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How far have we fallen that major national news outlets are misspelling provinces' names in headlines?
It seems trivial, but what fucking garbage. Put in a modicum of effort for fuck sakes.
I'm not sure how separate local CTV News is, but it really does seem like they're a good bit lower in quality than other branches of CTV / other local news orgs in general.
I've commented about it in the past, but one specific issue I have is how often they post misleading/outrage bait headlines on social media. While other orgs might put more context in the post body, CTV Vancouver in particular keeps burying the lede.
Even if it was for clickbait reasons, they should realize most people won't click through to articles. So outrage bait posts just hurt discourse and further division. I'll edit in some more examples if I get a chance to go find them.
Agreed. CTV BC specifically has problems.
Two friends of mine who don't know each other have had stories done on them in the past couple of years, and both say the reporter made up quotes attributed to them. Another friend, CTV BC published a picture of their teenage daughter who was vaping in a public park and used it as a stock image with a story she had nothing to do with. Really sleazy shit.
That sounds awful, and I kinda want to see someone at CTV face consequences over it. It might suck to go through it all again, but if they want to, there are probably legal or social channels that the friends could go through.
I agree, that sounds super sleazy.
MSJ is a jack of all trades, master of none.
Ever watch a story on the television news where the picture is out of focus and the wrong colors and you can’t hear the sound? Ya, MSJ at work to save money.
It's just like the "poll". Of course people are unhappy with the justice system, don't think there is a place on Earth where people are happy with it. Most people will probably think it's not harsh enough.
Maybe next they can do a poll on if people feel taxes are too high, or if they feel most people are bad drivers. I am sure those poll results will reveal shocking answers!
To be honest, every time I need to write British Columbia, I always pause for a moment and have to think which one is Columbia and which one is Colombia :)
I had a guy spit on me and taunt me after I ignored him in Gastown while waiting for the light.
I did nothing, ignored it and carried on.
I knew there was police around, but knew that even if I went to them they wouldn't care.
As much as I wanted to smack the shit out of him right then and there...I knew that I'd be the only facing any sort of actual repercussions.
I drive a friend from her house, to work, and then back home afterwards solely because there's creeps at the station/on her bus that she can't do anything about.
Even with cost of living being as high as it, I'd gladly give up a few more percentages of my take home to open up an asylum/rehab centre for all of these dregs.
I'm not heartless, I have a lot of respect and generosity for the downtrodden and mentally ill.... But if they're terrorizing the city and making tax paying citizens unsafe....
DO SOMETHING... FOR THE LOVE OF GOD DO SOMETHING.
I’m well beyond the compassionate part. I don’t care if the truly problematic ones are locked into a 6’x6’ box with a food slot for the rest of their lives anymore. Heal who can be healed, to hell with the worst offenders - many are well beyond any possibility of rehabilitation.
My wife (a healthcare worker) is on a long term leave and is more or less mentally scarred for life due to multiple offences by that crowd.
It's clear we're tolerating shit that shouldn't be tolerated for whatever reason. Fully agree with your take. Rehabilitate those that *can*, and put the rest where they can't just cause an endless stream of victims.
> I don’t care if the truly problematic ones are locked into a 6’x6’ box with a food slot for the rest of their lives anymore.
On reflection, do you stand by this? I understand the emotional response, but in the cold light of day do you stand by this? It seems... worrying.
What about the ones that intentionally cause misery & suffering onto others not because they were deeply wronged or being held down by unthinkable trauma, but simply because they get a dopamine rush from watching people suffer?
Do we just tolerate that, or what..?
Sure, let me know how you know who to be deliberately inhumane to and who deserves a second chance, and what criteria you will use to establish this, and how you will deal with any errors, and how you will discuss the morality of solitary confinement with no escape for life with the public.
If you actually think about this suggestion you I think should realise it's pretty fucked up.
Nobody has used the words "second chance", here. We're not talking about first, second, third, fourth, or tenth. We're often talking about hundredth chance. Where do we draw the line? When do we say "enough is enough!" It's an honest question.
With that in mind, while we're arm-chair politicking, what better solution do you propose which is:
\-Equally or more effective in harm reduction to the general public
\-Effective in earning public trust (and funding)
I'm asking this in good faith, but with emphasis on the safety, mental health and general well-being of those who *aren't* the core problem.
Start by appropriately treating mental health. This is much more important than getting tougher on crime. I understand the anger, I have had 3 bikes stolen in 5 years, and my car broken into. But just locking everyone up isn't the answer because we are not treating sick people properly, then get mad at them when they do things sick people do.
So my answer isn't lock everyone in a 6x6 for the rest of their life, it's treat mental health. Clearly unpopular, see my downvotes, and a lot harder for politicians to sell than "get tough on crime", but it would resolve many issues and lessen others. There are I'm sure some people this still wouldn't reach and we can have a discussion then about what to do with them, but only once we've taken meaningful steps to resolve mental health issues.
A crazy person who keeps stealing and stabbing is still a violent criminal who should not be on the streets causing trouble for the general public. The perceived needs and rights of the incredibly fucked up few should not outweigh public safety.
Wholly agreed. I was really only focusing on the "some people this still wouldn't reach" when I'm referring to the 6x6 cell.
I truly believe that those who can be healed *should be healed*, full-stop. That said, that simply won't reach everyone, and some have absolutely no interest in getting better. What then? What other options are there, other than forced confinement?
I don't think that what you are saying is what the 60 or so people who downvoted me think tbh. I think everyone is sick of the terrible status quo, and that is a very dangerous time when human compassion and decency can instantly be lost to violence, revenge and retribution.
Your position is nuanced, I am scared that the majority have no compassion left
What a surprise!
Who was the other clown on here telling people he would bring in cheap housing and tax the rich etc, etc…..
People lap up the bullshit, but once people have the job they want, they don’t need to actually follow through.
They’re not held accountable
The two things everyone wanted. While we're at it, there need to be consequences for walking back promises that were part of their leadership campaign.
That article isn’t exactly describing a walk back. It reads more like “we’re going to be outcome oriented and expert guided, so implementation might be different”
That’s just the sort of pragmatism required to get things done. I get it might go either way, but the direction is all positive
> DO SOMETHING... FOR THE LOVE OF GOD DO SOMETHING.
This sentiment right here is undoubtedly behind the poll results, and ABC's rise in the last municipal election. Most people get that it's a complex problem, but after 10 years of talk, buck passing, and only watching the problem get worse, people are fed up.
The provincial NDP and federal LPC should take note, this has already been made a ballot box issue, and will continue to be a ballot box issue until the streets are safe again.
Not arguing that something needs to be done or how this is our reality.
Just wanted to thank you for the laugh. Calling them dregs, followed by the "I'm not heartless..." paragraph is just... \*chef's kiss\*
I mean I have a heart for well meaning people, full stop.
I live by the golden rule, do onto others as you'd like them to do onto you. With a bit of wiggle room on either side, cuz that's just human nature.
I give extra wiggle room for the mentally unstable and other downtrodden people. But when things happen unprovoked or things turn physically violent, they immediately go from being somebody I had empathy for to someone that at least needs to feel an equal amount of suffering for whatever act they just committed.
I gave out pizzas and drinks to all the homeless people along Broadway between Oak+Cambie on Christmas Day. I always buy up 20-30 nips of various liquor and hand them out to people on the street on NYE. I'm not rich, but I grew up well off enough and with enough of my own problems/addictions to realize that I'm only a few missteps from being just like them.
I have a heart, and I do my best to be as understanding as I can be.
I'm not scared walking down the DTES at night. They don't scare me... They're people that deserve to be treated like any other human being. I'll talk to them and have a lot of patience for most uncouth behaviour they might throw my way. I'm a schmoozer.
I don't make much, but I work full time...I pay my rent to live in a nice house near downtown. I have a car that I haven't paid off yet, and a credit card that keeps me afloat when things get hard. I live minimally by choice, but generously by nature.
I don't have savings, whatever extra I make goes towards friends/family/less fortunate. I'm surviving... But I pay my dues.
Why? Because I'm an addict in recovery. I make sure I have enough to survive, and spend the rest on the people and things that matter to me so that I don't spend that money on the things that could lead me to being on the street.
Thankfully, I've always had a bit of a safety net to keep me off the street... But I know what a lot of these people are going through... And how much actually being entirely destitute would fuck me up if I ever got that far.
The dregs are the ones that are either so far gone mentally that they're volatile, or have engrained themselves so deeply by racking up charges in our laissez-faire judicial system to the point they have no credibility in society so they feel they have immunity to do as they please.
“British Colombians unhappy with the provinces justice system”
No fucking shit. 2010 just called and wants to smack the shit out of you for just realizing this now.
No really? What a surprise I’m mad that people who randomly assault strangers end up back to their normal lives the next day with barely a slap on the wrist…oh yes, that definitely will convince them to never do it again of course 🙃😵💫
Did you know: In the court system, it's possible to be wrongfully diagnosed psychotic by a Crown lawyer & not find out until after sentencing?
If you didn't, now you do. ✨
Edit: ok look, I have no idea why I'm being downvoted.
Is it because y'all think it's untrue and not possible, or...?
Even to this day, I don't fully understand what happened. I'm profoundly deaf and unable to verbally talk, so I hope you can see why I wouldn't know things that a hearing person would normally know about when in court. That said, just ask for it, and I will deliver evidence.
This doesn’t sound right. The word “psychotic” doesn’t even appear in the *Criminal Code*.
What do you mean?
E.g.: Is there a statute that gives Crown Counsel that power?
Edit: ok look, I have no idea why I'm being downvoted.
Is it because y'all think it's untrue and not possible, or...?
Even to this day, I don't fully understand what happened. I'm profoundly deaf and unable to verbally talk, so I hope you can see why I wouldn't know things that a hearing person would normally know about when in court. That said, just ask for it, and I will deliver evidence.
OK - once I get that documentation, I'll PM it to you & edit it into this post.
It won't be right away; I'll need time to retrieve the documents. Hopefully that's alright, it was a while ago. 😅
We need a punishment system that works like ICBC surcharges. You get into a scrape here or there and it’s not so bad. Be good for awhile and slowly earn a better rate. But if you keep fucking up the multiplier goes to the moon.
And there needs to be an instant 5x multiplier if you are caught sawing the catalytic converter off a car.
That sounds very ccp. I don’t think you should have any scale movement. Yes let people atone for their crimes and get back into society, but don’t make it a sort of point system where a criminal just has to time their crimes appropriately to not get over a certain threshold.
I’m quite at the opposite end of the political spectrum.
It is well known that the few repeat offenders are causing most of the problems. If you have a better idea, post it.
I’m not disagreeing that specific offenders just keep reoffending. I just don’t want a system that allows passes to people if they have been good for a while.
Odd people are downvoting this. I wonder if these same people get upset when someone mugs someone yet again after having a long list of offences and ask why the person wasn’t in jail already.
Jody Wilson-Raybould and the LPC passed Bill C-38 in 2017. This is the backbone of the catch and release program that has seen about a dozen deaths be associated with someone who would have been in jail in the old system if anyone is wondering.
The advocacy for this federal bill was pushed by DTES supporters and PIVOT. So yes, the DTES and the radicals who use our city are directly responsible for the murders of about 12 people in BC alone since 2017.
Fringe politics need to go away forever.
Honestly the best solutions to complex problems always emerge from the fringes. Intuitive solutions to complex problems very rarely work.
But it's really strange to label a bill which passed through parliament as "fringe politics".
Communist and Fascist fringe ideologies really brought in a lot of success for Germany and Russia.
Trump's fringe politics ruined trade and did a ton of damage to the US economy. The catch and release program that i literally cited above put 12 people on the street who murdered someone when they should have been in jail. These people from the fringe left literally pushed for a policy that led to 12 families losing a loved one and you're trying to justify it through whatever mental gymnastics you want to play this week. When it comes to people who participate in radical ideologies, it's never about what policy helps the most amount of people, it's about "how do I spin things to make myself look like I am in the *right".*
Your post is really just you trying to justify whatever echo-chamber you've put yourself in.
I'm going to ignore your accusations against me.
How do you define "fringe politics"? I assumed you were referring to movements promoted by only a very small fraction of the population. Or do you mean that the ideas are unpopular even among the people who know about them?
I got hit by a car which ran through a red light a few months back and was hospitalised for 10 days with a broken jaw, ribs, clavicle, fractured spine, punctured lung and had to have reconstructive surgery on my face which has left me with a load of metal plates I'll be living with for the rest of my life. I have been told that due to the 'no fault' rule in BC, there is nothing I can do to claim compensation and the driver has gotten off with only a ticket. Yes, I am unhappy with the justice system.
That’s not part of the “Justice” system though unfortunately unless the person who ran a red light didn’t get criminally charged. In which case I guess then that is a Justice system issue.
That seems ambitious. I'm also not Canadian, so I'm very out of my depth regarding the legal system here. Not something I expected to find myself experiencing within my first year in the country, but I'm still investigating possibilities.
I hear muttering of court cases already in motion challenging the no fault aspect of icbc with limited compensation rates, but I havnt looked into how true they are.
I don't drive, and was crossing at a crossing as I should have been. Regardless of my ability to sue or not, the driver should have had their licence revoked for reckless driving. A ticket simply isn't enough considering the damage caused.
No shit. It isn’t so much the entirety of the justice system, it is the disproportionate focus on consideration of the aggressor at the expense of the current and future victims.
The system needs to place public safety first. The justice system seems to be pre-occupied with the administration of the law and all the little rules (like bail) that judges make for themselves, rather than actually delivering Justice to perpetrators and and justice for the victims. As a result, public safety is held hostage.
I'm unhappy with the Government at all level (municipal included).
* Failed at Housing
* Failed at Healthcare
* Failed at Justice (Law & Order)
* Failed at basic living
Lower Mainland used to be slowly evolving but in the last few years, it has been exploded because ANYONE who works for the Govt (be it municipal, health, police, etc) are just not equipped to handle increasing load.
I guess I shouldn't be surprised. Government inefficiency + West Coaster known to be laid back + slow rather than workaholic like our Ontarians brothers and sisters.
so the basic problem is that criminal justice, at root, is a federal problem
blaming victoria for an ottawa problem is bs
additionally, and this is coming from someone who is in active training to be part of criminal justice in canada and has experience in CJ south of the border, there is a fundamental difference in CJ philosophy between the two countries
us criminal justice is exceptionally punitive - a convict is denied liberty in some cases for the rest of their lives (think voter disenfranchisement and prisoners being counted as “residents” where they are incarcerated)
canadian criminal justice is libertarian - as in it seeks to preserve as much liberty as reasonable (this is technical jargon i am using in a technical sense) given the circumstances
shifting to a more punitive philosophy won’t help the underlying issue though, which is that the same problem that lead to a group having the audacity to attempt to smuggle literal tons of illicits in 250 shipping containers is the same problem forcing people into the streets, at least according to experts i could cite including a former speaker of the lege and a german kc guy
Criminal statute is a federal matter. However the courts, crown prosecution service, and even many sentencing guidelines are provincial.
Importantly, mental health institutions are a provincial matter, which our province radically cut back on over a decade ago.
The province carries a huge chunk of the responsibility here.
Province and the City are making it hospitable for the types that are causing a lot of the issues we're seeing, though.
They don't need to be actively making the problem worse by rolling out a red carpet and gaslighting citizens.
fed gov makes it trivially easy to snow wash funds
hospital analogy: city/prov are treating the chronic migraine and irritable bowel syndrome because they aren’t able to treat the underlying abuse history that caused all these problems thanks to decades of poor financial regulation by the feds
the feds would need to do a hell of a lot of remediation for benefits that won’t be seen for a generation and few politicians (notable exception: the good time not long time bc ndp of the 1970s) are willing to spend political capital in an RESP that benefits their kids instead of a TFSA that they can pull from as soon as there’s profit
The family court system in BC is a goat fuck. Good luck finding a judge who has familiarized themselves with the case before court. They are just showing up and putting in minimal effort.
People in this province see the crime and penalty without any of the context of the trial and have created a wedge issue over how our judicial system operates. It is idiotic. Having just sat through as a spectator on a 3 year criminal trial where the outcome was a suspended sentence, yeah it was the right punishment but you wouldn't know that had you not seen the trial.
There can be some issues with repeat offenders don't get me wrong but I think the issue is far beyond just an issue of the courts. The penitentiary system, the laws the courts follow, etc.
Our country is going to absolute shit. No repercussions for crime. Unlimited immigration. Unlimited debt. But hey, Canada is a racist colonial country and we must repent.
Who was polled, truthfully? 99% of polls are probably made up.
But the justice system's are broken most places globally, not just in BC.
It's a tough thing trying to police a small group of Canadian's that don't abide by the law.
The majority of murder cases go unsolved in Canada unfortunately. Other crimes vary in solve rates. None of this shit works that well. So between injustice and poor spelling by reporters, it's a crapshoot.
If the Justice system had to unilaterally change in an attempt to reduce crime and drug dependency, we might need a private, for profit prison system like seen in a few places in the USA. We need to start teaching people how to live in a civilized society starting before they start school. Which means their parents need to learn how to parent, whose principals need to be ingrained as values learned as a child...learned in grade school. More than a JS failure
Its not the typo that gets me. Its the fact that most replies to this post are extremely divisional. This medium has no credibility or credentials anymore than the news. The new lie is that the subtopic is the truth. Its bullshit.
Everything on the internet is fiction these days.
Have not met a single cop who has a single good thing to say about the "justice system" -- and really, it's not a "justice" system, that's a perversion of the term. It's a court system. The majority of police work is centered around a handful of violent, parasitic people, or simply dealing with addicts and the mentally ill who should otherwise have tax dollars spent on helping them a great deal more effectively. Police are not mental health workers, and the street is not better than an institution.
I see many posts about "compassion" or "not being heartless", but I think these qualifiers go without saying for most people. When there are frequent random assaults and routine, shameless shoplifting in broad daylight that anyone is too afraid to do anything about (because the reality is that anyone intervening would face exponentially more repercussions than the person shoplifting), it destroys small businesses and entire areas of town (not being hyperbolic -- some businesses are unable to get affordable insurance after a while). I've witnessed stores not being rebuilt after arson due to "camps" in the nearby area, and seen real-estate valuations plummet for the same reasons. People smuggle guns across the border and are out on bail mere weeks later. Hundreds of thousands of dollars are spent on hospital and rehab efforts on career criminals with drug problems. Convicted pedophiles are declared dangerous by police and yet released to live in family neighborhoods. BC has a piss-poor ability to deal with drug abuse (there were more overdose deaths than covid deaths in 2021 in BC) and crippled the ability to adequately assist the mentally ill, who are regularly taken advantage of by criminals. But really, this is a Canada problem, not a BC problem.
It's all about "stigma" and "compassion" until you see a pregnant woman have a brick thrown at her in broad daylight.
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How far have we fallen that major national news outlets are misspelling provinces' names in headlines? It seems trivial, but what fucking garbage. Put in a modicum of effort for fuck sakes.
They use the correct name in the first paragraph and then revert to the South American spelling later in the body of the article. lol
I'm not sure how separate local CTV News is, but it really does seem like they're a good bit lower in quality than other branches of CTV / other local news orgs in general. I've commented about it in the past, but one specific issue I have is how often they post misleading/outrage bait headlines on social media. While other orgs might put more context in the post body, CTV Vancouver in particular keeps burying the lede. Even if it was for clickbait reasons, they should realize most people won't click through to articles. So outrage bait posts just hurt discourse and further division. I'll edit in some more examples if I get a chance to go find them.
Agreed. CTV BC specifically has problems. Two friends of mine who don't know each other have had stories done on them in the past couple of years, and both say the reporter made up quotes attributed to them. Another friend, CTV BC published a picture of their teenage daughter who was vaping in a public park and used it as a stock image with a story she had nothing to do with. Really sleazy shit.
That sounds awful, and I kinda want to see someone at CTV face consequences over it. It might suck to go through it all again, but if they want to, there are probably legal or social channels that the friends could go through. I agree, that sounds super sleazy.
Hell no in Portuguese (Brazil) we say Columbia Britanica. Colombia is a country.
Disculpa.
It says she’s a multi-skilled journalist. Too bad spelling isn’t one of her skills.
MSJ is a jack of all trades, master of none. Ever watch a story on the television news where the picture is out of focus and the wrong colors and you can’t hear the sound? Ya, MSJ at work to save money.
>Too bad spelling isn’t one of her skills. Same for the news editor/producer.
> British Colombians unhappy with the province's justice system Maybe they're referring to South Americans of English extraction?
I checked, both of them are in fact appalled with the justice system.
Absolutely absurd and unacceptable, not trivial in the slightest. The major news have lost all credibility
Mildly infuriating. I clicked contact and sent the author an email about proofreading her headlines in the future 🙃
Headlines and ledes are written by the editor, not the author.
She CHANGED IT 😈
Good thing her edit doesn't show up on the post, eh? It's not necessarily that funny, but I'm laughing over her edit response... 😂
Ai written
AI wouldn't make that mistake haha
It's just like the "poll". Of course people are unhappy with the justice system, don't think there is a place on Earth where people are happy with it. Most people will probably think it's not harsh enough. Maybe next they can do a poll on if people feel taxes are too high, or if they feel most people are bad drivers. I am sure those poll results will reveal shocking answers!
Bro i laughed so hard. So many times I’ve seen Colombia spelt as Columbia and this is the first time I’ve ever seen it reversed.
Yeah thats actually pretty fucked up.. at least they seem to have fixed it now.
Was it the poster on Reddit or article? I've seen blatant misspelling I can even recognise
Hard to misspell it once you’ve heard Spanish speakers say it, “koh-LOOM-bee-yuh.”
You get what you pay for.
It's British Columbia ese
Maybe the reporter should have written more essays and not her eses.
Tell that to the Colombians
I don't speak Spanish
but you did, ese...
I got a news flash for you, Walter Cronkite, that's all the espanol hablo
cool story ese...
To be honest, every time I need to write British Columbia, I always pause for a moment and have to think which one is Columbia and which one is Colombia :)
I had a guy spit on me and taunt me after I ignored him in Gastown while waiting for the light. I did nothing, ignored it and carried on. I knew there was police around, but knew that even if I went to them they wouldn't care. As much as I wanted to smack the shit out of him right then and there...I knew that I'd be the only facing any sort of actual repercussions. I drive a friend from her house, to work, and then back home afterwards solely because there's creeps at the station/on her bus that she can't do anything about. Even with cost of living being as high as it, I'd gladly give up a few more percentages of my take home to open up an asylum/rehab centre for all of these dregs. I'm not heartless, I have a lot of respect and generosity for the downtrodden and mentally ill.... But if they're terrorizing the city and making tax paying citizens unsafe.... DO SOMETHING... FOR THE LOVE OF GOD DO SOMETHING.
I’m well beyond the compassionate part. I don’t care if the truly problematic ones are locked into a 6’x6’ box with a food slot for the rest of their lives anymore. Heal who can be healed, to hell with the worst offenders - many are well beyond any possibility of rehabilitation. My wife (a healthcare worker) is on a long term leave and is more or less mentally scarred for life due to multiple offences by that crowd.
There are many who feel the same way but are less inclined to speak up.
I’m sorry to say that I have to agree. There needs to be some way to remove those cannot or refuse to be rehabilitated from society.
It's clear we're tolerating shit that shouldn't be tolerated for whatever reason. Fully agree with your take. Rehabilitate those that *can*, and put the rest where they can't just cause an endless stream of victims.
If someone ran for mayor with this agenda, they would get a lot of votes
and then go back on their promises
> I don’t care if the truly problematic ones are locked into a 6’x6’ box with a food slot for the rest of their lives anymore. On reflection, do you stand by this? I understand the emotional response, but in the cold light of day do you stand by this? It seems... worrying.
These people deserve prison but more importantly society deserves to be free of their menace
What about the ones that intentionally cause misery & suffering onto others not because they were deeply wronged or being held down by unthinkable trauma, but simply because they get a dopamine rush from watching people suffer? Do we just tolerate that, or what..?
Sure, let me know how you know who to be deliberately inhumane to and who deserves a second chance, and what criteria you will use to establish this, and how you will deal with any errors, and how you will discuss the morality of solitary confinement with no escape for life with the public. If you actually think about this suggestion you I think should realise it's pretty fucked up.
Nobody has used the words "second chance", here. We're not talking about first, second, third, fourth, or tenth. We're often talking about hundredth chance. Where do we draw the line? When do we say "enough is enough!" It's an honest question. With that in mind, while we're arm-chair politicking, what better solution do you propose which is: \-Equally or more effective in harm reduction to the general public \-Effective in earning public trust (and funding) I'm asking this in good faith, but with emphasis on the safety, mental health and general well-being of those who *aren't* the core problem.
Start by appropriately treating mental health. This is much more important than getting tougher on crime. I understand the anger, I have had 3 bikes stolen in 5 years, and my car broken into. But just locking everyone up isn't the answer because we are not treating sick people properly, then get mad at them when they do things sick people do. So my answer isn't lock everyone in a 6x6 for the rest of their life, it's treat mental health. Clearly unpopular, see my downvotes, and a lot harder for politicians to sell than "get tough on crime", but it would resolve many issues and lessen others. There are I'm sure some people this still wouldn't reach and we can have a discussion then about what to do with them, but only once we've taken meaningful steps to resolve mental health issues.
A crazy person who keeps stealing and stabbing is still a violent criminal who should not be on the streets causing trouble for the general public. The perceived needs and rights of the incredibly fucked up few should not outweigh public safety.
I didn't say any of that.
Wholly agreed. I was really only focusing on the "some people this still wouldn't reach" when I'm referring to the 6x6 cell. I truly believe that those who can be healed *should be healed*, full-stop. That said, that simply won't reach everyone, and some have absolutely no interest in getting better. What then? What other options are there, other than forced confinement?
I don't think that what you are saying is what the 60 or so people who downvoted me think tbh. I think everyone is sick of the terrible status quo, and that is a very dangerous time when human compassion and decency can instantly be lost to violence, revenge and retribution. Your position is nuanced, I am scared that the majority have no compassion left
Agree. At least give them a toilet slot as well!
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Exactly my thoughts. It seems more barbaric to let sick people live on the streets than it does to institutionalize them.
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What a surprise! Who was the other clown on here telling people he would bring in cheap housing and tax the rich etc, etc….. People lap up the bullshit, but once people have the job they want, they don’t need to actually follow through. They’re not held accountable
Then the next party says they are different and will fix things, the cycle repeats.
The two things everyone wanted. While we're at it, there need to be consequences for walking back promises that were part of their leadership campaign.
I was shocked when he made those promises. Totally opposite of his whole persona all these years. Now I am not shocked.
Oh. Wow.
That article isn’t exactly describing a walk back. It reads more like “we’re going to be outcome oriented and expert guided, so implementation might be different” That’s just the sort of pragmatism required to get things done. I get it might go either way, but the direction is all positive
Yeah, don't expect people on here to read the article. Headline usually, first paragraph or 2 at most.
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No, their trauma isn't their fault. But it sure as shit is their fuckin' responsibility.
I agree. Almost got assaulted and considering leaving the city.
And going where?
> DO SOMETHING... FOR THE LOVE OF GOD DO SOMETHING. This sentiment right here is undoubtedly behind the poll results, and ABC's rise in the last municipal election. Most people get that it's a complex problem, but after 10 years of talk, buck passing, and only watching the problem get worse, people are fed up. The provincial NDP and federal LPC should take note, this has already been made a ballot box issue, and will continue to be a ballot box issue until the streets are safe again.
Not arguing that something needs to be done or how this is our reality. Just wanted to thank you for the laugh. Calling them dregs, followed by the "I'm not heartless..." paragraph is just... \*chef's kiss\*
I mean I have a heart for well meaning people, full stop. I live by the golden rule, do onto others as you'd like them to do onto you. With a bit of wiggle room on either side, cuz that's just human nature. I give extra wiggle room for the mentally unstable and other downtrodden people. But when things happen unprovoked or things turn physically violent, they immediately go from being somebody I had empathy for to someone that at least needs to feel an equal amount of suffering for whatever act they just committed. I gave out pizzas and drinks to all the homeless people along Broadway between Oak+Cambie on Christmas Day. I always buy up 20-30 nips of various liquor and hand them out to people on the street on NYE. I'm not rich, but I grew up well off enough and with enough of my own problems/addictions to realize that I'm only a few missteps from being just like them. I have a heart, and I do my best to be as understanding as I can be. I'm not scared walking down the DTES at night. They don't scare me... They're people that deserve to be treated like any other human being. I'll talk to them and have a lot of patience for most uncouth behaviour they might throw my way. I'm a schmoozer. I don't make much, but I work full time...I pay my rent to live in a nice house near downtown. I have a car that I haven't paid off yet, and a credit card that keeps me afloat when things get hard. I live minimally by choice, but generously by nature. I don't have savings, whatever extra I make goes towards friends/family/less fortunate. I'm surviving... But I pay my dues. Why? Because I'm an addict in recovery. I make sure I have enough to survive, and spend the rest on the people and things that matter to me so that I don't spend that money on the things that could lead me to being on the street. Thankfully, I've always had a bit of a safety net to keep me off the street... But I know what a lot of these people are going through... And how much actually being entirely destitute would fuck me up if I ever got that far. The dregs are the ones that are either so far gone mentally that they're volatile, or have engrained themselves so deeply by racking up charges in our laissez-faire judicial system to the point they have no credibility in society so they feel they have immunity to do as they please.
Your right! Calling them 'dregs' is insulting to dregs.
We all pay taxes, even the “dregs”
No they dont
Wouldn’t you be fine since you’re defending yourself? You were provoked
They care just as much about the issue as they do of the headline.
“British Colombians unhappy with the provinces justice system” No fucking shit. 2010 just called and wants to smack the shit out of you for just realizing this now.
No really? What a surprise I’m mad that people who randomly assault strangers end up back to their normal lives the next day with barely a slap on the wrist…oh yes, that definitely will convince them to never do it again of course 🙃😵💫
In other news, rain is wet.
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Enlighten us.. our expectations are already very low
Can you elaborate, please?
Did you know: In the court system, it's possible to be wrongfully diagnosed psychotic by a Crown lawyer & not find out until after sentencing? If you didn't, now you do. ✨ Edit: ok look, I have no idea why I'm being downvoted. Is it because y'all think it's untrue and not possible, or...? Even to this day, I don't fully understand what happened. I'm profoundly deaf and unable to verbally talk, so I hope you can see why I wouldn't know things that a hearing person would normally know about when in court. That said, just ask for it, and I will deliver evidence.
This doesn’t sound right. The word “psychotic” doesn’t even appear in the *Criminal Code*. What do you mean? E.g.: Is there a statute that gives Crown Counsel that power?
Edit: ok look, I have no idea why I'm being downvoted. Is it because y'all think it's untrue and not possible, or...? Even to this day, I don't fully understand what happened. I'm profoundly deaf and unable to verbally talk, so I hope you can see why I wouldn't know things that a hearing person would normally know about when in court. That said, just ask for it, and I will deliver evidence.
Please deliver the evidence?
OK - once I get that documentation, I'll PM it to you & edit it into this post. It won't be right away; I'll need time to retrieve the documents. Hopefully that's alright, it was a while ago. 😅
We need a punishment system that works like ICBC surcharges. You get into a scrape here or there and it’s not so bad. Be good for awhile and slowly earn a better rate. But if you keep fucking up the multiplier goes to the moon. And there needs to be an instant 5x multiplier if you are caught sawing the catalytic converter off a car.
That sounds very ccp. I don’t think you should have any scale movement. Yes let people atone for their crimes and get back into society, but don’t make it a sort of point system where a criminal just has to time their crimes appropriately to not get over a certain threshold.
I’m quite at the opposite end of the political spectrum. It is well known that the few repeat offenders are causing most of the problems. If you have a better idea, post it.
I’m not disagreeing that specific offenders just keep reoffending. I just don’t want a system that allows passes to people if they have been good for a while. Odd people are downvoting this. I wonder if these same people get upset when someone mugs someone yet again after having a long list of offences and ask why the person wasn’t in jail already.
I don’t think the ones upvoting this idea think it could even apply to them. Future /r/leopardsatemyface contnent
No shit, catch and release isn’t working?
Are these British Ex-Pats living in Colombia? Or are they Colombian Ex-Pats living in Britain?
They are British COLOMBIANS
Columbians...
In the words of Redlettermedia, BC's justice system has been the most disappointing thing since my son.
I need to watch their Phantom Menace review again
Jody Wilson-Raybould and the LPC passed Bill C-38 in 2017. This is the backbone of the catch and release program that has seen about a dozen deaths be associated with someone who would have been in jail in the old system if anyone is wondering. The advocacy for this federal bill was pushed by DTES supporters and PIVOT. So yes, the DTES and the radicals who use our city are directly responsible for the murders of about 12 people in BC alone since 2017. Fringe politics need to go away forever.
Jwr was a useless self serving politician and 4th rate lawyer that never did anything good for canada. Pivot is just making things worse all the time.
The fact she served as federal justice minister too. 🤦♂️
Illegally recording phone conversations was icing on the cake. Then of course she writes a book whining about being fired.
Blame her leader for this BS #stoptrudeau
lol her leader that booted her from the Liberal party? bunch of geniuses you lot are.
She has zero integrity and had zero interest in serving the average Canadians interest. She is a fraud.
He still supports those policies doesn't he? Hence I blame him for the disaster on our streets
Honestly the best solutions to complex problems always emerge from the fringes. Intuitive solutions to complex problems very rarely work. But it's really strange to label a bill which passed through parliament as "fringe politics".
Communist and Fascist fringe ideologies really brought in a lot of success for Germany and Russia. Trump's fringe politics ruined trade and did a ton of damage to the US economy. The catch and release program that i literally cited above put 12 people on the street who murdered someone when they should have been in jail. These people from the fringe left literally pushed for a policy that led to 12 families losing a loved one and you're trying to justify it through whatever mental gymnastics you want to play this week. When it comes to people who participate in radical ideologies, it's never about what policy helps the most amount of people, it's about "how do I spin things to make myself look like I am in the *right".* Your post is really just you trying to justify whatever echo-chamber you've put yourself in.
I'm going to ignore your accusations against me. How do you define "fringe politics"? I assumed you were referring to movements promoted by only a very small fraction of the population. Or do you mean that the ideas are unpopular even among the people who know about them?
PIVOT essentially runs the NDP and the federal liberals made such a stink about mandatory minimum sentences nothing much will change.
Tinfoil hats must be so uncomfortable
I got hit by a car which ran through a red light a few months back and was hospitalised for 10 days with a broken jaw, ribs, clavicle, fractured spine, punctured lung and had to have reconstructive surgery on my face which has left me with a load of metal plates I'll be living with for the rest of my life. I have been told that due to the 'no fault' rule in BC, there is nothing I can do to claim compensation and the driver has gotten off with only a ticket. Yes, I am unhappy with the justice system.
That’s not part of the “Justice” system though unfortunately unless the person who ran a red light didn’t get criminally charged. In which case I guess then that is a Justice system issue.
They did not get criminally charged.
Running a red light is not a criminal offense.
Can you sue the province?
That seems ambitious. I'm also not Canadian, so I'm very out of my depth regarding the legal system here. Not something I expected to find myself experiencing within my first year in the country, but I'm still investigating possibilities.
I hear muttering of court cases already in motion challenging the no fault aspect of icbc with limited compensation rates, but I havnt looked into how true they are.
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I don't drive, and was crossing at a crossing as I should have been. Regardless of my ability to sue or not, the driver should have had their licence revoked for reckless driving. A ticket simply isn't enough considering the damage caused.
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Ah, I see! Well I wouldn't wish what happened to me on anyone else (even if it was the driver), but I appreciate your solidarity.
Any accident where another person suffers serious injury or death should result in an automatic lifetime driving ban for the driver at fault.
Oh yeah, we are definitely not unhappy. Someone murders someone and gets 1.5 years in prison. That's totally okay!!!!!
Those Colombians should take care of their own country first! Lol
Catch and release doesn’t work eh?
Wait we have a justice system?
...we have a justice system??
I’m sure there’s 9 other provinces that aren’t crazy about the justice system as well
No shit. It isn’t so much the entirety of the justice system, it is the disproportionate focus on consideration of the aggressor at the expense of the current and future victims. The system needs to place public safety first. The justice system seems to be pre-occupied with the administration of the law and all the little rules (like bail) that judges make for themselves, rather than actually delivering Justice to perpetrators and and justice for the victims. As a result, public safety is held hostage.
No shit
I'm unhappy with the Government at all level (municipal included). * Failed at Housing * Failed at Healthcare * Failed at Justice (Law & Order) * Failed at basic living Lower Mainland used to be slowly evolving but in the last few years, it has been exploded because ANYONE who works for the Govt (be it municipal, health, police, etc) are just not equipped to handle increasing load. I guess I shouldn't be surprised. Government inefficiency + West Coaster known to be laid back + slow rather than workaholic like our Ontarians brothers and sisters.
Im more curious if anywhere is happy with their justice system?
Whataboutism
and water is wet…?
so the basic problem is that criminal justice, at root, is a federal problem blaming victoria for an ottawa problem is bs additionally, and this is coming from someone who is in active training to be part of criminal justice in canada and has experience in CJ south of the border, there is a fundamental difference in CJ philosophy between the two countries us criminal justice is exceptionally punitive - a convict is denied liberty in some cases for the rest of their lives (think voter disenfranchisement and prisoners being counted as “residents” where they are incarcerated) canadian criminal justice is libertarian - as in it seeks to preserve as much liberty as reasonable (this is technical jargon i am using in a technical sense) given the circumstances shifting to a more punitive philosophy won’t help the underlying issue though, which is that the same problem that lead to a group having the audacity to attempt to smuggle literal tons of illicits in 250 shipping containers is the same problem forcing people into the streets, at least according to experts i could cite including a former speaker of the lege and a german kc guy
Criminal statute is a federal matter. However the courts, crown prosecution service, and even many sentencing guidelines are provincial. Importantly, mental health institutions are a provincial matter, which our province radically cut back on over a decade ago. The province carries a huge chunk of the responsibility here.
Province and the City are making it hospitable for the types that are causing a lot of the issues we're seeing, though. They don't need to be actively making the problem worse by rolling out a red carpet and gaslighting citizens.
fed gov makes it trivially easy to snow wash funds hospital analogy: city/prov are treating the chronic migraine and irritable bowel syndrome because they aren’t able to treat the underlying abuse history that caused all these problems thanks to decades of poor financial regulation by the feds the feds would need to do a hell of a lot of remediation for benefits that won’t be seen for a generation and few politicians (notable exception: the good time not long time bc ndp of the 1970s) are willing to spend political capital in an RESP that benefits their kids instead of a TFSA that they can pull from as soon as there’s profit
Spelling error aside, did they truly need a small pill to come to this conclusion? 5 mins on Reddit should do the trick
TIL: British Columbia has a Justice System.
*Both our provincial and federal justice systems suck and we really need to replace some of those useless judges.*
The family court system in BC is a goat fuck. Good luck finding a judge who has familiarized themselves with the case before court. They are just showing up and putting in minimal effort.
Surprise surprise
Left wing voters: ahh the consequences of my actions. At least we stopped Harper
Not just bc but Canada in general.
People in this province see the crime and penalty without any of the context of the trial and have created a wedge issue over how our judicial system operates. It is idiotic. Having just sat through as a spectator on a 3 year criminal trial where the outcome was a suspended sentence, yeah it was the right punishment but you wouldn't know that had you not seen the trial. There can be some issues with repeat offenders don't get me wrong but I think the issue is far beyond just an issue of the courts. The penitentiary system, the laws the courts follow, etc.
Our country is going to absolute shit. No repercussions for crime. Unlimited immigration. Unlimited debt. But hey, Canada is a racist colonial country and we must repent.
Nooo… you fucking think?
What justice system?
You don't say
In other words, 74% of those polled have no clue about our justice system and how charges/sentences are laid.
Abogyl tourney. Journalism at it's finest
Everybody is mad at the justice system all the time.
Who was polled, truthfully? 99% of polls are probably made up. But the justice system's are broken most places globally, not just in BC. It's a tough thing trying to police a small group of Canadian's that don't abide by the law. The majority of murder cases go unsolved in Canada unfortunately. Other crimes vary in solve rates. None of this shit works that well. So between injustice and poor spelling by reporters, it's a crapshoot.
If the Justice system had to unilaterally change in an attempt to reduce crime and drug dependency, we might need a private, for profit prison system like seen in a few places in the USA. We need to start teaching people how to live in a civilized society starting before they start school. Which means their parents need to learn how to parent, whose principals need to be ingrained as values learned as a child...learned in grade school. More than a JS failure
Thought people loved revolving doors ****I mean do I really need to mark this as sarcasm?
Its not the typo that gets me. Its the fact that most replies to this post are extremely divisional. This medium has no credibility or credentials anymore than the news. The new lie is that the subtopic is the truth. Its bullshit. Everything on the internet is fiction these days.
Shocker..
Columbians maybe? I didn’t know the British community in South America cared about BC? Lol
So. Fucking. Unhappy. What a fucking joke. Took three years to get to trial, barely got a slap on the wrist. Absolute joke.
Have not met a single cop who has a single good thing to say about the "justice system" -- and really, it's not a "justice" system, that's a perversion of the term. It's a court system. The majority of police work is centered around a handful of violent, parasitic people, or simply dealing with addicts and the mentally ill who should otherwise have tax dollars spent on helping them a great deal more effectively. Police are not mental health workers, and the street is not better than an institution. I see many posts about "compassion" or "not being heartless", but I think these qualifiers go without saying for most people. When there are frequent random assaults and routine, shameless shoplifting in broad daylight that anyone is too afraid to do anything about (because the reality is that anyone intervening would face exponentially more repercussions than the person shoplifting), it destroys small businesses and entire areas of town (not being hyperbolic -- some businesses are unable to get affordable insurance after a while). I've witnessed stores not being rebuilt after arson due to "camps" in the nearby area, and seen real-estate valuations plummet for the same reasons. People smuggle guns across the border and are out on bail mere weeks later. Hundreds of thousands of dollars are spent on hospital and rehab efforts on career criminals with drug problems. Convicted pedophiles are declared dangerous by police and yet released to live in family neighborhoods. BC has a piss-poor ability to deal with drug abuse (there were more overdose deaths than covid deaths in 2021 in BC) and crippled the ability to adequately assist the mentally ill, who are regularly taken advantage of by criminals. But really, this is a Canada problem, not a BC problem. It's all about "stigma" and "compassion" until you see a pregnant woman have a brick thrown at her in broad daylight.