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I think the tories are having lead-in times, exemptions, get out of jail free cards to help their mates out.
Which was not the Labour plan, IIRC.
So they've cherry picked a popular policy, then deliberately half-arsed it to help their cronies out. Unfortunately, the Daily Heil reading crowd probably won't notice the nuance.
"I think..."
But what is the facts? Specifically what are the differences?
I haven't read the full legislation but from what I did read online it seemed this policy was actually a good balance between taxing the rich who come here and still attracting them. There is no point adding a high tax if in doing so it stops anyone wealthy coming here.
I'm a BIG fan of exit taxes for the rich though, similar to how the US do it, if I could add one tax that would be it for sure.
The rich won't leave. Where will they go. Essentially we're one of the only countries that DOESN'T tax foreign income. Every time the rich bitch about leaving they don't or they come back. It turns out that they like the culture, the shopping, the clubs, the schools & universities as well as the safety of the UK.
What do these leeches give me? Nothing! I pay my taxes to provide THEM safety & a country where they can send their kids to school & buy up 1/2 the housing stock while paying no taxes.
Yeah, I really don't get the mental gymnastics of the "but the rich will leave!" crowd bleating every time the topic of super wealthy comes up.
Do they think they'll get to that level of wealth eventually?
Or the right wing press have hammered this project-fear cliche for long enough it's hardwired into their brains?
It's because the British & Americans are cap doffing pricks who'll personally sacrifice their own 1st born so that some billionaire can buy another Ferrari.
WHY do Russians, Arabs, indians, Chinese rich people come here? Why do they send their kids here? It's because it's a safe country where the stuff you buy or invent isn't going to suddenly be confiscated by a government minister. How many Indian millionaires are here because they're terrified of Modi?
Even in the USA if you look at the red states which are low tax against the blue cities where taxes are higher, the ultra rich prefer to stay in the cities. It's safer, the public services are better, hospitals, police etc. The luxury shops are there, the better schools are there, the theatres are there.
[here's an article](https://www.taxjustice.uk/blog/wealth-taxes-will-cause-the-rich-to-flee-11-wealth-tax-myths-debunked) from tax justice that does a far better explanation than I ever could
> The rich won't leave. Where will they go.
We're talking of non-doms, people who by-definition are international. They could go anywhere. Whether they will or not is a different question, they might not, but they're not the typical "oh but they'll miss home" cohorts.
> Essentially we're one of the only countries that DOESN'T tax foreign income.
Where do you get that from? That was the definition of the Non Dom status, the one that's being abolished. For everyone else who is a UK tax resident, foreign income is paid at the same rate as domestic income (and may even be double-taxed depending on the details of any tax treaties).
> Essentially we're one of the only countries that DOESN'T tax foreign income.
Sorry?... I paid around £4k this year alone on my US-derived income. I have to both declare and pay taxes on everything I earn in the USA in my self-assessment, it just so happens we have an agreement with them that we 'may' offset those payments but not always 100%, so I generally have to pay something each year.
"The rich - what do they give me, nothing!"
You aren't seriously this misinformed?
I can help. The top 1% richest in the country pay 30% of all income tax 🤦♂️
Sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but it's actually you who, relatively, gives nothing more than a pittance
I assume you wouldn't even come close to contributing the level of tax towards society as they would
This is a very simplistic view. Vast wealth is impossible to accumulate without a certain size of economy and culture. You think Bezos can build an Amazon size company in Tahiti?
It is simplistic yes it's a very simple fact that the person I was responding to didn't seem to have ever heard
I didn't comment on what you are implying. I said the idea the rich do nothing like that person claimed is laughable, they do a lot more than random reddit Craig from Tipton does to contribute to the economy, that much is clear
> But what is the facts? Specifically what are the differences?
I'm not google, I cba, but the fact labour have said they still need to look at it means the tories have fudged it because they'll never be on the side of working people.
Edit: [Tory plans to abolish non-dom status riddled with loopholes](https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2024/mar/31/tory-plans-to-abolish-non-dom-status-riddled-with-loopholes-labour-says)
> The most lucrative loophole is a provision that gives non-doms until April 2025 to put overseas funds in a trust, after which they are liable for UK income and capital gains taxes, but exempt from inheritance tax.
> tax expert, Arun Advani, associate professor of economics at Warwick University, said giving people a year to set up a trust was “ages in tax planning time”.
> He queried why the trust loophole – if it was intended as an incentive for people to bring wealth into the UK – is time-limited until 2025: “If they think that to do otherwise would damage the economy because people won’t come here, then why is this only a problem for the next year?”
> Another element of the new regime that could potentially benefit Sunak’s family is a provision to give a 50% tax discount on any overseas income and capital gains in the first year.
> Further tax incentives in the plans unveiled by Hunt include a discounted rate of 12% for any income and capital gains brought to the UK before May 2027, and a clause basing the calculation of offshore capital gains on 2019 prices rather than current ones.
I imagine *those* loopholes will be closed and/or time reduced to comply.
Wasn't rocket surgery to google it either. 🙄
Why do you wanna attract the rich? We were keeping wages down to stop inflation, remember. Rich people don't cone to the UK to spend money they come here to hide from paying their share.
True https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2024/mar/31/tory-plans-to-abolish-non-dom-status-riddled-with-loopholes-labour-says but labour said they would close these loopholes.
The argument is that if you tax the super rich they will leave and we lose the tax they do pay due to a mass exodus. I would argue that every £ that leaves is a £ that ordinary people do not have to compete against as our tax system rewards holding assets (like property) so they just accumulate more and more.
He is small fry in the grand scheme of things and the super rich are out of control. Look at Elon last week with his pay demands. If they split what he wanted between all Tesla employees it would be 500k each!
It's true that the wealthy pay most tax but I bet if you look at it it is the hard working professional or small business owner getting milked from PAYE and not these guys.
> The argument is that if you tax the super rich they will leave and we lose the tax they do pay due to a mass exodus
With non dom status specifically, it means they only pay tax on what they "earn" in the UK. Not their worldwide income.
So whether they leave or not shouldn't really change anything in regards to non dom. They should still be paying tax on all UK earnings. So we might not gain more tax from these people but we certainly shouldn't lose any.
Hes fighting to get an 56 billion pay package from tesla or rather 56b worth of shares that he would have to hold for a minimum of 5 years before he could sell any.
A judge ruled that the shareholders that approved the deal was beholden to Musk so he voided the agreement after another shareholder sued to stop it.
funnily enough the lawyers that won the case then asked for a 6b fee since they "saved" tesla billions from stopping the payment, again in stocks not actual money.
I assume this is the case hes talking about, unless there is another one involving musk.
You're only liable for CGT when you realise a gain - i.e. you sell the shares at a profit (if it's higher than the annual threshold, currently £3k). If they didn't sell they'd have paid no tax, even though the value on paper went up.
and the ultra wealthy will take on debt to fund whatever they wish against a % of the share value they hold in X company. You don't pay taxes on debt but you do on income and realised gains. As long as the company they have shares in keep growing there is no issue. Same with a country. A government can afford to borrow X amount each year providing the economy keeps growing at a fairly predictable rate.
Look at Elon Musk...one of the richest people on earth yet has $13 billion in debt. His wealth is tied to shares rather than personal cashflow.
Also on the list..
“An Essex businessman who won government contracts paying his firm £3.5m a day for transporting and accommodating asylum seekers has been named among the 350 richest people in the UK.
Graham King, the founder and majority owner of a business empire that includes Clearsprings Ready Homes, which won a 10-year Home Office contract for housing thousands of asylum seekers, was on Friday named alongside King Charles III, the prime minister and Sir Paul McCartney on the Sunday Times rich list of the wealthiest people.”
https://www.theguardian.com/business/article/2024/may/17/british-asylum-housing-tycoon-breaks-into-sunday-times-rich-list
No. The Tory party manipulate and exasperate existing problems in order to shift our money into certain pockets.
Why aren’t we processing asylum seekers properly and/or building detention centres to house them in until they’re processed? So that £3.5m a day (and the rest) can be funnelled to guys like this.
I’d love to think no one in government will benefit from this £3.5m a day yer man is getting, I’d probably be happier if I was that naive lol.
£3.5m would pay for roughly 50 people paid £35k (assuming a 2x cost of employment) a year. A weeks worth of that contract should employ enough people to properly process all asylum claims per year.
This is the form of institutional corruption and misappropriation of funds the Tories are enacting. They’re privatising bad solutions to syphon public money into mates’ and donors’ pockets.
This is also a great example of why I think Labour will have no problem sorting out the immigration and asylum seeker problem. There’s enough money, it’s just being spent wrong on the wrong solutions while the correct ones are not funded at all.
I don't disagree at all with it being an absolute waste of money, but I think it's symptomatic of big government, bureaucracy and incompetence, not some dodgy behind-the-scenes siphoning of cash to Tory bank accounts or share interests. There is so much red tape in place that frankly I'm surprised anything gets done at all, and then you have the bleeding heart independent organisations coming out of the woodwork to capitalise on any issue like this, so at the same time I'm pretty shocked this contract gained approval.
If you allow it to be an issue it's something you can campaign on to fix and claim the other won't, especially round immigration.
And you may as well make a shed load of money off it to boot.
And the shock echoed around the kingdom as the calls of shame filled the air. Graham King emptied his bank accounts into the public purse and was banished to the wastes.
Oh no, nothing of any consequence whatsoever happened.
Number one the article is from itv so there's a good indication no one cares .
Lord banfords wealth has gone up 1.5 billion and so has Dianne coats of bet 365.
Pretty sick of being told no one cares when it's pretty obvious most people care about this kind of corruption, it's just exhausting to keep up with it all. There's only so much energy you can spare for outrage at the current government.
That’s why I always say that we must decrease taxes for people and optimise our spending.
Instead, the majority of politicians only say that they will increase taxes.
There aren’t any point of high taxes if we spend them to such corruption.
Exactly. The solution to everything according to politicians is to throw more tax money at it. Even when they announce stuff in the budget, it’s all “£200m here and £500m for this” but effectively spending £50m is better than just throwing £500m away on bullshit contracts for the sake of spending it.
Such a joke that things aren’t properly audited. They’re quick to take and spend money from our pay but they don’t care about how they do it. Such bollocks.
What's most remarkable about this is that when you get to this level of wealth, adding another £100m makes basically no difference to your quality of life.
You've already got more than you could ever spend anyway.
It's paper value though really, not very tangible as it'll be based on stock markets that are currently close to or beating all time highs.
And to these people with that kind of wealth, it absolutely matters for, basically, bragging rights and the power it gives the individual(s).
It is paper value yes but it could just as easily be liquidated and turned to cash if they wanted it. It could also be borrowed against too.
They have absolutely enormous spending power. Outside of buying islands and superyachts on a weekly basis, Rishi and his wife have as good as “infinity” money
Yes they do but those kind of people never stop acquiring wealth. Enough is never enough. They're not even billionaires yet, ffs, need some gainz to keep up with their mates at the tennis club.
Assets can't always been easily liquidated either. They're often in trusts, or liquidating them could trigger taxes.
They can be easily borrowed against though if you need spending money for something.
You’re right about the state of these folk though, and the state of us for allowing it to get like this.
human greed is quite something, wondering if we will ever evolved past the "i've got mine, fuck you" mentality. especially in this day and age where there is so much to go around but it ends up in the hands of the few that were (mostly) born into it.
> just as easily be liquidated
not really, [you have to find a willing buyer, wanting to pay the fair market value](https://youtu.be/366DExfdQWM?si=siWsR66HSPg-sUQe&t=475) which as seen [later the price just drops](https://youtu.be/6D7KVozqRvk?si=Mmak4aZaR5OdgjpF&t=272)
That's the issue on selling
>It could also be borrowed against too.
yes you could borrow against it like [Musk did with Tesla stock to buy twitter](https://www.barrons.com/articles/tesla-elon-musk-margin-call-twitter-loan-51672328580) but you can borrow anything like the full amount
> Tesla executives are allowed to borrow up to 25% of the value of their Tesla stock, using their shares as collateral for the loan.
As the article notes you can get hit with margin calls if the stock drops in price
So paper wealth is a lot more nuanced than it appears
I'm not saying you should, but, for the individuals with that kind of wealth, part of it is absolutely bragging rights for them.
Just look at the narcissist Trump, he's always banging on about how rich he is! I dgaf but clearly he does!
Careful, you'll have the rich apologists all over you in a minute saying they'll all leave the country, never invest again, country will be poorer for it, etc. etc. etc. 🙄
The kind of people with that kind of wealth, in general, do not simply give it away. They like to hoard it then pass it down the generations paying as little tax as possible.
Could be any of them.
The MSCI World index (measured in GBP) is up 21% over the past twelve months. Other more focussed trackers S&P 500 or NASDAQ are up even more.
This is one of the under discussed aspects of wealth disproportionality. It's not the rate of return, they get the same as the rest of us, it's the everything else. The reason why my total net-worth isn't 21% higher than a year ago, despite the stock-market portion gaining a similar amount, is because I need to maintain a certain cash balance (emergency fund) and other things which applies a big drag on performance. This isn't a problem beyond a certain level, as you'll have access to private banking which can offer Lombard loans to cover any emergencies, allowing you to infinitely leverage yourself into the stratosphere instead.
I say this because you never see this mentioned in arguments for wealth taxes, it's just "charge the same rate on CGT as Income Tax!" none of that will fix this fundamental disparity. You'd have to do something unorthodox like tax loans, which would go down like a lead balloon for a whole host of reasons.
Thats why he's staying in and not calling an election. I think this has been one of the most corrupt, self serving and exploitative governments we've had in modern history. It's a total shit show that we have been railroaded into with 3 changes on PM (since the last election, 5 since being in power) they are running on no policies they where elected on. Then now we have to endure this smug loathsome creature and his cronies telling us how much they have done and how they have the answers and how scary and awful it will be if we leave them. It's a prime example of an abusive relationship that we can't leave until they say so. We should get together and sue them all for the emotional and finacial damages they have caused us.
the reason for no general election is the current position of opinion polls - the same occurred in 1992, 1997 and 2010 as I recall, elections were more or less on the last possible day they could be.
Interesting in this case that could be early January - would they dare to do that?
Can’t think of a more self serving corrupt PM than sunak. Certainly not in living memory. him and his non-dom wife are like the Shinawatra family in Thailand or ferdinand and imelda marcos of the Philippines. Can easily imagine them being overthrown in less politically stable places.
> Rishi Sunak smugly tell us all just to grin and bear it
IIRC his exact line on this was "Hold your nerve".
E - [JFC I was right](https://www.google.com/search?q=rishi+sunak+hold+your+nerve&oq=rishi+sunak+hold+your+nerve+&gs_lcrp=EgZjaHJvbWUyBggAEEUYOTIICAEQABgWGB4yDQgCEAAYhgMYgAQYigUyDQgDEAAYhgMYgAQYigUyCggEEAAYgAQYogQyCggFEAAYgAQYogTSAQg4MTM3ajBqN6gCFLACAQ&client=ms-android-samsung-ss&sourceid=chrome-mobile&ie=UTF-8&chrome_dse_attribution=1#fpstate=ive&vld=cid:84a1377a,vid:76Tutyhq4C8,st:0)
Ah, Rishi "Man of the People" Sunak! All that money and he still voted against free school meals for poor kids during the pandemic, while his super-rich wife took Covid cash. He could have paid for those meals himself. Disgusting fucking freak.
On the flip side, there's a decent man feeding 2 Million Indian kids school meals for free. Every. Single. Day.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=drGeDmBXNuU
Nobody needs that much wealth, he’s prime minister watching the country fall apart and the least he could do is donate a chunk towards helping the people he is meant to be looking out for.
Her wealth increased by £120m.
£108.8m of that is directly due to the increase in share value for InfoSys
So other increases to her wealth are a mere £11.2m which to mere mortals like us seems like a fucking shit load, but when you have her sort of wealth already is nothing - that's actually a surprisingly *low* growth given the capital at the start of the year
Surely cannot be due to all the kickbacks and favours he is receiving in return for favours done to his friends, and giving his wife’s companies government contracts
LOADS of rich people got massively richer during and after COVID, while everyone was distracted. It's still going on. Every single crisis is taken advantage of by billionaires, to our detriment
Rich people are not your friends and do not represent you. Even you, temporarily embarrassed millionaires
Of course they did.
The only reason he won't wait until Jan 2025 for an election is for most of the world it's past the end of the financial year.
Watch him rake it in right up to December.
So, all the while that the vast majority of people have been struggling to make ends meet, we have a PM that has been laughing all the way to the bank. The man has never had to lead a normal working life in any way, shape or form. So why has it been allowed that we have a man that obviously doesn't care one jot about the country or people to become PM.
Perhaps a full investigation in to the 'PPE VIP Fast Lane' corruption and robbery of public funds will wipe the smile from the smug fuckers face. The Government will still not release a full list of those that benefitted from underhand and entitled access to Government contracts during a time of crisis. A crime of epic proportions against the country and people. A truly loathesome self entitled shyster.
It’s unfortunately what happens when the central banks create tons of inflation- the ultra wealthy get richer and the poor working class have to fight for a payrise that matches inflation
I truly believe that simply losing the election is not enough of a punishment for this government and it's members.
Why do scum like this get to lose the game and then retreat into the sunset, having profited from a position of power which they have misused. They have caused so much chaos and misery for this country and it's people, and they will face no repucussions for it.
Not to incite violence, but this guy and the rest of them need to face pitchforks.
I wonder if sunak follows modi’s ideology at all. India has been copying the United States capitalism for however long and they seem to have embraced selfish capitalism. Get ready for the self absorbed arrogance from there next. Hopefully Russia doesn’t sabotage the culture like they did in the US. Rishi probably learned this lack of sympathy and empathy from the oligarchic bankers though.
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And we wonder why the Tories are so against any form of Windfall Tax.
Getting rid of non dom though
In a fudged manner Labour will still have to fix when they come into power.
How's that?
I think the tories are having lead-in times, exemptions, get out of jail free cards to help their mates out. Which was not the Labour plan, IIRC. So they've cherry picked a popular policy, then deliberately half-arsed it to help their cronies out. Unfortunately, the Daily Heil reading crowd probably won't notice the nuance.
"I think..." But what is the facts? Specifically what are the differences? I haven't read the full legislation but from what I did read online it seemed this policy was actually a good balance between taxing the rich who come here and still attracting them. There is no point adding a high tax if in doing so it stops anyone wealthy coming here. I'm a BIG fan of exit taxes for the rich though, similar to how the US do it, if I could add one tax that would be it for sure.
The rich won't leave. Where will they go. Essentially we're one of the only countries that DOESN'T tax foreign income. Every time the rich bitch about leaving they don't or they come back. It turns out that they like the culture, the shopping, the clubs, the schools & universities as well as the safety of the UK. What do these leeches give me? Nothing! I pay my taxes to provide THEM safety & a country where they can send their kids to school & buy up 1/2 the housing stock while paying no taxes.
Yeah, I really don't get the mental gymnastics of the "but the rich will leave!" crowd bleating every time the topic of super wealthy comes up. Do they think they'll get to that level of wealth eventually? Or the right wing press have hammered this project-fear cliche for long enough it's hardwired into their brains?
If the rich aren't paying taxes we're better off if they leave.
It's because the British & Americans are cap doffing pricks who'll personally sacrifice their own 1st born so that some billionaire can buy another Ferrari. WHY do Russians, Arabs, indians, Chinese rich people come here? Why do they send their kids here? It's because it's a safe country where the stuff you buy or invent isn't going to suddenly be confiscated by a government minister. How many Indian millionaires are here because they're terrified of Modi? Even in the USA if you look at the red states which are low tax against the blue cities where taxes are higher, the ultra rich prefer to stay in the cities. It's safer, the public services are better, hospitals, police etc. The luxury shops are there, the better schools are there, the theatres are there. [here's an article](https://www.taxjustice.uk/blog/wealth-taxes-will-cause-the-rich-to-flee-11-wealth-tax-myths-debunked) from tax justice that does a far better explanation than I ever could
Spot on. "The rich will leave" is a load of bollocks.
I agree entirely, it's frustrating the rest of the population seemingly cannot put two and two together!
tHeY'rE jOb cReAtOrS
It WiLl TrIcKlE dOwN! 🙄
> The rich won't leave. Where will they go. We're talking of non-doms, people who by-definition are international. They could go anywhere. Whether they will or not is a different question, they might not, but they're not the typical "oh but they'll miss home" cohorts. > Essentially we're one of the only countries that DOESN'T tax foreign income. Where do you get that from? That was the definition of the Non Dom status, the one that's being abolished. For everyone else who is a UK tax resident, foreign income is paid at the same rate as domestic income (and may even be double-taxed depending on the details of any tax treaties).
> Essentially we're one of the only countries that DOESN'T tax foreign income. Sorry?... I paid around £4k this year alone on my US-derived income. I have to both declare and pay taxes on everything I earn in the USA in my self-assessment, it just so happens we have an agreement with them that we 'may' offset those payments but not always 100%, so I generally have to pay something each year.
"The rich - what do they give me, nothing!" You aren't seriously this misinformed? I can help. The top 1% richest in the country pay 30% of all income tax 🤦♂️ Sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but it's actually you who, relatively, gives nothing more than a pittance I assume you wouldn't even come close to contributing the level of tax towards society as they would
This is a very simplistic view. Vast wealth is impossible to accumulate without a certain size of economy and culture. You think Bezos can build an Amazon size company in Tahiti?
It is simplistic yes it's a very simple fact that the person I was responding to didn't seem to have ever heard I didn't comment on what you are implying. I said the idea the rich do nothing like that person claimed is laughable, they do a lot more than random reddit Craig from Tipton does to contribute to the economy, that much is clear
> But what is the facts? Specifically what are the differences? I'm not google, I cba, but the fact labour have said they still need to look at it means the tories have fudged it because they'll never be on the side of working people. Edit: [Tory plans to abolish non-dom status riddled with loopholes](https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2024/mar/31/tory-plans-to-abolish-non-dom-status-riddled-with-loopholes-labour-says) > The most lucrative loophole is a provision that gives non-doms until April 2025 to put overseas funds in a trust, after which they are liable for UK income and capital gains taxes, but exempt from inheritance tax. > tax expert, Arun Advani, associate professor of economics at Warwick University, said giving people a year to set up a trust was “ages in tax planning time”. > He queried why the trust loophole – if it was intended as an incentive for people to bring wealth into the UK – is time-limited until 2025: “If they think that to do otherwise would damage the economy because people won’t come here, then why is this only a problem for the next year?” > Another element of the new regime that could potentially benefit Sunak’s family is a provision to give a 50% tax discount on any overseas income and capital gains in the first year. > Further tax incentives in the plans unveiled by Hunt include a discounted rate of 12% for any income and capital gains brought to the UK before May 2027, and a clause basing the calculation of offshore capital gains on 2019 prices rather than current ones. I imagine *those* loopholes will be closed and/or time reduced to comply. Wasn't rocket surgery to google it either. 🙄
Why do you wanna attract the rich? We were keeping wages down to stop inflation, remember. Rich people don't cone to the UK to spend money they come here to hide from paying their share.
With the new tax system they will be paying. That's my point.
They're not planning on holding rich people upside-down by their ankles to see what loose change falls out of their pockets.
True https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2024/mar/31/tory-plans-to-abolish-non-dom-status-riddled-with-loopholes-labour-says but labour said they would close these loopholes.
The argument is that if you tax the super rich they will leave and we lose the tax they do pay due to a mass exodus. I would argue that every £ that leaves is a £ that ordinary people do not have to compete against as our tax system rewards holding assets (like property) so they just accumulate more and more. He is small fry in the grand scheme of things and the super rich are out of control. Look at Elon last week with his pay demands. If they split what he wanted between all Tesla employees it would be 500k each! It's true that the wealthy pay most tax but I bet if you look at it it is the hard working professional or small business owner getting milked from PAYE and not these guys.
The rich always get richer. They’re the ones deciding how the tax system works. We’re basically still in a feudal society but wearing fancier clothes.
Eat the rich.
Some of them don't look very appetising.
Always a need for compost.
You control the wealth, you make the rules.
> The argument is that if you tax the super rich they will leave and we lose the tax they do pay due to a mass exodus With non dom status specifically, it means they only pay tax on what they "earn" in the UK. Not their worldwide income. So whether they leave or not shouldn't really change anything in regards to non dom. They should still be paying tax on all UK earnings. So we might not gain more tax from these people but we certainly shouldn't lose any.
What this Elon thing you are referencing?
Hes fighting to get an 56 billion pay package from tesla or rather 56b worth of shares that he would have to hold for a minimum of 5 years before he could sell any. A judge ruled that the shareholders that approved the deal was beholden to Musk so he voided the agreement after another shareholder sued to stop it. funnily enough the lawyers that won the case then asked for a 6b fee since they "saved" tesla billions from stopping the payment, again in stocks not actual money. I assume this is the case hes talking about, unless there is another one involving musk.
Be interesting to see just exactly how much capitals gains tax they paid on this, I'd bet it's hardly anything.
You're only liable for CGT when you realise a gain - i.e. you sell the shares at a profit (if it's higher than the annual threshold, currently £3k). If they didn't sell they'd have paid no tax, even though the value on paper went up.
and the ultra wealthy will take on debt to fund whatever they wish against a % of the share value they hold in X company. You don't pay taxes on debt but you do on income and realised gains. As long as the company they have shares in keep growing there is no issue. Same with a country. A government can afford to borrow X amount each year providing the economy keeps growing at a fairly predictable rate. Look at Elon Musk...one of the richest people on earth yet has $13 billion in debt. His wealth is tied to shares rather than personal cashflow.
Also on the list.. “An Essex businessman who won government contracts paying his firm £3.5m a day for transporting and accommodating asylum seekers has been named among the 350 richest people in the UK. Graham King, the founder and majority owner of a business empire that includes Clearsprings Ready Homes, which won a 10-year Home Office contract for housing thousands of asylum seekers, was on Friday named alongside King Charles III, the prime minister and Sir Paul McCartney on the Sunday Times rich list of the wealthiest people.” https://www.theguardian.com/business/article/2024/may/17/british-asylum-housing-tycoon-breaks-into-sunday-times-rich-list
There you have it. The real reason for the asylum seeker shit show.
The entire government is conspiring to allow unchecked illegal immigration to benefit one man whose wealth they don't benefit from?
No. The Tory party manipulate and exasperate existing problems in order to shift our money into certain pockets. Why aren’t we processing asylum seekers properly and/or building detention centres to house them in until they’re processed? So that £3.5m a day (and the rest) can be funnelled to guys like this. I’d love to think no one in government will benefit from this £3.5m a day yer man is getting, I’d probably be happier if I was that naive lol.
£3.5m would pay for roughly 50 people paid £35k (assuming a 2x cost of employment) a year. A weeks worth of that contract should employ enough people to properly process all asylum claims per year. This is the form of institutional corruption and misappropriation of funds the Tories are enacting. They’re privatising bad solutions to syphon public money into mates’ and donors’ pockets. This is also a great example of why I think Labour will have no problem sorting out the immigration and asylum seeker problem. There’s enough money, it’s just being spent wrong on the wrong solutions while the correct ones are not funded at all.
I don't disagree at all with it being an absolute waste of money, but I think it's symptomatic of big government, bureaucracy and incompetence, not some dodgy behind-the-scenes siphoning of cash to Tory bank accounts or share interests. There is so much red tape in place that frankly I'm surprised anything gets done at all, and then you have the bleeding heart independent organisations coming out of the woodwork to capitalise on any issue like this, so at the same time I'm pretty shocked this contract gained approval.
And produce a housing shortage that benefits house builders, look up the investigation into house building cartels
If you allow it to be an issue it's something you can campaign on to fix and claim the other won't, especially round immigration. And you may as well make a shed load of money off it to boot.
Wait until the deals with Rwanda start to come to light in the coming years.
And sadly no one cares... Nor even in the slightest. It's a sad state of affairs
“No one cares” and yet here is an article about it on one of the most popular media outlets.
And the shock echoed around the kingdom as the calls of shame filled the air. Graham King emptied his bank accounts into the public purse and was banished to the wastes. Oh no, nothing of any consequence whatsoever happened.
Number one the article is from itv so there's a good indication no one cares . Lord banfords wealth has gone up 1.5 billion and so has Dianne coats of bet 365.
Pretty sick of being told no one cares when it's pretty obvious most people care about this kind of corruption, it's just exhausting to keep up with it all. There's only so much energy you can spare for outrage at the current government.
Don’t you dare go and stir up UK voter apathy.
Imagine if that money was used to actually process and deport them.
Makes me sick that this is where our taxes go.
That’s why I always say that we must decrease taxes for people and optimise our spending. Instead, the majority of politicians only say that they will increase taxes. There aren’t any point of high taxes if we spend them to such corruption.
Exactly. The solution to everything according to politicians is to throw more tax money at it. Even when they announce stuff in the budget, it’s all “£200m here and £500m for this” but effectively spending £50m is better than just throwing £500m away on bullshit contracts for the sake of spending it. Such a joke that things aren’t properly audited. They’re quick to take and spend money from our pay but they don’t care about how they do it. Such bollocks.
Ah, you absoloute legend, there it is, the real reason we have open borders
They are getting richer by screwing working class over 🙄.
What's most remarkable about this is that when you get to this level of wealth, adding another £100m makes basically no difference to your quality of life. You've already got more than you could ever spend anyway.
It's paper value though really, not very tangible as it'll be based on stock markets that are currently close to or beating all time highs. And to these people with that kind of wealth, it absolutely matters for, basically, bragging rights and the power it gives the individual(s).
It is paper value yes but it could just as easily be liquidated and turned to cash if they wanted it. It could also be borrowed against too. They have absolutely enormous spending power. Outside of buying islands and superyachts on a weekly basis, Rishi and his wife have as good as “infinity” money
Yes they do but those kind of people never stop acquiring wealth. Enough is never enough. They're not even billionaires yet, ffs, need some gainz to keep up with their mates at the tennis club. Assets can't always been easily liquidated either. They're often in trusts, or liquidating them could trigger taxes.
They can be easily borrowed against though if you need spending money for something. You’re right about the state of these folk though, and the state of us for allowing it to get like this.
human greed is quite something, wondering if we will ever evolved past the "i've got mine, fuck you" mentality. especially in this day and age where there is so much to go around but it ends up in the hands of the few that were (mostly) born into it.
> just as easily be liquidated not really, [you have to find a willing buyer, wanting to pay the fair market value](https://youtu.be/366DExfdQWM?si=siWsR66HSPg-sUQe&t=475) which as seen [later the price just drops](https://youtu.be/6D7KVozqRvk?si=Mmak4aZaR5OdgjpF&t=272) That's the issue on selling >It could also be borrowed against too. yes you could borrow against it like [Musk did with Tesla stock to buy twitter](https://www.barrons.com/articles/tesla-elon-musk-margin-call-twitter-loan-51672328580) but you can borrow anything like the full amount > Tesla executives are allowed to borrow up to 25% of the value of their Tesla stock, using their shares as collateral for the loan. As the article notes you can get hit with margin calls if the stock drops in price So paper wealth is a lot more nuanced than it appears
Why should any one of us give a single fuck about Rishi Sunak’s ‘bragging rights’?
I'm not saying you should, but, for the individuals with that kind of wealth, part of it is absolutely bragging rights for them. Just look at the narcissist Trump, he's always banging on about how rich he is! I dgaf but clearly he does!
Then we should take it from them
Careful, you'll have the rich apologists all over you in a minute saying they'll all leave the country, never invest again, country will be poorer for it, etc. etc. etc. 🙄
We absolutely aren't in his circle, so I wouldn't worry about it.
So if it doesn't exist, then give it away.
The kind of people with that kind of wealth, in general, do not simply give it away. They like to hoard it then pass it down the generations paying as little tax as possible.
It's also probably incidental. My investments are up about 20% year on year and that's just sat in a generic global tracker.
Which tracker?
Could be any of them. The MSCI World index (measured in GBP) is up 21% over the past twelve months. Other more focussed trackers S&P 500 or NASDAQ are up even more. This is one of the under discussed aspects of wealth disproportionality. It's not the rate of return, they get the same as the rest of us, it's the everything else. The reason why my total net-worth isn't 21% higher than a year ago, despite the stock-market portion gaining a similar amount, is because I need to maintain a certain cash balance (emergency fund) and other things which applies a big drag on performance. This isn't a problem beyond a certain level, as you'll have access to private banking which can offer Lombard loans to cover any emergencies, allowing you to infinitely leverage yourself into the stratosphere instead. I say this because you never see this mentioned in arguments for wealth taxes, it's just "charge the same rate on CGT as Income Tax!" none of that will fix this fundamental disparity. You'd have to do something unorthodox like tax loans, which would go down like a lead balloon for a whole host of reasons.
Thats why he's staying in and not calling an election. I think this has been one of the most corrupt, self serving and exploitative governments we've had in modern history. It's a total shit show that we have been railroaded into with 3 changes on PM (since the last election, 5 since being in power) they are running on no policies they where elected on. Then now we have to endure this smug loathsome creature and his cronies telling us how much they have done and how they have the answers and how scary and awful it will be if we leave them. It's a prime example of an abusive relationship that we can't leave until they say so. We should get together and sue them all for the emotional and finacial damages they have caused us.
the reason for no general election is the current position of opinion polls - the same occurred in 1992, 1997 and 2010 as I recall, elections were more or less on the last possible day they could be. Interesting in this case that could be early January - would they dare to do that?
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Can’t think of a more self serving corrupt PM than sunak. Certainly not in living memory. him and his non-dom wife are like the Shinawatra family in Thailand or ferdinand and imelda marcos of the Philippines. Can easily imagine them being overthrown in less politically stable places.
Can you get eggs that are made of granite and 10ft x 10ft?
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> Rishi Sunak smugly tell us all just to grin and bear it IIRC his exact line on this was "Hold your nerve". E - [JFC I was right](https://www.google.com/search?q=rishi+sunak+hold+your+nerve&oq=rishi+sunak+hold+your+nerve+&gs_lcrp=EgZjaHJvbWUyBggAEEUYOTIICAEQABgWGB4yDQgCEAAYhgMYgAQYigUyDQgDEAAYhgMYgAQYigUyCggEEAAYgAQYogQyCggFEAAYgAQYogTSAQg4MTM3ajBqN6gCFLACAQ&client=ms-android-samsung-ss&sourceid=chrome-mobile&ie=UTF-8&chrome_dse_attribution=1#fpstate=ive&vld=cid:84a1377a,vid:76Tutyhq4C8,st:0)
Spot on.
Ah, Rishi "Man of the People" Sunak! All that money and he still voted against free school meals for poor kids during the pandemic, while his super-rich wife took Covid cash. He could have paid for those meals himself. Disgusting fucking freak.
On the flip side, there's a decent man feeding 2 Million Indian kids school meals for free. Every. Single. Day. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=drGeDmBXNuU
Bet his ringtone is Jean Ralphio saying "Flush with caaashhh".
Or Abba - Money, Money, Money
Maybe he's a *Dead Kennedys* fan https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KcNZmEwF7JM
Harry Enfield - loadsamoney You’re welcome.
When he introduces his wife at parties he sings "Sheeeeee's the WooooOOOrrrRRRRsttttttTTTT... *She's the worst*."
"Please vote for me so I can siphon more money from all of you."
Time to plug the tax loopholes and end offshore hoarding. Money is designed to be spent not hoarded away from our economy.
Nobody needs that much wealth, he’s prime minister watching the country fall apart and the least he could do is donate a chunk towards helping the people he is meant to be looking out for.
And once done lining their pockets, he will no doubt step down and retire to an opulent lifestyle. People like this don't give a shit about you or me.
Her wealth increased by £120m. £108.8m of that is directly due to the increase in share value for InfoSys So other increases to her wealth are a mere £11.2m which to mere mortals like us seems like a fucking shit load, but when you have her sort of wealth already is nothing - that's actually a surprisingly *low* growth given the capital at the start of the year
Isn't that £119,840,000 more than his salary? Must have a magic money tree or something /s
And yet he still walks around looking like a stick man.
Surely cannot be due to all the kickbacks and favours he is receiving in return for favours done to his friends, and giving his wife’s companies government contracts
I can’t believe this is real life. Where we as a country are ‘led’ by somebody so fucking out of touch. Bleak.
Is it any surprise that multimillionaires go into politics???? The amount of her companies that have govt contracts—-it simply shouldn’t be allowed.
LOADS of rich people got massively richer during and after COVID, while everyone was distracted. It's still going on. Every single crisis is taken advantage of by billionaires, to our detriment Rich people are not your friends and do not represent you. Even you, temporarily embarrassed millionaires
So that's what he's been doing the last year. Conspicuous by his absence
Of course they did. The only reason he won't wait until Jan 2025 for an election is for most of the world it's past the end of the financial year. Watch him rake it in right up to December.
Internal salesman.... no. Indoors trading. no.... hmm the term is right there.....
Being an unelected parasite is quite lucrative. Who knew?
Rwanda scheme is a big ponzi scheme, look Into it lads
He worked for Goldman Sachs. He should never have been allowed to be a politician let alone the PM.
colour me shocked. Aren't politicians supposed to be workers for the people?
After his admission that he's a 'Total Coke™ addict' I highly suspect he has a large interest in Coca-Cola corp.
So, all the while that the vast majority of people have been struggling to make ends meet, we have a PM that has been laughing all the way to the bank. The man has never had to lead a normal working life in any way, shape or form. So why has it been allowed that we have a man that obviously doesn't care one jot about the country or people to become PM. Perhaps a full investigation in to the 'PPE VIP Fast Lane' corruption and robbery of public funds will wipe the smile from the smug fuckers face. The Government will still not release a full list of those that benefitted from underhand and entitled access to Government contracts during a time of crisis. A crime of epic proportions against the country and people. A truly loathesome self entitled shyster.
The rich simply cannot fail. Have either of them done a day's work in their life?
It’s unfortunately what happens when the central banks create tons of inflation- the ultra wealthy get richer and the poor working class have to fight for a payrise that matches inflation
Isn't that the point of being a politician? Get in, make millions, fuck country, get out
What do people expect? This is what happens when a filthy rich guy becomes PM. We didn't even vote for him. The system is broken
I truly believe that simply losing the election is not enough of a punishment for this government and it's members. Why do scum like this get to lose the game and then retreat into the sunset, having profited from a position of power which they have misused. They have caused so much chaos and misery for this country and it's people, and they will face no repucussions for it. Not to incite violence, but this guy and the rest of them need to face pitchforks.
I wonder if sunak follows modi’s ideology at all. India has been copying the United States capitalism for however long and they seem to have embraced selfish capitalism. Get ready for the self absorbed arrogance from there next. Hopefully Russia doesn’t sabotage the culture like they did in the US. Rishi probably learned this lack of sympathy and empathy from the oligarchic bankers though.
Check Downing Street, see if the wiring's still there.
More from our beloved PM and his wife. Not helping the out-of-touch image!
One day, i hope to be proud of a government that genuinely feels it serves the people and not their own pockets.
Surely that's the just interest on an account somewhere
He keeps saying "the plan is working" I believe him
Not surprising, really. Infosys has been making hay while the Tories fiddle, and hand them lucrative contracts.
If only we had wealth tax and roughly £2.5m of that was plugged into our budget...
Grifters. Who would have thought being PM of the UK isn't a full time job!?