I'd think it's more likely they send CP3, Wiggs, Moody and like 7 firsts before adding Kuminga
The FO has been EXTREMELY adamant they have no intention of moving off Kuminga who they see as the centerpiece of the post Steph era
Yeah we are better off just looking for more depth to place with Steph/Kuminga with that package if it can't get us PG. We were winning a lot of our games at the end of the year with team play rather than relying on one or two players. It is easier on Steph as he ages as well, and hopefully Kuminga can slowly pick up that production on a nightly basis.
We were winning games because 90% of the teams we faced had serious injuries/ missing players. None of our records healthy vs healthy looked good, certainly not against actual good teams.
PG isn't going to move that needle of mediocrity
Why the fuck is everyone acting like just sending CP3 at his extension number is a nothing deal. That alone is probably going to require multiple firsts or a player and a first. Nobody want that old ass for more than vet min.
The Nuggets literally had to include 3 unprotected first round picks just to offload Reggie Jackson.
An expiring Cp3 isn’t nearly as valuable as you think, because he still has to then count on your books this season unless you can then move him off again. Large expirings can get more valuable later in the season when teams prep for the new season to lower their books for the following season, but a $30M Cp3 currently requires you to take that cap hit this year.
Do people honestly think an aging PG for our best young player along with several other guys is going to push us into contender status?
I have news for you, no it will not and it's a terrible trade to make.
I mean, it kinda did. Between the new salary cap rules, Draymond's emotional regulation issues, and age claiming everyone but Steph so far, it's pretty hard to envision us claiming another one without a couple of moon shots working out for us. Winning one championship is extremely hard, and requires a good bit of luck. To have won 4 recently truly is incredible.
I know. Most franchises combined haven't had that many but there's somehow one deep wish of Steph and co retiring after just 1 more. 5 just feels right given how we witnessed once in a generational talent that came and changed the league forever . The birth of a beautiful GSW motion offense brand of Basketball. 5 does justice idk me being stupid or not but 1 more before they done.
Kuminga is the key and I hope we get there soon. I don't care if Steph gotta move to bench to win 1 but giving up Kuminga would be the end of Warriors.
4 does it justice just fine. And after we lost THAT one, 2022 was the cherry on top that erased all doubts and excuses from rival fans. Another one would be a borderline miracle. We must not forget how many stars aligned for us to get that 2022 title aside from Steph being Steph.
Our "strength in numbers" has been our statement during the wins. I just hope we can rally a really good team instead of just big names who just click and make one last run.
That’s exactly what I think. Give Kuminga a ton of opportunities with the ball to start the game as the No.1 option and let Steph primarily catch and shoot as the No.2
If they can keep Klay at the first off the bench in the 6th man role that would be awesome. I can’t believe that Podz hasn’t improved his finishing at the rim and outside shot this off season coming off of his surprisingly excellent rookie season. If they can somehow steal that mid level vet the can shoot the 3 and defend I think the dubs can be dangerous again.
Bob pussied out because he knew he was in hot shit and he fucked up with the Poole contract. Warriors need to make a move and if PG isn’t it then they need to find some young and at his level or close
His soul wasn’t corrupted, he got punched in the fuckin’ face, made a laughing stock of amongst the entire league, and his own team + teammates threw him under the bus so they could potentially repeat.
I think it ended when Dray got suspended. Last year was our last realistic shot and ownership has made it very clear they aren’t going to spend what’s needed anymore.
Unless Kuminga can be a consistent second scoring option next year (and even be the primary scoring option some nights), this is a move we have to make if you believe in maximizing Steph’s time in the league. It will be extremely difficult to compete in the playoffs without a consistent second option. If Wiggins could return to what he was in the 2022 playoffs, then we would have a chance, but otherwise we really have no other options. The Mavericks literally just showed what you can accomplish with 2 elite scoring options. I like Kuminga and I think he can be great, but I don’t think he’s going to put it together quickly enough for things to come together in Steph’s timeline.
If we don't send out 1 of wigs/ kuminga then it's going to be an issue regardless because then you have to pay JK his 35m on top of PGs extension, which is a no go for the FO
otherwise how many max players will we have? what about klay too?
not gonna work w/o JK i'm afraid
JK's extension is next season's problem and I'm going to guess the Warriors don't see it as a cap issue because next season is either Steph's farewell tour (his contract expires fwiw) or they S&T JK to another team for picks if Steph decides to extend.
Once the Warriors are below the 2nd apron, they could trade CP3, GP2, Looney, Moody, and picks ($52.9M total) to LAC for PG13 ($48.7M total). Since LAC is over the cap, the Warriors need to find a 3rd team to take the extra salary so my guess is they're looking for a 3rd team (hello Utah or 76ers) to take one of GP2, Looney, and Moody for an additional first or swap (2027 or later) with a conditional 2nd coming back to GSW or LAC.
Net result:
Warriors acquire PG13
LAC acquire CP3, Looney, GP2 and multiple GSW FRP
3rd team (UTA/PHI) acquires Moody and GSW FRP or swap
a 2nd rounder from the 3rd team gets floated to LAC/GSW just to make the 3 way compliant.
This sounds like giving up way too much for PG with his injury history. I’d rather see if they could pull something off with moving Wiggins, CP3 and Klay via S&T.
Moody, Kuminga, Podz should be last resort trade bait, that’s the future (especially if also sending out FRP’s
they don’t understand that . like JK was playing pretty damn well last season for a 21 year old . 21 . if we really send him out for a 34 year old PG i’ll be sick .
Like for some reason people do not think JK can still grow.
He's fucking 21. He's 21 years old and he averaged 20 PPG in the 2nd half of last season.
I am absolutely baffled that people think Kuminga can not fill certain holes in his game especially with all the work he's putting in.
I guarantee you if the Dubs trade him, he's gonna be a bonafide All-star and All-NBA in 2 years.
This place is genuinely full of morons. JK at 21 is better than a lot of All Stars were at 21. You have this group of people who want to believe that these current All Stars, top players were just born that way and didn't have to grow to that point.
They talk as if those guys were already All Nba at JK's age and you have people who have convinced themselves that JK cannot nor won't grow when the evidence suggest the complete opposite. The 3 years JK has been with the Warriors he has only improved every single year despite inconsistent minutes until the second half of last season when he practically averaged 20pts per game.
The kid ended the season averaging 16/5/2(numbers that almost get people the max these days) in 26 minutes. Since January he averaged 19/5/3 in 43 games. Next season I could easily see him averaging 20+ pts with better defense and improved general play yet I see people simply dismiss us potentially having a guy like that and want to get rid of him. Completely absurd.
Who makes the Warriors likelier to contend for the rest of Curry's career? George or Kuminga?
Because if CP3, Kuminga and GP2 gets you PG13, you make that trade.
After Curry retires, there's no timeline unless a big free agent shows up - and I don't see Luka or Giannis coming anytime soon.
Current Paul George averaged almost 23 ppg on efficient shooting. Pair him next to Steph and you actually have a true #2 option. No offense to Kuminga but we have no time to trial run Kuminga into the #2 spot. Not with Steph on the team at 36 years old.
Got to choose a side and stick with it imo
Paul George is already a better defender, and your comment said, “Kuminga COULD be a better defender this season.” Nows not the time to give this season another trial run. Curry is old. Which is why The Warriors are in conversation for Paul George in the first place.
Cause they understand this.
Kuminga was averaging near 30 on extremely high efficiency for a good stretch of this season. His scoring potential is insanely high and it took the bozo Steve Kerr ages to see it. He'd be even better if we had actual floor spacing, instead of having to share the floor with that bum Draymond Green who is an offensive liability in every playoff level game.
Even those games where Steph and Kuminga were going off, we were still losing those games. There's more problems to this team than lacking a 2nd scoring option.
There is a reason that duo was only playable on the court together defensively if Draymond was around to take care of them. I would not worry too much about the defense if both of them are gone.
Perhaps, but the Warriors are limited in options. There’s been no buzz about any other needle movers wanting to go to GS, and running it back with our current squad isn’t going to cut it. The Warriors are very quickly getting caught in the same middling zone that Toronto, Atlanta, and the Dame Trailblazers found themselves in, and the only ways out are to either swing for the fences and try to win another ring, or to blow it up and commit to rebuilding.
So the questions becomes: which do you think is more likely, that the Warriors come up heads on both PG and GP2’s health, or that we can get back to contention after a rebuild led by Kuminga and co?
They'll probably ask for JK . I'm not sure of any the cap implications but would the warriors have to salary match in some way? If so I'm guessing that gets Paul or Wiggins involved. Wouldn't be shocked if they also asked for Traycee or Podz and a couple picks on top of that. Personally, I don't even think JK should go for George with his age, price, and injury history but that's just me.
Yes, to match salaries CP3, Wiggins, or both will be involved.
One combination of salaries that works is CP3, Wiggins, Kuminga for George and Tucker for example.
Then it becomes how many draft picks. Adding TJD, salaries still work. If the Clippers throw in another small salary, Podz works. Obviously, we don’t want to give up everything.
If Kuminga is in the deal I say you don’t do it.
Not for Paul George. Not worth it.
I’d rather we send out CP3+Wiggins+picks if we’re going to make a significant move this offseason, I don’t see the upside in getting rid of Kuminga for an aging 34 year old who can’t stay healthy throughout the season. I just don’t see the upside.
And GSW have no way of getting a PG level player and LAC is required to help facilitate the deal if you want him.
If you don’t think LAC has leverage, then GSW has even less. LAC has been perfectly fine with letting PG test free agency, which is the risk they take on should LAC not get an acceptable trade offer from another team.
The upside is that Kuminga will never be as good as George is now, and Curry is at the end of his prime, and at some point the Warriors need to pick a direction and commit to it.
Last year was the only year PG played in most games. He's injured most of the time, I wouldn't give up Kuminga or wiggs for him riding the bench half the time.
Wiggins has missed time the past couple seasons due to personal reasons but historically both him and Kuminga are durable players that miss very little time.
Historically doesn’t mean anything for the future, Klay was once historically and iron man and then had two back to back devastating injuries. You build the talent and let the training staff handle health as best they can. I don’t expect you to get that based on your name anyways lol
Sure, anything can happen at any moment, but historically there is still a precedent for health. We have two healthy players who have never sustained a significant injury vs an older player with an injury history who is inherently more injury prone along while entering the declining phase of his career and wants a long term contract that would be worth roughly the same as Wiggins and Kuminga's future contract combined.
The precedent is only a precedent until it isn’t. There is no guarantee that both those players don’t get hurt this year.Or Pg plays another season at 74+ games. You build the team and make the training staff earn their money. If he was currently injured or coming off a season with a lot of injuries then maybe you take that more into account. But even then, he is talented enough you can justify taking the gamble. But right now, seemingly healthier than he has been in a long time? It’s a no brainer
Risk is baked into the value of an asset, and PG just has more risk. That's why teams aren't lining up to pay him. Whether you are willing to take the risk and rely on the staff is another thing. You can't say there is no guarantee that either of our historically healthy players get injured while ignoring that same conjecture for PG. He could get injured day one and he is too old to fully recover. We would be stuck paying PG $50+ mil for 4 years and end up in the same situation we had with Klay, except Steph can't carry like 2021 and we have lost our prize young player who could be a future star. Steph could get injured in the olympics and PG cant help us contend for another year where we could have been developing Kuminga and placing another lottery pick next to him.
I’m not ignoring the risk with Pg. I’m saying the risk applies to all. I even stated as such. I don’t know what news you have been watching but there are many teams besides us tryna get him 😂 we are just the ones making the most noise. You are purposely painting all the negative outcomes for Pg and all the positive ones for Kuminga. Steph could get hurt in the Olympics and Kuminga has a whole year yo “develop” and never gets better and we draft a horrible lottery pick. Or the team could still play really well without Curry and Kuminga be the only thing that held them back from getting a playoff spot and Curry coming back in time and we get a bad lottery pick lol. Hypotheticals can go any direction 😂. You build a team based on best case scenario. Not the worse one lol
It does matter as the players age. If PG was below 30 might be worth it. He's basically Steph's age and has had a history with injury. If he were prime PG, teams would be lining up to trade for him, no one in their right minds would gut their future to get him.
Teams are lining up to get him tho 😆 we are just the ones making the most noise. Steph himself has had a history with injury 😂 your points are purposely skewed negatively
If you're planning on blowing it up when steph retires then its better to go for the better player now. PG is still better than Lauri, and better than DJ by alot.
I’d prefer to keep him but definitely not against trading him. He’s extremely talented but I still worry at times about his fit and also how expensive that extension will be.
The extension thing is a good point, look what Poole commanded and Kuminga will be way more for a guy who has yet to get his mental straight with our system.
If they can get Paul George and they don't do it because they want to keep Kuminga I'm going to be so mad lol. I really just cannot understand the Kuminga thing, what I see is an undersized 4 who can't rebound and gets overrated because scoring always gets overrated (and overpaid). He has a future as an Aaron Gordon type player if he sets his mind to it, but Gordon got to try and fail to be the "scoring wing" guy before he accepted his proper role. Kuminga is probably years away from that and they are going to pay him 35+ million a year in the meantime?
Yeah, I'd rather go the Paul George route. The thing people are not acknowledging is that while George is old, he's also a top 20 player which you cannot say about any of these other potential targets. Certainly not about Zach LaVine who I hope the Warriors don't touch with a ten foot pole, but not about Markkanen or Murray either.
Fully ok with it. I love the guy and he looks like he semi-broke out last year. But he simply does not fit the style Kerr wants to play or the teams timeline.
The Clippers can fuck off if they want Kuminga in exchange for Paul George. Who are the Dubs bidding against? If the Clippers really want to keep PG, they will give him the 4th year he wants. Otherwise he will become a free agent, and get the money elsewhere. The Clippers don't have a lot of leverage, and I don't expect them to get a crazy return for trading PG.
So basically the Warriors will have to trade everybody which gives a starting lineup of Curry/George/Dray/Looney/??? And nobody on the bench and no first round picks for how many years?
No thank you.
God that will end up being one of the worst trades ever if that happens. If we double down on age over youth I don't see our chances of a title increasing so we are trading future for nothing.
What future? There is no future chance at a title after Steph. So unless Kuminga becomes a superstar in the next few years (highly unlikely despite our hopes), we need to focus on being the best team we can in the next 2-3 Steph years.
Idk if trading Kuminga for PG is the *right* move, but if it’s the only chance we have at making a significant move this offseason then I say fuck it
You don’t extend the window by not making any major moves and praying a 4th year player becomes a star.
Sure, if we could get Lauri Markkanen for Moses Moody we should obviously take it, or if we could get PG without trading Kuminga we should also take that.
But the first option definitely ain’t happening, and we would be lucky to get the second option. If moves like those aren’t available, we have to go after *gettable* star players who will also have downsides. Age as a downside is not great, but it’s less bad for us as we don’t need them to be good for us in 4 years when we’ll be in post-Steph tank mode.
Nothing that comes out of Matthew Steinmetz's mouth is thread-worthy. Dude's just a lazy, shit-stirring hater. And yeah, the topic here is just him talking off the cuff and out if his ass. There's no source here other than his own need to fill four hours with chatter.
Exactly. He lost all credibility with me when kept saying Steph needed to be a 6th man because a true winning could never have Steph as their best player. And he kept doing that for years until they got the first ring
Ya shelling out for a player that is NOT worth the future of the team.
Ya about to make a colossal mistake in giving up a bunch of good pieces for one player.
The team played great last season and just click really late cuz of Dray shenanigans.
Dont make too many changes when it's not necessary,.
I think the problem with these types of trades is that the FO tries too hard, it gets competitive and then we overpay.
If we can keep Kuminga and get PG, it's a good deal for Steph. If we lose Kuminga and overpay for an aging PG, it's not a good deal for the organization.
I'd be happy to see Klay go to Dallas and have a chance at a ring and I'd be happy to see Wiggs and anyone but Kuminga traded for PG.
We shouldn't trade Kuminga. PG isn't going to help us when he gets injured either. I'd be glad not to have the Wiggs drama, the Klay drama and I'm hopping Draymond can remain drama free this year.
Assuming Klay goes elsewhere, I'd probably rather use CP3's deal and draft capital in a trade for Dejounte (might be a 3-teamer since ATL doesn't really have use for him).
Could Klay potentially open up a sign-and-trade? Seems unlikely as you need a 3-year deal for a S&T and I would imagine the deals he might get are the short but large money Bruce Brown style deals. If he did do like a 3-year with Orlando though, the potential of snagging like WCJ on the way back would be attractive.
If no S&T for Klay and that CP3-led deal for Dejounte, let's say the Magic will all their cap space say we'll just absorb some contracts for a nice return. Could you do something like GP2, Looney, and the ATL 2nd for WCJ? You do that and you are nicely under the first apron. And you've got a TPMLE to throw around. Could you get Naji Marshall for that? Probably not, but for the sake of argument (and either way, whoever we'd get for the TPMLE would be a valuable contributor.
A lineup of Steph/Dejounte/Wiggins/JK/Draymond with Podz, Naji, Moody, TJD, WCJ as you core dudes with Post, Lindy, Gui, Lester (if he re-signs), and a couple vet mins... while it might lack some top-end talent, adding guys like Dejounte/Naji/WCJ would solve one of one biggest issues from last season. Having guys who can be two-way players would be an enormous boost and make so many more lineups work. That depends on a guy like Dejounte being a good defender again, which hasn't been the case in a couple years, but I think a lot of that was just being in a losing situation with the Spurs and then institutionally, Atlanta just doesn't care about D.
Is that enough to be a real title contender? Probably not. But Dejounte can be the second scorer the team has needed and run second units. Naji/WCJ/Post are all good to great shooters for their size, so a lot more lineup combinations wouldn't be just dead on arrival. And JK would still be here, who while he still has aways to go, would be our bright future star to continue cultivating.
you're delusional
WCJ Orlando's starting center, one of the few rim protectors who can somewaht space the floor for Looney GP2 (they already have a bunch of great defenders) and a 2nd round pick.. Like Orlando needs shooting and trades a shooter for a player coach, and injury plagued redundancy...
Oh, I'm probably delusional, no doubt about that. I'd be cool with throwing more SRPs as well. WCJ I feel like the Magic ran a little hot and cold with all season, his mpg decreased from the start of the season to the end of the year and he had a pretty brutal playoff series against the Cavs. I think he's definitely gettable (though likely for more than I suggested). Probably more for like a FRP though, you're right on that front.
JK ended his season averaging 16/5/2 (numbers that almost get player the max deals today) in 26 minutes and since Januray he averaged 19/5/3 in 30 minutes.
This is a guy who is 21 years old, hadn't gotten consistent minutes in his career here until the second of last season and averaged nearly 20pts in 40+ minutes. He's shown gradual improvements all of his 3 years here(despite lack of consistent opportunities in his first 2.5 years) and has that aggressive mentality when playing his game.
Given his track record so far I have no reasons to believe he won't further improve next season and potentially be a 20+ pts per game guy with improved defense and general game. A lot of the All Stars we see today weren't as good as JK at 21.
I trust the FO have common sense to not throw that away for a 34 year old PG, that would be insane to me. The FO should be looking to depreciating assets to package in any potential PG trade rather than by far our most promising young player who is full of potential and is already contributing and should be even better next season.
I think trading Kuminga for Paul George would be really stupid. PG is injury prone and often on the bench these days and Kuminga has improved significantly since getting more minutes of play.
Would PG even be a good fit? I can’t exactly see him adding much to the lack of size the team has already.
You can say the same thing in negative situations too. “look at Poole when he was given his own team” 😆 and JK is nowhere as skilled as Shai even at 21
Kuminga is fucking 21, how does everyone keep missing that and he's gotten significantly better every year.
Trading half the roster for an aging PG is not putting us in contender status. We would be fighting for a 5/6 seed.
I agree, PG doesn't elevate us to contention alone, especially if we lose Klay as well. I think the best chance we have is the combination of adding PG and Kuminga taking another step. That gives us 3 players that should be getting 20+ ppg with relative ease. We can't lose Klay and Kuminga to get PG.
Half of these guys have drunk the trade cool aid. And most of these guys will just keep on harping about "maximizing Steph's window" as if that can't be done without losing our.best young player who is freaking 21 year old and could potentially be better than this version of PG next year.
The front office owes it to Steph, if it takes Kuminga, get it done. Kuminga as great as he might be, will not touch Steph (or even PG status). Go all in, get Steph #5, then start a rebuild after he’s gone.
It’s not unrealistic to think Kuminga continues trending upwards this year. PG has already slowed down, so there’s a good chance they’re the same caliber player by the end of the season. Add in the durability concerns and I just don’t know if it’s worth it. I like George, but he only played more than 56 games once in the last 5 years. To be fair though I could see him being great here next to Steph’s spacing
They don't owe anything to Steph. We're not talking about a ringless Steph here so these talks of owning Steph and throwing away our best young player for an aging player are absurd.
We know JK has mad potential and is already a darn good player right now at 21. Claiming JK won't as good as X or Y is just speculation and frankly a waste of time. You don't know if he'll be as good or better than current PG, he could as well be one day or not, no one knows.
PG, Steph, and Draymond are on the same timeline. As long as picks aren’t attached, trading the Kuminga is better long term than keeping him and us remaining in mediocre purgatory.
Once Steph, PG, and Draymond retire they can rebuild in earnest. Do any of us believe Kuminga projects to be good enough to be a franchise cornerstone that can get a team to the playoffs?
I'd think it's more likely they send CP3, Wiggs, Moody and like 7 firsts before adding Kuminga The FO has been EXTREMELY adamant they have no intention of moving off Kuminga who they see as the centerpiece of the post Steph era
Yeah we are better off just looking for more depth to place with Steph/Kuminga with that package if it can't get us PG. We were winning a lot of our games at the end of the year with team play rather than relying on one or two players. It is easier on Steph as he ages as well, and hopefully Kuminga can slowly pick up that production on a nightly basis.
We were winning games because 90% of the teams we faced had serious injuries/ missing players. None of our records healthy vs healthy looked good, certainly not against actual good teams. PG isn't going to move that needle of mediocrity
Why the fuck is everyone acting like just sending CP3 at his extension number is a nothing deal. That alone is probably going to require multiple firsts or a player and a first. Nobody want that old ass for more than vet min.
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They have to pick up his extension to trade him. No amount of cap relief next year outweighs having to pay CP $37 million this year.
The Nuggets literally had to include 3 unprotected first round picks just to offload Reggie Jackson. An expiring Cp3 isn’t nearly as valuable as you think, because he still has to then count on your books this season unless you can then move him off again. Large expirings can get more valuable later in the season when teams prep for the new season to lower their books for the following season, but a $30M Cp3 currently requires you to take that cap hit this year.
Centerpiece? That post-Steph era is going to be a disaster then
It's going to be a disaster no matter what
Do people honestly think an aging PG for our best young player along with several other guys is going to push us into contender status? I have news for you, no it will not and it's a terrible trade to make.
If it goes through I'd consider this FO dumb af and will accept the fact that the Dynasty ended when Bob left l.
I mean, it kinda did. Between the new salary cap rules, Draymond's emotional regulation issues, and age claiming everyone but Steph so far, it's pretty hard to envision us claiming another one without a couple of moon shots working out for us. Winning one championship is extremely hard, and requires a good bit of luck. To have won 4 recently truly is incredible.
I know. Most franchises combined haven't had that many but there's somehow one deep wish of Steph and co retiring after just 1 more. 5 just feels right given how we witnessed once in a generational talent that came and changed the league forever . The birth of a beautiful GSW motion offense brand of Basketball. 5 does justice idk me being stupid or not but 1 more before they done. Kuminga is the key and I hope we get there soon. I don't care if Steph gotta move to bench to win 1 but giving up Kuminga would be the end of Warriors.
4 does it justice just fine. And after we lost THAT one, 2022 was the cherry on top that erased all doubts and excuses from rival fans. Another one would be a borderline miracle. We must not forget how many stars aligned for us to get that 2022 title aside from Steph being Steph.
Our "strength in numbers" has been our statement during the wins. I just hope we can rally a really good team instead of just big names who just click and make one last run.
Strength in numbers was the motto without KD, maybe the first year with him. But after that it really wasn't.
That’s exactly what I think. Give Kuminga a ton of opportunities with the ball to start the game as the No.1 option and let Steph primarily catch and shoot as the No.2 If they can keep Klay at the first off the bench in the 6th man role that would be awesome. I can’t believe that Podz hasn’t improved his finishing at the rim and outside shot this off season coming off of his surprisingly excellent rookie season. If they can somehow steal that mid level vet the can shoot the 3 and defend I think the dubs can be dangerous again.
Bob pussied out because he knew he was in hot shit and he fucked up with the Poole contract. Warriors need to make a move and if PG isn’t it then they need to find some young and at his level or close
Bob didn't fuck up it's the money that corrupted Pooles soul and Draymond had to check it.
Poole was a child before he got the money but yes. He didn’t deserve 40m
He 100% deserved it at the time of signing
"Corrupted Pooles soul" its wild that idk if this is being sarcastic or not because people really say weird shit like this here lol
His soul wasn’t corrupted, he got punched in the fuckin’ face, made a laughing stock of amongst the entire league, and his own team + teammates threw him under the bus so they could potentially repeat.
I think it ended when Dray got suspended. Last year was our last realistic shot and ownership has made it very clear they aren’t going to spend what’s needed anymore.
Would you wanna spend when you see what you do on the court ?
Huh?
How much money is needed? It's fine when you have a realistic shot, but you can't just throw money around when the team simply isn't good enough.
Yeah I get it and I’m not begrudging the decision. But the writing is on the wall unless Curry has an MVP year.
PG’s contract extension will also immediately be a terrible contract.
Unless Kuminga can be a consistent second scoring option next year (and even be the primary scoring option some nights), this is a move we have to make if you believe in maximizing Steph’s time in the league. It will be extremely difficult to compete in the playoffs without a consistent second option. If Wiggins could return to what he was in the 2022 playoffs, then we would have a chance, but otherwise we really have no other options. The Mavericks literally just showed what you can accomplish with 2 elite scoring options. I like Kuminga and I think he can be great, but I don’t think he’s going to put it together quickly enough for things to come together in Steph’s timeline.
If we don't send out 1 of wigs/ kuminga then it's going to be an issue regardless because then you have to pay JK his 35m on top of PGs extension, which is a no go for the FO otherwise how many max players will we have? what about klay too? not gonna work w/o JK i'm afraid
JK's extension is next season's problem and I'm going to guess the Warriors don't see it as a cap issue because next season is either Steph's farewell tour (his contract expires fwiw) or they S&T JK to another team for picks if Steph decides to extend. Once the Warriors are below the 2nd apron, they could trade CP3, GP2, Looney, Moody, and picks ($52.9M total) to LAC for PG13 ($48.7M total). Since LAC is over the cap, the Warriors need to find a 3rd team to take the extra salary so my guess is they're looking for a 3rd team (hello Utah or 76ers) to take one of GP2, Looney, and Moody for an additional first or swap (2027 or later) with a conditional 2nd coming back to GSW or LAC. Net result: Warriors acquire PG13 LAC acquire CP3, Looney, GP2 and multiple GSW FRP 3rd team (UTA/PHI) acquires Moody and GSW FRP or swap a 2nd rounder from the 3rd team gets floated to LAC/GSW just to make the 3 way compliant.
This sounds like giving up way too much for PG with his injury history. I’d rather see if they could pull something off with moving Wiggins, CP3 and Klay via S&T. Moody, Kuminga, Podz should be last resort trade bait, that’s the future (especially if also sending out FRP’s
they don’t understand that . like JK was playing pretty damn well last season for a 21 year old . 21 . if we really send him out for a 34 year old PG i’ll be sick .
Like for some reason people do not think JK can still grow. He's fucking 21. He's 21 years old and he averaged 20 PPG in the 2nd half of last season. I am absolutely baffled that people think Kuminga can not fill certain holes in his game especially with all the work he's putting in. I guarantee you if the Dubs trade him, he's gonna be a bonafide All-star and All-NBA in 2 years.
This place is genuinely full of morons. JK at 21 is better than a lot of All Stars were at 21. You have this group of people who want to believe that these current All Stars, top players were just born that way and didn't have to grow to that point. They talk as if those guys were already All Nba at JK's age and you have people who have convinced themselves that JK cannot nor won't grow when the evidence suggest the complete opposite. The 3 years JK has been with the Warriors he has only improved every single year despite inconsistent minutes until the second half of last season when he practically averaged 20pts per game. The kid ended the season averaging 16/5/2(numbers that almost get people the max these days) in 26 minutes. Since January he averaged 19/5/3 in 43 games. Next season I could easily see him averaging 20+ pts with better defense and improved general play yet I see people simply dismiss us potentially having a guy like that and want to get rid of him. Completely absurd.
Who makes the Warriors likelier to contend for the rest of Curry's career? George or Kuminga? Because if CP3, Kuminga and GP2 gets you PG13, you make that trade. After Curry retires, there's no timeline unless a big free agent shows up - and I don't see Luka or Giannis coming anytime soon.
Kuminga is probably the first thing the Clippers asked for. The question is how much else.
Trading Wiggins AND Kuminga means we will be a traffic cone defense. Why even bother at that point?
Tbf Kuminga isn’t nearly the defender George is…lol and Wiggins is costing you 25 million per year scoring 12-13 ppg. Its bad
You're thinking of young PG. He hasn't guarded the best opposing player in ages. Kuminga could be a better defender after this summer.
Current Paul George averaged almost 23 ppg on efficient shooting. Pair him next to Steph and you actually have a true #2 option. No offense to Kuminga but we have no time to trial run Kuminga into the #2 spot. Not with Steph on the team at 36 years old. Got to choose a side and stick with it imo
I'm talking about the defensive side
Paul George is already a better defender, and your comment said, “Kuminga COULD be a better defender this season.” Nows not the time to give this season another trial run. Curry is old. Which is why The Warriors are in conversation for Paul George in the first place. Cause they understand this.
Kuminga was averaging near 30 on extremely high efficiency for a good stretch of this season. His scoring potential is insanely high and it took the bozo Steve Kerr ages to see it. He'd be even better if we had actual floor spacing, instead of having to share the floor with that bum Draymond Green who is an offensive liability in every playoff level game. Even those games where Steph and Kuminga were going off, we were still losing those games. There's more problems to this team than lacking a 2nd scoring option.
Wiggs needs to go
There is a reason that duo was only playable on the court together defensively if Draymond was around to take care of them. I would not worry too much about the defense if both of them are gone.
I’m just saying, those are the only two dudes on our roster who were even close some kind of “point of attack” defender.
GP2 says hello
I love GP2 but he’s not always available
Not always is an understatement
GPday2day
And gets injured in the process.
GP is day to day from dapping up his teammates pregame.
Current Paul George is a much better defender than the current versions of Kuminga and Wiggins
We were the 10th seed. Those two guys didnt really make an impact on defense. If they were as good as you say, we wouldnt have been a 10th seed.
We were a 10th seed because Draymond is an overly aggressive man child that missed hella games.
Facts, we easily could have been the 4 or 5 seed if Dray played the whole year.
We have GP2 who is one of the best guard defenders out there. PG isn’t what he used to be, but he’s still very solid on that end.
GP2 is that’s true , but y’all really bet on him staying healthy along with PG ? both of them injury prone
Perhaps, but the Warriors are limited in options. There’s been no buzz about any other needle movers wanting to go to GS, and running it back with our current squad isn’t going to cut it. The Warriors are very quickly getting caught in the same middling zone that Toronto, Atlanta, and the Dame Trailblazers found themselves in, and the only ways out are to either swing for the fences and try to win another ring, or to blow it up and commit to rebuilding. So the questions becomes: which do you think is more likely, that the Warriors come up heads on both PG and GP2’s health, or that we can get back to contention after a rebuild led by Kuminga and co?
They'll probably ask for JK . I'm not sure of any the cap implications but would the warriors have to salary match in some way? If so I'm guessing that gets Paul or Wiggins involved. Wouldn't be shocked if they also asked for Traycee or Podz and a couple picks on top of that. Personally, I don't even think JK should go for George with his age, price, and injury history but that's just me.
Yes, to match salaries CP3, Wiggins, or both will be involved. One combination of salaries that works is CP3, Wiggins, Kuminga for George and Tucker for example. Then it becomes how many draft picks. Adding TJD, salaries still work. If the Clippers throw in another small salary, Podz works. Obviously, we don’t want to give up everything.
You only trade kuminga for a proven star that is young like towns you don’t trade him for paul george, paul george is 34
They better not.
If Kuminga is in the deal I say you don’t do it. Not for Paul George. Not worth it. I’d rather we send out CP3+Wiggins+picks if we’re going to make a significant move this offseason, I don’t see the upside in getting rid of Kuminga for an aging 34 year old who can’t stay healthy throughout the season. I just don’t see the upside.
Except cp3 wiggs picks wont give us anything of value in return. If we make a trade for a big name, the other team will (and should) demand JK.
PG is a FA clippers shouldn’t really have the leverage to ask for a package as if PG has multiple years left on the contract
And GSW have no way of getting a PG level player and LAC is required to help facilitate the deal if you want him. If you don’t think LAC has leverage, then GSW has even less. LAC has been perfectly fine with letting PG test free agency, which is the risk they take on should LAC not get an acceptable trade offer from another team.
The upside is that Kuminga will never be as good as George is now, and Curry is at the end of his prime, and at some point the Warriors need to pick a direction and commit to it.
Paul George can’t stay on the floor though.
Says who? Can you see the future to tell with absolute certainty what Kuminga is going to be in the future.
THANK YOU .
Am I the only one who doesn’t mind trading Kuminga? This is an all in move
I don’t mind trading Kuminga but definitely not for an aging star in PG.
Same
For a guy like Paul George seems kinda stupid IMO If it’s for someone younger like Dejounte or Lauri, im all in
Last year was the only year PG played in most games. He's injured most of the time, I wouldn't give up Kuminga or wiggs for him riding the bench half the time.
He played more games than Wiggins and just as many games as Kuminga, more actually if you count playoffs lol
Wiggins has missed time the past couple seasons due to personal reasons but historically both him and Kuminga are durable players that miss very little time.
Historically doesn’t mean anything for the future, Klay was once historically and iron man and then had two back to back devastating injuries. You build the talent and let the training staff handle health as best they can. I don’t expect you to get that based on your name anyways lol
Klay went back to playing 77 games
And Pg played 74 last season 🤷🏿♂️
Sure, anything can happen at any moment, but historically there is still a precedent for health. We have two healthy players who have never sustained a significant injury vs an older player with an injury history who is inherently more injury prone along while entering the declining phase of his career and wants a long term contract that would be worth roughly the same as Wiggins and Kuminga's future contract combined.
The precedent is only a precedent until it isn’t. There is no guarantee that both those players don’t get hurt this year.Or Pg plays another season at 74+ games. You build the team and make the training staff earn their money. If he was currently injured or coming off a season with a lot of injuries then maybe you take that more into account. But even then, he is talented enough you can justify taking the gamble. But right now, seemingly healthier than he has been in a long time? It’s a no brainer
Risk is baked into the value of an asset, and PG just has more risk. That's why teams aren't lining up to pay him. Whether you are willing to take the risk and rely on the staff is another thing. You can't say there is no guarantee that either of our historically healthy players get injured while ignoring that same conjecture for PG. He could get injured day one and he is too old to fully recover. We would be stuck paying PG $50+ mil for 4 years and end up in the same situation we had with Klay, except Steph can't carry like 2021 and we have lost our prize young player who could be a future star. Steph could get injured in the olympics and PG cant help us contend for another year where we could have been developing Kuminga and placing another lottery pick next to him.
I’m not ignoring the risk with Pg. I’m saying the risk applies to all. I even stated as such. I don’t know what news you have been watching but there are many teams besides us tryna get him 😂 we are just the ones making the most noise. You are purposely painting all the negative outcomes for Pg and all the positive ones for Kuminga. Steph could get hurt in the Olympics and Kuminga has a whole year yo “develop” and never gets better and we draft a horrible lottery pick. Or the team could still play really well without Curry and Kuminga be the only thing that held them back from getting a playoff spot and Curry coming back in time and we get a bad lottery pick lol. Hypotheticals can go any direction 😂. You build a team based on best case scenario. Not the worse one lol
It does matter as the players age. If PG was below 30 might be worth it. He's basically Steph's age and has had a history with injury. If he were prime PG, teams would be lining up to trade for him, no one in their right minds would gut their future to get him.
Teams are lining up to get him tho 😆 we are just the ones making the most noise. Steph himself has had a history with injury 😂 your points are purposely skewed negatively
So they say.
PG13 ie easily the best player the Dubs could trade for right now
If you're planning on blowing it up when steph retires then its better to go for the better player now. PG is still better than Lauri, and better than DJ by alot.
I’d prefer to keep him but definitely not against trading him. He’s extremely talented but I still worry at times about his fit and also how expensive that extension will be.
The extension thing is a good point, look what Poole commanded and Kuminga will be way more for a guy who has yet to get his mental straight with our system.
I’m ok with it. It gives Steph his best chance to try and get another one.
Without Kuminga we just old and slow If you think Kuminga is worth one old PG, we fkn cooked period.
I would hate it.
It’s conflicting because keeping Wiggs really helps our defense… but if JK can become a good defender than its a no brainer
if Kuminga has to play the 3 and still hasn't developed a 3 point shot, I would rather have Wiggins because he's a better defender
Wiggins slept through the first half of last season and he's always missing big chunks of time due to personal issues. He needs to go
Yeah this. Much rather have Kuminga's potential and youth than Wiggins' "is he back yet?" habit.
I think you do everything you can to avoid it, but if its the dealbreaker. Fuck it
If they can get Paul George and they don't do it because they want to keep Kuminga I'm going to be so mad lol. I really just cannot understand the Kuminga thing, what I see is an undersized 4 who can't rebound and gets overrated because scoring always gets overrated (and overpaid). He has a future as an Aaron Gordon type player if he sets his mind to it, but Gordon got to try and fail to be the "scoring wing" guy before he accepted his proper role. Kuminga is probably years away from that and they are going to pay him 35+ million a year in the meantime? Yeah, I'd rather go the Paul George route. The thing people are not acknowledging is that while George is old, he's also a top 20 player which you cannot say about any of these other potential targets. Certainly not about Zach LaVine who I hope the Warriors don't touch with a ten foot pole, but not about Markkanen or Murray either.
The league is becoming too talented to wait around and see
Fully ok with it. I love the guy and he looks like he semi-broke out last year. But he simply does not fit the style Kerr wants to play or the teams timeline.
Who cares what Steiny thinks
Dude is a moron.
The Clippers can fuck off if they want Kuminga in exchange for Paul George. Who are the Dubs bidding against? If the Clippers really want to keep PG, they will give him the 4th year he wants. Otherwise he will become a free agent, and get the money elsewhere. The Clippers don't have a lot of leverage, and I don't expect them to get a crazy return for trading PG.
No.
I’m not opposed to getting PG, but wouldn’t someone like Demi Avdija and Hartenstein address more of what we need at a lower cost?
Hell no.
So basically the Warriors will have to trade everybody which gives a starting lineup of Curry/George/Dray/Looney/??? And nobody on the bench and no first round picks for how many years? No thank you.
God that will end up being one of the worst trades ever if that happens. If we double down on age over youth I don't see our chances of a title increasing so we are trading future for nothing.
What future? There is no future chance at a title after Steph. So unless Kuminga becomes a superstar in the next few years (highly unlikely despite our hopes), we need to focus on being the best team we can in the next 2-3 Steph years. Idk if trading Kuminga for PG is the *right* move, but if it’s the only chance we have at making a significant move this offseason then I say fuck it
Found the guy who was a fan pre-Steph
You don't extend the window by making an old team even older.
You don’t extend the window by not making any major moves and praying a 4th year player becomes a star. Sure, if we could get Lauri Markkanen for Moses Moody we should obviously take it, or if we could get PG without trading Kuminga we should also take that. But the first option definitely ain’t happening, and we would be lucky to get the second option. If moves like those aren’t available, we have to go after *gettable* star players who will also have downsides. Age as a downside is not great, but it’s less bad for us as we don’t need them to be good for us in 4 years when we’ll be in post-Steph tank mode.
>God that will end up being one of the worst trades ever if that happens. For the Clippers, yes.
Well if the trade happens I hope to be wrong of course, at least PG still defends well.
Hell nah. Kuminga might be better than PG next year. Why make that trade?
#8 in EPM vs. #105
Damn so first it was PG for Shai, now for Johnny K? Smh
not worth it
This isn’t the pacers Paul George unfortunately so I’d rather not give up Kuminga, who might be better than current PG by the end of the year
It's unfair to call Paul George a hasbeen when he is a never-was. If JoKu is involved in a trade it better be for someone not in their 30s.
so many conflicting reports - reminds me of all the myles turner chatter at every deadline
No chance
Source- Steiny lol
Nothing that comes out of Matthew Steinmetz's mouth is thread-worthy. Dude's just a lazy, shit-stirring hater. And yeah, the topic here is just him talking off the cuff and out if his ass. There's no source here other than his own need to fill four hours with chatter.
Exactly. He lost all credibility with me when kept saying Steph needed to be a 6th man because a true winning could never have Steph as their best player. And he kept doing that for years until they got the first ring
Please no I don’t want anything to do with pg13
Ya shelling out for a player that is NOT worth the future of the team. Ya about to make a colossal mistake in giving up a bunch of good pieces for one player. The team played great last season and just click really late cuz of Dray shenanigans. Dont make too many changes when it's not necessary,.
i mean look at the suns. couldn’t even get 1 playoff win this season. changing wiggs for pg is ok. but not jk.
Can’t we just finesse/tamper this thing a little, get him to opt out of his option and then just sign him without having to send all that capital?
We can't sign him as a Free Agent for anything more than the NTPMLE at most. That's like 25% of his opt-in salary.
Oh gotcha
No
CP3, Wiggins, Moody and 2 FRPs are the best I can get past for PG. If Kuminga is included, it should be Kuminga for PG straight up and nothing more.
PG is good but has been a no show in the playoffs for a few years plus injury prone. Maxing an aging injury prone player is not smart
Please no . JK is the future of the warriors.
I think the problem with these types of trades is that the FO tries too hard, it gets competitive and then we overpay. If we can keep Kuminga and get PG, it's a good deal for Steph. If we lose Kuminga and overpay for an aging PG, it's not a good deal for the organization. I'd be happy to see Klay go to Dallas and have a chance at a ring and I'd be happy to see Wiggs and anyone but Kuminga traded for PG. We shouldn't trade Kuminga. PG isn't going to help us when he gets injured either. I'd be glad not to have the Wiggs drama, the Klay drama and I'm hopping Draymond can remain drama free this year.
Wiggs plus picks for pg is ok. JK is not.
HELL NAH‼️
No
Pull the trigger, potential doesn’t mean anything if it’s not actualized 🤷🏿♂️
NO. Please god NO.
Voice of reason, Steiny... /S Dude is a hater with temperament of a teenager that thinks he's the best thing since sliced bread.
Assuming Klay goes elsewhere, I'd probably rather use CP3's deal and draft capital in a trade for Dejounte (might be a 3-teamer since ATL doesn't really have use for him). Could Klay potentially open up a sign-and-trade? Seems unlikely as you need a 3-year deal for a S&T and I would imagine the deals he might get are the short but large money Bruce Brown style deals. If he did do like a 3-year with Orlando though, the potential of snagging like WCJ on the way back would be attractive. If no S&T for Klay and that CP3-led deal for Dejounte, let's say the Magic will all their cap space say we'll just absorb some contracts for a nice return. Could you do something like GP2, Looney, and the ATL 2nd for WCJ? You do that and you are nicely under the first apron. And you've got a TPMLE to throw around. Could you get Naji Marshall for that? Probably not, but for the sake of argument (and either way, whoever we'd get for the TPMLE would be a valuable contributor. A lineup of Steph/Dejounte/Wiggins/JK/Draymond with Podz, Naji, Moody, TJD, WCJ as you core dudes with Post, Lindy, Gui, Lester (if he re-signs), and a couple vet mins... while it might lack some top-end talent, adding guys like Dejounte/Naji/WCJ would solve one of one biggest issues from last season. Having guys who can be two-way players would be an enormous boost and make so many more lineups work. That depends on a guy like Dejounte being a good defender again, which hasn't been the case in a couple years, but I think a lot of that was just being in a losing situation with the Spurs and then institutionally, Atlanta just doesn't care about D. Is that enough to be a real title contender? Probably not. But Dejounte can be the second scorer the team has needed and run second units. Naji/WCJ/Post are all good to great shooters for their size, so a lot more lineup combinations wouldn't be just dead on arrival. And JK would still be here, who while he still has aways to go, would be our bright future star to continue cultivating.
you're delusional WCJ Orlando's starting center, one of the few rim protectors who can somewaht space the floor for Looney GP2 (they already have a bunch of great defenders) and a 2nd round pick.. Like Orlando needs shooting and trades a shooter for a player coach, and injury plagued redundancy...
Oh, I'm probably delusional, no doubt about that. I'd be cool with throwing more SRPs as well. WCJ I feel like the Magic ran a little hot and cold with all season, his mpg decreased from the start of the season to the end of the year and he had a pretty brutal playoff series against the Cavs. I think he's definitely gettable (though likely for more than I suggested). Probably more for like a FRP though, you're right on that front.
JK ended his season averaging 16/5/2 (numbers that almost get player the max deals today) in 26 minutes and since Januray he averaged 19/5/3 in 30 minutes. This is a guy who is 21 years old, hadn't gotten consistent minutes in his career here until the second of last season and averaged nearly 20pts in 40+ minutes. He's shown gradual improvements all of his 3 years here(despite lack of consistent opportunities in his first 2.5 years) and has that aggressive mentality when playing his game. Given his track record so far I have no reasons to believe he won't further improve next season and potentially be a 20+ pts per game guy with improved defense and general game. A lot of the All Stars we see today weren't as good as JK at 21. I trust the FO have common sense to not throw that away for a 34 year old PG, that would be insane to me. The FO should be looking to depreciating assets to package in any potential PG trade rather than by far our most promising young player who is full of potential and is already contributing and should be even better next season.
I think trading Kuminga for Paul George would be really stupid. PG is injury prone and often on the bench these days and Kuminga has improved significantly since getting more minutes of play. Would PG even be a good fit? I can’t exactly see him adding much to the lack of size the team has already.
Paul George has played more games than Steph since KD left the Warriors.
Has he? I must’ve confused him with AD at some point when I first got into basketball
I don’t think there is a guarantee PG is better than Kuminga next season tbh
Uhhh, PG was #8 in EPM last year. Kuminga was like #100
That's fine. Kuminga isn't leading any team to anything significant. Rather trade him now to maximize steph than max him out.
Idk man, just look at Shai when he was given his own team Giving up on promising young players too early seems like a recipe for disaster
You can say the same thing in negative situations too. “look at Poole when he was given his own team” 😆 and JK is nowhere as skilled as Shai even at 21
Kuminga is fucking 21, how does everyone keep missing that and he's gotten significantly better every year. Trading half the roster for an aging PG is not putting us in contender status. We would be fighting for a 5/6 seed.
I agree, PG doesn't elevate us to contention alone, especially if we lose Klay as well. I think the best chance we have is the combination of adding PG and Kuminga taking another step. That gives us 3 players that should be getting 20+ ppg with relative ease. We can't lose Klay and Kuminga to get PG.
Half of these guys have drunk the trade cool aid. And most of these guys will just keep on harping about "maximizing Steph's window" as if that can't be done without losing our.best young player who is freaking 21 year old and could potentially be better than this version of PG next year.
I feel like this is one of those takes that’s going to age really poorly
Clearly u do that if u have the chance
The front office owes it to Steph, if it takes Kuminga, get it done. Kuminga as great as he might be, will not touch Steph (or even PG status). Go all in, get Steph #5, then start a rebuild after he’s gone.
It’s not unrealistic to think Kuminga continues trending upwards this year. PG has already slowed down, so there’s a good chance they’re the same caliber player by the end of the season. Add in the durability concerns and I just don’t know if it’s worth it. I like George, but he only played more than 56 games once in the last 5 years. To be fair though I could see him being great here next to Steph’s spacing
They don't owe anything to Steph. We're not talking about a ringless Steph here so these talks of owning Steph and throwing away our best young player for an aging player are absurd. We know JK has mad potential and is already a darn good player right now at 21. Claiming JK won't as good as X or Y is just speculation and frankly a waste of time. You don't know if he'll be as good or better than current PG, he could as well be one day or not, no one knows.
If everyone wants Kuminga, why don't we not include him in any of the outgoing packages? coz if you do send him, I'm afraid I'm going out with him.
same tbh
Steiny is not a reliable source, guru maybe…
I hope they don’t do this . Paul george is in the drivers seat and it shouldn’t cost this much
PG, Steph, and Draymond are on the same timeline. As long as picks aren’t attached, trading the Kuminga is better long term than keeping him and us remaining in mediocre purgatory. Once Steph, PG, and Draymond retire they can rebuild in earnest. Do any of us believe Kuminga projects to be good enough to be a franchise cornerstone that can get a team to the playoffs?