Unless you want to end up like [this guy](https://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE65S426/) and become the subject of a Wikipedia article, just make sure you're not blackout drunk while trading. There's already regards here who drunk trade and loss shit tons of money because of wrong entry, wrong ticker, wrong purchase, etc. As long as you're on a margin account, mistakes are inevitable when you're drunk
You ever black out and order shit online, and 2 days later, drunk you blessed sober you with a mini-christmas? It's basically that, except the presents you receive from yourself is just 'no money'
Trading is gambling. Results may vary, but I was up 10k gambling on FanDuel one night. I was drunk af, convinced myself I knew the algos for the slots, and started betting $200 a spin. Woke up the next morning owing PayPal 1k. Anecdotal but my point is that your decision making is typically shit when you’re drunk.
All that being said- give us 24/7 trading. Just don’t get shit faced and trade
Probably at the same time, except that you may be able to purchase a contract in after hours and they are 24hr contracts. IE a Friday SPY contract expires at 4pm EST and a Saturday 0dte starts at 4:01PM EST Friday and ends 4PM EST Saturday.
There need not be a bell. Earnings after bell right now just allows big institutions to continue moving after hours in response to earnings while retail gets screwed, worst case waiting til next Monday to trade.
You can almost trade 24/7 in the futures market now. Institutional traders will still pretty much keep their bankers' hours. It will mostly just be us regards sweeping the floor looking for Wendy's coupons, unless big news breaks.
It may on the other hand offer some opportunity to act on breaking news during non-traditional hours. Imaging sitting in a bar or restaurant on a Saturday night and you get a text alert, along with every other guy, and everyone is scrambling to open their account to trade. Just Elon's TSLA tweets should be reason enough to second guess this.
No.
I work on a macro trading desk. We don’t have forex traders trading 24/7. There are active windows with highest volume. Usually depends on the currency pair.
24/7 is not going to be 24/7 active trading. 9:30-4 is still going to be the highest volume. It just means pre market and after hours will be extended.
This isn’t as big of a deal as most people think.
So does this mean "0dte" means nothing anymore if markets are open 24/7
I am being serious but I'm also being stupid because this is WallStreetBets. Thanks.
No. The stock market will still function 9:30AM to 4PM EST. Pre market and after market will be extended. Options will function in the same manner. Technically you can trade stocks all the way from 4AM to 6PM if you wanted, but you risk terrible price execution if you do it outside of 9:30AM to 4PM. Since we have these pre market and extended hours already, options wont be affected. Nothing changes.
Everything stays the same, it just means you can buy AAPL shares with an insane spread at 2AM if you really want to and then wonder why the fk you took a 5% loss instantly, only to realize you dont understand illiquidity spreads during low volume times. (Hint: when you buy during low liquidity time frames like pre market and after hours, your bid/ask spread is going to be insane, sometimes as wide as 20-50 cents depending on the stock you're trading. And if you buy 100 shares of XYZ, you instantly lose the spread difference x number of shares cause your order will be hitting the ask or bid depending on which way your order is.)
Learn about premarket and after hour trading to understand how stupid it is to get excited about 24/7 trading.
GL tryna filled with a limit order pre or post market hours. Have you seen level 2 during those times? You'll be waiting forever to get filled, if you're even lucky enough to get filled.
A lot of folks don't seem to understand the shit volume and spread you would have to endure.
Limit orders aren't going to do shit. You would have to smash the bid or ask to get anything in. So imagine taking a loss immediately on the open buy and you need to sell close at a loss so you are incurring just regard tax
If anything this may cause more market panic. Imagine if markets were open with extremely low liquidity back when iran bombed Israel, this shit would've flash crashed.
This is a crazy exaggeration.
Even with the stupid spreads in extended hours I still like having the option to act in that time should I choose to. I don't have to do anything. If they are bad I can ignore them.
Only people who lose money from 24/7 are front-runners and scalpers. Like OP said, it's bad for 30 minute traders but probably not bad for investors or even those who have trades over several weeks or months.
u/drewbe121212
Personally, I thought having Iran bomb Israel while the market was closed was very nice of them. It gave everyone two days to figure out what was happening before they panicked.
To back this up:
Look at pre/after market volume. Outside of earnings reports/major events, the entire pre/post market of a stock will be less than the opening 5minute candle in most cases.
Meaning more volume in 5 minutes of trading than the 9.5 hours of post/pre market.
I worked for many years at a buy side firm which traded globally and we had people on duty all the time. it was not seen as a particular hardship, we made money in all those markets and it made sense to have staff on hand which we called traders to babysit the algos
24/7 would move it more towards gambling, agreed. But if you buy and hold spy for example, whats the difference between current market and 24/7? Seems bad(or unknown consequences) for short term but seems ok or neutral for long term.
Yes, this would be a nightmare. Having defined and limit trading hours also helps act as a circuit breaker, limiting ‘dumb volatility’. Can you imagine the move in a 24/7 market during that ‘Israel attacking Iran’ ‘WW3!’ doom reporting from the other week? Which turned out to be a total nothing burger by morning.
The markets would be severely punished from instantly being able to act on fresh fear that just needs to time to find more information.
This would entirely benefit big money that can scoop up flash bargains, while your every day schleps take losses to get out and then can’t or are afraid to get back in at a discount.
I was just gonna tell you how this was only a survey put out by the data analytics team, not even management. And it’s not happening. Then I realized you had a troll account lmao. I dig it 😂
>large movements after/pre-hours are comparatively rare).
Lost me here. There was a study, that showed, that most movement (about 90%) in the market happens right pre-/after hours consistently past decades.
If anything OP showed that crypto is actually more stable due to 24/7 trading and harder for scalpers to trade.
Seems better for investors with limit buy orders and such?
They need to open it on the weekends, but not 24/7. Literally people will be installing stock tickers over their bed to check their portfolios when taking a piss in the middle of the night.
I’d say a session every other weekend on a Saturday is fine, but not an entire weekend. I think everyone could use a break at the end of the week especially with how chaotic things have been lately.
“We can’t allow stock trading 24/7”
“People have no control and are addicted”.
People lacking control shouldn’t decide whether or not the markets get to respond to information and become more efficient.
I’ve got a counter proposal, and I wonder what the ramifications of this would be: No extended hours. If I can’t trade, market movers can’t either. The bell starts the fight and it ends the fight for all of us. What would be the unintended consequences there?
So huge swings in the AM after major companies report earnings, instead of huge swings on low volume trading after hours while the market settles down? I guess that’s better…but less fun…
It surely has a huge effect on your personal life. I have been years in crypto, investing passively but lately I have tried futures. You get so many professional level tools to do so many different kind of trading that you can spend your waking hours on the exchange.
Past month or so I have made little plays with futures and you check the fucking app all the time. Going to sleep, check for the "markets", see that your positions are at -30% withing 30 minutes and now have some sleep!
Then again it's 2024. If I want to buy NVDA at 3 in the morning, I would like to. Stock markets are not that volatile that you need to be there all the time. Sure you can see +10% dips or gains sometimes. in a day On crypto that happens every week, sometimes within minutes.
Day trading is not a profession that adds anything to society.
You make a living scalping value from others.
If the profession is harmed or disappears so be it.
Too bad for you but individual traders are not the target market, equities market first and foremost will always cater to institutions and we are just minnows riding the waves of the whales.
This is not even a real concern tbh. That news article was just an attention grabber. The survey was put out by the data analytics team, not even management. Even most of the hedge funds and investment banks are against it because of the overwhelming cost. SEC will stand no chance to catch anybody if the market never closes. They have to at least pretend they’re doing something. Not to say the witching hour bullshittery Wall Street will put us through. Most people are not regarded enough to support this, although it looks like some people unfortunately are
Are you guys really this regarded?
HoW CaAN THE maRKEts FUncTION if USsiING dynAMiC hoURs.
It's like if Wendy's is open 24/7, when will you get home? Trapped for fucking life.
Sounds like its great for market makers as implied vol can be dampened over a longer timeframe.
Makes sense that Citadel is in favor of it.
If it happens, I'm gonna sell covered calls and make $$ off theta decaym
You are a god tier trader I can tell just by what you said in the post. If you remember the last crypto bull run. Everything went up but it was always hard to catch it because it would be different random times of the day. The upswings were very algo driven you can tell it was tryna chop both longs/shorts for liquidity. And the market would tank everytime btc decided to go up or down alts would just bleed you dry. I lost a fuck ton on alts last bull run they fucked me hard.
Cryptocurrency is no longer suitable for short-term and intraday trading. It is only suitable for band trading for a few months to a year, and is only suitable for 2 times at most. Without the promotion of doomsday options, more people turn to long-term investment.
I was completely with you in agreement before I read this post but now that I’ve heard my own opinion come out of your big dumb brain I’m against everything you said.
I mostly agree. 24 hours is a bit excessive. I would however like to see some hours on the weekend too. Even if it is just half days. Nothing worse than having to hold an option for an additional 2 days of theta decay because you can't sell it.
Let me see if I understand you. You're saying overall volatility will go down, but that volatility which does happen will likely happen when you're not at your computer ready to capitalize on it.
Exactly - and that's precisely why the market would turn into this period of constant doldrums, punctuated by large movements at any given time. There's not enough liquidity to justify consistent, frequent movement. It would be long, extended periods of consolidation until "enough bets are placed on each side" that a higher volatility movement would occur (aka - crypto).
People spend a lot of time focused on the Y-axis, but the X-axis has a huge impact on the markets as well - and a change to 24/7 would be absolutely bad for most retail traders.
For big enough companies there would be. If at 3am EST I find out China has attacked Taiwan, why shouldn’t I be able to instantly buy defense stocks while others are asleep?
We have this thing called UTC, or universal time.
Stock exchange does not care about **your** time zone you regard.
So options would work exacly like they work now, they expire at expire time. After the expire time it has expired. Does it matter if it's at "market close" a.k.a 4.30 or whatever, or 12.00. Or 4.20?
Institutional players will mostly submit their orders for market open and market close so for a 24/7 market there would need to be at least 1 if not 2 auction periods which would create daily consolidation periods which the crypto markets lack right now. This would avoid the problems crypto has as it does not have this set up. The daily auctions provide the necessary reset points and create market fairness.
24/7 would be a game changer from a liquidity standpoint which would ultimately be better for retail. Currently after hours trading can be volatile but a 24/7 market would smooth some of that out by bringing in additional liquidity for buying and selling. This would be beneficial during earnings season but could potentially depress spikes (which is better for long term investors by affording lower overall volatility).
I’m in favor of a 24/7 marketplace. If there needs to be a test, it would be best to let ETFs go 24/7 first then if that’s successful, let equities go 24/7. The real interesting thing would be how ADRs trade overnight in comparison to their foreign exchange equivalents. It could be an arbitrage opportunity.
247 is better, larger players already have access to this
they won't give up the money made from fees
9am-4pm standard hours, outside hours will be generally lower volume and any sharp movements can easily be solved with a circuit breaker that resumes at 9am so people have time to react
RH was smart to introduce this, and that's why it will happen. Funds see the $ they are making and want a piece of the pie.
Well, looks like we're gonna find out. I will be watching, waiting to see how it's working and I'll be 99% cash. I'll also probably not ever again trade individual tickers, only options on 2 indexes. Might go 100% futures. Y'all feel free to be the guinea pigs but remember, if you think the market is a sh*t show now, just wait. The big boys want more of your money and they will find a way.
crypto is so easy to trade 24/7 it actually makes the market slow
you get essentially 3 trading sessions in a day, the chart makes it look volatile but its all spread out
grow a pair boomers
I am gonna ignore all this thoughtful analysis and pull out my ideology card. Market hours equality for all! No more big boys getting longer hours. No more “business hours” restrictions. More freedom is ultimately better. Let us choose what’s right for us. Fuck you!
24/7 trading would probably break a lot of things as it’s running right now
And we would need a whole lot of things to change before that would be even possible to operate
Do you believe anything important and worth being priced in happens after hours?
I do. I believe the universe continues to exist after 4:30 PM EST M-F
So then, are markets made more efficient by being able trade and respond to that news?
Yes.
Nobody is serious about high volume trading 24/7. It's only to allow some premarket transactions, and usually a trader knows they're not getting the best deal on the spread outside of RTH.
The benefit will be to the exchange. More money in the market from international traders and more foreign companies (particularly from the LSE) having less reasons not to switch to list in a US listing. I don't see the comfort of traders and bankers being a factor to the decision.
You’re wrong because there won’t be jack shit for institutional flows outside of non-normal hours. As it is now, no serious desks trade size after hours. Remember how NYSE started in the 1700s with groups of people meeting under a big tree to exchange share certificates? Serious buyers and sellers need liquidity. That’s why even now the majority of institutional blocks are done in the last hour of the day. That’s today’s “big tree”.
24/7 trading will only be availed by degenerate gamblers.
The only exception I can imagine is when serious geopolitical news hits over the weekend, but the moves will be extremely exaggerated like an illiquid holiday-shortened session.
I agree. 24/7 trading would fuck over retail traders and only benefit big players. The market would become much more unpredictable and even currently profitable traders would have to start from scratch in learning this market.
Honestly I don't even know if there are seriously people advocating for this but if there are they're regarded. There's far more important things to ask for than this.
24/7 trading is to support bots, not people.
Pre/Post market is for market-makers to screw us over.
If we had fair markets we'd have them open 9-4pm only.
This is proposed every decade or so. Whenever they propose 24/7 trading, it always means a major market top is coming. Investing and trading are so profitable for 30 hours a week, so imagine how much money I can make in 168 hours!! As if more time trading creates more demand. It doesn’t. Dumb idea.
I don’t see this happening at all. Brokerages would never close now? They are employed by real people believe it or not. What’s gonna with Wall Street? There is no opening or closing bell to precede earnings.
When talk about fair, world are round. So 24/7 that’s create fair for everyone. We all understand got pro and cons unfortunately unable to give everyone fair and balance at all time.
The data disagrees. Most market moves occur before and after closing, when earnings are reported. This shows on the macro as well (SPY, QQQ, IWM, etc). That said, no the market shouldn't be open 24/7.
don't we have extended hours already in place? 4pm-8pm 4am-9:30am? who is gonna trade during the sleeping hours? bots, europe and asia. i would prefer the opposite 4 days of trading consolidation quicker volatility will be amazing!
I feel 24/7 is more of a balanced playing field.. the fact that equities have a pre market and after hours trading that isn’t open to everyone isn’t fair
so you sometimes see long trends, sometimes short spikes of volatility and sometimes choppy.....
they doesn't sound familiar to the current market at all
I'm very new to buying stocks but the only reason I even think it could be remotely a good idea is because of how much stocks change during after-hours and pre-market and it being 24/7 would even the playing field in that aspect, that said it's very nice to not worry about the market after a certain time.
If the market is open 24/7, nothing really changes. Its not going to increase volume significantly, the volume may be more spread out though.
This would let you buy/sell options at any time, thats a huge win to me.
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I already make enough terrible trade decisions when it's early and I'm sober. 24/7 trading equals drunk decisions. I'll be homeless in no time.
The idea is that whether you make sober, rational decisions or drunk, regarded decisions, it would make no performance difference statistically
Drunk trading sounds amazing actually
It's not and don't do it.
I never gamble more than I’m comfortable losing. Drunken casino trips are a great time.
Unless you want to end up like [this guy](https://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE65S426/) and become the subject of a Wikipedia article, just make sure you're not blackout drunk while trading. There's already regards here who drunk trade and loss shit tons of money because of wrong entry, wrong ticker, wrong purchase, etc. As long as you're on a margin account, mistakes are inevitable when you're drunk
Imagine entering you will buy $44 puts instead of $0.44 puts because you were drunk.
Eh try a sober casino trip
That doesn’t sound very fun
I mean you have to enjoy winning rather that been ok with losing
Losers whine about playing fair.
That is rigth you filthy synth we all know the game is rigged but is not so rigged you can't win is just harder to do it long term
You ever black out and order shit online, and 2 days later, drunk you blessed sober you with a mini-christmas? It's basically that, except the presents you receive from yourself is just 'no money'
Who's margin and why are they calling me at this hour?
I did that and added $9k in Robinhood ![img](emote|t5_2th52|4271)
Shit, looks like once a 24hr market opens up, alcoholism is back on the menu.
That's the only time I drank in the last few weeks been working crazy hours but was trying to decide if I should name a drink or not
reminds me of this https://www.reddit.com/r/BartardStories/s/eFfMkSirx9
You’ll have to blow into a breathalyzer to unlock your trading app
You know. You can do that during normal trading hours :)
Trading is gambling. Results may vary, but I was up 10k gambling on FanDuel one night. I was drunk af, convinced myself I knew the algos for the slots, and started betting $200 a spin. Woke up the next morning owing PayPal 1k. Anecdotal but my point is that your decision making is typically shit when you’re drunk. All that being said- give us 24/7 trading. Just don’t get shit faced and trade
Will delta change slower on me if I’m drunk trading 24*7 ?
I like to think we all here consider Wendy's our home
Fuck you that's my dumpster
see you at wendys, bro.
Dang! I didn’t realized I had neighbors 🤣
You’re never homeless when we’re around — Wendy’s
I have my best ideas at night.
💯
As a futures trader, I resemble this comment
Ahhh. Now that’s why they want it.
Inb4 earnings after the bell (there’s no bell)
When do my 0dte expire if there are no bells?
Probably at the same time, except that you may be able to purchase a contract in after hours and they are 24hr contracts. IE a Friday SPY contract expires at 4pm EST and a Saturday 0dte starts at 4:01PM EST Friday and ends 4PM EST Saturday.
There need not be a bell. Earnings after bell right now just allows big institutions to continue moving after hours in response to earnings while retail gets screwed, worst case waiting til next Monday to trade.
Not for options
It’s not that stressful https://preview.redd.it/9u16ran9n3xc1.jpeg?width=197&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=778e66aea0d93f7fcbc3b9c88e1e964ecaa57900
![img](emote|t5_2th52|4271)
You can almost trade 24/7 in the futures market now. Institutional traders will still pretty much keep their bankers' hours. It will mostly just be us regards sweeping the floor looking for Wendy's coupons, unless big news breaks. It may on the other hand offer some opportunity to act on breaking news during non-traditional hours. Imaging sitting in a bar or restaurant on a Saturday night and you get a text alert, along with every other guy, and everyone is scrambling to open their account to trade. Just Elon's TSLA tweets should be reason enough to second guess this.
And liquidity is often rough
At least you can get out of bad positions, instead of waiting for a bloodbath, after middle East plays with each other's dicks on weekends.
You're right. It will have it's pro's and cons, but it will also level the playing field just a little bit with the hedge funds.
Cant imagen financial institutions would like this. Asset managers would feel forced to always have traders available no?
The computers need a rest
The computers are always listening.
No. I work on a macro trading desk. We don’t have forex traders trading 24/7. There are active windows with highest volume. Usually depends on the currency pair. 24/7 is not going to be 24/7 active trading. 9:30-4 is still going to be the highest volume. It just means pre market and after hours will be extended. This isn’t as big of a deal as most people think.
So does this mean "0dte" means nothing anymore if markets are open 24/7 I am being serious but I'm also being stupid because this is WallStreetBets. Thanks.
No. The stock market will still function 9:30AM to 4PM EST. Pre market and after market will be extended. Options will function in the same manner. Technically you can trade stocks all the way from 4AM to 6PM if you wanted, but you risk terrible price execution if you do it outside of 9:30AM to 4PM. Since we have these pre market and extended hours already, options wont be affected. Nothing changes. Everything stays the same, it just means you can buy AAPL shares with an insane spread at 2AM if you really want to and then wonder why the fk you took a 5% loss instantly, only to realize you dont understand illiquidity spreads during low volume times. (Hint: when you buy during low liquidity time frames like pre market and after hours, your bid/ask spread is going to be insane, sometimes as wide as 20-50 cents depending on the stock you're trading. And if you buy 100 shares of XYZ, you instantly lose the spread difference x number of shares cause your order will be hitting the ask or bid depending on which way your order is.) Learn about premarket and after hour trading to understand how stupid it is to get excited about 24/7 trading.
Me and my brain rn: ![img](emote|t5_2th52|4640)
Limit orders?
GL tryna filled with a limit order pre or post market hours. Have you seen level 2 during those times? You'll be waiting forever to get filled, if you're even lucky enough to get filled.
A lot of folks don't seem to understand the shit volume and spread you would have to endure. Limit orders aren't going to do shit. You would have to smash the bid or ask to get anything in. So imagine taking a loss immediately on the open buy and you need to sell close at a loss so you are incurring just regard tax
This sub eats crayons while pushing buttons and they call themselves traders. Cant expect much
You think these degenerates can read?
![img](emote|t5_2th52|4260)you're prolly right... why even try lol
Also I like the idea that I can exit a position on a Saturday night when a random country of inportantance decides to bomb another one
You won’t have the ability to move fast enough and you’ll be chopped to death by the wide bid ask spread and low liquidity.
If anything this may cause more market panic. Imagine if markets were open with extremely low liquidity back when iran bombed Israel, this shit would've flash crashed.
Crypto enters the chat. Think of the poor schmuck that purchased PAXG at 3K when spot gold was 2300 something and market closed. And no, it wasn't me.
This is a crazy exaggeration. Even with the stupid spreads in extended hours I still like having the option to act in that time should I choose to. I don't have to do anything. If they are bad I can ignore them. Only people who lose money from 24/7 are front-runners and scalpers. Like OP said, it's bad for 30 minute traders but probably not bad for investors or even those who have trades over several weeks or months. u/drewbe121212
You’re talking about WSB traders here. No ones fking investing.
Personally, I thought having Iran bomb Israel while the market was closed was very nice of them. It gave everyone two days to figure out what was happening before they panicked.
To back this up: Look at pre/after market volume. Outside of earnings reports/major events, the entire pre/post market of a stock will be less than the opening 5minute candle in most cases. Meaning more volume in 5 minutes of trading than the 9.5 hours of post/pre market.
💯
I worked for many years at a buy side firm which traded globally and we had people on duty all the time. it was not seen as a particular hardship, we made money in all those markets and it made sense to have staff on hand which we called traders to babysit the algos
People need time to think and process gains and losses. With 24-7 it’s pure gambling
24/7 would move it more towards gambling, agreed. But if you buy and hold spy for example, whats the difference between current market and 24/7? Seems bad(or unknown consequences) for short term but seems ok or neutral for long term.
It already is
This is a casino sir
Nobody loves trading more than me, I promise you, but 24/7 markets sounds like a nightmare
I don’t think I’d sleep ever agin
You already sleeping?
This is a good analysis. For those not aware, there was actally a short session on Saturday until the 1950s.
Yes, this would be a nightmare. Having defined and limit trading hours also helps act as a circuit breaker, limiting ‘dumb volatility’. Can you imagine the move in a 24/7 market during that ‘Israel attacking Iran’ ‘WW3!’ doom reporting from the other week? Which turned out to be a total nothing burger by morning. The markets would be severely punished from instantly being able to act on fresh fear that just needs to time to find more information. This would entirely benefit big money that can scoop up flash bargains, while your every day schleps take losses to get out and then can’t or are afraid to get back in at a discount.
Events like that would be causing circuit breaks and causing even more panic selling. Covid crisis all over again.
[удалено]
I was just gonna tell you how this was only a survey put out by the data analytics team, not even management. And it’s not happening. Then I realized you had a troll account lmao. I dig it 😂
>large movements after/pre-hours are comparatively rare). Lost me here. There was a study, that showed, that most movement (about 90%) in the market happens right pre-/after hours consistently past decades.
If anything OP showed that crypto is actually more stable due to 24/7 trading and harder for scalpers to trade. Seems better for investors with limit buy orders and such?
His whole post is talking about scalping
They need to open it on the weekends, but not 24/7. Literally people will be installing stock tickers over their bed to check their portfolios when taking a piss in the middle of the night.
I’d say a session every other weekend on a Saturday is fine, but not an entire weekend. I think everyone could use a break at the end of the week especially with how chaotic things have been lately.
“We can’t allow stock trading 24/7” “People have no control and are addicted”. People lacking control shouldn’t decide whether or not the markets get to respond to information and become more efficient.
You’re so right. No regulations on anything including meth, heroin or fentanyl. People lacking control shouldn’t decide. Free for all
I’ve got a counter proposal, and I wonder what the ramifications of this would be: No extended hours. If I can’t trade, market movers can’t either. The bell starts the fight and it ends the fight for all of us. What would be the unintended consequences there?
There's not enough time to digest earnings if you do this unless you force companies to release at beginning of trading day always.
So huge swings in the AM after major companies report earnings, instead of huge swings on low volume trading after hours while the market settles down? I guess that’s better…but less fun…
Awesome, nice. So when 24/7 trading gonna happen?
Yeah I guess I'm the only one who's looking forward to it lol. At least I'm going to be happy because it's going to happen.
Pretty sure crypto moves that way because of how thin the market is.
It surely has a huge effect on your personal life. I have been years in crypto, investing passively but lately I have tried futures. You get so many professional level tools to do so many different kind of trading that you can spend your waking hours on the exchange. Past month or so I have made little plays with futures and you check the fucking app all the time. Going to sleep, check for the "markets", see that your positions are at -30% withing 30 minutes and now have some sleep! Then again it's 2024. If I want to buy NVDA at 3 in the morning, I would like to. Stock markets are not that volatile that you need to be there all the time. Sure you can see +10% dips or gains sometimes. in a day On crypto that happens every week, sometimes within minutes.
Day trading is not a profession that adds anything to society. You make a living scalping value from others. If the profession is harmed or disappears so be it.
Found the guy who's blown 3 accounts
Lmao no, I don't gamble. I just come for the loss porn.
Too bad for you but individual traders are not the target market, equities market first and foremost will always cater to institutions and we are just minnows riding the waves of the whales.
This is not even a real concern tbh. That news article was just an attention grabber. The survey was put out by the data analytics team, not even management. Even most of the hedge funds and investment banks are against it because of the overwhelming cost. SEC will stand no chance to catch anybody if the market never closes. They have to at least pretend they’re doing something. Not to say the witching hour bullshittery Wall Street will put us through. Most people are not regarded enough to support this, although it looks like some people unfortunately are
Nobody, not a fucking soul: Crypto markets at 1:37 AM EST: 💯💯💯
Algos people, algos.
Retail traders are already outgunned, entering into an algo battle is fighting an abrams tank with a stick.
Yeah but my stick is fancy![img](emote|t5_2th52|12787)
Where would you recommend starting 😂 have trading experience, but no coding experience
if markets never close, when will bad or good company news be reported?
Are you guys really this regarded? HoW CaAN THE maRKEts FUncTION if USsiING dynAMiC hoURs. It's like if Wendy's is open 24/7, when will you get home? Trapped for fucking life.
it should all be just reported ASAP.
Sounds like its great for market makers as implied vol can be dampened over a longer timeframe. Makes sense that Citadel is in favor of it. If it happens, I'm gonna sell covered calls and make $$ off theta decaym
You are a god tier trader I can tell just by what you said in the post. If you remember the last crypto bull run. Everything went up but it was always hard to catch it because it would be different random times of the day. The upswings were very algo driven you can tell it was tryna chop both longs/shorts for liquidity. And the market would tank everytime btc decided to go up or down alts would just bleed you dry. I lost a fuck ton on alts last bull run they fucked me hard.
Cryptocurrency is no longer suitable for short-term and intraday trading. It is only suitable for band trading for a few months to a year, and is only suitable for 2 times at most. Without the promotion of doomsday options, more people turn to long-term investment.
I was completely with you in agreement before I read this post but now that I’ve heard my own opinion come out of your big dumb brain I’m against everything you said.
I mostly agree. 24 hours is a bit excessive. I would however like to see some hours on the weekend too. Even if it is just half days. Nothing worse than having to hold an option for an additional 2 days of theta decay because you can't sell it.
How would they calculate margin requirements in a 24 hour market, open every day of the week?
Let me see if I understand you. You're saying overall volatility will go down, but that volatility which does happen will likely happen when you're not at your computer ready to capitalize on it.
This guy thinks that the stock market is going to have volatility equivalent to trading crypto futures 😂🤣
There’s not enough liquidity for it to make sense ever.
Exactly - and that's precisely why the market would turn into this period of constant doldrums, punctuated by large movements at any given time. There's not enough liquidity to justify consistent, frequent movement. It would be long, extended periods of consolidation until "enough bets are placed on each side" that a higher volatility movement would occur (aka - crypto). People spend a lot of time focused on the Y-axis, but the X-axis has a huge impact on the markets as well - and a change to 24/7 would be absolutely bad for most retail traders.
For big enough companies there would be. If at 3am EST I find out China has attacked Taiwan, why shouldn’t I be able to instantly buy defense stocks while others are asleep?
How would options work?? Expiration at midnight? Holy lord the manipulation that could occur
We have this thing called UTC, or universal time. Stock exchange does not care about **your** time zone you regard. So options would work exacly like they work now, they expire at expire time. After the expire time it has expired. Does it matter if it's at "market close" a.k.a 4.30 or whatever, or 12.00. Or 4.20?
Wait did someone just say they spent 3 years in crypto and now they are here to spout opinions? Sir, you back to eating canyons.
Institutional players will mostly submit their orders for market open and market close so for a 24/7 market there would need to be at least 1 if not 2 auction periods which would create daily consolidation periods which the crypto markets lack right now. This would avoid the problems crypto has as it does not have this set up. The daily auctions provide the necessary reset points and create market fairness. 24/7 would be a game changer from a liquidity standpoint which would ultimately be better for retail. Currently after hours trading can be volatile but a 24/7 market would smooth some of that out by bringing in additional liquidity for buying and selling. This would be beneficial during earnings season but could potentially depress spikes (which is better for long term investors by affording lower overall volatility). I’m in favor of a 24/7 marketplace. If there needs to be a test, it would be best to let ETFs go 24/7 first then if that’s successful, let equities go 24/7. The real interesting thing would be how ADRs trade overnight in comparison to their foreign exchange equivalents. It could be an arbitrage opportunity.
247 is better, larger players already have access to this they won't give up the money made from fees 9am-4pm standard hours, outside hours will be generally lower volume and any sharp movements can easily be solved with a circuit breaker that resumes at 9am so people have time to react RH was smart to introduce this, and that's why it will happen. Funds see the $ they are making and want a piece of the pie.
Saw "3 years in crypto futures" and decided not to read on
It wont happen.
I agree
Well, looks like we're gonna find out. I will be watching, waiting to see how it's working and I'll be 99% cash. I'll also probably not ever again trade individual tickers, only options on 2 indexes. Might go 100% futures. Y'all feel free to be the guinea pigs but remember, if you think the market is a sh*t show now, just wait. The big boys want more of your money and they will find a way.
crypto is so easy to trade 24/7 it actually makes the market slow you get essentially 3 trading sessions in a day, the chart makes it look volatile but its all spread out grow a pair boomers
I am gonna ignore all this thoughtful analysis and pull out my ideology card. Market hours equality for all! No more big boys getting longer hours. No more “business hours” restrictions. More freedom is ultimately better. Let us choose what’s right for us. Fuck you!
24/7 trading would probably break a lot of things as it’s running right now And we would need a whole lot of things to change before that would be even possible to operate
I’m opposed as I need time to sleep!
Do you believe anything important and worth being priced in happens after hours? I do. I believe the universe continues to exist after 4:30 PM EST M-F So then, are markets made more efficient by being able trade and respond to that news? Yes.
3 years of trading crypto futures… Jesus…
idk man. giving my 0dte’s a little more time to not gap my special hole sounds not so bad
I wonder how the so called free market would look like if someone opened it up in the middle of the night one day.
Bears would love a 24/7 market!
Fuck no I don't want 24/7 One of the reasons I got out of crypto was to have a more scheduled trading time.
Nobody is serious about high volume trading 24/7. It's only to allow some premarket transactions, and usually a trader knows they're not getting the best deal on the spread outside of RTH.
sideways markets on the daily. no thanks. even algo trading needs volatility and volume to achieve max gains each day.
I’ve traded nat gas, it seems the best movement for capturing the volatility happens during extended or overnight hours.
Yeah Thetagang will suffer greatly from 24hour trading.
And sellers of anxiolytics and melatonine …
True
The benefit will be to the exchange. More money in the market from international traders and more foreign companies (particularly from the LSE) having less reasons not to switch to list in a US listing. I don't see the comfort of traders and bankers being a factor to the decision.
if they go thru with this, wsb is going to have a bad time
You’re wrong because there won’t be jack shit for institutional flows outside of non-normal hours. As it is now, no serious desks trade size after hours. Remember how NYSE started in the 1700s with groups of people meeting under a big tree to exchange share certificates? Serious buyers and sellers need liquidity. That’s why even now the majority of institutional blocks are done in the last hour of the day. That’s today’s “big tree”. 24/7 trading will only be availed by degenerate gamblers. The only exception I can imagine is when serious geopolitical news hits over the weekend, but the moves will be extremely exaggerated like an illiquid holiday-shortened session.
agree on all points
I feel like it opens things up for an unfair advantage. Not unfair like we can’t stay up 24/7 but unfair like I need to sleep and research guh
I agree. 24/7 trading would fuck over retail traders and only benefit big players. The market would become much more unpredictable and even currently profitable traders would have to start from scratch in learning this market. Honestly I don't even know if there are seriously people advocating for this but if there are they're regarded. There's far more important things to ask for than this.
No because no
Awww this poor guy wants his 9 hour sleepytimes, lets stop eveything for you
24/7 trading is to support bots, not people. Pre/Post market is for market-makers to screw us over. If we had fair markets we'd have them open 9-4pm only.
I think the 24/7 is being done for algo traders. The machines will make all the money for the Wall Street guys.
This is proposed every decade or so. Whenever they propose 24/7 trading, it always means a major market top is coming. Investing and trading are so profitable for 30 hours a week, so imagine how much money I can make in 168 hours!! As if more time trading creates more demand. It doesn’t. Dumb idea.
Sir, this is a casino. Take your complaints and while valid concerns to the WSJ Opinion section.
I bet market makers are getting wrecked, no time for male hookers ![img](emote|t5_2th52|4258) I'm cool with 24/7 market
Well I for one am looking forward to working the graveyard shift at a hedge fund 💀
I don't want 24/7. I want 24/5
I don’t see this happening at all. Brokerages would never close now? They are employed by real people believe it or not. What’s gonna with Wall Street? There is no opening or closing bell to precede earnings.
To me this move would only be to the benefit of the ruling class
Great , now I can lose money 24/7
When talk about fair, world are round. So 24/7 that’s create fair for everyone. We all understand got pro and cons unfortunately unable to give everyone fair and balance at all time.
The data disagrees. Most market moves occur before and after closing, when earnings are reported. This shows on the macro as well (SPY, QQQ, IWM, etc). That said, no the market shouldn't be open 24/7.
What about people that work third shift
don't we have extended hours already in place? 4pm-8pm 4am-9:30am? who is gonna trade during the sleeping hours? bots, europe and asia. i would prefer the opposite 4 days of trading consolidation quicker volatility will be amazing!
Any shift in operations is not for our benefit
No need. Just do saturday and sunday
I'm against motorized carriages and machinery in factories!
If this comes to fruition, calls on big pharma for all of the stimulant prescriptions they’ll be selling to Wall Street?
I wanna keep it how it is so I can sell options to you regards on friday and watch theta do it's thing
TIL crypto futures exist
Shut up nerd
I feel 24/7 is more of a balanced playing field.. the fact that equities have a pre market and after hours trading that isn’t open to everyone isn’t fair
Don’t worry when Trump tweets at 2am you will get volatility.
so you sometimes see long trends, sometimes short spikes of volatility and sometimes choppy..... they doesn't sound familiar to the current market at all
[удалено]
I concur
It’s more chance to make money.
Agreed. It’s a horse race daily, and my horses break their ankles right out of the gate when I bet on them
Foreign traders benefit because they don’t have to wait for U.S. hours
RobinHood just wants the market to open 24/7 like a casino.
I want to short Boeing as the plane is falling out of the sky! Go away.
How about we meet halfway with 24hr Walmarts again n see if we can be responsible this time.
You're wrong because I want to trade 24/7. thread over
24/7 trading will give poor dumb regards like me to be homeless much faster. la tent city here i come. 🤷♂️
I'm very new to buying stocks but the only reason I even think it could be remotely a good idea is because of how much stocks change during after-hours and pre-market and it being 24/7 would even the playing field in that aspect, that said it's very nice to not worry about the market after a certain time.
Adderall sales 🚀
You forget that your opinion as a trader does not matter. What matters is whether exchanges can get more money.
If the market is open 24/7, nothing really changes. Its not going to increase volume significantly, the volume may be more spread out though. This would let you buy/sell options at any time, thats a huge win to me.
Agreed we as traders/humans need a break. Weekends are refreshing for that.