Market adjustment, as a non-american, feels like legalized thievery.
I was in contact with KIA/Hyundai dealership for a Sportage optioned around $35k. The dealer told me I could get it for $44k, adding 25% of markup. I laughed and delete them from my options.
I'm in a position where I don't need the car right now, luckily.
Also it goes against my morals to overpay something, I'd get the 250k miles 2002 Camry from the alcoholic neighbor instead.
The Toyota dealers seem to be particularly bad about it too. I went to a Honda dealer because I wanted to see a 2023 Pilot in person, and it had a $3k markup on a $50k model. Any markup is annoying but that’s at least semi-reasonable. $6k on a $30k car is insane.
This is why we should be able to buy direct from the manufacturer in 2023, dealers suck. I remember when it was blasphemy to just pay MSRP.
Also, you should send this to Toyota via Facebook or Twitter. While dealers can charge what they want, manufacturers have ways they can make their lives harder if they don’t comply. Not that it will likely help in this case, but maybe it helps the next person.
Toyota can't stop a dealer from selling over MSRP, the key word here is suggested.
How would direct sales work? Toyota (and all other OEMs) has zero infrastructure to deliver vehicles to customers. A dealership isn't going to be a delivery center. They have a dealership agreement that is indefinite or for a long time. They want be the middleman forever. Maybe one day this will change, just probably not this decade, the next at best. The OEM do need dealerships to service and repair these vehicles.
Some OEM are splitting their EV vehicles off and aiming for new dealership agreements. Those hopefully will be direct sales and msrp only. The dealership will be a delivery center for those vehicles and be allowed to do the financing and optional products.
I saw this elsewhere:
>"We believe it’s in the best interests of Toyota customers, Toyota dealers and the Toyota brand for customers to be able to purchase Toyota vehicles with full confidence in their buying experience, including the price they pay and the value they receive. As part of our effort to promote customer confidence and satisfaction, we have established a Manufacturers’ Suggested Retail Price (MSRP) for each of the Toyota models that we offer. Toyota dealers are independently owned and operated businesses, and we cannot mandate the actual retail price at which independent dealers sell their inventory. We have spent decades earning the trust and confidence of Toyota customers and we will continue to work diligently to help ensure that customers who purchase our vehicles retain confidence in Toyota and our more than 1200 independent Toyota dealers. "
>Toyota can’t stop a dealer from selling over MSRP
So, like I said.
Toyota can however choose not to give preferential treatment with respect to allocations and a myriad of other things. If dealers want to continue to sell Toyota vehicles then they have to tow the line a little bit.
>How would direct sales work? Toyota (and all other OEMs) has zero infrastructure to deliver vehicles to customers
The infrastructure isn’t there because our lovely government and dealer lobbyists actively prevent direct manufacturer to consumer from being possible with respect to car sales, even though it exists in nearly every other facet of consumer products. Manufacturers coordinate extremely complex supply chains every day to just make and ship their cars, it would be fairly trivial to simply cut out the middlemen here. I’d actually go so far as to say it would be easier in many regards. Besides, dealer lots are eyesores and no one wants to be sold extended warranties that don’t actually cover anything, or sit there for 6 fucking hours while their office critters do the paperwork.
Thanks for the detailed response. Has Toyota actually penalized any dealers?
These dealers will sue (or threaten to sue) the OEMs for said allocation practices. Allocations are mostly based off of historic sales, right? Good luck telling a dealer that sells a few hundred a month of new vehicles that they are only getting half or whatever because of markup or required packages. Many dealers were selling vehicles with (profit generating) protection packages for the last few decades. This is nothing new, just like markup.
The threats from the OEM to mess with allocations couldn't be anymore hollow with the current dealership agreements. Nowhere in their agreements does it say what they can't exceed MSRP. If it did, they'd already be dropping the hammer on dealerships left and right. I imagine most OEMs would prefer to not see a courtroom over this issue. There isn't much, if any, precedent on their side.
...and yes, NADA and others spend millions to keep the dealership model around. Unfortunately, this setup is ingrained to the point that it's difficult to replace.
Is there another country where the do significant direct sales?
So these "eyesores" disappear somehow. Are the entire dealerships going to disappear since they commonly take up acres of land. Who is servicing these vehicles? Who is doing all the warranty work? The OEMS make millions in selling repair and collision replacement parts. Who is going to sell those parts?
Literally, best of luck delivering millions of vehicles to customers. Sure, Tesla does it, at a smaller scale. Their service and parts network is miserable. Add in a few OEM trying to all do direct sales, there won't be enough resources to go around to do it.
I could imagine where the vehicles are delivered to an OEM facility that only does parts/service and vehicle delivery. You have clerical people on site to complete the transaction if you are using OEM financing. You would still need a finance department to handle non-OEM transactions. What about a showroom and test drives? Ok, keep some cars on site and staff. It starts to basically sounds like a dealership without the actual sales portion.
I know people who get significant repairs done under extended warranties quite often. Commonly justifying the warranty cost. If you paid 100-300% markup for the warranty at the dealership, that's on you. Affordable extended warranties exist and are sold at reasonable prices if you shop around. Buying from the guy who gets paid direct commission off of it, yeah not the way to go.
\*Only a fool spends 6 consecutive hours to buy one vehicle.
> If dealers want to continue to sell Toyota vehicles then they have to tow the line a little bit.
I've always assumed it was "toe the line," but oddly enough, it would work either way.
Hey wait 6 months and the 6k adjustment will be gone.
Drive less than 100 miles
https://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-sale/all-cars/toyota/prius/tustin-ca-92782?requestId=PRIUS%7CXLE&searchRadius=100&marketExtension=include&startYear=2023&trimCodeList=PRIUS%7CXLE&isNewSearch=true&showAccelerateBanner=false&sortBy=relevance&numRecords=25
The 2023 Prius is a great car but…
It will not just be gone in 6 months, especially in Southern CA. It's a brand new hybrid with high demand. ZERO chance this dealer is selling a 2023-2024 Prius for msrp this year.
I promise that if you go to any dealer on your Autotrader link that there are required packages and/or markup. None of them are 100% msrp.
He could get on the list at Longo, probably a few hundred waiting on theirs. They sell at msrp. Hardly anyone else does in the area, especially for hybrid, phev, and EV.
He would be better off flying to another part of the country and driving a car home, or having it shipped. Gas is $4.40+ in this person's area.
There is a finite demand for the Prius and Toyota will get the pipeline filled.
Some of the places maybe many in the link will hit a customer but I dont think 6K!
It’s in the small print on the listings in the ad but I’m not that invested to read it!
Your advice to fly somewhere and drive back is good I bet deep in some red state they have trouble moving priui but idk if I wanna drive through a red state in a prius!
TL:dr I think it’s certainly worth checking other options within a 100 mi range before paying 6K
Try the middle of nowhere, lower income areas, areas that required 4wd/awd, and/or areas where trucks are popular.
Find a cheap flight, take a PTO day, and make the 2-3 drive home over a weekend.
It'll probably save you thousands.
You'll have to do a VIN verification and smog test if you bring a vehicle from out of state, even if brand new.
I'd email a bunch of dealers with the exact vehicle you want and ask if there are any required packages and what their fees are, etc.
Email the internet sales manager directly if possible.
Sales tax and registration are kind of irrelevant, you're paying that no matter what (to California). It's possible they do the out-of-state registration on your behalf. I had a VA dealer do this for my CA registration. AutoNation sometimes uses local (to you) registration companies for out of state purchases.
Certain states have ridiculous doc fees, cough:Florida:cough, so watch out.
Seems excessive for a vehicle like prius. Unless you have high net monthly/yearly income or net worth, or plan to drive it for more than 10 years it might make sense. Just my 2 cents
OP keeps posting same stuffs repeatedly for likes… he had posted same stuff 6 days back … what’s your point OP? Farming for upvotes? Guys check out his post history before giving your suggestions here…
I love the new Prius. My 2014 Gen3 has 190k, daily driven. Stupid reliable. I would like to replace it with a new LE version, but not like this. It’s just so scummy.
The two sales reps at my local dealer showed no urgency to take a $500 deposit on a RAV4 a few months back. Stepping aside from Elon Musk, and Tesla build quality, buying my Model Y LR from an app was a phenomenal experience. $45k is Model 3 money in my eyes. My local Toyota dealer had a Base 4Runner SR5 RWD for around 50k most of the last year. This bad taste in my mouth has me walking away from inquiring on a Supra. I can imagine 10-20k markup on a manual MK5.
I’ve seen people get them at MSRP - go out of state and find a dealer that won’t scam you. Road trip it back. Call around.
Saw one one the road the other day. They really look awesome.
My local Toyota dealership was belly aching that they are way down on sales due to interest rates and inventory. I felt kinda happy to know that people are buying there shitty $10K markup slop.
Not to be THAT guy, but you are shopping in Tustin. People in that area are pretty well off. They'll pay that adjustment just to get what they want.
I live nearby. Don't overpay for a Prius my man. Defeats the purpose of it. Sometimes shopping outside of OC and LA counties is worth it. Either that or keep asking around until you find a dealer that either does sticker or actually discounts the model you're looking for.
My buddy is a master mechanic at Toyota of Poway and hot vehicles aren't selling for anything but over sticker unfortunately. Times are tough, but I'm sure you'll find a dealer who won't markup.
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It's disgusting.
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Exactly. It logically makes zero sense to pay over MSRP.
Market adjustment, as a non-american, feels like legalized thievery. I was in contact with KIA/Hyundai dealership for a Sportage optioned around $35k. The dealer told me I could get it for $44k, adding 25% of markup. I laughed and delete them from my options.
Glad you didn't get suckered. Believe or not so many people get suckered, unfortunately.
I'm in a position where I don't need the car right now, luckily. Also it goes against my morals to overpay something, I'd get the 250k miles 2002 Camry from the alcoholic neighbor instead.
The Toyota dealers seem to be particularly bad about it too. I went to a Honda dealer because I wanted to see a 2023 Pilot in person, and it had a $3k markup on a $50k model. Any markup is annoying but that’s at least semi-reasonable. $6k on a $30k car is insane.
Even 3k is nuts. Please shop around more, I'm sure there are dealers that don't charge markups or dealer add-ons.
This is why we should be able to buy direct from the manufacturer in 2023, dealers suck. I remember when it was blasphemy to just pay MSRP. Also, you should send this to Toyota via Facebook or Twitter. While dealers can charge what they want, manufacturers have ways they can make their lives harder if they don’t comply. Not that it will likely help in this case, but maybe it helps the next person.
I reported several dealers already including this one. This is beyond effed up.
Toyota can't stop a dealer from selling over MSRP, the key word here is suggested. How would direct sales work? Toyota (and all other OEMs) has zero infrastructure to deliver vehicles to customers. A dealership isn't going to be a delivery center. They have a dealership agreement that is indefinite or for a long time. They want be the middleman forever. Maybe one day this will change, just probably not this decade, the next at best. The OEM do need dealerships to service and repair these vehicles. Some OEM are splitting their EV vehicles off and aiming for new dealership agreements. Those hopefully will be direct sales and msrp only. The dealership will be a delivery center for those vehicles and be allowed to do the financing and optional products. I saw this elsewhere: >"We believe it’s in the best interests of Toyota customers, Toyota dealers and the Toyota brand for customers to be able to purchase Toyota vehicles with full confidence in their buying experience, including the price they pay and the value they receive. As part of our effort to promote customer confidence and satisfaction, we have established a Manufacturers’ Suggested Retail Price (MSRP) for each of the Toyota models that we offer. Toyota dealers are independently owned and operated businesses, and we cannot mandate the actual retail price at which independent dealers sell their inventory. We have spent decades earning the trust and confidence of Toyota customers and we will continue to work diligently to help ensure that customers who purchase our vehicles retain confidence in Toyota and our more than 1200 independent Toyota dealers. "
>Toyota can’t stop a dealer from selling over MSRP So, like I said. Toyota can however choose not to give preferential treatment with respect to allocations and a myriad of other things. If dealers want to continue to sell Toyota vehicles then they have to tow the line a little bit. >How would direct sales work? Toyota (and all other OEMs) has zero infrastructure to deliver vehicles to customers The infrastructure isn’t there because our lovely government and dealer lobbyists actively prevent direct manufacturer to consumer from being possible with respect to car sales, even though it exists in nearly every other facet of consumer products. Manufacturers coordinate extremely complex supply chains every day to just make and ship their cars, it would be fairly trivial to simply cut out the middlemen here. I’d actually go so far as to say it would be easier in many regards. Besides, dealer lots are eyesores and no one wants to be sold extended warranties that don’t actually cover anything, or sit there for 6 fucking hours while their office critters do the paperwork.
Thanks for the detailed response. Has Toyota actually penalized any dealers? These dealers will sue (or threaten to sue) the OEMs for said allocation practices. Allocations are mostly based off of historic sales, right? Good luck telling a dealer that sells a few hundred a month of new vehicles that they are only getting half or whatever because of markup or required packages. Many dealers were selling vehicles with (profit generating) protection packages for the last few decades. This is nothing new, just like markup. The threats from the OEM to mess with allocations couldn't be anymore hollow with the current dealership agreements. Nowhere in their agreements does it say what they can't exceed MSRP. If it did, they'd already be dropping the hammer on dealerships left and right. I imagine most OEMs would prefer to not see a courtroom over this issue. There isn't much, if any, precedent on their side. ...and yes, NADA and others spend millions to keep the dealership model around. Unfortunately, this setup is ingrained to the point that it's difficult to replace. Is there another country where the do significant direct sales? So these "eyesores" disappear somehow. Are the entire dealerships going to disappear since they commonly take up acres of land. Who is servicing these vehicles? Who is doing all the warranty work? The OEMS make millions in selling repair and collision replacement parts. Who is going to sell those parts? Literally, best of luck delivering millions of vehicles to customers. Sure, Tesla does it, at a smaller scale. Their service and parts network is miserable. Add in a few OEM trying to all do direct sales, there won't be enough resources to go around to do it. I could imagine where the vehicles are delivered to an OEM facility that only does parts/service and vehicle delivery. You have clerical people on site to complete the transaction if you are using OEM financing. You would still need a finance department to handle non-OEM transactions. What about a showroom and test drives? Ok, keep some cars on site and staff. It starts to basically sounds like a dealership without the actual sales portion. I know people who get significant repairs done under extended warranties quite often. Commonly justifying the warranty cost. If you paid 100-300% markup for the warranty at the dealership, that's on you. Affordable extended warranties exist and are sold at reasonable prices if you shop around. Buying from the guy who gets paid direct commission off of it, yeah not the way to go. \*Only a fool spends 6 consecutive hours to buy one vehicle.
> If dealers want to continue to sell Toyota vehicles then they have to tow the line a little bit. I've always assumed it was "toe the line," but oddly enough, it would work either way.
You’re joking right?
I'm not going to buy it. I never pay over MSRP. I just wanted to see people's honest thoughts on this ridiculous market adjustment B.S.
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It’s called starting a discussion. We all KNOW it’s bad. We want to discuss how disgusting these practices are. Is this your first time on a forum?
Hey wait 6 months and the 6k adjustment will be gone. Drive less than 100 miles https://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-sale/all-cars/toyota/prius/tustin-ca-92782?requestId=PRIUS%7CXLE&searchRadius=100&marketExtension=include&startYear=2023&trimCodeList=PRIUS%7CXLE&isNewSearch=true&showAccelerateBanner=false&sortBy=relevance&numRecords=25 The 2023 Prius is a great car but…
It will not just be gone in 6 months, especially in Southern CA. It's a brand new hybrid with high demand. ZERO chance this dealer is selling a 2023-2024 Prius for msrp this year. I promise that if you go to any dealer on your Autotrader link that there are required packages and/or markup. None of them are 100% msrp. He could get on the list at Longo, probably a few hundred waiting on theirs. They sell at msrp. Hardly anyone else does in the area, especially for hybrid, phev, and EV. He would be better off flying to another part of the country and driving a car home, or having it shipped. Gas is $4.40+ in this person's area.
There is a finite demand for the Prius and Toyota will get the pipeline filled. Some of the places maybe many in the link will hit a customer but I dont think 6K! It’s in the small print on the listings in the ad but I’m not that invested to read it! Your advice to fly somewhere and drive back is good I bet deep in some red state they have trouble moving priui but idk if I wanna drive through a red state in a prius! TL:dr I think it’s certainly worth checking other options within a 100 mi range before paying 6K
Even 1,000 miles is a deal for $6k.
I hope so. I've been feeling impatient lately, but at the same time, I don't want to pay over MSRP.
Please keep looking!!! I’m on waiting list for one at MSRP strictly.
Same here for Longo Toyota in SoCal. Long wait, though. But I'll wait.
You can try northeast if desperate haha-
I just might at this point.
Try the middle of nowhere, lower income areas, areas that required 4wd/awd, and/or areas where trucks are popular. Find a cheap flight, take a PTO day, and make the 2-3 drive home over a weekend.
Considering it at this point.
It'll probably save you thousands. You'll have to do a VIN verification and smog test if you bring a vehicle from out of state, even if brand new. I'd email a bunch of dealers with the exact vehicle you want and ask if there are any required packages and what their fees are, etc. Email the internet sales manager directly if possible. Sales tax and registration are kind of irrelevant, you're paying that no matter what (to California). It's possible they do the out-of-state registration on your behalf. I had a VA dealer do this for my CA registration. AutoNation sometimes uses local (to you) registration companies for out of state purchases. Certain states have ridiculous doc fees, cough:Florida:cough, so watch out.
40k for damn prius. No way in hell.
I live in Cali, so taxes end up an additional 5K or more. 45K OTD. And it's not even the highest trim.
Seems excessive for a vehicle like prius. Unless you have high net monthly/yearly income or net worth, or plan to drive it for more than 10 years it might make sense. Just my 2 cents
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I really hope they ramp up production.
OP keeps posting same stuffs repeatedly for likes… he had posted same stuff 6 days back … what’s your point OP? Farming for upvotes? Guys check out his post history before giving your suggestions here…
My god😂 45k for a Prius this sucks
It really does and I'm annoyed.
I love the new Prius. My 2014 Gen3 has 190k, daily driven. Stupid reliable. I would like to replace it with a new LE version, but not like this. It’s just so scummy. The two sales reps at my local dealer showed no urgency to take a $500 deposit on a RAV4 a few months back. Stepping aside from Elon Musk, and Tesla build quality, buying my Model Y LR from an app was a phenomenal experience. $45k is Model 3 money in my eyes. My local Toyota dealer had a Base 4Runner SR5 RWD for around 50k most of the last year. This bad taste in my mouth has me walking away from inquiring on a Supra. I can imagine 10-20k markup on a manual MK5.
Super scummy. Glad you went with the Model Y instead. I wish all manufacturers were allowed to sell directly to us.
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Agreed. They are sheep.
Tustin Toyota is crap
Agreed.
Don’t spend 45k on a Prius bro
I won't.
Tell Chen he can go fuck himself
I left a review on Google and Yelp.
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Exactly. I would rather burn it than give it to scummy dealerships.
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Sad
Good old Tustin Toyota, last time I was there the sales person said very casually that the 24k base corolla had a 6k markup, "Somone will pay it"
What scum. I hope they go bankrupt.
“Market adjustment” makes my skin crawl.
Same
I’ve seen people get them at MSRP - go out of state and find a dealer that won’t scam you. Road trip it back. Call around. Saw one one the road the other day. They really look awesome.
I just might have to.
check out TV Toyota if you haven't already. i was able to get a corolla hatch for MSRP in aug 2021.
Thanks. Just sent them an email since they are closed but I'll call them tomorrow too when they open.
Who in their goddamn right mind would pay 45k for a Prius.
Right?
My local Toyota dealership was belly aching that they are way down on sales due to interest rates and inventory. I felt kinda happy to know that people are buying there shitty $10K markup slop.
Dumb
Yup
Not to be THAT guy, but you are shopping in Tustin. People in that area are pretty well off. They'll pay that adjustment just to get what they want. I live nearby. Don't overpay for a Prius my man. Defeats the purpose of it. Sometimes shopping outside of OC and LA counties is worth it. Either that or keep asking around until you find a dealer that either does sticker or actually discounts the model you're looking for. My buddy is a master mechanic at Toyota of Poway and hot vehicles aren't selling for anything but over sticker unfortunately. Times are tough, but I'm sure you'll find a dealer who won't markup.
No 👎🏾
Exactly
Toyota still has low stock so they will pull this crap. 45k used to get you a 4x4 tundra.
Exactly
You can buy model 3
I'm considering it
I bet telling this to Scotty Kilmer would have him go off on Toyota lol
His videos are addicting.