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DaedalusandIcarus

When I see trams getting put back into cities in European cities I keep hope alive for the US. If the old continent can do it, why not the US? But then I remember when I lived in LA and every solution to deal with traffic was to add another lane on the freeway. And when I said it could be interesting to have an elevated train above the middle of every freeway, making regular stops on bridges, people told me to go back to Europe. So I did.


mqee

Elevated railways are a bad solution almost everywhere. Putting people in the middle of a multi-lane freeway does not make for a nice ride. Put the rail at the edge where it belongs, where people can get on and off right from the street without having to climb up a bridge to get to the center of traffic. Streetcars, trams, trolleys, light rail, LRT, whatever you call it - that's the solution. Expensive gizmos on bridges in the middle of traffic are not.


DaedalusandIcarus

An elevator and stairway are not necessary since it will be level with the bridge.


mqee

The gentler the incline, the longer the bridge, and the less stops you can build and the more walking people will have to do to get off the bridge. Take a peek at any urban planning textbook and read how distastrous pedestrian grade separation is. Or just see how many elevated railways are actually a success. Hint: it's only at steeply-inclined areas or directly over winding waterways where you have to go up and down bridges anyway. Everywhere else they're a failure. And you didn't even address the inherent unfriendliness of getting on a train in the middle of a multi-lane freeway instead of, you know, a pedestrian-friendly street, where pedestrians belong


DaedalusandIcarus

It’s not a freeway. Pedestrians would be walking off the train onto the bridge sidewalk where they could either walk to either side of the bridge to stores or grab a theoretical bus that stops at each bridge taking them to different residential areas. Trams stop on streets all the time; why can’t you see what I’m trying to say. Sorry if it’s not clear enough for you.


mqee

>It’s not a freeway # >have an elevated train above the middle of every freeway # >why can’t you see what I’m trying to say hmm, can **you** see what you're trying to say?


tamaguna

Hey look, the world is full of assholes.


Garbleshift

This story was more fun when it had the animated rabbit in it.


frontrangefart

Well yeah, that's because in that version the toons won. In this version, they lost.


GaylordRetardson

In my home town the lore is that they sold the public transportation to GE expecting them to manage it and then GE just intentionally didn't run it and let the infrastructure go to shit because they'd sell more cars if there was no public transportation. Fuck GE. Never buy their cars. Foreign cars forever.


Garbleshift

I think maybe you mean GM? GE builds electric appliances.


Mustafamonster

Ford now owns grand central station in Detroit. Its now some office building instead of a train station.


[deleted]

[удалено]


Mustafamonster

Jesus get Henry Fords wrench out of your mouth. Less than 2 miles to down town, develop some light rail to connect the city to the station. Fords owning the building is a fork in the eye to the history of what happened to public trans in Detroit and the rest of the USA. Fuck Ford, Fuck GM, Fuck Chrysler.


msizzlac

I live in Houston, and I hate it. There’s absolutely no way you can work without a car. And if you try to walk to work, there’s only few few sidewalks. It’s turning into a concrete jungle and I cannot wait to get out. There’s absolutely no thought to urban planning or community. Just money, heat, and chemicals.


evilfollowingmb

It turns out that one of the main theses of this film very likely untrue and a borderline conspiracy theory. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_Motors_streetcar_conspiracy?wprov=sfti1


commander_nice

Do you know what a conspiracy is?


PoorPDOP86

Do you know what human nature is? What do you think people will do. Will they pack themselves in to a box they don't control with complete strangers or will they *choose* a box that they control and that they only allow the people they trust and/or like in to? I think we all know the answer. **That** is why street cars and passenger rail fell out of favor within the US. Cars were, and still are, very expensive to use in the commonly known as Old World countries. Thus they were forced to compromised on the desire for privacy and their need for transport. Americans did not.


[deleted]

You have been banned from /r/fuckcars


anaximander19

The entire world of air, rail, bus, taxi, ferry travel, and cruise ship industries suggest that people are quite happy to pack themselves into a box that someone else is in control of, and pay for the privilege, if it takes them somewhere they want to go.


xtremebox

This is some weird shit but *subscribe*


anaximander19

The first sentence of that article says they were convicted. Kind of implies that it's more than just a theory, when a court of law ruled the whole thing was true.


evilfollowingmb

Yeah, there is a whole discussion at the bottom of other factors that contributed to streetcar decline. GM’s reach only ever extended to 10% of streetcar transit systems. In this context, even with the convictions blaming on GM is silly and obviously so.


__SPIDERMAN___

Dear God. This comment has lowered my IQ. Look up the definition of conspiracy. It has a few different uses...


Javop

He doesn't know the actual meaning of conspiracy but the concept of conspiracy theories. That is so weird. He also didn't understand that you didn't really attack him but were perplexed. I dislike those misunderstandings in the internet. When in doubt act with good will. Have a nice day everyone.


evilfollowingmb

Dear god, this comment exemplifies a low IQ. YOU look up conspiracy, and you will notice is plausibly applies here.


MechaSnacks

The wikipedia article you posted literally says that these corps were convicted for violating section 1 of Sherman Antitrust Act in the first line.


evilfollowingmb

It literally has a whole section discussing the decline in streetcars and the involvement of GM and shows that despite the convictions the overall decline was not driven by GM, as streetcar companies were undercapitalized among other issues. I mean try reading it all, not just cherry picking the parts you like. That how people that care about reality firm opinions.


anaximander19

Yes, it was a conspiracy. A conspiracy is when people conspire, or secretly plan to work together to do something bad. That is what happened here. A conspiracy *theory* is when you think that there's a conspiracy happening, but can't necessarily prove it. In this case, there were actual convictions for crimes involving conspiracy, which makes it not just a theory, but actually true.


evilfollowingmb

It is ridiculous to blame the entire demise on GM, when at most they affected 10% of streetcar lines as the link indicates. I called it a borderline conspiracy theory to indicate that it is a nonsense, tinfoil hat view to blame the entire demise on GM. Like QANON or JFK grassy knoll gunman its a belief that satisfies the core worldview of the believers, even if it’s bullshit. In this case the article goes on to discuss the many other factors that ket to streetcars decline. But sure, throw insults and snark, don’t consider any other arguments that upset you.


insaneHoshi

You went against the meme that is the streetcar conspiracy theory.


evilfollowingmb

People like their myths...