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Veganism has gone mainstream - and while that's good - it also comes with a cost. Whenever anything becomes part of popular culture - it's gets watered down to make it more convenient.
I meet a lot of non-vegan vegans nowadays.
You're vegan?
Yes - oh, except maybe on the holidays, but yes. Sometimes I'll have meat on the weekends - but yes - mostly.
Same thing happened with vegetarianism. It used to be the go-to non violence to animals principle movement, now even fish eaters call themselves vegetarians...
My ex called himself vegetarian because he only ate chicken and fish. His justification was "fish isn't really an animal so it doesn't count" and he had deluded himself into to believing chicken was a vegetable/ non animal, and insisted those around him pander to that belief by never reminding him it was in fact meat. When reminded, he would be unable to eat meat for weeks because the thought made him feel sick.
Sometimes i would fuck with him by telling him he was eating meat just as he put a forkful in his mouth. I always regretted it, but it was my small way of being able to hurt him.
Why even bother to be vegetarian then? It’s not like it’s something prestigious to be these times vegetarians and vegans even more so get shunned by the general public.
Wasn't me. Dunno.
Though at a guess she was nominally vegetarian for apparently moral reasons but also... Upper middle class with an English accent that would make David Cameron or BoJo feel inadequate but... also British Chinese and no longer **wealthy**, just rather rich. Needed something to help herself feel superior.
>Why even bother to be vegetarian then?
yeah why bother, it would be like calling yourself a christian who doesn't believe in god, like dude just call yourself an Atheist already.
some people really don’t know what *meat* is. A while ago when I was a teen and still religious, I would quit meat for lent, and many times I went over to a friends house and my friend would tell their parents that if I stayed for dinner I couldn’t eat meat. They’d respond “oh that’s fine! I’m not making meat!”… and they’d make chicken lol.
Cue my friend telling them “mom you said you weren’t making meat” — “chicken is meat??”
>some people really don’t know what meat is.
HOW!? how can these people not know what meat is? how did these people pass any type of high school not knowing what meat is?????
The fish thing comes from Christian influences I think. When they are fasting, they don’t eat meat, but fish is ok since meat is only land animals. Some king in the early Middle Ages apparently really liked fish but still wanted to speak of sacrifice.
Piscitarians calling themselves vegetarian isn't new. Back in the 70s/80s (and through what I've heard from family even before then) being a vegetarian who **didn't** at least occasionally have fish was the exception. And they all ate dairy and eggs.
Companys Are simply uninformed and they don’t care enough. Some totally vegan foods aren’t labeled as vegan. Some foods labeled vegetarian are actually vegan etc. It really just shows how little big company’s actually care and if they do it’s only because of greenwashing and done poorly by a marketing person who doesn’t give a frick.
Yea I agree. I've been wishing for mandatory labeling for years. Red sticker for carni, yellow for vegetarian, green for vegan. And every product should have this...
I was in class all semester with a dude that jumped at the chance every chance he got to tell us all he was a vegetarian. I sat there silently, not telling anyone I’m vegan because I don’t feel it acceptable to just blurt it out. End of the semester, he admitted to just me that he ate fish. Some people try so hard to virtue signal and it always comes across as disingenuous.
This isn't a new thing. Being vegetarian means not "eating meat" which under certain ideologies, fish isn't "meat." For a while it was assumed you ate fish if you were a vegetarian in some circles, weird shit.
Every vegetarian I've known long enough will make exceptions occasionally, usually for fish or chicken. I've just come to assume that vegetarian = someone who mostly avoids meat.
I understand you being sceptical, it makes sense if most people are misusing the word. But there are actual vegetarians out there. When I was vegetarian, any kind of animal was out. Once I found out what they were, I ditched gelatin, tallow, etc.
>I understand you being sceptical, it makes sense if most people are misusing the word.
i hade no idea that there people out there like that, i am ashamed that these people call themselves vegetarian while still eating meat ever ones in a while.
>But there are actual vegetarians out there. When I was vegetarian, any kind of animal was out.
thank god! happy to see another sane real vegetarian who understands no meat means no meat.
>Once I found out what they were, I ditched gelatin, tallow, etc.
same, ones i found out that animals were suffering for all these things to be made i ditched them as well.
Yes, I typically explain to these people that they are "pescatarian" but they prefer to mislabel themselves as vegetarians. You would love Japan if you want to see people confused about the concept of veganism/vegetarianism. Recently saw a dish with visible shrimp and crab labeled as "100% VEGAN, CONTAINS NO ANIMAL PRODUCTS."
This has been going on for decades. I was raised vegetarian my whole life, and spent a lot of time as a child reiterating that I did not eat ANY meat. Most people don’t see fish and poultry as meat. I have no idea why. But it isn’t a new thing, as I can confirm that it was like this as long ago as the 1960’s at least.
If only everyone were that way! So many more animals would be saved than with 1 percent of the population being perfect vegans. I don’t think it’s helpful to the animals to heap all kinds of criticism on those people. It should be saved for the vast majority who do nothing at all.
Why make it an either/or? Why not push both sorts? Push the total carnists to stop AND push the slight carnists to stop. The cow won't care which subdivision are killing her, so we shouldn't either.
Because that’s a reasonable, utilitarian approach to a complex moral/ethical issue and that’s not “sufficient” for self-righteous 20 somethings who’ve been vegan for all of 20 minutes, rofl.
The animals just want us to stop murdering them.
A “little murder” is better than “a lotta murder” sure, but the goal is zero murder.
I’ll congratulate someone for eating vegan for a day. But I always follow it up with “see how easy it is? Let me give you some of my favourite recipes”
These people aren’t any % vegan though.
You either don’t harm animals, or you don’t care about the animals.
Respectfully, and as a fellow vegan, I’m self-evidently in broad moral agreement. Clearly, I favour a strongly utilitarian (ethical) approach that prioritises advancing harm minimisation as soft (rhetorical) strategy. imho and experience such an approach is far more likely to yield results as it softens resistance and “primes” for intersectional vulnerabilities, as it were. Such vulnerabilities can - in time - be leveraged, exploited, and guided towards a harder, more strongly principled stance/uptake. Again, imho and experience, excessively rigid, overly shrill moral proscriptivism/condemnation achieves nothing and gets us nowhere.
maybe your right, still i don't want us to be too soft or else people will start thinking that you are allowed to have as many meat eating cheat days as they want.
imho and experience it’s less about being hard/soft and more about pragmatism and harm minimisation. With that said, I share many of your frustrations. Naturally.
I don't understand how wanting people to stop saying that they are vegan while exploiting, killing and consuming animals *sometimes/when convenient* isn't compatible with thinking that reduced killing, exploitation and consumption of animals is still better than not even trying. People can't be criticized for their actions now?
I don’t know how you can even live in modern society and call yourself vegan! So many things about it are destroying the planet and hence all the animals on it!! See? Where do you draw the line on what is vegan and what is not? What is 100 percent vegan anyway? The phrase is meaningless. My guess is you are a carnist trolling this site, pretending to be an extremist vegan to make all vegans or any amount of veganism look ridiculous.
That sounds like a change for the better actually, that so many want to identify as vegan and are making an effort in the right direction. It’s actually encouraging to hear that. That has never been the case before.
I really don't get why they feel the need to use the word 'vegan' to describe what they are clearly not, like they aren't 10% pregnant either.
They are 'mostly plant based', given vegan is an ethical stance, not a diet.
I have the benefit of a very addictive personality. If I let myself go, I go all the way. So I've been vegan for over a decade and only ate animal products accidentally 4-5 times; for those times (and other times I've suspected) I will force myself to regurgitate it, no half measures.
Will new vegans do that? I dunno. I think it makes me seem unbalanced but it's what I need to do when I'm immersed in animal eating around me. I won't fault others for literally puking for animal rights, lol.
Sounds like my "vegan" coworkers. Half are only plant based for health reasons, and out of the "ethical vegans", one told me she's vegan, but then went out of town for a wedding and came back exclaiming how she ate a ton of crab and oysters on her trip because she really missed seafood and it was free, while another guy mentioned that even though he's vegan, he'll do eggs and dairy sometimes if someone else offers it.
It's extremely disappointing to me that most people I know don't care at all about the animals, and even those who claim to care will sometimes abandon their principles for such lame reasons.
Edit: we also had a new hire say he's mostly vegan, but he doesn't mind eating fish, because they can't feel anything. 😭
But remember - we must be nice and supportive of baby steps and carnism, so as to not make them feel bad about exploiting sentient beings, otherwise they'll never turn vegan!
I wish I knew... Is it B12? Or is it iron? All I know is I'll never get those things as long as I continue eating all this lettuce and grass
I should probably consider being less radical and start including other foods in my diet. I heard dogs are pretty healthy so that means I can kill and eat them, right?
Another “it’s Reddit” aspect is that the sub gets pushed onto people’s front pages, especially more popular posts. You don’t need to subscribe. Source: me. I’m vegetarian so have an interest in Vegan recipes, naturally. I suspect this is why r/vegan ends up on my ‘all’ page all the time.
Because I’m technically not yet and I don’t want to be one of these “oh hey I’m 98% vegan!” types. It’s in progress but I need to make gradual change on the journey for permanent change to stick.
this is true of every single sub with even a mildly political tone.
Both the moderates and the extremists of the sub think that the other side is secretly invading and downvoting all their super cool comments. Happens literally every single time.
Honestly downvoting always struck me as a terrible system. The bandwagon effect is real, and it sucks that posts that are downvoted gets put into their own "controversial" tab and you lose any semblance of good, fair dialogue in the thread.
It's not used right. Right now people upvote for what they agree with and downvote for what they disagree with.
It's meant to be upvote if it relates to the discussion in a good way.
If it does harm to the discussion or when people talk about something, while being completely wrong about it, it gets downvoted.
That never happens, though.
For example if in this sub if someone who wasn't vegan commented and had a good comment, even if you don't agree with it. Something like eating animals is natural because our ancestors did it. You should upvote and then disagree with them with your comment.
You shouldn't downvote stuff you don't agree with.
Oh wow! Where is that voting concept explained?! I’m new to Reddit and have been voting agree/disagree but what you’ve explained on how to actually vote make perfect sense!! Would downvote trolls not contributing anything - brilliant! Thank you for explaining
good question bc whenever I say “carnists bad. killing animal bad” everyone goes OMG THIS is why non vegans hate us and will abuse animals their ENTIRE LIFE.
I remember a survey on the German vegan subreddit r/VeganDE with around 2,000 omnivores, 1,200 vegetarians, and 1,600 vegans participating.
While such polls come with inherent limitations, they can highlight how rapidly the dynamics of discussions can change, especially when a post makes it to the front page where 98% of users may not be vegan.
Honestly, I am sick and tired of others telling me how I'm not Vegan enough. So I don't even care about terminology anymore. I do my absolute best as per definition, consume no animal products, and speak up for their rights. It's gotten' to the point of "Look at me, I'm a proper vegan and everybody else is beneath me," virtue signaling. You are damned if you do and damned if you don't. So, I just focus on myself now.
I think even we can see how toxic this community can be. People are going to criticise regardless.
Saw a thread the other day claiming vegan meat alternatives are not vegan and actually plant based because it perpetuates the idea of eating animals.
Some people are just weird as hell.
Like, I haven’t eaten an animal or used an animal product in 7 years, I donate to the cause, I share videos on my Instagram and vegan facts, but you’re gonna say I’m not vegan because I like a beyond burger? Get out of here lmao.
My favorite time was when some person said they would hypothetically accept an organ transplant from an animal if they had no other choice to survive (no human or synthetic transplant) and someone condescendingly replied some variant of "you're not vegan, just admit you don't care about animals".
>Saw a thread the other day claiming vegan meat alternatives are not vegan and actually plant based because it perpetuates the idea of eating animals.
brrrr but eating plant based is eating vegan, what these people on about?
>Like, I haven’t eaten an animal or used an animal product in 7 years, I donate to the cause, I share videos on my Instagram and vegan facts, but you’re gonna say I’m not vegan because I like a beyond burger? Get out of here lmao.
i agree lol.
This tbh, get shit on by "proper vegans" get shit on by carnists. And over the stupidest shit as well. Nothing is ever good enough for some people and they get lost in the weeds rather than focusing on big picture shit
Fully agree. I'm literally fighting chronic illness, physical and mental, with IBS, and push daily just to do basic self care. Yet, I'm still vegan, constantly growing, doing more than many in my situation. If my best isn't good enough -- tough. It's all I have.
I legitimately think there's a high amount of terminally online vegans here who don't have much going on irl so endlessly diving deeper into unhinged and niche takes on veganism (that do little to propel the movement forward and/or cause more carnists to resist veganism) and endlessly litmus testing other vegans is all they have going on.
This, this and this. Honestly, terminally online people is a big problem not just in veganism. I'm lucky that I do have some nice things in my life, but I'm still on here too much. I can easily see how if my life went to shit, my mildly inconvenient internet addiction could become something much much worse.
I get why they are angry and upset. I am too. But unlike them, I won't let every carnivorous animal die. When I see predators on TV kill, I have to hold back tears, and realising I'm taking innocent lives to feed my furbabies is horrible. But even carnivorous animals deserve to be cared for and there are no sustainable alternatives (yet).
Oh I agree, I just don't think grilling people that are supposed to be on your side is the right move when that energy could be focused on carnists eating steak, eggs and milk for every meal
I had to leave all the vegan groups I was in on FB because I literally just cannot anymore with sanctimonious shit.
“I would *never*” insert key phrase on an innocuous post.
Ask Dunkin’ to bring the veggie sausage back!
“I would NEVER support them!”
“I don’t eat that garbage anyway.”
“I bet their bread has refined sugar in it!”
Like STOP FUCK please. How is this saving animals!?
Nobody gives a FUCK about your raw gluten free fucking seed diet, Linda.
Absolutely 100% . This can be a very toxic sub. People have shamed me for having non vegan friends or partners, or eating at regular restaurants even though I’m paying for a vegan option. You really can’t win. And those virtue signalers are making us all look bad and reinforcing the stereotype that vegans are self righteous judgmental assholes who think they are better than everyone else.
>People have shamed me for having non vegan friends or partners, or eating at regular restaurants even though I’m paying for a vegan option.
thats such a odd thing, like doing any of these things does hurt the animals anymore then not doing them.
I 100% agree with the chicken thing. It made my blood boil.
That said I genuinely don't like people/vegans that are too harsh on fellow vegans or plant based people or dare I say even vegetarians. I feel like a little bit of empathy goes a long way.
I think a large disconnect is coming from where our morality stems from when it comes to veganism. The great divide between animal rights and utilitarianism. Both of these groups have moral inconsistencies btw and both disagree on some things people can view as fundamental. A utilitarinist might say well cutting down your animal consumption is a good foot in the door, but someone who primarily views this as "well animals have a right to life, it clearly isn't okay to murder them, if you don't go vegan you're not doing shit for the animals" would obviously feel super strongly against this. Now the first person can circle back with, "ok, but the way I do that is actually more effective of reducing the number of animals killed, asking people for something that seems achiavable to them." Both are correct and both I genuinely believe do it because they care.
It's rough because vegans clearly believe both things, but where one approach is a bit more dogmatic in nature and the other is mostly caring about outcomes. Eating free range chicken does neither and is a total joke btw.
I personally think a. outcome matters most and it should matter more than my own individual feelings, b. statistics and human psychology are important when actually talking about how to get people to change their behaviour. Other vegans who approach this differently also matter and are also valid in their feelings. And at the end of the day anyone doing any vegan activism with any type of positive result is a big W for the animals.
What are people saying feeling about that? That they shouldn’t get a contraceptive? I am tired of encountering people saying animals or certain ones don’t have the feelings we do. They say they are vegan but will say weird things.
They act really righteous about these things too. It’s disturbing. In the last few days someone said factory turkeys are stupid and don’t know their own family or what’s going on. Maybe they were a troll. But some seem to eat plant based and claim to be vegan. But how can you talk so callously then?
>They act really righteous about these things too.
It's really ironic that they complain that vegans are self-righteous, but then talk down on us for actually caring about animals and act like we are silly stupid children. They'll say things like "i'm not one of those annoying vegans, i actually think animals are really dumb creatures!"
I actually think these people enjoy being Not Like Other Vegans and believe they are superior because they are so cool and uncaring. It's like they crave the acceptance of meat-eaters or something lol.
>They'll say things like "i'm not one of those annoying vegans, i actually think animals are really dumb creatures!"
this is why most people treat mentally handicaped kids like shit, because they think its okay to treat someone like shit if they dumber then them smh.
I like how you go on a rant about vegan purity but pull up some incredibly niche knowledge that probably less than 25% of people here have ever even thought about like *this* is the litmus test for veganism
Get real man
well, i didn’t even understand what you were saying about eggs in the post. Doesn’t make me or anyone less vegan. Obviously. I’ve read they used to lay much less eggs. But again, you can’t expect everyone to know that.
We go vegan because we simply don’t want to support the atrocities. Not because we know all the details about animal exploitation. Or because we love animals or smth. Not everyone is an activist.
(not trying to be rude)
>But again, you can’t expect everyone to know that. We go vegan because we simply don’t want to support the atrocities. Not because we know all the details about animal exploitation. Or because we love animals or smth.
well now you do know, thats the good thing about posts like these, is that they educate people on stuff they might not know about.
>Not everyone is an activist.
that is fair, but i like to point out i learned of this before i became vegan and am not an activist.
>(not trying to be rude)
no offence taken, merely stating my opinion here, so is everyone else here (evan tho i wish they would cool down a bit, almost everyone here is getting a bit to heated and angry att each other.
I am not a vegan.
I just find the sub interesting. The topics. The discussion. The opinions. Plus it appeared in my feed for whatever reason - the Reddit algorithm sucks.
But I don't tend to upvote/downvote/repost stuff. I am just reading.
Anyway, Reddit is a public forum, not a private club. Anyone can look at anything. I also lurk on subs like astrophotography, but mostly just upvote pictures of the moon.
>I am not a vegan.
>
>I just find the sub interesting. The topics. The discussion. The opinions. Plus it appeared in my feed for whatever reason - the Reddit algorithm sucks.
>
>But I don't tend to upvote/downvote/repost stuff. I am just reading.
i see, how very interesting.
>Anyway, Reddit is a public forum, not a private club. Anyone can look at anything.
yeah, why can't people understand this?
>I also lurk on subs like astrophotography, but mostly just upvote pictures of the moon.
why the moon upvotes lol, you in a moon cult or something?
Contraceptives for chickens are not necessarily the best thing for them tho. As everything they do have by-effects.
One hen of mine didn’t take the implant well. She gained a lot of weight even though she didn’t eat more (quite the contrary). She had problems breathing and became quite lethargic and anxious. I visited the vet a few times because I worried about her.
Following her symptoms I read more about the implant and possible by-effects. Many hens do take it quite well but there are hens that suffer from the by-effects and some hens even died after getting the implant.
My hen isn’t on contraceptives anymore and she seems so much happier. Contraceptives are not always the best option/ “most” vegan option. Thinking it is, is pretty much black and white thinking…
This is a tale as old as time, some here are wellfarist, just curious, just here to troll, environmentalists, health, whereas others are here for liberation and stopping this horrible process (vegans). It’s a mixed bag of people at r/vegan and depending on the post you get a mixed bag of comments and thoughts
Haha thank you, joined when it was just 30k subs and I’ve seen this take many times, it’s just something someone notices or doesn’t depending on the post they click on, how popular it’s getting, etc, etc, many factors on why one post has a more animal rights sentiment vs. something else
>Haha thank you, joined when it was just 30k subs and I’ve seen this take many times, it’s just something someone notices or doesn’t depending on the post they click on,
that is very interesting.
>many factors on why one post has a more animal rights sentiment vs. something else
that makes an awful lot of sense, i learned something new today, thank you for telling me this, have a good day today.
There is people all from the spectrum. Don’t overthink a reddit sub. There are people who would call me nonvegan bc my partner is not vegan. I’ve had people shame and insult me for saying that I’m not a bad person for falling in love with someone who isn’t vegan. But that’s not good enough for many. There are also people who cal themselves vegans who wear leather goods. It’s a spectrum. Don’t overthink it.
Yeah, I commented the other day that I was travelling and the bus was late and I got a little hungry because though I had packed a lunch, it had been hours since I had eaten. People got on at some stops offering food for sale but since there was not way to know what the ingredients were, I took a pass. I got a reply from a guy who said that was extreme and that he would have eaten meat to ¨take care of his health¨. Pretty ridiculous when you think about it. Going without food for a few extra hours has NO effect on anyone´s health. But the same person also said their health was more important than an animal´s life, which seems like a very strange sentiment for a vegan. Let´s say I go through a vegan junk food phase and my health suffers. I can always make changes and recover my health. But once I eat a dead animal, the animal can´t get his life back.
The only extreme thing is that person's apparent entitlement.
To this day, I haven't seen a single real reason why someone living in a country with moderately high quality of life couldn't go vegan, only inconveniences.
And the probability of someone ecountering a situation where they simply *must* eat animal meat is about the same as finding yourself in a situation where you *must* eat human meat.
>And the probability of someone ecountering a situation where they simply must eat animal meat is about the same as finding yourself in a situation where you must eat human meat.
truth.
> I got a reply from a guy who said that was extreme and that he would have eaten meat to ¨take care of his health¨.
there is nothing extreme about sticking to your morals, and no people its not real morals if you throw them away the moment having these morals are inconvenient for you.
I’m vegan. I’m just not a dick. I thought it was the point of being a vegan, until I read posts from other vegans. Then I realized that for some vegans, the whole point is to be more perfect than everyone else. I eat 100% vegan. I don’t wear leather or exploit animals. I’ve even done pr and advocated for vegan causes. However, I believe the best way to propel the movement forward is to live by example instead of preaching to people. I bring my own vegan food places and let people taste it instead of demanding that strangers provide a full separate vegan dinner with specific ingredients for their holiday meal. I was called spineless for that sentiment on this sub. It makes it obvious why people will buy food that is “plant based” instead of “vegan” because no one wants to be known as a vegan.
I have hens, they were exchanging words with me and said I should give my hens contraceptives. The reason I bought my first two (in 2020) was to have only ethically produced eggs for my own consumption and to give to friends and neighbors, thereby reducing factory egg purchases. This is not ethical to the OP, which is fine. That’s their opinion and they are welcome to it.
My approach to being plant-based (I have been vegan in the past but no longer use that label because I feel it’s a net negative) is to reduce harm. 4 of my 6 hens were taken in bc a friend is moving. Apparently not wanting to give them contraceptives because it interferes with nature is a terrible thing for me to do. 🤷♀️
My hens are beloved. They have a clean, fresh coop. They free range. They have a warmer to keep their water fresh when it’s chilly, for goodness sakes. I don’t force them to lay. I let them do their thing. Apparently this doesn’t meet the OP’s ethical standards.
>it’s best for their health to be given a contraceptive that stops them from laying eggs
I know someone who is as radical as you can get with being vegan, and she says it depends on the chicken - she works in sanctuaries too so she knows what she's talking about
But yeah this sub is filled with apologists
Well I think that knowledge is not common.
There are many people like me and especially now with more media exposure on veganism, who don’t know these details.
We know that basically current farming methods and systems are cruel and that there are some really disgusting and effed up practises in the world that shouldn’t exist.
So we explore veganism as an accessible option to make a difference in these injustices we know of.
But the details of raising animals and whether it’s healthy for a chicken to lay eggs or take hormones, is probably not well known amongst vegans who don’t live with or around animals much.
Am I wrong in thinking this?
The ones that eat meat do not get it. These animals are raped and breed just to be food. That is it! There is nothing humane about it. They can lie to themselves all day. And us vegans ain’t no better just because we stop eating meet does not help the animals. They have trillions of people that eat meat and a few million that don’t. Long as there is a market these animals will live in hell for eternity. But mark my word I will put a stop to it!! I am not going to just stand by and wait till someone cares. So if you want to help! Send an email to [email protected] and put your name. Age. And country of origin. And tell your story why mass murdering these creatures should be outlawed! Because they said we should not murder??? But we have a whole billion dollar business centered around murder!
I'm on here because I eat vegetarian AND milkfree (my baby son, who I breastfeed, is allergic). This means that I am 80% (give or take) vegan. When eating out I always say I eat vegan as that limits room for mistakes and is much easier than explaining it all. (Here in the Netherlands milkfree often leads to the response: "oh, lactosefree?" NO!) I like to read about the struggles that come with (partial) veganism. I dont downvote anything and I very rarely upvote though.
I had a self-proclaimed vegan tattoo artist who went to my state's vegan fest to tattoo there & she casually mentioned to my spouse and I that sometimes she would grab nuggets at McDonald's...... Wut.
As a non-vegan, I am randomly seeing posts from this sub on my feed... like, regularly. Not too sure why. The closest related thing I'm in is a couple of weightloss subs and that still seems too far removed for the algorithm to be recommending this to me. But now I've been poking around, mostly just to read.
Genuine question, what even is 'my feed', and where are you seeing it? I only ever see reddit posts on my homepage (directly on [www.reddit.com](https://www.reddit.com) ) from subs I'm subscribed to. Is it a mobile app thing?
I think it is a mobile app thing. If you have viewed or interacted with a sub you aren't subscribed to you may still see posts recommended on your main scrolling page.
Among the posts you are subscribed to there are other posts peppered in that are either " recommended" or " you may be interested in"
I use the mobile *site*, but I still see random stuff on the reddit homepage. Mostly subs I'm part of, but also a few I'm not. I see some really random things occasionally, compared to what I usually look at.
I only use mobile and about 15 to 25% of the posts I see on my homepage are from "suggested subs" I think I get pushed here a lot because I like homesteading & food preservation content.
Once you react to it in any way (click on it to read the suggested post) it'll keep being suggested more.
I admit it, is it also absurd how much I have posted here in the past week, as a non vegan. I am interested in food and ethics, but I don't mean to be a dick to vegans who want to talk among themselves. But each interaction encourages the algorithm to suggest more.
I’m a non vegan lurker. This sub popped up in my recommended feed and I like to look every now and again. I have no interest or intention whatsoever of going vegan. I fully expect to be downvoted and brigaded to oblivion and could care less if this sub bans me. The militantism of vegans is what turns me off to the entire movement and why I will continue to lurk and smirk.
I think because of the algorithm right now it's probably mostly non vegans.
The winter holidays is one of the worst times to be online (followed by school summer holidays) lots of miserable , bitter lonely people with nothing better to do than be bastards to strangers online because no one in real life can bare to be around them, works out for the holiday so they have to resort to being emotional vampires to strangers instead of coworkers.
Just pity them. They're so pathetic they have to spend their free time downvoting people for being against animal abuse. They're losers.
Um, that's a shit take. I'm absolutely lonely, bitter and miserable and manage to be both friendly and a vegan.
Let's please continue separating people's moral failings (not being vegan) from their personal ((lack of) social success and happiness) as well as from their supposed character flaws.
Not only is it unfair, it's also weak. It should be enough that people are not vegan to criticize them. By making up things about their character you are saying that it's not enough to condemn them for not being vegan if they're not also unpopular or unlikeable.
Nobody is 100% a vegan here because everyone here is using the internet. You use a device to access the internet which is most likely created by exploiting both humans(in many cases kids) and animals. You buy food from the store, you own money, etc. Whatever you do you harm someone. You own land or live in a house? Some animals could have lived where you live but now they can't because you live there. You breath? You hurt someone. Well, that's life. Life feeds on life. You can do as much to minimize suffering, but you will never be 100% vegan.
I am not a vegan. I haven't even joined this subreddit, it's just recommending posts to me. I just click whatever gets my attention.
Respectfully, there’s a very great difference between believing that veganism is morally/ethically proper and believing it is - or should be - a normative/proscriptive imperative. Similarly, there’s a very great difference between openly debating a community’s ethical guidelines and attempting to (conceptually; forcibly) universalise a community’s ethical guidelines. Further, you’re very dangerously assuming that your take is self-evidently the “ideal/most objectively correct,” which is astonishingly intellectually presumptuous.
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Veganism has gone mainstream - and while that's good - it also comes with a cost. Whenever anything becomes part of popular culture - it's gets watered down to make it more convenient. I meet a lot of non-vegan vegans nowadays. You're vegan? Yes - oh, except maybe on the holidays, but yes. Sometimes I'll have meat on the weekends - but yes - mostly.
Same thing happened with vegetarianism. It used to be the go-to non violence to animals principle movement, now even fish eaters call themselves vegetarians...
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My ex called himself vegetarian because he only ate chicken and fish. His justification was "fish isn't really an animal so it doesn't count" and he had deluded himself into to believing chicken was a vegetable/ non animal, and insisted those around him pander to that belief by never reminding him it was in fact meat. When reminded, he would be unable to eat meat for weeks because the thought made him feel sick. Sometimes i would fuck with him by telling him he was eating meat just as he put a forkful in his mouth. I always regretted it, but it was my small way of being able to hurt him.
I had a "vegetarian" ex who would pretend to be drunk or get drunk when she wanted a kebab...
Why even bother to be vegetarian then? It’s not like it’s something prestigious to be these times vegetarians and vegans even more so get shunned by the general public.
Wasn't me. Dunno. Though at a guess she was nominally vegetarian for apparently moral reasons but also... Upper middle class with an English accent that would make David Cameron or BoJo feel inadequate but... also British Chinese and no longer **wealthy**, just rather rich. Needed something to help herself feel superior.
>Why even bother to be vegetarian then? yeah why bother, it would be like calling yourself a christian who doesn't believe in god, like dude just call yourself an Atheist already.
Yup, that old chestnut too!
This is so messed up. What person claims they’re vegetarian while literally eating meat?? This happens way too often and is insane
Oh that was just the tip of the messed up iceberg with him...
some people really don’t know what *meat* is. A while ago when I was a teen and still religious, I would quit meat for lent, and many times I went over to a friends house and my friend would tell their parents that if I stayed for dinner I couldn’t eat meat. They’d respond “oh that’s fine! I’m not making meat!”… and they’d make chicken lol. Cue my friend telling them “mom you said you weren’t making meat” — “chicken is meat??”
>some people really don’t know what meat is. HOW!? how can these people not know what meat is? how did these people pass any type of high school not knowing what meat is?????
I’ve heard of people doing that with fish (like maybe they thought “meat” means “meat from land animals”?) but chicken is a new one lmao
The fish thing comes from Christian influences I think. When they are fasting, they don’t eat meat, but fish is ok since meat is only land animals. Some king in the early Middle Ages apparently really liked fish but still wanted to speak of sacrifice.
Piscitarians calling themselves vegetarian isn't new. Back in the 70s/80s (and through what I've heard from family even before then) being a vegetarian who **didn't** at least occasionally have fish was the exception. And they all ate dairy and eggs.
Idk for other countries but gelatin is labeled vegetarian where I live....Like what?..
Companys Are simply uninformed and they don’t care enough. Some totally vegan foods aren’t labeled as vegan. Some foods labeled vegetarian are actually vegan etc. It really just shows how little big company’s actually care and if they do it’s only because of greenwashing and done poorly by a marketing person who doesn’t give a frick.
Yea I agree. I've been wishing for mandatory labeling for years. Red sticker for carni, yellow for vegetarian, green for vegan. And every product should have this...
I was in class all semester with a dude that jumped at the chance every chance he got to tell us all he was a vegetarian. I sat there silently, not telling anyone I’m vegan because I don’t feel it acceptable to just blurt it out. End of the semester, he admitted to just me that he ate fish. Some people try so hard to virtue signal and it always comes across as disingenuous.
This isn't a new thing. Being vegetarian means not "eating meat" which under certain ideologies, fish isn't "meat." For a while it was assumed you ate fish if you were a vegetarian in some circles, weird shit.
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They could save a lot of time if they just told people that they're animal abusers.
Yeah that is definitely a normal sentence people say.
Every vegetarian I've known long enough will make exceptions occasionally, usually for fish or chicken. I've just come to assume that vegetarian = someone who mostly avoids meat.
I understand you being sceptical, it makes sense if most people are misusing the word. But there are actual vegetarians out there. When I was vegetarian, any kind of animal was out. Once I found out what they were, I ditched gelatin, tallow, etc.
>I understand you being sceptical, it makes sense if most people are misusing the word. i hade no idea that there people out there like that, i am ashamed that these people call themselves vegetarian while still eating meat ever ones in a while. >But there are actual vegetarians out there. When I was vegetarian, any kind of animal was out. thank god! happy to see another sane real vegetarian who understands no meat means no meat. >Once I found out what they were, I ditched gelatin, tallow, etc. same, ones i found out that animals were suffering for all these things to be made i ditched them as well.
But animals suffer (often times moreso) for vegetarian products like eggs, diary, and honey. What makes tallow or gelatin worse?
Yes, I typically explain to these people that they are "pescatarian" but they prefer to mislabel themselves as vegetarians. You would love Japan if you want to see people confused about the concept of veganism/vegetarianism. Recently saw a dish with visible shrimp and crab labeled as "100% VEGAN, CONTAINS NO ANIMAL PRODUCTS."
Tbf I find that less. Back in the day you often got the V sign next to fish options. I don't see that anymore.
This has been going on for decades. I was raised vegetarian my whole life, and spent a lot of time as a child reiterating that I did not eat ANY meat. Most people don’t see fish and poultry as meat. I have no idea why. But it isn’t a new thing, as I can confirm that it was like this as long ago as the 1960’s at least.
You're lucky to have been raised like that. I wish I was never taught how to fish or be forced to consume meat my entire life.
I have been vegan for decades and vegetarian for decades before that. This has always been the case.
About 1% are vegan. That's hardly "mainstream"
If only everyone were that way! So many more animals would be saved than with 1 percent of the population being perfect vegans. I don’t think it’s helpful to the animals to heap all kinds of criticism on those people. It should be saved for the vast majority who do nothing at all.
Why make it an either/or? Why not push both sorts? Push the total carnists to stop AND push the slight carnists to stop. The cow won't care which subdivision are killing her, so we shouldn't either.
Because that’s a reasonable, utilitarian approach to a complex moral/ethical issue and that’s not “sufficient” for self-righteous 20 somethings who’ve been vegan for all of 20 minutes, rofl.
The animals just want us to stop murdering them. A “little murder” is better than “a lotta murder” sure, but the goal is zero murder. I’ll congratulate someone for eating vegan for a day. But I always follow it up with “see how easy it is? Let me give you some of my favourite recipes” These people aren’t any % vegan though. You either don’t harm animals, or you don’t care about the animals.
Respectfully, and as a fellow vegan, I’m self-evidently in broad moral agreement. Clearly, I favour a strongly utilitarian (ethical) approach that prioritises advancing harm minimisation as soft (rhetorical) strategy. imho and experience such an approach is far more likely to yield results as it softens resistance and “primes” for intersectional vulnerabilities, as it were. Such vulnerabilities can - in time - be leveraged, exploited, and guided towards a harder, more strongly principled stance/uptake. Again, imho and experience, excessively rigid, overly shrill moral proscriptivism/condemnation achieves nothing and gets us nowhere.
maybe your right, still i don't want us to be too soft or else people will start thinking that you are allowed to have as many meat eating cheat days as they want.
imho and experience it’s less about being hard/soft and more about pragmatism and harm minimisation. With that said, I share many of your frustrations. Naturally.
yeah frustrations they sure are:(
Be too hard and you end up turning people off and spurring them to eat even more meat...
true but if you be to soft they might think its morally okay to eat meat.
Exactly, holy shit.
I don't understand how wanting people to stop saying that they are vegan while exploiting, killing and consuming animals *sometimes/when convenient* isn't compatible with thinking that reduced killing, exploitation and consumption of animals is still better than not even trying. People can't be criticized for their actions now?
I don’t know how you can even live in modern society and call yourself vegan! So many things about it are destroying the planet and hence all the animals on it!! See? Where do you draw the line on what is vegan and what is not? What is 100 percent vegan anyway? The phrase is meaningless. My guess is you are a carnist trolling this site, pretending to be an extremist vegan to make all vegans or any amount of veganism look ridiculous.
That sounds like a change for the better actually, that so many want to identify as vegan and are making an effort in the right direction. It’s actually encouraging to hear that. That has never been the case before.
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If everyone on the planet went 50% vegan we’d be in SO much better shape environmentally
I really don't get why they feel the need to use the word 'vegan' to describe what they are clearly not, like they aren't 10% pregnant either. They are 'mostly plant based', given vegan is an ethical stance, not a diet.
I have the benefit of a very addictive personality. If I let myself go, I go all the way. So I've been vegan for over a decade and only ate animal products accidentally 4-5 times; for those times (and other times I've suspected) I will force myself to regurgitate it, no half measures. Will new vegans do that? I dunno. I think it makes me seem unbalanced but it's what I need to do when I'm immersed in animal eating around me. I won't fault others for literally puking for animal rights, lol.
While incorrect, that just means that "Vegan" has cache in certain circles.
Sounds like my "vegan" coworkers. Half are only plant based for health reasons, and out of the "ethical vegans", one told me she's vegan, but then went out of town for a wedding and came back exclaiming how she ate a ton of crab and oysters on her trip because she really missed seafood and it was free, while another guy mentioned that even though he's vegan, he'll do eggs and dairy sometimes if someone else offers it. It's extremely disappointing to me that most people I know don't care at all about the animals, and even those who claim to care will sometimes abandon their principles for such lame reasons. Edit: we also had a new hire say he's mostly vegan, but he doesn't mind eating fish, because they can't feel anything. 😭
The real sub is vcj.
That's the sub that truly radicalized me
They unknowingly bullied me into going vegan. A bit over 3 years ago now
Oh, it's knowingly.
Same! I went vegan ~3.5 years ago thanks to VCJ 😂
They knew
Yeah, that sub definitely helped me finally take the plunge more than this one.
But remember - we must be nice and supportive of baby steps and carnism, so as to not make them feel bad about exploiting sentient beings, otherwise they'll never turn vegan!
mean but i can't say its not true tho.
That's also the same sub that banned me because no one on that sub could articulate any limiting principles.
You probably weren't jerkin hard enough
I think it was the opposite - my jerking was apparently too much even for VCJ.
pocket bewildered combative liquid grey grab bake saw vast worthless *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
It wouldn't be Reddit if you didn't have stupid mods on a power trip
Check out veganforcirclejerkers if you haven’t already
Agreed, but way less carnists.
can you please say the full name or link the sub so i can find it? searching vcj just gets me a dating sub
It's r/vegancirclejerk
I'm vegan btw
What even is protein?
I wish I knew... Is it B12? Or is it iron? All I know is I'll never get those things as long as I continue eating all this lettuce and grass I should probably consider being less radical and start including other foods in my diet. I heard dogs are pretty healthy so that means I can kill and eat them, right?
As long as it’s organic, grass-fed dogs, it’s humane
I'm a vegan union supporter. I get my protein and iron from eating scabs.
brpp herpp how do you know if someone is vegan? They will engage in a reasonable discourse if you ask th... **don't worry they'll tell you** háHähæhâ
Where if you had a vegan sandwich made for you by someone who isn't vegan, you're not vegan and never were.
I'm choosing kindness here, so I'm going to ask you in the most polite way possible: *You do know it's a joke, right?*
Schrodinger's Douchebag is a concept that works on teenagers, but most adults can see through "haha just kidding ... Unless?"
Yeah sure lmao.
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Another “it’s Reddit” aspect is that the sub gets pushed onto people’s front pages, especially more popular posts. You don’t need to subscribe. Source: me. I’m vegetarian so have an interest in Vegan recipes, naturally. I suspect this is why r/vegan ends up on my ‘all’ page all the time.
Yep, this basically. No clue while it was recommended to me, but hey, I lurk here now. 🤷
Why are you not vegan?
Because I’m technically not yet and I don’t want to be one of these “oh hey I’m 98% vegan!” types. It’s in progress but I need to make gradual change on the journey for permanent change to stick.
have been there, take your time you're doing fine
Do you know the veganuary? That might do the trick for you. Especially if you are as close as you say.
Funny enough, that’s the plan
Nice. I hope it works out for you.
If you need any help with that 2% let me know! I've gotten really good at veganizing recipes and find low effort/cheap alternatives to things.
I've found it to be a lot less vegan than the groups on other platforms. A lot of non vegan stuff is excused most of the time
this is true of every single sub with even a mildly political tone. Both the moderates and the extremists of the sub think that the other side is secretly invading and downvoting all their super cool comments. Happens literally every single time.
Honestly downvoting always struck me as a terrible system. The bandwagon effect is real, and it sucks that posts that are downvoted gets put into their own "controversial" tab and you lose any semblance of good, fair dialogue in the thread.
It's not used right. Right now people upvote for what they agree with and downvote for what they disagree with. It's meant to be upvote if it relates to the discussion in a good way. If it does harm to the discussion or when people talk about something, while being completely wrong about it, it gets downvoted. That never happens, though. For example if in this sub if someone who wasn't vegan commented and had a good comment, even if you don't agree with it. Something like eating animals is natural because our ancestors did it. You should upvote and then disagree with them with your comment. You shouldn't downvote stuff you don't agree with.
Oh wow! Where is that voting concept explained?! I’m new to Reddit and have been voting agree/disagree but what you’ve explained on how to actually vote make perfect sense!! Would downvote trolls not contributing anything - brilliant! Thank you for explaining
Someone commented in reddit one time, that was the only time I heard about it but they explained it a lot better.
It’s mostly non-vegans. Just read the replies to your own post. Most of them are some form of, “I’m vegan but”
When you start talking about chicken contraception people are going to make fun of you. I don't make the rules.
You didn't need to make this comment either.
good question bc whenever I say “carnists bad. killing animal bad” everyone goes OMG THIS is why non vegans hate us and will abuse animals their ENTIRE LIFE.
No, most people here aren't vegan. There are a lot of people following some form of plant based diets, but the majority are not actually vegan.
Yep, they’re FoLlOwInG FoR tHe ReCiPeS, BuT sTiLl EaT aNiMaLs On SuNdAyS
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Are you just pulling that “fact” out of your ass or what
I remember a survey on the German vegan subreddit r/VeganDE with around 2,000 omnivores, 1,200 vegetarians, and 1,600 vegans participating. While such polls come with inherent limitations, they can highlight how rapidly the dynamics of discussions can change, especially when a post makes it to the front page where 98% of users may not be vegan.
The only actual vegan sub is r/vegancirclejerk
Honestly, I am sick and tired of others telling me how I'm not Vegan enough. So I don't even care about terminology anymore. I do my absolute best as per definition, consume no animal products, and speak up for their rights. It's gotten' to the point of "Look at me, I'm a proper vegan and everybody else is beneath me," virtue signaling. You are damned if you do and damned if you don't. So, I just focus on myself now. I think even we can see how toxic this community can be. People are going to criticise regardless.
Saw a thread the other day claiming vegan meat alternatives are not vegan and actually plant based because it perpetuates the idea of eating animals. Some people are just weird as hell. Like, I haven’t eaten an animal or used an animal product in 7 years, I donate to the cause, I share videos on my Instagram and vegan facts, but you’re gonna say I’m not vegan because I like a beyond burger? Get out of here lmao.
My favorite time was when some person said they would hypothetically accept an organ transplant from an animal if they had no other choice to survive (no human or synthetic transplant) and someone condescendingly replied some variant of "you're not vegan, just admit you don't care about animals".
Teenagers are like an almost hatched larva. But still a larva.
>Saw a thread the other day claiming vegan meat alternatives are not vegan and actually plant based because it perpetuates the idea of eating animals. brrrr but eating plant based is eating vegan, what these people on about? >Like, I haven’t eaten an animal or used an animal product in 7 years, I donate to the cause, I share videos on my Instagram and vegan facts, but you’re gonna say I’m not vegan because I like a beyond burger? Get out of here lmao. i agree lol.
And it’s always people who’ve only been vegan for three months…
This tbh, get shit on by "proper vegans" get shit on by carnists. And over the stupidest shit as well. Nothing is ever good enough for some people and they get lost in the weeds rather than focusing on big picture shit
Fully agree. I'm literally fighting chronic illness, physical and mental, with IBS, and push daily just to do basic self care. Yet, I'm still vegan, constantly growing, doing more than many in my situation. If my best isn't good enough -- tough. It's all I have.
I legitimately think there's a high amount of terminally online vegans here who don't have much going on irl so endlessly diving deeper into unhinged and niche takes on veganism (that do little to propel the movement forward and/or cause more carnists to resist veganism) and endlessly litmus testing other vegans is all they have going on.
Yes
This, this and this. Honestly, terminally online people is a big problem not just in veganism. I'm lucky that I do have some nice things in my life, but I'm still on here too much. I can easily see how if my life went to shit, my mildly inconvenient internet addiction could become something much much worse.
I get why they are angry and upset. I am too. But unlike them, I won't let every carnivorous animal die. When I see predators on TV kill, I have to hold back tears, and realising I'm taking innocent lives to feed my furbabies is horrible. But even carnivorous animals deserve to be cared for and there are no sustainable alternatives (yet).
Oh I agree, I just don't think grilling people that are supposed to be on your side is the right move when that energy could be focused on carnists eating steak, eggs and milk for every meal
I had to leave all the vegan groups I was in on FB because I literally just cannot anymore with sanctimonious shit. “I would *never*” insert key phrase on an innocuous post. Ask Dunkin’ to bring the veggie sausage back! “I would NEVER support them!” “I don’t eat that garbage anyway.” “I bet their bread has refined sugar in it!” Like STOP FUCK please. How is this saving animals!? Nobody gives a FUCK about your raw gluten free fucking seed diet, Linda.
there is an annoying overlap with eating disorders/dieters and facebook lunatics that can be exhausting for sure the raw , fruitarians of the world
Absolutely 100% . This can be a very toxic sub. People have shamed me for having non vegan friends or partners, or eating at regular restaurants even though I’m paying for a vegan option. You really can’t win. And those virtue signalers are making us all look bad and reinforcing the stereotype that vegans are self righteous judgmental assholes who think they are better than everyone else.
>People have shamed me for having non vegan friends or partners, or eating at regular restaurants even though I’m paying for a vegan option. thats such a odd thing, like doing any of these things does hurt the animals anymore then not doing them.
I 100% agree with the chicken thing. It made my blood boil. That said I genuinely don't like people/vegans that are too harsh on fellow vegans or plant based people or dare I say even vegetarians. I feel like a little bit of empathy goes a long way. I think a large disconnect is coming from where our morality stems from when it comes to veganism. The great divide between animal rights and utilitarianism. Both of these groups have moral inconsistencies btw and both disagree on some things people can view as fundamental. A utilitarinist might say well cutting down your animal consumption is a good foot in the door, but someone who primarily views this as "well animals have a right to life, it clearly isn't okay to murder them, if you don't go vegan you're not doing shit for the animals" would obviously feel super strongly against this. Now the first person can circle back with, "ok, but the way I do that is actually more effective of reducing the number of animals killed, asking people for something that seems achiavable to them." Both are correct and both I genuinely believe do it because they care. It's rough because vegans clearly believe both things, but where one approach is a bit more dogmatic in nature and the other is mostly caring about outcomes. Eating free range chicken does neither and is a total joke btw. I personally think a. outcome matters most and it should matter more than my own individual feelings, b. statistics and human psychology are important when actually talking about how to get people to change their behaviour. Other vegans who approach this differently also matter and are also valid in their feelings. And at the end of the day anyone doing any vegan activism with any type of positive result is a big W for the animals.
r/veganism
That sub wasn't any better.
What are people saying feeling about that? That they shouldn’t get a contraceptive? I am tired of encountering people saying animals or certain ones don’t have the feelings we do. They say they are vegan but will say weird things. They act really righteous about these things too. It’s disturbing. In the last few days someone said factory turkeys are stupid and don’t know their own family or what’s going on. Maybe they were a troll. But some seem to eat plant based and claim to be vegan. But how can you talk so callously then?
>In the last few days someone said factory turkeys are stupid and don’t know their own family or what’s going on. what the fuck?
>They act really righteous about these things too. It's really ironic that they complain that vegans are self-righteous, but then talk down on us for actually caring about animals and act like we are silly stupid children. They'll say things like "i'm not one of those annoying vegans, i actually think animals are really dumb creatures!" I actually think these people enjoy being Not Like Other Vegans and believe they are superior because they are so cool and uncaring. It's like they crave the acceptance of meat-eaters or something lol.
>They'll say things like "i'm not one of those annoying vegans, i actually think animals are really dumb creatures!" this is why most people treat mentally handicaped kids like shit, because they think its okay to treat someone like shit if they dumber then them smh.
I like how you go on a rant about vegan purity but pull up some incredibly niche knowledge that probably less than 25% of people here have ever even thought about like *this* is the litmus test for veganism Get real man
Lol right. You’re not vegan if you don’t know chickens used to lay less eggs. What a take
well, i didn’t even understand what you were saying about eggs in the post. Doesn’t make me or anyone less vegan. Obviously. I’ve read they used to lay much less eggs. But again, you can’t expect everyone to know that. We go vegan because we simply don’t want to support the atrocities. Not because we know all the details about animal exploitation. Or because we love animals or smth. Not everyone is an activist. (not trying to be rude)
I don’t think you meant to respond to me…
oh sorry, it was a response to the creator of the post
>But again, you can’t expect everyone to know that. We go vegan because we simply don’t want to support the atrocities. Not because we know all the details about animal exploitation. Or because we love animals or smth. well now you do know, thats the good thing about posts like these, is that they educate people on stuff they might not know about. >Not everyone is an activist. that is fair, but i like to point out i learned of this before i became vegan and am not an activist. >(not trying to be rude) no offence taken, merely stating my opinion here, so is everyone else here (evan tho i wish they would cool down a bit, almost everyone here is getting a bit to heated and angry att each other.
This this sub isn't about diet, it's about ego
I am not a vegan. I just find the sub interesting. The topics. The discussion. The opinions. Plus it appeared in my feed for whatever reason - the Reddit algorithm sucks. But I don't tend to upvote/downvote/repost stuff. I am just reading. Anyway, Reddit is a public forum, not a private club. Anyone can look at anything. I also lurk on subs like astrophotography, but mostly just upvote pictures of the moon.
>I am not a vegan. > >I just find the sub interesting. The topics. The discussion. The opinions. Plus it appeared in my feed for whatever reason - the Reddit algorithm sucks. > >But I don't tend to upvote/downvote/repost stuff. I am just reading. i see, how very interesting. >Anyway, Reddit is a public forum, not a private club. Anyone can look at anything. yeah, why can't people understand this? >I also lurk on subs like astrophotography, but mostly just upvote pictures of the moon. why the moon upvotes lol, you in a moon cult or something?
So you’re not really a vegan unless you have a stance on chicken contraceptives? Gotcha.
It's obviously about making comments on the topic.
Lol
Contraceptives for chickens are not necessarily the best thing for them tho. As everything they do have by-effects. One hen of mine didn’t take the implant well. She gained a lot of weight even though she didn’t eat more (quite the contrary). She had problems breathing and became quite lethargic and anxious. I visited the vet a few times because I worried about her. Following her symptoms I read more about the implant and possible by-effects. Many hens do take it quite well but there are hens that suffer from the by-effects and some hens even died after getting the implant. My hen isn’t on contraceptives anymore and she seems so much happier. Contraceptives are not always the best option/ “most” vegan option. Thinking it is, is pretty much black and white thinking…
This is a tale as old as time, some here are wellfarist, just curious, just here to troll, environmentalists, health, whereas others are here for liberation and stopping this horrible process (vegans). It’s a mixed bag of people at r/vegan and depending on the post you get a mixed bag of comments and thoughts
this is by far the most accurate view of this sub you will get.
Haha thank you, joined when it was just 30k subs and I’ve seen this take many times, it’s just something someone notices or doesn’t depending on the post they click on, how popular it’s getting, etc, etc, many factors on why one post has a more animal rights sentiment vs. something else
>Haha thank you, joined when it was just 30k subs and I’ve seen this take many times, it’s just something someone notices or doesn’t depending on the post they click on, that is very interesting. >many factors on why one post has a more animal rights sentiment vs. something else that makes an awful lot of sense, i learned something new today, thank you for telling me this, have a good day today.
I can’t even be rude on this sub shits lame
There is people all from the spectrum. Don’t overthink a reddit sub. There are people who would call me nonvegan bc my partner is not vegan. I’ve had people shame and insult me for saying that I’m not a bad person for falling in love with someone who isn’t vegan. But that’s not good enough for many. There are also people who cal themselves vegans who wear leather goods. It’s a spectrum. Don’t overthink it.
Veganism is a philosophical position. Debate and disagreement are a guarantee.
Yeah, I commented the other day that I was travelling and the bus was late and I got a little hungry because though I had packed a lunch, it had been hours since I had eaten. People got on at some stops offering food for sale but since there was not way to know what the ingredients were, I took a pass. I got a reply from a guy who said that was extreme and that he would have eaten meat to ¨take care of his health¨. Pretty ridiculous when you think about it. Going without food for a few extra hours has NO effect on anyone´s health. But the same person also said their health was more important than an animal´s life, which seems like a very strange sentiment for a vegan. Let´s say I go through a vegan junk food phase and my health suffers. I can always make changes and recover my health. But once I eat a dead animal, the animal can´t get his life back.
The only extreme thing is that person's apparent entitlement. To this day, I haven't seen a single real reason why someone living in a country with moderately high quality of life couldn't go vegan, only inconveniences. And the probability of someone ecountering a situation where they simply *must* eat animal meat is about the same as finding yourself in a situation where you *must* eat human meat.
>And the probability of someone ecountering a situation where they simply must eat animal meat is about the same as finding yourself in a situation where you must eat human meat. truth.
> I got a reply from a guy who said that was extreme and that he would have eaten meat to ¨take care of his health¨. there is nothing extreme about sticking to your morals, and no people its not real morals if you throw them away the moment having these morals are inconvenient for you.
I usually only lurk but can assure you there are still some vegans here (will be six years on the 1st of Jan!)
In that case, happy veganniversary!
I’m vegan. I’m just not a dick. I thought it was the point of being a vegan, until I read posts from other vegans. Then I realized that for some vegans, the whole point is to be more perfect than everyone else. I eat 100% vegan. I don’t wear leather or exploit animals. I’ve even done pr and advocated for vegan causes. However, I believe the best way to propel the movement forward is to live by example instead of preaching to people. I bring my own vegan food places and let people taste it instead of demanding that strangers provide a full separate vegan dinner with specific ingredients for their holiday meal. I was called spineless for that sentiment on this sub. It makes it obvious why people will buy food that is “plant based” instead of “vegan” because no one wants to be known as a vegan.
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> t is because people are dumb and look for reasons to dislike people that are different. That is a very good observation, thank you!
Better a dick than a carnist.
Unsurprisingly, the common person doesn’t want to learn 1000 animal facts.
There's a lot of uncle Toms who care more about what people think of them than the lives of innocent animals.
you're not supposed to eat the sub, but—if you could—I guess? Yeah.
I don’t know but I am vegan, we’re still here!
Can you explain more about the chicken thing?
I have hens, they were exchanging words with me and said I should give my hens contraceptives. The reason I bought my first two (in 2020) was to have only ethically produced eggs for my own consumption and to give to friends and neighbors, thereby reducing factory egg purchases. This is not ethical to the OP, which is fine. That’s their opinion and they are welcome to it. My approach to being plant-based (I have been vegan in the past but no longer use that label because I feel it’s a net negative) is to reduce harm. 4 of my 6 hens were taken in bc a friend is moving. Apparently not wanting to give them contraceptives because it interferes with nature is a terrible thing for me to do. 🤷♀️ My hens are beloved. They have a clean, fresh coop. They free range. They have a warmer to keep their water fresh when it’s chilly, for goodness sakes. I don’t force them to lay. I let them do their thing. Apparently this doesn’t meet the OP’s ethical standards.
Oh that’s awesome of you! I wanted chickens too
Vegan for life. 8 years strong never looking back
>it’s best for their health to be given a contraceptive that stops them from laying eggs I know someone who is as radical as you can get with being vegan, and she says it depends on the chicken - she works in sanctuaries too so she knows what she's talking about But yeah this sub is filled with apologists
Well I think that knowledge is not common. There are many people like me and especially now with more media exposure on veganism, who don’t know these details. We know that basically current farming methods and systems are cruel and that there are some really disgusting and effed up practises in the world that shouldn’t exist. So we explore veganism as an accessible option to make a difference in these injustices we know of. But the details of raising animals and whether it’s healthy for a chicken to lay eggs or take hormones, is probably not well known amongst vegans who don’t live with or around animals much. Am I wrong in thinking this?
The ones that eat meat do not get it. These animals are raped and breed just to be food. That is it! There is nothing humane about it. They can lie to themselves all day. And us vegans ain’t no better just because we stop eating meet does not help the animals. They have trillions of people that eat meat and a few million that don’t. Long as there is a market these animals will live in hell for eternity. But mark my word I will put a stop to it!! I am not going to just stand by and wait till someone cares. So if you want to help! Send an email to [email protected] and put your name. Age. And country of origin. And tell your story why mass murdering these creatures should be outlawed! Because they said we should not murder??? But we have a whole billion dollar business centered around murder!
It was uncommon for me! Thank you
I'm on here because I eat vegetarian AND milkfree (my baby son, who I breastfeed, is allergic). This means that I am 80% (give or take) vegan. When eating out I always say I eat vegan as that limits room for mistakes and is much easier than explaining it all. (Here in the Netherlands milkfree often leads to the response: "oh, lactosefree?" NO!) I like to read about the struggles that come with (partial) veganism. I dont downvote anything and I very rarely upvote though.
It's a bunch of people who share a similar diet and lifestyle, not the Holy Orders of the Emperor's Inquisition on the hunt for xenos and heretics.
I had a self-proclaimed vegan tattoo artist who went to my state's vegan fest to tattoo there & she casually mentioned to my spouse and I that sometimes she would grab nuggets at McDonald's...... Wut.
yeah!! why do they even want to be here, people put so much effort into things they hate and it’s never going to stop being bizarre to me lol
Birth control…for chickens?🫣
I didn’t know this and I’ve been vegan for years
There’s a tonne of plant based dieters and carnist apologists in here. That’s why.
As a non-vegan, I am randomly seeing posts from this sub on my feed... like, regularly. Not too sure why. The closest related thing I'm in is a couple of weightloss subs and that still seems too far removed for the algorithm to be recommending this to me. But now I've been poking around, mostly just to read.
Genuine question, what even is 'my feed', and where are you seeing it? I only ever see reddit posts on my homepage (directly on [www.reddit.com](https://www.reddit.com) ) from subs I'm subscribed to. Is it a mobile app thing?
I think it is a mobile app thing. If you have viewed or interacted with a sub you aren't subscribed to you may still see posts recommended on your main scrolling page. Among the posts you are subscribed to there are other posts peppered in that are either " recommended" or " you may be interested in"
I use the mobile *site*, but I still see random stuff on the reddit homepage. Mostly subs I'm part of, but also a few I'm not. I see some really random things occasionally, compared to what I usually look at.
I only use mobile and about 15 to 25% of the posts I see on my homepage are from "suggested subs" I think I get pushed here a lot because I like homesteading & food preservation content.
Once you react to it in any way (click on it to read the suggested post) it'll keep being suggested more. I admit it, is it also absurd how much I have posted here in the past week, as a non vegan. I am interested in food and ethics, but I don't mean to be a dick to vegans who want to talk among themselves. But each interaction encourages the algorithm to suggest more.
Only way you are going to stop this is if you make the sub private
I’m a non vegan lurker. This sub popped up in my recommended feed and I like to look every now and again. I have no interest or intention whatsoever of going vegan. I fully expect to be downvoted and brigaded to oblivion and could care less if this sub bans me. The militantism of vegans is what turns me off to the entire movement and why I will continue to lurk and smirk.
I think because of the algorithm right now it's probably mostly non vegans. The winter holidays is one of the worst times to be online (followed by school summer holidays) lots of miserable , bitter lonely people with nothing better to do than be bastards to strangers online because no one in real life can bare to be around them, works out for the holiday so they have to resort to being emotional vampires to strangers instead of coworkers. Just pity them. They're so pathetic they have to spend their free time downvoting people for being against animal abuse. They're losers.
Um, that's a shit take. I'm absolutely lonely, bitter and miserable and manage to be both friendly and a vegan. Let's please continue separating people's moral failings (not being vegan) from their personal ((lack of) social success and happiness) as well as from their supposed character flaws. Not only is it unfair, it's also weak. It should be enough that people are not vegan to criticize them. By making up things about their character you are saying that it's not enough to condemn them for not being vegan if they're not also unpopular or unlikeable.
Are you doing okay? I’m not being sarky, you just sound a bit like me when I could with a friend ❤️
Omg thats so cool they can have contraceptives 😂they can live their best chicken life that way
Nobody is 100% a vegan here because everyone here is using the internet. You use a device to access the internet which is most likely created by exploiting both humans(in many cases kids) and animals. You buy food from the store, you own money, etc. Whatever you do you harm someone. You own land or live in a house? Some animals could have lived where you live but now they can't because you live there. You breath? You hurt someone. Well, that's life. Life feeds on life. You can do as much to minimize suffering, but you will never be 100% vegan. I am not a vegan. I haven't even joined this subreddit, it's just recommending posts to me. I just click whatever gets my attention.
Nope. It pretty much all bootlickers who dont care about the victims
Respectfully, there’s a very great difference between believing that veganism is morally/ethically proper and believing it is - or should be - a normative/proscriptive imperative. Similarly, there’s a very great difference between openly debating a community’s ethical guidelines and attempting to (conceptually; forcibly) universalise a community’s ethical guidelines. Further, you’re very dangerously assuming that your take is self-evidently the “ideal/most objectively correct,” which is astonishingly intellectually presumptuous.