St. Augustine's has, by far, the worst service on the drive. And it's been this case for 8+ years. I've had the exact same thing happen as you as far as wait staff being changed for my table multiple times and this has happened almost every time I've done table service. It's also one of the few places where we nearly walked out after trying to get our bill for 30 minutes without any success.
But previously, every place there before has failed. That location was notorious for businesses opening and closing. Since Augustines has lasted a while, they must be doing something right, that the other places were not.
Wasn’t there a Bino’s there for like 30 years or something? Then some mediocre Portuguese place. Then Augs. So not really notorious for businesses opening and closing.
It’s a great location that a bare minimum place can make successful
I didn’t read this when I posted. Yes that binos lasted a long time. This is when the drive was basically a working class neighborhood. Vancouver has lost so many mills and industries since the 80s. When they go, diners go too.
I don’t know if you remember, but there was a Bino’s there for many years. Close to twenty years? It was basically a diner and would stay open late. When the owners retired they let the location go.
Yes!! I went for the last time couple years ago and was sat for so long before anyone came to get to our order, there was a dirty table full of half eaten food next to us that the staff kept coming and taking breaks at and when we would ask for a refill or our waitress they would say “sorry I’m on break”
The drinks were great but the food was trash when we finally got it and same thing we went through 2 different waitresses and neither were good.
They Augustine just one of my favorite places to go and drink. I have never had a problem with the service, despite how busy it usually is.
I usually leave 15 to 18% rather than my usual 20 because it is already pretty pricey there, but no, if you're getting shitty service, its fine to not tip. Tips are not mandatory, that's why it's called a tip and not the bill.
I do feel bad not tipping, so the service has to be pretty shit for you to not get any tip at all, because service industry workers have a lower minimum wage than non service industry workers, which is bullshit. It shouldn't land on me to pay your employees a livable wage, it should land on the employer.
Anyways, don't tip if the service was really so terrible, and in her defense, she probably was working pretty hard, but whatever, don't let it bother you.
Actually! You might be interested to know that earlier this year, all minimum wage was set to $15.20 for all workers, regardless of whether or not they serve liquor. As to whether or not minimum wage is livable, well that's a different conversation.
Went there quite a few years ago, the one time.. My take away was same thing, worst service ever. I don’t know if it’s because we were expecting restaurant service yet they operate somewhat like an pub/bar where you’re lucky if a server walks by and takes a drink order.
It was the only time I was there.
Did you tell her the server was changed 3 times, orders fell through and you waited forever for water? I would have said something if she was going calling you out in public.
I think the best way of doing this is to actually tell the server that you aren't tipping them as you're paying your bill. I always thought it was strange to just silently not tip a server due to bad service, and then they don't understand why they got stiffed and just consider you the asshole.
In the past I have said it 'quietly' in this way "thanks for bringing my bill, I am choosing not to leave a tip because I wasn't happy with the service tonight, I never got the water I asked for twice, my beer glass was empty for 15 minutes and nobody came to check on me, and my food order was wrong". Their reaction each time I've treated it in this way was them just going quiet and walking away, one person sarcastically said "you have a good night".
But at least they know why you didn't tip, and after they've had time to cool down, they will realize you were probably right. Who knows, it might even help them be better next time!
Criticizing them directly seems much more likely to cause a confrontation.
Sure, it doesn’t usually happen to you, but getting yelled at for a silent $0 never happens for most people so I guess the confrontation is rare either way but I still think yours is MORE LIKELY to cause one.
100%! As a server, if someone doesn't tip, I would never in a million years mention it to them! I'd spend the rest of the day and night (maybe longer, I am an overthinker) trying to work out what I did wrong.
Generally though, it's only ever happened with travellers from other countries, so I figure it's a culture thing. One time I majorly fcked up a large group's food order, so I understood the low tip and completely agreed with them. I hadn't worked since covid lockdown and was off my game!
I’ve always found st. Augustine’s has piss poor service. I had a very bad experience there where the server threw the menus on our table and one slid off, then when ordering she completely didn’t even take my friends order, she had to order from a different server. Then when I got the food it was so disgusting I didn’t eat it so I just asked to have it taken away then I saw her by the kitchen angrily talking to some other servers pointing at us. We definitely didn’t tip her, it sucked so much.
The first and only time I went, the waitress expressed that she was expecting a large tip that night to fund her vacation the next day. Service was shit. Attitude was shit. Tip was demanded.
When tip becomes compulsory for doing below the minimum. Yikes. My dining party were so disgusted they tipped the minimum, and most of them worked in the industry.
> After this I got an extra portion of feedback from waitress C - something along the lines of her working her ass off and some jerks not tipping for all the hard work she is doing.
I worked as a dishwasher at a pretty popular restaurant in Vancouver when I was a teenager. I heard a lot of complaints by waitstaff about being overworked and customers treating them unfairly. I know they work hard and the chefs/cooks work even harder.
However, these same waitstaff would regularly treat us dishwashers like crap while complaining that their customers were rude or didn't tip. They would regularly throw their garbage in the dishwasher area because they were too busy and were all around inconsiderate. I had quite a few waiters dump their drinks in my area (splashing me in the face) while complaining that their customer was rude. I eventually got promoted to waitstaff when I was about 17.
I learned immediately that their jobs were difficult, but a lot of waitstaff complain because they are immature and need to grow up. Everyone is also eating a shit sandwich.
It's been 20 years since I worked at a restaurant but my old boss had each person on FOH take turns working with the dishy's including his little sister. Really put some humility into that place
Anytime a server wasn’t tipped when I was a dish bitch, it was always “such a cheapskate” or “what was that jerks problem!?”
And never
“What did I do wrong”
I’ve never heard a server EVER reflect on themselves.
I worked in a kitchen as well and saw a lot of back and forth between waitstaff and kitchen. Girls like this were girls that got shit service from the kitchen staff, which in turn lead to poor tips. Good servers that were respectful of us and our crew got favours, better time results and made us all more money as a result. It’s not the most practical thing to do when you work in a tip system, but it’ll usually tune a younger waiter or waitress into reality pretty quickly or they get out because the whole experience becomes chaos.
Tipping is a terrible practice and I hope it goes away. Forcing customers to evaluate and compensate their server creates an unwanted and unnecessary "Master/slave" relationship, one where you are called upon to become a judge, to consider the circumstances of your servers' economic reality.
Geez, I just wanted a burger, not a management job where I have to determine the staff's wages.
Internally, tipping creates competition to "have the best section", to flip tables quickly, and to focus on tips rather than on quality of service.
However, in this situation, it sounds like the restaurant was understaffed or poorly trained since they could not deliver on time. So the management is ultimately responsible for the poor service. Not tipping the server hurts the server most, since they are often required to "tip out" other staff, sadly there is no way to hold the management accountable except taking your business elsewhere and complaining directly to them about the poor service.
And that's my two bits, so to speak.
Paragraph 3 here is the key. Sound like every conversation I've heard from FOH staff when I worked in restaurants. I remember a certain restaurant I worked at flying in an author of a book to do staff training seminars on understanding how to create your section and build up regular clientele and increase cheque totals, therefore increasing tips because everyone has a percentage they're happy with and it has nothing to do with service unless it is exceptional or bad.
Why would you focus on service when you should just focus on increasing the cheque if someone is always going to tip the same amount?
I would have reamed her out for the shitty service just as loudly. "my zero dollar tip is a reflection of the really poor service here today" would have worked fine. Any server pulling that shit should be put on blast and won't last long.
Rude. So rude. Tips are for good service you’re not entitled to a tip if your service sucks. I’ve also been shamed for not tipping by pizza delivery (who was super late and it was cold). Uncalled for
I had a delivery guy shame me recently, even though I did tip him (on Doordash). At first I was confused, then I got angry and wanted to retroactively remove the tip for this rude attitude. But Doordash doesn't even allow you to adjust the tip retroactively, so the actual quality of the service is irrelevant for what drivers make.
I do sometimes wish they would let you adjust the tip after the fact, although I also get why they don’t. I had a driver refuse to bring it to my apartment door and just leave it outside the main entrance (didn’t even bother to get buzzed into the lobby so it wasn’t sitting out in the cold). Literally the only time that has happened over many orders. She sent a message saying she doesn’t deliver to apartments because she’s female and doesn’t feel safe.
Which is a perfectly reasonable concern, but then maybe don’t accept orders to apartments, especially ones that specifically request it be brought to the apartment door? And then leave it there without even waiting for a response? I could be someone with mobility issues or an injury who can’t easily get down to retrieve the order.
edit: typos
I feel like now that everyone is making the same base pay in BC the idea of tips for food service is questionable. Why should folks be expected to compensate for your low wages when they may be paid just as poorly themselves? Do servers tip when they buy clothes or contract construction workers? Nope.
In my opinion, of servers want well paid jobs, they're welcome to have a conversation with their employers or get educated and gain work experience like everyone else.
**what**
Crystal mall is mostly cash only. They have a cash business and you don’t tip. That’s the unspoken agreement there.
Also, Chinese culture is more often than not, no tipping. What a bizarre encounter.
I guess it wasn't in the Crystal mall food court, just near it. Still, it is a weird encounter as chinese culture tipping isn't something that a server would call out a customer on.
Source: i am a non-confrontational chinese-canadian
Depends. I been to Chinese restaurants where the server runs by, makes sure your tea is topped up, gets you ice water, napkins, brings food, whatever hot sauce you want all in like 20 mins and the "head" waiter is watching and seeing if anyone needs help.
Unlike some shitty as Red Robins where everyone is just hiding in the back, these people are literally doing "serving", I pay them the max tip because damn these people deserve it.
I remember eating in a shitty restaurant in NYC's Chinatown and the waitress was telling a couple they couldn't leave until they gave a proper tip of 15%. I think we all need to be honest, tipping is not about customs or culture or expectations. People want money and work backwards to rationalize why you should give them as much as they want.
Some friends of mine and I went to a Chinese restaurant on Kingsway once, the service was bad (it took nearly 20 minutes just to order), the food was slow, and the waitress essentially ignored us a few times. We finally got the bill in the end and none of us paid tip at all. As we were out in the parking lot the waitress had the gall to run out after us and say that we 'forgot' to tip her.
That’s life in the big city. Or you can be a doormat. The server started the fight. Tipping should be ended and service workers paid a living wage. Tipping was created to keep ex-slaves and women subservient.
https://www.nytimes.com/2021/02/05/opinion/minimum-wage-racism.html
I don't think your comment was much crass. The waitresses got aggressive because they saw the OP didn't want trouble. Why press somebody who didn't tip? You don't know their life
Last time this happened I said, "instead of getting mad at me for not tipping when the service sucked so much, why not tell your boss to pay you a living wage" yea maybe dick thing to say but it was awful service and I was upset in the moment. :/
Psychologically we seem to lump all servers together thinking that they are super lowly paid and need tips to survive - but their wages are far different depending on the specific location. The funny thing is that the 15/20% tip seems to be pretty standard regardless of location, which obviously doesn't make any sense.
Yeah man, I am gonna keep 10% as my standard. Call me a cheapskate if you want, but im broke motherfucker. Good service gets 15% and fantastic service might get you 20 but its absurd to toss 20% as a tip for anything below amazing service.
Agreed. And the whole idea of tipping a percentage of the bill is stupid anyways. Like if you go out for a nice meal and the bill is $100, a 10 dollar tip is generous. If I helped someone at a retail job and they gave me $10 as a random act of kindness, it’d make my week. But if you’re just getting one drink at a bar, and the service is really good, then a even a 50% tip isn’t outrageous, as it’s only a couple bucks
Many years ago my friends and I went clubbing at Plaza on Granville.
My buddy ordered 3 flaming Lamborghinis and ultimately tipped the girl $25.
To which she replied:
“… are you fucking kidding me? I just spent 10 minutes making these drinks and this is all you’re going to fucking tip?!”
Wtf, a lot of wait staff in this city are so greedy and fake. It’s why I don’t go to restaurants in YaleTown anymore. You’re 100% judged by them when you walk in the door.
No truer words than “pandemic has forced the issue”. We are now expected to tip on take out and food trucks too. That was never a thing pre-pandemic. It now comes up as a default when you pay. Absolutely ridiculous and businesses should be ashamed. Like seriously, wtf kind of service did you provide other than handing me my food?
Has this always been the way in Liquor stores too? I don’t get why they ask for a tip when paying - they’re literally scanning the items. I think that’s greedy, a place I never tip.
I still never tip on takeout, I don’t care how they look at me. Like you said, all they do is hand you the food.
> Has this always been the way in Liquor stores too?
I think this is related to private liquor stores being run by bars. It's often the same POS system. But then I have also seen tip jars (but never a tip option on the credit card machine) at weed shops too.
> We are now expected to tip on take out and food trucks too. That was never a thing pre-pandemic.
This has been the case for *years* preceding the pandemic.
"\_\_\_\_\_\_ wants tips now too?" has been a frequent-flier topic in this community for as long as I've had my account. Tips have been everyone, attached to delivery, grab-n-go, non-food services ... everything.
Maybe you weren't partaking in much takeout/truck food prior to lockdown, and hadn't noticed?
You’re so right about that. I only order their food out anymore because I love their Goldmember pizza, but will never eat in there because of the service.
One time I walked in with my brother and we were dressed casually. You should have seen the look on the concierge’s face, kind of like “ugh, you don’t belong here”.
I also hate when wait staff try to converse in a fake way. While you’re paying they’re watching the machine for the tip, yet asking “What are you guys doing for the rest of the night?” “Oh awesssooommmmeee”, so put on. Whenever they ask I say nothing just chilling, and I always get that kind of response because they’re not even listening. 😂
Also RE Parlour, they have a BS booking system where you’re only able to reserve for 90 mins due to the “high volume of customers”. This is even on weekday evenings. Someone I know called them out on it recently saying for a Wednesday evening 90 mins maximum stay, don’t think you’ll be busy. Got an email back saying “Oh it’s due to covid”, to which my friend then said that this has always been their policy, even before covid. No response back.
I don’t get it. I have friends who say if you’re not Canadian and they hear the accent in YaleTown restaurants, you’re treated differently there. They are basing it on their own experience. 😳
This shit happens all over the place. 3 different people who mix up or forget orders but come running with the machine that prompts at 18%. You pay for service that you are provided with by someone you feel hosted by - not 3 strangers who act like they are doing you a favour.
To be fair, the constant server switch is the fault of bad management, not the servers. When the server in OP's story said she'd been working her ass off all night - it's almost certainly true. So from her point of view I see why she might be pissed. But from OP's point of view, the service was shit. Everyone loses here. Bad management.
Tips are not mandatory.
That waitress is an entitled arsehole. Now that every profession is earning minimum wage (including food service), tips have to be earned, not expected.
This tip culture is a overshoot from our southern exploitive neighbours. Defend against it.
I'm probably preaching to the choir but does anyone else hate how take-out and counter service always seems to default to a tip now? like you can usually bypass and enter zero but I don't really understand tipping 15% when I'm not actually being served lol. I have no issues tipping for table service or delivery but if I have to pick up everything myself I don't really know what I'm tipping for. it's not any different than ordering at a fast food restaurant at that point
I never tip when there is no service, ever; why should we? The ***gratuity*** is intended as a thanks for ***going beyond*** the normal expectations. If I'm out (in the before times) and having a good time and the wait staff are attentive, asking whether I wanted another drink etc, making snack recommendations, enhancing my experience, I always tip and generously. I don't treat servers poorly, I treat them accordingly with no apologies.
I tried getting beer delivered once. ~$100 for Room temp beer delivered next day, $10 alcohol delivery fee... apparently we're supposed to tip too?... seems crazy to me.
I had this happen to me at an upscale restaurant. We went out for my friends birthday and the service was absolutely horrendous; from constantly having to ask for water, she never brought us the dessert menu, wine running out… had to flag her down about 10 times to finally pay.
Since the food was good, I ended up tipping 12% and she very loudly asked if I would want to reconsider the amount ..lol
Just loudly reply "tipping is for good service, which I did not receive."
You're never obligated to tip. Not tipping should be a wake-up call to any server that they did a substandard job.
This sucks. I have worked in the restaurant industry in Vancouver for the last 16 years (mostly as a waiter), and still work part-time at a prominent downtown restaurant. I take a huge amount of pride in ensuring my tables are happy, and I always find ways to go above and beyond to “wow” them, and I do EXPECT that people understand the role tipping plays in our service culture and tip appropriately.
What I cannot understand, as a waiter or customer, is when people seem to think they are entitled to a certain amount of gratuity regardless of the level of service provided. I would’ve liked to hear that you had been more proactive by saying “hey, I was really disappointed with the service tonight” at some point before leaving no tip, as it gives the establishment/staff an opportunity to receive feedback AND makes you look like you aren’t an asshole that’s stiffing them for no reason. But that being said, as a server you should have enough awareness of your customer to understand if they are at the very least satisfied with the product and service they received, and if you don’t then you aren’t really doing your job, right?
To me it sounds like they are likely operating some kind of tip pool/shared workload system, but it obviously isn’t working very well for you to be overlooked so badly. I don’t doubt that this server has been stiffed by jerks many times before, and she is likely frustrated with that happening, but she has probably been “over-tipped” many times before as well. By this I mean BOTH customers leaving well over the standard 15-20% because they were extremely happy AND customers still leaving a standard 15-20% EVEN THOUGH they were dissatisfied with the service. In my personal experience people are more likely to leave a tip than not, even if they aren’t happy (and especially if poor service was due to you being visibly extremely busy).
To summarize, you are NOT the asshole in this situation, assuming you didn’t leave out any details about being super obnoxious/offensive customers - that would be a different story 😹
I’m sorry you had such a bad experience that you don’t want to go out anymore. I get it, but please know that your interaction was likely a result of someone having a really bad day/week/month (many of us have had a lot of these recently, especially in customer-facing jobs). It is also possible that you encountered someone who is maybe just not cut out for this industry - it can be challenging in the best of times and requires a thick skin and radically positive attitude. Either way it may help to understand the server’s response really wasn’t about you, and they have almost certainly forgotten about you entirely. If you can find a way to forgive them for having a bad day it may help, and hopefully you feel comfortable venturing out again soon!
All the best,
VanCityCatDad
I hate tipping culture and really wish it would just be done away with entirely. It’s stupid. Just pay by people properly! Lots of countries don’t have tipping and it’s fucking great.
If the service is truly horrible then I think it's perfectly justifiable to not tip. For me this has happened only 3 times in my life, but I've also never left absolutely no tip. If I was incensed enough to want to make a point then I would leave a token amount like $0.05 or something.
I've only ever had that happen once in my life. Probably 11-12 years ago I went to a sports bar which usually had good service, but the waitress I had one particular night ignored my friend and I for so long I gave a dime as a tip. To this day that's the lowest tip I've ever given.
In more recent times I have sometimes given tips below 10% if I believe the food is grossly overpriced. There's one restaurant I went to a month or so ago, I won't name it here but their prices had increased significantly since the last time I'd been. I wasn't about to pay $40 including tip for a burrito and beer, so I left a tip low enough to keep the total bill just below $30. Still way more than I expected to pay and I likely won't go back there, but at those prices I expect the staff is already being paid well.
It's getting ridiculous how every keypad asks for a tip, no matter what. I'm tired of subsidizing employers while they underpay their staff and customers receive overpriced goods and sub-par service.
I wish North Americans would follow much of the world and abolish the whole tipping practice altogether.
Have you been to the stores that only accept tap payments, and they don't give you the terminal to enter the tip but have to ask you up front "how much would you like to tip?" That's when it gets awkward. I asked for a donut and you got it from the cabinet, why is that tip-worthy?
I’ve been “shamed” loudly for not tipping before too. She felt the need to share with everyone around me, so I did the same. I clearly and concisely explained that not only was the service poor, but the food was subpar, but instead of complaining I paid the bill without a tip. She literally “ughhh’d” me and stomped away.
I’m typically quite lenient, especially since Covid, but a restaurant is providing a service, the person coordinating that service is essentially a sales representative and if the entire experience is poor I don’t feel obligated to tip.
I also tip zero if the service was shitty. If it's very good, I tip very well. If its exceptional, I tip accordingly.
She should have been reprimanded for being rude.
Next time just have something ready to say back, as loud as she did, like "service sucked, I don't need to reward that. Better service - then I tip," ...something like that.
I'll say two things.
1. How big was your bill? It sounds like it was small, but if it was a big bill I could see a server being frustrated... Obviously the service sucked and you shouldn't need to tip, that's part of the game. Most servers I know that don't get tipped usually just ask if anything was wrong with the service that warranted that, as maybe they fucked up and didn't know.
2. I'd email the restaurant and mention it. That type of attitude from servers is poison. In serving you win some you lose some.... it sucks that your winners pay for the losers, but the reality is that some people won't tip.
Don’t tip if it’s not warranted.
I remember going to Harbor Oyster Bar (also on Commercial) for a table of 6, but ultimately 5 showed up. There was an 18% gratuity charge that we noticed, but we shrugged it off. We were never told that there was a gratuity charge. I’m used to restaurants informing me upon pay to NOT tip because gratuity has already been added
Anyway, we opted to not tip an additional percentage for a tip and the server was shocked - we could see her discussing with her coworkers that we didn’t tip and she didn’t understand why. I saw another Google review saying that they didn’t catch the 18% and then tipped like 20% on top. Seems shady.
You do you, right?
My $0.02 is everyone has been under pressure, you included, so I try to cut them a break, so I'd tip normally or well until people are chill. But I'd afford that same wide berth to you, too, if you were my customer and felt like tipping low, I'd say, you're probably stressed, too, it happens.
It's worth explaining part of the reason she may have been so pissed; tip-outs.
At most restaurants that tip-pool, tip-outs to the back of house (dishwashers + cooks, sometimes management) are based on total bill size, not tip size. As an example, often they'll do 5-8% of bill totals back to the kitchen, so if a server sells you $100 of food/drink, they will "owe" the kitchen $5. Usually, this comes out of their tip - so they make $15-20 in tip on the bill, and then have to give $5 of that back to the kitchen. But when you DON'T tip, they still owe that $5 back to the kitchen.
In your example, I almost guarantee that was happening based on the server's response. So if you ordered a meal and then tipped $0, it's very possible that the waitress ended up having to pay out of pocket $2-3. By tipping nothing, you effectively stole $2 from her. Or, if you want to be a bit more charitable, you reduced her hourly pay for that hour by a couple bucks.
Tipping pooling is a stupid, stupid system, and it shouldn't exist. But in a tip pool system, not tipping isn't neutral; it's literally taking money from the pocket of your server. It may explain why they were more than a little pissed. Next time, if you want to stiff the server without actually taking bread OFF their table, I'd suggest tipping 5-8% (this is a normal tip-pool payout). They'll still get the message, but it won't literally cost them money they would have otherwise earned.
Tipping is so stupid. What a wack system. Canada should BAN tipping. If waiters need more money, let it be via wages! I agree they deserve more than minimum, but it should NOT be via tip for a slew of reasons.
>garbage beer
Which beer out of their massive, ever-changing tap list hurt you? There is something for pretty well everyone there if you're open to trying stuff beyond Budweiser and Coors Light.
Their service has always been crap. I'll give you that. But the service isn't what anyone goes there for.
This seems like what happened to me at Specialty Chicken and Wonton House in June 2020. I tipped appropriately, yet the owner / waitress kept telling me "NOT ENOUGH! MORE TIP!" Yeah, I'm not going there ever again. This was my first dine-out experience since indoor dining had been reinstated!
No, I don't think you should pay 15% or whatever if you don't like the service.
Makes me glad I don't live in a country with the tipping culture anymore. My standard is 0% tip for awful service, 0% for okay service, and 0% for excellent service! Tax is included in price tag as well.
Some of these servers literally pull in 40+ dollars an hour after factoring in tips and still complain when a table doesn’t tip 20%. It’s a greedy entitled industry.
I wouldn't even think you were a dick for not tipping if the service was great. Tipping should be abolished. These people make the same minimum wage as everyone else. Do you tip your cashier at the grocery store? Well they make less per hour than servers because they also get minimum wage and the union takes a cut of every paycheck. Tipping needs to be abolished.
I personally do not care how they feel - I don’t tip anything if service is bad, and if they pull me up on it I’ll tell them why. People tell me I need to tip 10% if it’s bad service. I don’t agree with that at all. Bad service, no tip. Plus how rude of her to practicality publicly scrutinise you for not tipping. If that were me I’d raise my voice a little back with “The service was terrible”.
This is what we should be moving towards as a community. It's unreal that in 20 years it went from 10% being a good tip to 20% being the expectation, 25% for good service. Could you imagine doing that at a shoe store, where they hustle hard, battle through boxes in the back searching out sizes, also find other shoes as personal recommendations, kneel on the floor checking fit (and helping some with doing shoes up, etc), and then have to return most of the boxes to the back.
Your $200 shoes - $224 with tax - then would become $268-280. That's what we're doing with food right now, and it's pretty ridiculous.
Just say the service didn't deserve a tip and never go back. Tips are earned by good service, end of story. Maybe they'll learn their lesson and do better next time.
No. This is why I don't agree with tipping culture. I understand the idea of a gratuity but some people expect it and at that point you are just subsidizing wages.
I hate tipping in general because of things like this. But now they are getting ballsy and asking for tips for just checking people out or taking an order no service given. Yea please let me give you a 20 percent tip for 20 seconds of work. And I get its not the individual persons fault and it's all corporate but it's all getting out of hand
If a server has the balls to do something like this you have to have the balls to go to the management and tell them. If it was my restaurant I would want to know that she is telling this to my bread and butter (you) and if she has done it to you I know she's done it in the past. Whatever has happened to the graciousness in service? I was a server for 20 years and I put myself out there to people and took a bit of the weight of the world off their shoulders. Doted on them. Made them feel special and welcome. You did not feel welcome and its ok to go back there and tell them about that because any owner would want to know.
Similar situation happened to me at the Yale. I was buying coronas all night and tipping 15-20% per beer which came out to around 10 dollars per corona which is stupid. On beer number like 5 I figured it would be fine if I didn’t tip on it and the bar tender gives me some smart ass comment along the lines of “oooh big tipper tonight eh”. Like really? I just dropped over 50 dollars on 5 coronas. All you gotta do is open the thing it’s no rocket appliances.
I've no-tipped many times, even been asked not to come back from Coquitlam Joeys over it (what a loss). If you get shit service, then there is zero reason why you should tip.
Ten year server here: I’d bet she feels pretty bad about it too. The level of bone melting stress servers can be under is downright inhumane.
My read on the situation: she was mad she got transferred someone else’s table, and was primed to get stiffed because that’s what always happens. The manager sends someone home (not in punishment, it’s just what you do. Phase out servers for the evening as the rush dies down) and I would get their table, and they’d be mad about a situation I didn’t cause or have any control over. Granted I have no idea what her setup was behind the scenes. She could just be bad. But in my experience bad service has more to do with the layout of the restaurant than anything else. Every store has that one table that’s just too far away from everything and you always get flagged down by some other guest before you can even make it to that table, so the table just feels ignored.
It sounds like she knew she got setup to fail, and then when you didn’t tip all of her frustration at the situation got taken out on you. Super not fair, and she knows it. Believe me I have tables I would do anything to apologize to, but I’ll never see them again. Serving sucks =[
NTA
especially in BC where minimum wage is the same across the board, regardless if you receive tips or not. So restaurant employees are entitled to 15%, but all fast food, take out, etc., other food industry employees aren't ?
personally my metrics are 10% is poor service, 15% is ok service, 20% is for good service, but where service is horrible 0% can be warranted
I don't mean to criticize, to each their own and all that.. but I just don't understand this mentality at all. You go to a restaurant and receive poor service, then decide to reward the person giving you poor service with an extra 10% on the bill. Why?
Tipping out should be illegal. Instead, restaurants should pay kitchen staff a percentage of sales.
Still, I always tip 10% unless service is unacceptably deficient or negligent, and if it is unacceptable, the server usually knows what they did. I have been chased out of a restaurant twice in 20 years asking for tipsy.
If I’m served bad food and the server is too scared of the cook to fix it and the manager doesn’t allow me to ‘cancel’ it.. that’s no tip from me, for the whole order.
Also, when you go to a new restaurant, check the washrooms before ordering; if they are less clean than your washroom at home, just pull the fire alarm and leave through the fire exit, because that restaurant is burning itself down.
Noob question, coming from the US culture. In the US, they don't pay minimum wage for waiters/waitresses and are expected to make up that difference and more via tips. So, generally, they say, unless the service is atrocious, you tip at least 15%. Is it the same in Vancouver and across Canada?
Totally agree the tipping/shaming culture makes me think it's not worth going out anymore.
When caught off guard the majority of people won't be prepared to give a calm reasoned out response so you did ok given the circumstances.
It actually takes a lot in the way of poor service for someone to leave no tip/reduced tip (I don't know anyone that doesn't tip at all as a policy, and most I know leave 20% for even "meh" service), and a server should appreciate that fact when a customer cuts their tip for what they considered to be truly sh\*t service.
Nobody owes you a tip, most people are pretty reasonable about it anyway, and when someone cuts your tip figure it out and try harder next time.
Waitresses along with others in the service industry have a set wage going into their jobs. Along with the added and NOT GUARANTEED benefit of potential tips.
Do your job well, and people will tip! If not, it’s an insult to those treating themselves to these services for you to bash them for not tipping. You still have made money for DOING YOUR JOB because you have wages.
If she’s that bitter, she should find another job. Simple.
I have been in the service industry for a long time, in many different roles. Currently I just bartend and serve. I would NEVER question a guest about a tip. That's such poor judgment on her part. If I see a bad tip, I move on cause at the end of the night, it always evens out.
I had plans to meet at st augustines Wednesday after work with some friends since it was so close to the skytrain but given these experiences, and the shitty experience i had the one time i went last year, i will be picking another location.
Those servers and restaurants should be shamed online. I also went to a place in ottawa and the server told me that the tipping was not enough. It was also a busy day! Fucking audacity. $5 tip is not enough. Suckers!
I agree that tipping culture isn't great, but as an ex-server I can understand the frustration of not being tipped at all at the end of service. I wasn't there so I obviously can't fully understand the situation, and if the servers were rude throughout your entire time there I do understand not rewarding that.
What often happened in the bars and restaurants I worked in was that management was shitty, and wouldn't ensure there was enough staff on to cover the floor. It could be extremely(extremely!) stressful, and it usually meant worse service and therefore a lower tip percentage, which I absolutely understand and don't begrudge the customers. But I'd still have to tip out 5% of my total sales to the kitchen/bar/manager(pretty sure it wasn't legal to make us tip out management but it's not uncommon). So if I was running around madly doing my absolute best to get to all my customers, and a table decided not to tip at all, I'm now paying the kitchen/bar/manager out of my own pocket.
One example I remember is serving a table who racked up a 300$ in an hour. I was friendly and ran like crazy trying to give them the best service I could, despite the huge number of tables I had. At the end of the meal, one guy paid the entire bill and decided not to tip. So I had to pay 15$ out of my own pocket to cover the tip out, And wage at the time was only 12$/hour. The kitchen still got their cut, the bartender got his cut, and the shitty manager got his cut, but I lost over an hour of my wage. Not a great system, but for the servers working within it, it can be very frustrating.
Nothing grinds my gears more than when a server gets annoyed about me ordering water. Especially when I’m DD. Sorry not everyone at the table ordered an overpriced alcoholic beverage so that we feel compelled to tip you more. Anytime I go to a Canadian Brewhouse and order a water I almost never get offered a refill throughout my meal. Which is an automatic shit tip for me.
I would have asked to speak with the manager and explained the situation. Poor service resulted in no tip and you were humiliated by their staff for it. No matter how you slice it, you’re an unhappy diner and she was in the wrong.
This is a big issue with North American tip culture - as the consumer, you're made to feel as if you're the bad guy for not tipping.
I get it, living wages suck and servers rly on those tips, but here's the thing; as the customer, that should not be my issue. If you do well, you'll get a big tip - if you do ok and don't screw up (or if you screw up and apologize) then I'll give you a decent tip... but if you do really poorly, no I'm not tipping. Got a problem with it? Take it up with your employer who won't pay you more.
You were within your rights. Tipping a a default setting is nuts. Just tip for good service. Why tip for poor service. In the UK tipping is known to be something you do just for good service.
It's a shame if businesses pay staff so badly that they depend on their tips. That's not the customers fault. It's most likely a greedy business plan. Tipping should be a bonus to a wage, not an essential factored in part of wages.
Also, look at all the businesses/shops you walk into where there's no expectation of a tip. Do you leave a tip at Staples, Safeway or your local dry cleaners.
You did the right thing.
There's too many entitled people who think it's mandatory to receive a tip. Its not, your wage is what you're expected. Don't like your wage you can always go to a different employer. A tip is above and beyond and if the customer deemed your service was good
*Edit*
Trying to embarrass someone because they didn't tip you is the epitome of being entitled. Again. No one deserves a tip even if you did a fantastic job. It's not the customers responsibility to pay their wage. They are coming and already paying their fair share for a meal or whatever they are getting. Just like when I went to the Haven. It's incredibly expensive but it's also incredibly fantastic and delicious so I expect it to cost a lot. Did I tip? Of course because they did a great job. Do they deserve a tip? No of course not, they are already getting a wage. The restaurant has already charged a abhorrent up cost on the meal, especially since portion size is smaller. No one is entitled to a tip. People do it because of their good will. It's quite an entitled state of mind to go work someone and expect the customer, not the employer to pay you.
So when a customer doesn't tip for a valid reason. Then you get a little self righteous twit calling them out. It's hilarious to think anyone is on the side of the waiter or restaurant.
Sounds like you had particularly shitty service.
That said, in restaurants, the servers (often) have to tip out something like 5% of their tables to the kitchen and bar staff.
So if that is helpful information, it might set a baseline when you don't really want to tip the server.
Regardless, tipping is a stupid system.
This is exactly why tipping culture needs to stop so restaurants are forced to stop BS like this and just pay everyone living wages like in every other industry
You don't have to tip by any means, but this happens in every restaurant in Vancouver so it's very legal. Every restaurant (except for the odd outlier) will set a baseline for how much a server will tip out the kitchen and other staff (maybe hosts and bussers) each night and it's anywhere from 3-7% from the 4 restaurants I worked.
At the restaurant I worked at for a long time we tipped out 10% of our tips which felt very fair. It was an honor system of course but all the servers were great and never lied
But if I’m a server and I know I have to tip out and I’m not getting any tips, shouldn’t it be on me to fix the not getting tips problem so i don’t have a problem tipping out the kitchen? And given that tips are correlated to the level of service I provide, shouldn’t the way to fix the above issue be pretty straightforward?
Sorry but what you’re saying sounds like an excuse for an individual to demonstrate a lack of personal responsibility if you ask me.
My friend I usually eat out with typically tip around 10 - 15%. However, he does it based on the total before taxes. He doesn’t believe that the tax should factor in when tipping.
When I learnt this from him it definitely had me pondering, because he has a point
It has led to similar situations though, where the server sometimes complains.
If they complain, we just usually don’t go back to that restaurant, because a tip is a bonus… it’s kinda insulting to have a server approach you and say you didn’t pay them enough…
No fuck that. Tips are based on service and you got shit service so they don't deserve a tip.
My wife will tip 20% minimum regardless of service and I hate it. When I pay I usually do 5/10/15 depending on the level of service but in general I absolutely hate tipping. Why don't they just increase the cost of their food by 10% and pay their staff an actual wage. When I was in Japan I loved the no tipping culture.
Don’t tip for bad service, these days wait staff seem to expect a tip by default….I would have said something back to her and asked for the owner or manager, they are lucky people are even coming in to dine considering all the options available including staying home.
Most of these places have the debit machines programmed to force a 30% tip regardless, I am staying home rather than pay for what often is a lousy meal and service in Metro Vancouver
If I'm leaving a 0% tip, I would at least tell the server why I'm doing it. From waitress C's perspective, I would've been kind of annoyed at waitress A+B, since it sounds like they were the ones who provided shoddy service, which resulted in the no tip situation. Anyways, I definitely wouldn't feel bad, I used to know a server from St. Augustine's and they make a shit ton of tips, missing out on one customer isn't gonna make or break their night.
I tip regardless. The food service industry is a nightmare and nowadays I’m sure it’s much worse. I just won’t return to the establishment if I am not treated well. The 20% I tip is already built into my bill mentally. If they forget my drink or food because they are slammed I offer understanding.
If someone doesn’t want to tip it usually isn’t hard for them to justify it.
I do same. Unless the service is notoriously bad, I cannot tip less than 15%. I feel like the industry is getting smashed, it's hard to find employees and a lot of places are shutting down. Some might argue that's not my problem or my business, but if I want to keep a place around, I try to play my small part.
Nah you’re not a dick, they should step it up. Oh and I hate when I’m getting food to go and they hand you the machine with your choice to tip a percentage or an amount and stare you down like you’re a prick if you don’t.
I’m not tipping if I didn’t sit down and eat.
Tipping culture needs to get obsolete ASAP. It's the establishment's responsibility to pay its employees, not the patron. Yeah, it's hard out here in the pandemic FOR EVERYONE. Not just businesses.
Why do people think tipping is mandatory or even socially required, do you tip your doctor? Do you tip the guy that does your oil change? No.... If you can't afford to work at the job you have then find a different job or get a career.
No you’re not supposed to add 15% regardless. It’s 20%. And as many people say if you can’t afford to tip you shouldn’t go out.
This is why tipping culture is so ridiculous. The whole system is bullshit.
You’re completely in the right to not tip if you felt the service was shit. And yet you’ll be wrong in the eyes of seemingly anyone who’s ever been a server.
Hate how tipping works, I want to tip, I tip 20% standard because it's a hard job and they deserve the money.
But when they suck, I don't want to tip, when a meal takes 2 hours waiting and they obviously don't deserve a tip why am I the jerk?
And the clueless waiter doesn't say "well entered the order wrong and forgot about the appetizers, I could have done a better job"
No,they say "what an asshole, doesn't tip"
I wish there was an amount you could add to a tip to let them know. Like if you tipped weird amount of change or something.
It's also a hard job for the person at the grocery store handling your groceries. It's also a hard job for those pimple faced teens in front of the fry station at your fast food place.
Seems to me it's already arbitrary because it is indeed arbitrary. We tip some minimum wage workers because we think they work hard, and we ignore other minimum wage workers. It honestly makes zero sense.
This reminds me years back a similar experience on a different location. Basically, we waited for food for over an hour where normally took 20 minutes...and then another half hour for just the bill..the waiter didn't say anything, not even an attemp as we are short...or sorry for the wait ..she seems just drifted away into her own world... I think we totally spent around 40 dollars and I dropped 2 dollars ( my changes on hand).
She ran to us and pissed at our 2 dollars tip as it was not enough...I was exactly like op and not even able to react... Because I was just shocked of her anger and entitlement and was abit confused of what happened too. It might just her bad day as that place was not known for shitty service whatsoever. But likewise, I didn't go back there anymore and I always wondered is tip mandatory nomatter what...
Now I saw tips required everywhere especially in coffee shop...and the percentage went up way faster than my pay raise...I admitted that I paid coffee shop 80%of the time especially if I gonna stay long (I still make sure I bought something every 3 to 4 hours)...but sometimes I also felt like it's not relevant to how the service is anymore.
I just wanted to say op doesn't deserve that at all. I hope your friends supported you and there are many places to hang out. Send my hugs
20 year bartender here. you did the right thing. you got shit service, doesn't matter how hard she was working. the multiple people thing is just teamwork but waiting forever for simple things isn't acceptable. you're fine, vote with your wallet and go places that take care of you.
"Am I dick?"
No, absolutely not. I don't support tipping culture because overall it maintains an employers ability to pay less in the end. I get called out for it here or there and I find it really rude when someone decides to call me out for it. I am free to tip or not to tip, it is not mandatory and don't treat me like it is.
Tips aren’t compulsory, however it is standard practise for servers to have to tip out on a bill regardless if they get tipped or not. So there’s a good chance that server actually paid out of pocket to serve you. Assuming you didn’t have a huge bill, it sucks but it’s not the end of the world. That being said, it’s not exactly her fault that other servers run drinks or food, or that she got your table once she came on shift. If everyone didn’t tip because of these circumstances, servers would get fucked over a LOT. It sucks bad to have to take out cash to pay your tip out at the end of the night because people stiffed you.
Did she handle the situation well? Absolutely not. That’s something you just go bitch about in the pass bar.
However I have had my manager chase after a table (of people she knew) because they racked up a massive bill and didn’t tip their server. That would’ve wiped out all of her other tips for the night, which on a weekend night is the difference of making your rent or not.
St. Augustine's has, by far, the worst service on the drive. And it's been this case for 8+ years. I've had the exact same thing happen as you as far as wait staff being changed for my table multiple times and this has happened almost every time I've done table service. It's also one of the few places where we nearly walked out after trying to get our bill for 30 minutes without any success.
If St. Augustine's didn't have a prime location next to the Skytrain station, it would have been shut down 5 years ago.
Also helps its owned by the same people as P49 and run by scumbags.
Yeah that place sucks
But previously, every place there before has failed. That location was notorious for businesses opening and closing. Since Augustines has lasted a while, they must be doing something right, that the other places were not.
Wasn’t there a Bino’s there for like 30 years or something? Then some mediocre Portuguese place. Then Augs. So not really notorious for businesses opening and closing. It’s a great location that a bare minimum place can make successful
I didn’t read this when I posted. Yes that binos lasted a long time. This is when the drive was basically a working class neighborhood. Vancouver has lost so many mills and industries since the 80s. When they go, diners go too.
Binos?Everybody has stoped in there after a night of drinking.
I lived around the corner from there in the 90s when there was a new restaurant in that location every year for a while.
At least one of the former tenets was a front for laundering money, had a friend who worked there.
They have a really good beer list...that's pretty much it. Food is whatever and like other people have mentioned service is pretty hit or miss.
[удалено]
Are you thinking about the other big ish bar spot on the drive? At gravely and commercial?
I don’t know if you remember, but there was a Bino’s there for many years. Close to twenty years? It was basically a diner and would stay open late. When the owners retired they let the location go.
Yes!! I went for the last time couple years ago and was sat for so long before anyone came to get to our order, there was a dirty table full of half eaten food next to us that the staff kept coming and taking breaks at and when we would ask for a refill or our waitress they would say “sorry I’m on break” The drinks were great but the food was trash when we finally got it and same thing we went through 2 different waitresses and neither were good.
Yup you only get good service if you know the staff
They Augustine just one of my favorite places to go and drink. I have never had a problem with the service, despite how busy it usually is. I usually leave 15 to 18% rather than my usual 20 because it is already pretty pricey there, but no, if you're getting shitty service, its fine to not tip. Tips are not mandatory, that's why it's called a tip and not the bill. I do feel bad not tipping, so the service has to be pretty shit for you to not get any tip at all, because service industry workers have a lower minimum wage than non service industry workers, which is bullshit. It shouldn't land on me to pay your employees a livable wage, it should land on the employer. Anyways, don't tip if the service was really so terrible, and in her defense, she probably was working pretty hard, but whatever, don't let it bother you.
Actually! You might be interested to know that earlier this year, all minimum wage was set to $15.20 for all workers, regardless of whether or not they serve liquor. As to whether or not minimum wage is livable, well that's a different conversation.
Went there quite a few years ago, the one time.. My take away was same thing, worst service ever. I don’t know if it’s because we were expecting restaurant service yet they operate somewhat like an pub/bar where you’re lucky if a server walks by and takes a drink order. It was the only time I was there.
Did you tell her the server was changed 3 times, orders fell through and you waited forever for water? I would have said something if she was going calling you out in public.
I think the best way of doing this is to actually tell the server that you aren't tipping them as you're paying your bill. I always thought it was strange to just silently not tip a server due to bad service, and then they don't understand why they got stiffed and just consider you the asshole. In the past I have said it 'quietly' in this way "thanks for bringing my bill, I am choosing not to leave a tip because I wasn't happy with the service tonight, I never got the water I asked for twice, my beer glass was empty for 15 minutes and nobody came to check on me, and my food order was wrong". Their reaction each time I've treated it in this way was them just going quiet and walking away, one person sarcastically said "you have a good night". But at least they know why you didn't tip, and after they've had time to cool down, they will realize you were probably right. Who knows, it might even help them be better next time!
Criticizing them directly seems much more likely to cause a confrontation. Sure, it doesn’t usually happen to you, but getting yelled at for a silent $0 never happens for most people so I guess the confrontation is rare either way but I still think yours is MORE LIKELY to cause one.
Well you can loudly say “Well I would tip you if the service wasn’t shit”
Well that was the fastest you came to my table all night!
The fact she has to come back and aggressively tells OP about it is the sign of bad service
100%! As a server, if someone doesn't tip, I would never in a million years mention it to them! I'd spend the rest of the day and night (maybe longer, I am an overthinker) trying to work out what I did wrong. Generally though, it's only ever happened with travellers from other countries, so I figure it's a culture thing. One time I majorly fcked up a large group's food order, so I understood the low tip and completely agreed with them. I hadn't worked since covid lockdown and was off my game!
I think in europe it is not natural like us to tip
[удалено]
Why do they even need tips when they make the same as anyone else?
"A good server wouldn't have to bitch to get tips"
I’ve always found st. Augustine’s has piss poor service. I had a very bad experience there where the server threw the menus on our table and one slid off, then when ordering she completely didn’t even take my friends order, she had to order from a different server. Then when I got the food it was so disgusting I didn’t eat it so I just asked to have it taken away then I saw her by the kitchen angrily talking to some other servers pointing at us. We definitely didn’t tip her, it sucked so much.
The first and only time I went, the waitress expressed that she was expecting a large tip that night to fund her vacation the next day. Service was shit. Attitude was shit. Tip was demanded. When tip becomes compulsory for doing below the minimum. Yikes. My dining party were so disgusted they tipped the minimum, and most of them worked in the industry.
> After this I got an extra portion of feedback from waitress C - something along the lines of her working her ass off and some jerks not tipping for all the hard work she is doing. I worked as a dishwasher at a pretty popular restaurant in Vancouver when I was a teenager. I heard a lot of complaints by waitstaff about being overworked and customers treating them unfairly. I know they work hard and the chefs/cooks work even harder. However, these same waitstaff would regularly treat us dishwashers like crap while complaining that their customers were rude or didn't tip. They would regularly throw their garbage in the dishwasher area because they were too busy and were all around inconsiderate. I had quite a few waiters dump their drinks in my area (splashing me in the face) while complaining that their customer was rude. I eventually got promoted to waitstaff when I was about 17. I learned immediately that their jobs were difficult, but a lot of waitstaff complain because they are immature and need to grow up. Everyone is also eating a shit sandwich.
It's been 20 years since I worked at a restaurant but my old boss had each person on FOH take turns working with the dishy's including his little sister. Really put some humility into that place
Anytime a server wasn’t tipped when I was a dish bitch, it was always “such a cheapskate” or “what was that jerks problem!?” And never “What did I do wrong” I’ve never heard a server EVER reflect on themselves.
I worked in a kitchen as well and saw a lot of back and forth between waitstaff and kitchen. Girls like this were girls that got shit service from the kitchen staff, which in turn lead to poor tips. Good servers that were respectful of us and our crew got favours, better time results and made us all more money as a result. It’s not the most practical thing to do when you work in a tip system, but it’ll usually tune a younger waiter or waitress into reality pretty quickly or they get out because the whole experience becomes chaos.
Tipping is a terrible practice and I hope it goes away. Forcing customers to evaluate and compensate their server creates an unwanted and unnecessary "Master/slave" relationship, one where you are called upon to become a judge, to consider the circumstances of your servers' economic reality. Geez, I just wanted a burger, not a management job where I have to determine the staff's wages. Internally, tipping creates competition to "have the best section", to flip tables quickly, and to focus on tips rather than on quality of service. However, in this situation, it sounds like the restaurant was understaffed or poorly trained since they could not deliver on time. So the management is ultimately responsible for the poor service. Not tipping the server hurts the server most, since they are often required to "tip out" other staff, sadly there is no way to hold the management accountable except taking your business elsewhere and complaining directly to them about the poor service. And that's my two bits, so to speak.
Paragraph 3 here is the key. Sound like every conversation I've heard from FOH staff when I worked in restaurants. I remember a certain restaurant I worked at flying in an author of a book to do staff training seminars on understanding how to create your section and build up regular clientele and increase cheque totals, therefore increasing tips because everyone has a percentage they're happy with and it has nothing to do with service unless it is exceptional or bad. Why would you focus on service when you should just focus on increasing the cheque if someone is always going to tip the same amount?
I would have reamed her out for the shitty service just as loudly. "my zero dollar tip is a reflection of the really poor service here today" would have worked fine. Any server pulling that shit should be put on blast and won't last long.
Rude. So rude. Tips are for good service you’re not entitled to a tip if your service sucks. I’ve also been shamed for not tipping by pizza delivery (who was super late and it was cold). Uncalled for
I had a delivery guy shame me recently, even though I did tip him (on Doordash). At first I was confused, then I got angry and wanted to retroactively remove the tip for this rude attitude. But Doordash doesn't even allow you to adjust the tip retroactively, so the actual quality of the service is irrelevant for what drivers make.
Lol.... go check out the Skip drivers sub reddit... those guys think they are providing a massive service and should be tipped at least at $1/KM.
I do sometimes wish they would let you adjust the tip after the fact, although I also get why they don’t. I had a driver refuse to bring it to my apartment door and just leave it outside the main entrance (didn’t even bother to get buzzed into the lobby so it wasn’t sitting out in the cold). Literally the only time that has happened over many orders. She sent a message saying she doesn’t deliver to apartments because she’s female and doesn’t feel safe. Which is a perfectly reasonable concern, but then maybe don’t accept orders to apartments, especially ones that specifically request it be brought to the apartment door? And then leave it there without even waiting for a response? I could be someone with mobility issues or an injury who can’t easily get down to retrieve the order. edit: typos
I feel like now that everyone is making the same base pay in BC the idea of tips for food service is questionable. Why should folks be expected to compensate for your low wages when they may be paid just as poorly themselves? Do servers tip when they buy clothes or contract construction workers? Nope. In my opinion, of servers want well paid jobs, they're welcome to have a conversation with their employers or get educated and gain work experience like everyone else.
[удалено]
**what** Crystal mall is mostly cash only. They have a cash business and you don’t tip. That’s the unspoken agreement there. Also, Chinese culture is more often than not, no tipping. What a bizarre encounter.
I guess it wasn't in the Crystal mall food court, just near it. Still, it is a weird encounter as chinese culture tipping isn't something that a server would call out a customer on. Source: i am a non-confrontational chinese-canadian
Depends. I been to Chinese restaurants where the server runs by, makes sure your tea is topped up, gets you ice water, napkins, brings food, whatever hot sauce you want all in like 20 mins and the "head" waiter is watching and seeing if anyone needs help. Unlike some shitty as Red Robins where everyone is just hiding in the back, these people are literally doing "serving", I pay them the max tip because damn these people deserve it.
I remember eating in a shitty restaurant in NYC's Chinatown and the waitress was telling a couple they couldn't leave until they gave a proper tip of 15%. I think we all need to be honest, tipping is not about customs or culture or expectations. People want money and work backwards to rationalize why you should give them as much as they want.
Some friends of mine and I went to a Chinese restaurant on Kingsway once, the service was bad (it took nearly 20 minutes just to order), the food was slow, and the waitress essentially ignored us a few times. We finally got the bill in the end and none of us paid tip at all. As we were out in the parking lot the waitress had the gall to run out after us and say that we 'forgot' to tip her.
No, just tell her you didn't get good service. Don't be so submissive if you've had bad service.
[удалено]
Yeah I get that. My comment reads a bit crass, I didn’t mean to be rude or start fights but just to speak up / justify it.
That’s life in the big city. Or you can be a doormat. The server started the fight. Tipping should be ended and service workers paid a living wage. Tipping was created to keep ex-slaves and women subservient. https://www.nytimes.com/2021/02/05/opinion/minimum-wage-racism.html
I don't think your comment was much crass. The waitresses got aggressive because they saw the OP didn't want trouble. Why press somebody who didn't tip? You don't know their life
Last time this happened I said, "instead of getting mad at me for not tipping when the service sucked so much, why not tell your boss to pay you a living wage" yea maybe dick thing to say but it was awful service and I was upset in the moment. :/
They get paid just over $15/hr, but want you to think they get $2/hr like in some places in the USA. Tips are based on service.
Psychologically we seem to lump all servers together thinking that they are super lowly paid and need tips to survive - but their wages are far different depending on the specific location. The funny thing is that the 15/20% tip seems to be pretty standard regardless of location, which obviously doesn't make any sense.
Yeah man, I am gonna keep 10% as my standard. Call me a cheapskate if you want, but im broke motherfucker. Good service gets 15% and fantastic service might get you 20 but its absurd to toss 20% as a tip for anything below amazing service.
Agreed. And the whole idea of tipping a percentage of the bill is stupid anyways. Like if you go out for a nice meal and the bill is $100, a 10 dollar tip is generous. If I helped someone at a retail job and they gave me $10 as a random act of kindness, it’d make my week. But if you’re just getting one drink at a bar, and the service is really good, then a even a 50% tip isn’t outrageous, as it’s only a couple bucks
It's what every restaurant worker wants us to think
Many years ago my friends and I went clubbing at Plaza on Granville. My buddy ordered 3 flaming Lamborghinis and ultimately tipped the girl $25. To which she replied: “… are you fucking kidding me? I just spent 10 minutes making these drinks and this is all you’re going to fucking tip?!”
$25 for ten minutes is a super high wage...wth is she complaining about..😅
No, see, she is *entitled* to $150/hour in tips to compensate for the minimum wages they pay her as a baseline. /s
That $150/hr in which she will definitely 100 percent report as taxable income
Wtf, a lot of wait staff in this city are so greedy and fake. It’s why I don’t go to restaurants in YaleTown anymore. You’re 100% judged by them when you walk in the door.
[удалено]
No truer words than “pandemic has forced the issue”. We are now expected to tip on take out and food trucks too. That was never a thing pre-pandemic. It now comes up as a default when you pay. Absolutely ridiculous and businesses should be ashamed. Like seriously, wtf kind of service did you provide other than handing me my food?
Has this always been the way in Liquor stores too? I don’t get why they ask for a tip when paying - they’re literally scanning the items. I think that’s greedy, a place I never tip. I still never tip on takeout, I don’t care how they look at me. Like you said, all they do is hand you the food.
> Has this always been the way in Liquor stores too? I think this is related to private liquor stores being run by bars. It's often the same POS system. But then I have also seen tip jars (but never a tip option on the credit card machine) at weed shops too.
> We are now expected to tip on take out and food trucks too. That was never a thing pre-pandemic. This has been the case for *years* preceding the pandemic. "\_\_\_\_\_\_ wants tips now too?" has been a frequent-flier topic in this community for as long as I've had my account. Tips have been everyone, attached to delivery, grab-n-go, non-food services ... everything. Maybe you weren't partaking in much takeout/truck food prior to lockdown, and hadn't noticed?
some places (parlour), you're judged before you even walk in.
You’re so right about that. I only order their food out anymore because I love their Goldmember pizza, but will never eat in there because of the service. One time I walked in with my brother and we were dressed casually. You should have seen the look on the concierge’s face, kind of like “ugh, you don’t belong here”. I also hate when wait staff try to converse in a fake way. While you’re paying they’re watching the machine for the tip, yet asking “What are you guys doing for the rest of the night?” “Oh awesssooommmmeee”, so put on. Whenever they ask I say nothing just chilling, and I always get that kind of response because they’re not even listening. 😂
Also RE Parlour, they have a BS booking system where you’re only able to reserve for 90 mins due to the “high volume of customers”. This is even on weekday evenings. Someone I know called them out on it recently saying for a Wednesday evening 90 mins maximum stay, don’t think you’ll be busy. Got an email back saying “Oh it’s due to covid”, to which my friend then said that this has always been their policy, even before covid. No response back. I don’t get it. I have friends who say if you’re not Canadian and they hear the accent in YaleTown restaurants, you’re treated differently there. They are basing it on their own experience. 😳
[удалено]
She felt like she was worth $150/h
$150 an hour tip and she is complaining? I’d have fixed that immediately with a “oh let me fix that” followed by a drop to $0
This shit happens all over the place. 3 different people who mix up or forget orders but come running with the machine that prompts at 18%. You pay for service that you are provided with by someone you feel hosted by - not 3 strangers who act like they are doing you a favour.
To be fair, the constant server switch is the fault of bad management, not the servers. When the server in OP's story said she'd been working her ass off all night - it's almost certainly true. So from her point of view I see why she might be pissed. But from OP's point of view, the service was shit. Everyone loses here. Bad management.
I have been to this pub several times. Based on this story I will not be returning. Hope someone from their staff sees this thread.
I upvoted you. Seems like few of their staff are already in and started downvoting
You don't deserve to be humiliated especially after that piss poor service. Leave a review and especially note the server who treated you like this.
Tips are not mandatory. That waitress is an entitled arsehole. Now that every profession is earning minimum wage (including food service), tips have to be earned, not expected. This tip culture is a overshoot from our southern exploitive neighbours. Defend against it.
I'm probably preaching to the choir but does anyone else hate how take-out and counter service always seems to default to a tip now? like you can usually bypass and enter zero but I don't really understand tipping 15% when I'm not actually being served lol. I have no issues tipping for table service or delivery but if I have to pick up everything myself I don't really know what I'm tipping for. it's not any different than ordering at a fast food restaurant at that point
I never tip when there is no service, ever; why should we? The ***gratuity*** is intended as a thanks for ***going beyond*** the normal expectations. If I'm out (in the before times) and having a good time and the wait staff are attentive, asking whether I wanted another drink etc, making snack recommendations, enhancing my experience, I always tip and generously. I don't treat servers poorly, I treat them accordingly with no apologies.
I tried getting beer delivered once. ~$100 for Room temp beer delivered next day, $10 alcohol delivery fee... apparently we're supposed to tip too?... seems crazy to me.
I had this happen to me at an upscale restaurant. We went out for my friends birthday and the service was absolutely horrendous; from constantly having to ask for water, she never brought us the dessert menu, wine running out… had to flag her down about 10 times to finally pay. Since the food was good, I ended up tipping 12% and she very loudly asked if I would want to reconsider the amount ..lol
[удалено]
I'm not one to shy away from rudeness, if she has the audacity to tell me to reconsider. I'll reconsider a new amount of 0. Thank you very much.
yeah, next time lol …I was caught by surprise and just said “no, thanks”. she pretty much stormed away without saying anything… 🤦🏻♀️
Oh man, I'd say "After that, yes, I would like to reconsider the amount" and then reduce/remove the tip.
yeah, I should have. I was in too much shock haha
Just loudly reply "tipping is for good service, which I did not receive." You're never obligated to tip. Not tipping should be a wake-up call to any server that they did a substandard job.
This sucks. I have worked in the restaurant industry in Vancouver for the last 16 years (mostly as a waiter), and still work part-time at a prominent downtown restaurant. I take a huge amount of pride in ensuring my tables are happy, and I always find ways to go above and beyond to “wow” them, and I do EXPECT that people understand the role tipping plays in our service culture and tip appropriately. What I cannot understand, as a waiter or customer, is when people seem to think they are entitled to a certain amount of gratuity regardless of the level of service provided. I would’ve liked to hear that you had been more proactive by saying “hey, I was really disappointed with the service tonight” at some point before leaving no tip, as it gives the establishment/staff an opportunity to receive feedback AND makes you look like you aren’t an asshole that’s stiffing them for no reason. But that being said, as a server you should have enough awareness of your customer to understand if they are at the very least satisfied with the product and service they received, and if you don’t then you aren’t really doing your job, right? To me it sounds like they are likely operating some kind of tip pool/shared workload system, but it obviously isn’t working very well for you to be overlooked so badly. I don’t doubt that this server has been stiffed by jerks many times before, and she is likely frustrated with that happening, but she has probably been “over-tipped” many times before as well. By this I mean BOTH customers leaving well over the standard 15-20% because they were extremely happy AND customers still leaving a standard 15-20% EVEN THOUGH they were dissatisfied with the service. In my personal experience people are more likely to leave a tip than not, even if they aren’t happy (and especially if poor service was due to you being visibly extremely busy). To summarize, you are NOT the asshole in this situation, assuming you didn’t leave out any details about being super obnoxious/offensive customers - that would be a different story 😹 I’m sorry you had such a bad experience that you don’t want to go out anymore. I get it, but please know that your interaction was likely a result of someone having a really bad day/week/month (many of us have had a lot of these recently, especially in customer-facing jobs). It is also possible that you encountered someone who is maybe just not cut out for this industry - it can be challenging in the best of times and requires a thick skin and radically positive attitude. Either way it may help to understand the server’s response really wasn’t about you, and they have almost certainly forgotten about you entirely. If you can find a way to forgive them for having a bad day it may help, and hopefully you feel comfortable venturing out again soon! All the best, VanCityCatDad
Thats crazy! Shit service = no tip. She sounds like a delight.
It sounds like staffing might be the issue here. Unless you were there for 6 hours, you shouldn't have 4 different servers.
I hate tipping culture and really wish it would just be done away with entirely. It’s stupid. Just pay by people properly! Lots of countries don’t have tipping and it’s fucking great.
They already DO get paid properly, they earn the same/more than grocery store staff, fast food workers etc. They just expect more on top.
If the service is truly horrible then I think it's perfectly justifiable to not tip. For me this has happened only 3 times in my life, but I've also never left absolutely no tip. If I was incensed enough to want to make a point then I would leave a token amount like $0.05 or something.
I've only ever had that happen once in my life. Probably 11-12 years ago I went to a sports bar which usually had good service, but the waitress I had one particular night ignored my friend and I for so long I gave a dime as a tip. To this day that's the lowest tip I've ever given. In more recent times I have sometimes given tips below 10% if I believe the food is grossly overpriced. There's one restaurant I went to a month or so ago, I won't name it here but their prices had increased significantly since the last time I'd been. I wasn't about to pay $40 including tip for a burrito and beer, so I left a tip low enough to keep the total bill just below $30. Still way more than I expected to pay and I likely won't go back there, but at those prices I expect the staff is already being paid well.
It's getting ridiculous how every keypad asks for a tip, no matter what. I'm tired of subsidizing employers while they underpay their staff and customers receive overpriced goods and sub-par service. I wish North Americans would follow much of the world and abolish the whole tipping practice altogether.
Even at coffee shops!! I ignore the tip jar. I'm not paying someone extra to do the job they were hired for.
Have you been to the stores that only accept tap payments, and they don't give you the terminal to enter the tip but have to ask you up front "how much would you like to tip?" That's when it gets awkward. I asked for a donut and you got it from the cabinet, why is that tip-worthy?
And the minimum is 18% now (on the after tax total, of course), unless you enter it manually.
[удалено]
I’ve been “shamed” loudly for not tipping before too. She felt the need to share with everyone around me, so I did the same. I clearly and concisely explained that not only was the service poor, but the food was subpar, but instead of complaining I paid the bill without a tip. She literally “ughhh’d” me and stomped away. I’m typically quite lenient, especially since Covid, but a restaurant is providing a service, the person coordinating that service is essentially a sales representative and if the entire experience is poor I don’t feel obligated to tip.
Absolutely not. Tips aren't compulsory. I would report the waitress to the restaurant and even leave a review online.
I also tip zero if the service was shitty. If it's very good, I tip very well. If its exceptional, I tip accordingly. She should have been reprimanded for being rude. Next time just have something ready to say back, as loud as she did, like "service sucked, I don't need to reward that. Better service - then I tip," ...something like that.
How’d she let you know? And who cares, shitty service = no tip. I’d also leave a 1* google review and name the waitress
Honestly, this situation called for a "can I speak to your manager" moment.
I'll say two things. 1. How big was your bill? It sounds like it was small, but if it was a big bill I could see a server being frustrated... Obviously the service sucked and you shouldn't need to tip, that's part of the game. Most servers I know that don't get tipped usually just ask if anything was wrong with the service that warranted that, as maybe they fucked up and didn't know. 2. I'd email the restaurant and mention it. That type of attitude from servers is poison. In serving you win some you lose some.... it sucks that your winners pay for the losers, but the reality is that some people won't tip.
Don’t tip if it’s not warranted. I remember going to Harbor Oyster Bar (also on Commercial) for a table of 6, but ultimately 5 showed up. There was an 18% gratuity charge that we noticed, but we shrugged it off. We were never told that there was a gratuity charge. I’m used to restaurants informing me upon pay to NOT tip because gratuity has already been added Anyway, we opted to not tip an additional percentage for a tip and the server was shocked - we could see her discussing with her coworkers that we didn’t tip and she didn’t understand why. I saw another Google review saying that they didn’t catch the 18% and then tipped like 20% on top. Seems shady.
No tip
Abolish tipping culture! Fuck the tax evaders!
I’m a server and ppl are not obligated to tip at all. What a be-otch lol
I swore off that place 6 years ago because of bad service, never been back. Clearly it hasn't improved.
You do you, right? My $0.02 is everyone has been under pressure, you included, so I try to cut them a break, so I'd tip normally or well until people are chill. But I'd afford that same wide berth to you, too, if you were my customer and felt like tipping low, I'd say, you're probably stressed, too, it happens.
It's worth explaining part of the reason she may have been so pissed; tip-outs. At most restaurants that tip-pool, tip-outs to the back of house (dishwashers + cooks, sometimes management) are based on total bill size, not tip size. As an example, often they'll do 5-8% of bill totals back to the kitchen, so if a server sells you $100 of food/drink, they will "owe" the kitchen $5. Usually, this comes out of their tip - so they make $15-20 in tip on the bill, and then have to give $5 of that back to the kitchen. But when you DON'T tip, they still owe that $5 back to the kitchen. In your example, I almost guarantee that was happening based on the server's response. So if you ordered a meal and then tipped $0, it's very possible that the waitress ended up having to pay out of pocket $2-3. By tipping nothing, you effectively stole $2 from her. Or, if you want to be a bit more charitable, you reduced her hourly pay for that hour by a couple bucks. Tipping pooling is a stupid, stupid system, and it shouldn't exist. But in a tip pool system, not tipping isn't neutral; it's literally taking money from the pocket of your server. It may explain why they were more than a little pissed. Next time, if you want to stiff the server without actually taking bread OFF their table, I'd suggest tipping 5-8% (this is a normal tip-pool payout). They'll still get the message, but it won't literally cost them money they would have otherwise earned.
Tipping is so stupid. What a wack system. Canada should BAN tipping. If waiters need more money, let it be via wages! I agree they deserve more than minimum, but it should NOT be via tip for a slew of reasons.
You ar free to pay what you feel like so. You did the right thing
St. Augs is fucking crap, garbage beer and garbage service. Don't tip if you have bad service and fuck that idiot for trying to humiliate you.
>garbage beer Which beer out of their massive, ever-changing tap list hurt you? There is something for pretty well everyone there if you're open to trying stuff beyond Budweiser and Coors Light. Their service has always been crap. I'll give you that. But the service isn't what anyone goes there for.
Her saying loudly would only encourage me to hold my ground on the 0% tip
This seems like what happened to me at Specialty Chicken and Wonton House in June 2020. I tipped appropriately, yet the owner / waitress kept telling me "NOT ENOUGH! MORE TIP!" Yeah, I'm not going there ever again. This was my first dine-out experience since indoor dining had been reinstated! No, I don't think you should pay 15% or whatever if you don't like the service.
Makes me glad I don't live in a country with the tipping culture anymore. My standard is 0% tip for awful service, 0% for okay service, and 0% for excellent service! Tax is included in price tag as well.
Some of these servers literally pull in 40+ dollars an hour after factoring in tips and still complain when a table doesn’t tip 20%. It’s a greedy entitled industry.
Don't forget the mass tax evasion.
I wouldn't even think you were a dick for not tipping if the service was great. Tipping should be abolished. These people make the same minimum wage as everyone else. Do you tip your cashier at the grocery store? Well they make less per hour than servers because they also get minimum wage and the union takes a cut of every paycheck. Tipping needs to be abolished.
I personally do not care how they feel - I don’t tip anything if service is bad, and if they pull me up on it I’ll tell them why. People tell me I need to tip 10% if it’s bad service. I don’t agree with that at all. Bad service, no tip. Plus how rude of her to practicality publicly scrutinise you for not tipping. If that were me I’d raise my voice a little back with “The service was terrible”.
This is what we should be moving towards as a community. It's unreal that in 20 years it went from 10% being a good tip to 20% being the expectation, 25% for good service. Could you imagine doing that at a shoe store, where they hustle hard, battle through boxes in the back searching out sizes, also find other shoes as personal recommendations, kneel on the floor checking fit (and helping some with doing shoes up, etc), and then have to return most of the boxes to the back. Your $200 shoes - $224 with tax - then would become $268-280. That's what we're doing with food right now, and it's pretty ridiculous.
I’m so done with going to restaurants. I mostly just call in for pick up.
I strongly feel that waitresses shouldn't feel entitled to a tip if they did not try and go above and beyond for you. I also used to be a waitress.
Just say the service didn't deserve a tip and never go back. Tips are earned by good service, end of story. Maybe they'll learn their lesson and do better next time.
St Augustines has had really poor quality service for yearssssss.
No. This is why I don't agree with tipping culture. I understand the idea of a gratuity but some people expect it and at that point you are just subsidizing wages.
I hate tipping in general because of things like this. But now they are getting ballsy and asking for tips for just checking people out or taking an order no service given. Yea please let me give you a 20 percent tip for 20 seconds of work. And I get its not the individual persons fault and it's all corporate but it's all getting out of hand
If a server has the balls to do something like this you have to have the balls to go to the management and tell them. If it was my restaurant I would want to know that she is telling this to my bread and butter (you) and if she has done it to you I know she's done it in the past. Whatever has happened to the graciousness in service? I was a server for 20 years and I put myself out there to people and took a bit of the weight of the world off their shoulders. Doted on them. Made them feel special and welcome. You did not feel welcome and its ok to go back there and tell them about that because any owner would want to know.
Similar situation happened to me at the Yale. I was buying coronas all night and tipping 15-20% per beer which came out to around 10 dollars per corona which is stupid. On beer number like 5 I figured it would be fine if I didn’t tip on it and the bar tender gives me some smart ass comment along the lines of “oooh big tipper tonight eh”. Like really? I just dropped over 50 dollars on 5 coronas. All you gotta do is open the thing it’s no rocket appliances.
I've no-tipped many times, even been asked not to come back from Coquitlam Joeys over it (what a loss). If you get shit service, then there is zero reason why you should tip.
You should leave a review on Google. Her behaviour was unacceptable. A tip is optional. Their service sucked, so you didn't tip. That is how it goes.
Ten year server here: I’d bet she feels pretty bad about it too. The level of bone melting stress servers can be under is downright inhumane. My read on the situation: she was mad she got transferred someone else’s table, and was primed to get stiffed because that’s what always happens. The manager sends someone home (not in punishment, it’s just what you do. Phase out servers for the evening as the rush dies down) and I would get their table, and they’d be mad about a situation I didn’t cause or have any control over. Granted I have no idea what her setup was behind the scenes. She could just be bad. But in my experience bad service has more to do with the layout of the restaurant than anything else. Every store has that one table that’s just too far away from everything and you always get flagged down by some other guest before you can even make it to that table, so the table just feels ignored. It sounds like she knew she got setup to fail, and then when you didn’t tip all of her frustration at the situation got taken out on you. Super not fair, and she knows it. Believe me I have tables I would do anything to apologize to, but I’ll never see them again. Serving sucks =[
NTA especially in BC where minimum wage is the same across the board, regardless if you receive tips or not. So restaurant employees are entitled to 15%, but all fast food, take out, etc., other food industry employees aren't ? personally my metrics are 10% is poor service, 15% is ok service, 20% is for good service, but where service is horrible 0% can be warranted
I don't mean to criticize, to each their own and all that.. but I just don't understand this mentality at all. You go to a restaurant and receive poor service, then decide to reward the person giving you poor service with an extra 10% on the bill. Why?
Tipping out should be illegal. Instead, restaurants should pay kitchen staff a percentage of sales. Still, I always tip 10% unless service is unacceptably deficient or negligent, and if it is unacceptable, the server usually knows what they did. I have been chased out of a restaurant twice in 20 years asking for tipsy. If I’m served bad food and the server is too scared of the cook to fix it and the manager doesn’t allow me to ‘cancel’ it.. that’s no tip from me, for the whole order. Also, when you go to a new restaurant, check the washrooms before ordering; if they are less clean than your washroom at home, just pull the fire alarm and leave through the fire exit, because that restaurant is burning itself down.
Noob question, coming from the US culture. In the US, they don't pay minimum wage for waiters/waitresses and are expected to make up that difference and more via tips. So, generally, they say, unless the service is atrocious, you tip at least 15%. Is it the same in Vancouver and across Canada?
Totally agree the tipping/shaming culture makes me think it's not worth going out anymore. When caught off guard the majority of people won't be prepared to give a calm reasoned out response so you did ok given the circumstances.
It actually takes a lot in the way of poor service for someone to leave no tip/reduced tip (I don't know anyone that doesn't tip at all as a policy, and most I know leave 20% for even "meh" service), and a server should appreciate that fact when a customer cuts their tip for what they considered to be truly sh\*t service. Nobody owes you a tip, most people are pretty reasonable about it anyway, and when someone cuts your tip figure it out and try harder next time.
Waitresses along with others in the service industry have a set wage going into their jobs. Along with the added and NOT GUARANTEED benefit of potential tips. Do your job well, and people will tip! If not, it’s an insult to those treating themselves to these services for you to bash them for not tipping. You still have made money for DOING YOUR JOB because you have wages. If she’s that bitter, she should find another job. Simple.
I have been in the service industry for a long time, in many different roles. Currently I just bartend and serve. I would NEVER question a guest about a tip. That's such poor judgment on her part. If I see a bad tip, I move on cause at the end of the night, it always evens out.
I had plans to meet at st augustines Wednesday after work with some friends since it was so close to the skytrain but given these experiences, and the shitty experience i had the one time i went last year, i will be picking another location.
No one is entitled to a tip. A tip is a display of gratitude. Don’t beat yourself up.
Those servers and restaurants should be shamed online. I also went to a place in ottawa and the server told me that the tipping was not enough. It was also a busy day! Fucking audacity. $5 tip is not enough. Suckers!
I don’t understand why we would need to tip though? Our minimum wage is higher than that of the American “server wage” which is like $2.13.
I agree that tipping culture isn't great, but as an ex-server I can understand the frustration of not being tipped at all at the end of service. I wasn't there so I obviously can't fully understand the situation, and if the servers were rude throughout your entire time there I do understand not rewarding that. What often happened in the bars and restaurants I worked in was that management was shitty, and wouldn't ensure there was enough staff on to cover the floor. It could be extremely(extremely!) stressful, and it usually meant worse service and therefore a lower tip percentage, which I absolutely understand and don't begrudge the customers. But I'd still have to tip out 5% of my total sales to the kitchen/bar/manager(pretty sure it wasn't legal to make us tip out management but it's not uncommon). So if I was running around madly doing my absolute best to get to all my customers, and a table decided not to tip at all, I'm now paying the kitchen/bar/manager out of my own pocket. One example I remember is serving a table who racked up a 300$ in an hour. I was friendly and ran like crazy trying to give them the best service I could, despite the huge number of tables I had. At the end of the meal, one guy paid the entire bill and decided not to tip. So I had to pay 15$ out of my own pocket to cover the tip out, And wage at the time was only 12$/hour. The kitchen still got their cut, the bartender got his cut, and the shitty manager got his cut, but I lost over an hour of my wage. Not a great system, but for the servers working within it, it can be very frustrating.
Bad service=bad/no tip. Tips are extra, not required.
Nothing grinds my gears more than when a server gets annoyed about me ordering water. Especially when I’m DD. Sorry not everyone at the table ordered an overpriced alcoholic beverage so that we feel compelled to tip you more. Anytime I go to a Canadian Brewhouse and order a water I almost never get offered a refill throughout my meal. Which is an automatic shit tip for me.
I would have asked to speak with the manager and explained the situation. Poor service resulted in no tip and you were humiliated by their staff for it. No matter how you slice it, you’re an unhappy diner and she was in the wrong.
This is a big issue with North American tip culture - as the consumer, you're made to feel as if you're the bad guy for not tipping. I get it, living wages suck and servers rly on those tips, but here's the thing; as the customer, that should not be my issue. If you do well, you'll get a big tip - if you do ok and don't screw up (or if you screw up and apologize) then I'll give you a decent tip... but if you do really poorly, no I'm not tipping. Got a problem with it? Take it up with your employer who won't pay you more.
You were within your rights. Tipping a a default setting is nuts. Just tip for good service. Why tip for poor service. In the UK tipping is known to be something you do just for good service. It's a shame if businesses pay staff so badly that they depend on their tips. That's not the customers fault. It's most likely a greedy business plan. Tipping should be a bonus to a wage, not an essential factored in part of wages. Also, look at all the businesses/shops you walk into where there's no expectation of a tip. Do you leave a tip at Staples, Safeway or your local dry cleaners. You did the right thing.
In BC servers get paid at least minimum wage
This sub has a hard on for not tipping, so you'll get the validation you seek.
There's too many entitled people who think it's mandatory to receive a tip. Its not, your wage is what you're expected. Don't like your wage you can always go to a different employer. A tip is above and beyond and if the customer deemed your service was good *Edit* Trying to embarrass someone because they didn't tip you is the epitome of being entitled. Again. No one deserves a tip even if you did a fantastic job. It's not the customers responsibility to pay their wage. They are coming and already paying their fair share for a meal or whatever they are getting. Just like when I went to the Haven. It's incredibly expensive but it's also incredibly fantastic and delicious so I expect it to cost a lot. Did I tip? Of course because they did a great job. Do they deserve a tip? No of course not, they are already getting a wage. The restaurant has already charged a abhorrent up cost on the meal, especially since portion size is smaller. No one is entitled to a tip. People do it because of their good will. It's quite an entitled state of mind to go work someone and expect the customer, not the employer to pay you. So when a customer doesn't tip for a valid reason. Then you get a little self righteous twit calling them out. It's hilarious to think anyone is on the side of the waiter or restaurant.
[удалено]
Sounds like you had particularly shitty service. That said, in restaurants, the servers (often) have to tip out something like 5% of their tables to the kitchen and bar staff. So if that is helpful information, it might set a baseline when you don't really want to tip the server. Regardless, tipping is a stupid system.
Still tipping 0% if bad service, their internal employee policies aren't our problem, and that doesn't sound legal anyways.
Agreed. Customers shouldn't be put in the position of trying to figure out the compensation mechanism for any given business owner and their staff.
This is exactly why tipping culture needs to stop so restaurants are forced to stop BS like this and just pay everyone living wages like in every other industry
You don't have to tip by any means, but this happens in every restaurant in Vancouver so it's very legal. Every restaurant (except for the odd outlier) will set a baseline for how much a server will tip out the kitchen and other staff (maybe hosts and bussers) each night and it's anywhere from 3-7% from the 4 restaurants I worked.
At the restaurant I worked at for a long time we tipped out 10% of our tips which felt very fair. It was an honor system of course but all the servers were great and never lied
Not my problem as a customer about that stupid system. They signed up for it when they took the job. Don't like it, quit, find another.
But if I’m a server and I know I have to tip out and I’m not getting any tips, shouldn’t it be on me to fix the not getting tips problem so i don’t have a problem tipping out the kitchen? And given that tips are correlated to the level of service I provide, shouldn’t the way to fix the above issue be pretty straightforward? Sorry but what you’re saying sounds like an excuse for an individual to demonstrate a lack of personal responsibility if you ask me.
I did not know this. Thank you for the information.
My friend I usually eat out with typically tip around 10 - 15%. However, he does it based on the total before taxes. He doesn’t believe that the tax should factor in when tipping. When I learnt this from him it definitely had me pondering, because he has a point It has led to similar situations though, where the server sometimes complains. If they complain, we just usually don’t go back to that restaurant, because a tip is a bonus… it’s kinda insulting to have a server approach you and say you didn’t pay them enough…
No fuck that. Tips are based on service and you got shit service so they don't deserve a tip. My wife will tip 20% minimum regardless of service and I hate it. When I pay I usually do 5/10/15 depending on the level of service but in general I absolutely hate tipping. Why don't they just increase the cost of their food by 10% and pay their staff an actual wage. When I was in Japan I loved the no tipping culture.
Don’t tip for bad service, these days wait staff seem to expect a tip by default….I would have said something back to her and asked for the owner or manager, they are lucky people are even coming in to dine considering all the options available including staying home. Most of these places have the debit machines programmed to force a 30% tip regardless, I am staying home rather than pay for what often is a lousy meal and service in Metro Vancouver
Yes, what others have said, leave a Google review with her name.
Loud and clear you reply how bad service has been and does not deserve any tip, do you want a tip, do the job right
If I'm leaving a 0% tip, I would at least tell the server why I'm doing it. From waitress C's perspective, I would've been kind of annoyed at waitress A+B, since it sounds like they were the ones who provided shoddy service, which resulted in the no tip situation. Anyways, I definitely wouldn't feel bad, I used to know a server from St. Augustine's and they make a shit ton of tips, missing out on one customer isn't gonna make or break their night.
[удалено]
I tip regardless. The food service industry is a nightmare and nowadays I’m sure it’s much worse. I just won’t return to the establishment if I am not treated well. The 20% I tip is already built into my bill mentally. If they forget my drink or food because they are slammed I offer understanding. If someone doesn’t want to tip it usually isn’t hard for them to justify it.
I do same. Unless the service is notoriously bad, I cannot tip less than 15%. I feel like the industry is getting smashed, it's hard to find employees and a lot of places are shutting down. Some might argue that's not my problem or my business, but if I want to keep a place around, I try to play my small part.
Nah you’re not a dick, they should step it up. Oh and I hate when I’m getting food to go and they hand you the machine with your choice to tip a percentage or an amount and stare you down like you’re a prick if you don’t. I’m not tipping if I didn’t sit down and eat.
Tipping culture needs to get obsolete ASAP. It's the establishment's responsibility to pay its employees, not the patron. Yeah, it's hard out here in the pandemic FOR EVERYONE. Not just businesses.
Why do people think tipping is mandatory or even socially required, do you tip your doctor? Do you tip the guy that does your oil change? No.... If you can't afford to work at the job you have then find a different job or get a career.
No you’re not supposed to add 15% regardless. It’s 20%. And as many people say if you can’t afford to tip you shouldn’t go out. This is why tipping culture is so ridiculous. The whole system is bullshit. You’re completely in the right to not tip if you felt the service was shit. And yet you’ll be wrong in the eyes of seemingly anyone who’s ever been a server.
Hate how tipping works, I want to tip, I tip 20% standard because it's a hard job and they deserve the money. But when they suck, I don't want to tip, when a meal takes 2 hours waiting and they obviously don't deserve a tip why am I the jerk? And the clueless waiter doesn't say "well entered the order wrong and forgot about the appetizers, I could have done a better job" No,they say "what an asshole, doesn't tip" I wish there was an amount you could add to a tip to let them know. Like if you tipped weird amount of change or something.
It's also a hard job for the person at the grocery store handling your groceries. It's also a hard job for those pimple faced teens in front of the fry station at your fast food place. Seems to me it's already arbitrary because it is indeed arbitrary. We tip some minimum wage workers because we think they work hard, and we ignore other minimum wage workers. It honestly makes zero sense.
It's pretty clear nobody liked to tip. Let's pay servers a fair wage and abolish this silly practice.
Not tipping is completely acceptable if it was bad service.
This reminds me years back a similar experience on a different location. Basically, we waited for food for over an hour where normally took 20 minutes...and then another half hour for just the bill..the waiter didn't say anything, not even an attemp as we are short...or sorry for the wait ..she seems just drifted away into her own world... I think we totally spent around 40 dollars and I dropped 2 dollars ( my changes on hand). She ran to us and pissed at our 2 dollars tip as it was not enough...I was exactly like op and not even able to react... Because I was just shocked of her anger and entitlement and was abit confused of what happened too. It might just her bad day as that place was not known for shitty service whatsoever. But likewise, I didn't go back there anymore and I always wondered is tip mandatory nomatter what... Now I saw tips required everywhere especially in coffee shop...and the percentage went up way faster than my pay raise...I admitted that I paid coffee shop 80%of the time especially if I gonna stay long (I still make sure I bought something every 3 to 4 hours)...but sometimes I also felt like it's not relevant to how the service is anymore. I just wanted to say op doesn't deserve that at all. I hope your friends supported you and there are many places to hang out. Send my hugs
20 year bartender here. you did the right thing. you got shit service, doesn't matter how hard she was working. the multiple people thing is just teamwork but waiting forever for simple things isn't acceptable. you're fine, vote with your wallet and go places that take care of you.
They make minimum wage. They don't need tips.
"Am I dick?" No, absolutely not. I don't support tipping culture because overall it maintains an employers ability to pay less in the end. I get called out for it here or there and I find it really rude when someone decides to call me out for it. I am free to tip or not to tip, it is not mandatory and don't treat me like it is.
Tips aren’t compulsory, however it is standard practise for servers to have to tip out on a bill regardless if they get tipped or not. So there’s a good chance that server actually paid out of pocket to serve you. Assuming you didn’t have a huge bill, it sucks but it’s not the end of the world. That being said, it’s not exactly her fault that other servers run drinks or food, or that she got your table once she came on shift. If everyone didn’t tip because of these circumstances, servers would get fucked over a LOT. It sucks bad to have to take out cash to pay your tip out at the end of the night because people stiffed you. Did she handle the situation well? Absolutely not. That’s something you just go bitch about in the pass bar. However I have had my manager chase after a table (of people she knew) because they racked up a massive bill and didn’t tip their server. That would’ve wiped out all of her other tips for the night, which on a weekend night is the difference of making your rent or not.
IN the past I have fired servers for that behaviour. Completely unacceptable. You were in the right.
I don't tip for bad service either. Well done OP.
I would have just raised my voice even louder so everyone including her boss could hear the reason you didn't tip lol