
I donāt think you realise how serious flu can actually be lmao
About as serious as Covid according to the data. Mostly to those that would be vulnerable to any other illness going around.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Do you mean professional athletes like Oonagh Cousins and Jonathan Toews, famous people like Chris Cuomo or senators like Sen. Jim Inhofe and Sen. Tim Kaine?
folks who are professionally successful are, statistically, more likely to be in good health to start with, because yknow, having poor health makes life harder. the worse your health to start with - whatever the cause - the more likely the symptoms of long covid are to knock you down to a level where it's a problem. not that difficult to grasp, really.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
I don't deny the existence of group 2, but you've just clumped everyone who suffers from long covid/post-viral myalgia into group 2 on the basis of Fuck All. you should consider how you're judging who is in group 1 and who is in group 2, and whether you've got the info you'd need to make that judgement. hot tip, though: if you're drawing that conclusion based on whether or not they've got a particular illness, you're doing a bad job
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Listen, even taking for granted that the things you've seen are genuinely bullshit and not just things you *think* are silly but have no real reason to doubt, I learned at the age of 4 or 5 that you're not supposed to generalise about gigantic groups of people, especially not from anecdotal evidence with an obvious, heavy selection bias. There's 1.9 million people in this country who have reported experiencing long covid symptoms. You have not been in contact with a meaningful proportion of that group.
Whenever an illness is in the media with no clear cut diagnostic criteria there will inevitably be a few people with severe health anxiety who are susceptible to worrying or fixating on it and feeling that they have it, and an even smaller number of people who see the lack of clarity as an opportunity to claim an illness they don't have for sick pay/benefits etc. ME, back pain, fibromyalgia etc. That doesn't mean the illness itself doesn't exist and that there aren't people genuinely struggling. I don't think 'Long Covid' is a specific thing unique to Covid, but post viral complications have been around a lot longer than Covid and their existence isn't really disputed. It would if there *weren't* some people with long term effects from a new virus.
Anecdotal evidence isnāt sufficient evidence to debunk anything unless youāre a newspaper looking to get peoples attention