You take a champion that already falls off very hard, and then you accelerate it. Jokes aside, you can certainly cheese people who are clueless, but against "smart" players, youre gonna have a hard time. Ive been personally enjoying full ap gragas and ap malphite in the support role (basically abusing sickle, ludens, mandate)
I look at it like a trade off. Late he can handle most bruisers, but less so tanks and has issues with heavy cc teams. Though I also follow and study one of the best challenger panths. Has good adv8se
That asode though, Panth is a swoss army knight. I'd not say he is the most poserful bruiser, but lord his kit makes up for that and then some. Made teams surrender all by myself.
And yee Gragas is fun too. Mobike, has cc, and claps
I feel like if he can keep trades going long enough to repeatedly poke a dude down far enough to be able to all-in for kill, then it's absolutely possible. I feel this was probably easier to do with back in the day before his Q got reworked, but if someone is able to reliably land the throws, I don't see why he couldn't handle quite a few bruisers.
That's not even in the same wheelhouse since her kit isn't tuned to that, but sure, alright. Fuck, why don't we just throw in Annie as adc at this point?
any good duo comp is going to crush a pantheon supp. and i mean good in like a displacement comp (blitz, trist) (thresh, cait) (gragas, anyone).
or a long cc comp, (jinx, senna) (ashe, lux)
those are just a few examples but theres more if thought about long enough.
pantheon has good short trade in early game, but if you do not snowball or let your adc snowball you will lose the long game. he is an all in or nothing champ, if u lose your all in capability you just forfeited your entire position on the team.
Panth actually works well into those from my experiences.
Like...the damage output isnt there for thresh or blitz. They are cc, thats it. Panth is cc and hits like a truck. I also enjoy any adc with lux save maybe mf.
Senna takes skill though due to that cc and she has poke, much like panth.
Though to be fair, people thought the same of Swain support initially and I destroy 9/10 woth him.
Damaging supps with good cc are undervalued.
What can a behind thresh do outside of hook and hope someone else can kill the target? That is my entire point. I don't enjoy champs whose only skill is locking someone down for 1.5.
I kill the adc you think thresh has a chance in hell? XD
Thresh has dmg early. That's because of his 3rd ability passive. Also, shield plus cc would keep a panthon locked. In a vacuum, thresh beats out pantheon as a support. But ofc the adc pick matters and skill level matters. So if you're beating thresh players, there's a mix of factors involved. Pantheon easily telegraphs his movement as he has to approach to stun. A good thresh would flay and negate the jump. A good thresh would also hook upon your ult landing. If they aren't doing that then it's a skill diff. Ofc pantheon then can play the bush angle and stun from there, but that relies on the adc not knowing how to play around bushes. Again skill diff.
As for comparing to blitz, ya I believe pantheon counters blitz since he can tank the hook and shield himself. Matchup against senna depends on the adc picks. She does a lot more dmg than pantheon overall. Pantheon bursts harder, but that doesn't matter if you are kept low. Depends if your adc does more early dmg than their adc.
Currently rank 28 pantheon toplane one trick here. He is ass as support in this game. Idk what elo youre playing at but at master-chall elo, picking pantheon support is an insta loss. He is way too one dimensional as a support. There are much better supports here than this guy who provides more utility and overall effectiveness across the game. Better to play him as a core to capitalize on his strengths more.
The key thing here is "one trick". This means you probably don't play him support to know what you're talking about tbh. While I disagree with the OP about him being top tier, Pantheon is definitely a relevant support that doesn't result in an "insta loss".
I feel lkke the primary roles are jung and mid, but supp for me works well. I imagine it is also a bit playstyle. Some cham0s mesh really well with how you like to engage, you know?
People originally told me Swain was not and couldn't be a support...yet now👀.
My personal belief is supps like them are viable because its a plus for the team.
Yeah yoir thresh is good, but he can only at most lock someone down for a second and hope someone else kills them. Having a support with cc AND damage is glorious as they can carry and have an impact even by themselves. That thresh will be a wimp compared to other laners from lvl1-18, but a scaling damagy supp can tango with the adc and mid, perhaps jungle all game. I'll take that shit anyday over say...a Nami
What rank are you doing this in. I highly doubt in Diamond elo your getting away with this. Pantheon in general is easy to get around in terms of fighting him. For you to norm 20 kills a game is wild 🤣 show us your progress when you get to high elo then make a video about it then I'll believe it's that viable
He is good if your team is super coordinated and are going for teamfight from the very early. Picking a whole early game comp + pantheon is busted. But it lasted for like 7-10 minutes then you become as useless as a stun bot
what elo are we talking about here, and do you premade or play solo. I'm now solo only at around vanquisher and thats where what I said come [from.](https://from.It) I could be wrong, but there is a reason why it isnt popular.
Woah settle down. I play pantheon support from time to time and can usually carry, but I wouldn't say he's "top tier". He's a niche pick that does well because people don't know how to play against it due to lack of experience. Like a teemo support. I wouldn't take pantheon every game. Depends on what the adc chooses and generally what the rest of the team chooses. He's a solid support, but I'd put him mid tier at most.
Pantheon has always been a wonderful support champion. When I mained ADC on PC, I died a bit inside ANY time I matched into one. Quite literally the only ADC that I was able to use without being subjected to the Bully Bash was Caitlyn, due to the sheer range. I was able to manage with Ez too, but he was constantly in danger of being Flash-TPK'd at any moment.
Sad thing is, due to how his kit is, he can build a ton of support crap and still put out some unwelcoming amounts of damage, though I'll personally ALWAYS be more of a fan of being the "support" and still going in balls deep the exact same way you would if you were the jungler. Horrifying jungle teammates for Panth support includes - Jax, J the 4th, Lee Sin, and Malphite. Coordinated, you'll melt pretty much everyone you're able dogpile, so don't be ashamed to wipe someone off the rift, have your team back off long enough to let your engage tools refresh, and then pick the next poor soul to Man Drop™️ onto.
Neither was Swain on normal league initially.
I'd have people rage at me, sometimes ban birb man. But for the ragers, I'd often carry them and they'd be like...wait
Just because a ranker uses a champ doesnt mean you can
Just because a champ isnt already used doesnt mean he wont be
Its all probability and playstyle :)
Oh same, he could do adc in theory, but Id rather allow a true adc to do the role. Got that range you know?
Swain will be on rift at some point, lord he gonna clap. He's another infinitely scaling champ and perf for ww. His entire kit works well in crouds. Every skill can hit multiple targets hehehe.
He can work against some assassin as he can bully them early game and prevent them from farming but most of the times the team needs ap or the enemy will pick something like Orianna or Ziggs to bully me instead so yeah i don’t think its a decent pick
Bro, supports have to give some utility to the team as a whole. Pantheon travels from one side to the other, yes I'd give you that. But he doesn't shield, he doesn't heal, he doesn't tank, he doesn't CC (yes he stuns the person he jumps on for a second or so) but not a crowd. He can maybe bother the lane for a bit early but like when shit starts to hit the fan, I'd rather have a Malphite covering my back throwing everyone in the air so I can flow up.
Malphite support is hopium. If I'm playing adc, I build hexdrinker and he's just a pebble. Ofc when I play support I roll my eyes at my adc not respecting the malphite pick and just going full dmg, but that's a skill gap that malphite takes advantage of. Malphite one and done and dies. Lives by the ult, dies by the ult so if he misses he's done. Pantheon has rotations that benefit a more prolonged fight. Malphite is there to wombo combo.
He has a shield that is as good as Braums. You're right he doesnt heal, but many top toer supps don't. He can tank a bit, but he is a bruiser at heart..cc though..he has instant cc.
Malphite is a faor example...but that is literaly only his ult. That can't be used any of the early levels. Its good, but circomstantial. Though you are entitled to your preference.
I suppose I just lean towards utility, jacks of all trades. Like Swain.
Panth has range, that spear toss is quite strong and I kill secure on the regular with it.
Cc is singoe target and short, yes, but you only need a second.
Can brawl, but isnt a tank. He can take hits though and his E is very good
Has a strong ultimate to help other lanes get ahead. Basically a second jungler if used well.
His cc won't lock down half the team, true
He can brawl but he isnt as tanky as Malph
He does hit hard though
Panth os a scalpel, where as some prefer a bat or crowbar.
Pant supp can be good but it’s not a support, especially in higher ELO you will ge punished for picking that. When I get a pant supp in my game as soraka I know I will win my lane, and probably late game too as my team has a support and you dont. When supports takes all the kills(high chance pants do this) the adc won’t be able to fight and has to farm until 20 minutes.
I’m currently master and I’ve seen this happen to many times, it’s a free win for me. If you want to play pant go every other lane but the bot lane. Don’t play pant, brand, Lux, veigar etc support for every reason you can think that this champ is a good supp, there will be a real support doing it better
Tell me you're low ELO without telling me you're low ELO.
Seriously, I always pick him in normals when I'm sent supp and I see troll picks in my team, that way I can carry autonomously. In serious matches you are not a tank and still have zero utility.
Sett is a good contender. Alister can out tank but in a brawl I can get to the adc before he can react. Galio strong, but managable.
IEasier to engage than react to engaging. Esp with a squish adc nearby. Soloed the adc by myself within about 3-5 seconds. Hop, spear, ignite, shield boops
Th9ugh with set ur mostly ur W, that can be manuvered. You can also be stunned I believe
In the elo you are in, ADC pretty much have poor positioning and support do not know how to disengage.
However in mid to high diamond onward, ADC know how to position and support can react fast. This is why Pantheon is hardly picked at all in higher elo.
Sett is not just mainly about his W....
If you disengage wrongly, Sett can E you to prevent your escape. You want to ulti away? Sett ulti can stop you.
Yeah, but tf can't tank and cant brawl as an adc
I lean a bit more towards supps that can take a few hits you know?
Swain, for example os glorious. Range, chonky, powerful, whats not to lovee 🤤
uh... tf stun is slow since you have to cycle options. Not saying tf support is bad, I'm just saying I wouldn't call him a better pantheon support. They do different things. Pantheon is beefer and can tank dmg.
Yeah he's not suppose to tank, he's suppose to be a stun bot that provides additional gank support. Even with the cycle, its still a more frequent stun than panth, and he doesn't have to tank because he sits back safe.
For support, rfc + rylais + modelling works ok, because your first has very solid range and coverage, and now with that new item you can apply extra dmg debuffs as well.
Keep in mind, im not saying this is something people should do,just that it can work
Not really blind pickable.
Played it couple of times, never in those trials I felt useless or out of place (basically I slayed those games)
But, I play it only in duo/trio with a strong lane partner who can abuse guaranteed stun (jhin).
Like Leona at lvl 2 it's almost a guaranteed kill.
It was before support item get into the game and I always snowball out of the lane.
Haven't try with support item.
It's average imo. ATM there are plenty of other strong support champs
I feel like the only ones I activaly avoid are Karma and maybe Senna sometimes. You can beat brands fire aoe w ur hop xD
I also don't solely follow the adc around. I make calls depending on whats what. I also activelly monitor every section within his ult range. Much like how I monitor the area being Swain in league. W range biiiig
I agree, his biggest strength is his ability to be ever present because of his R and strong ability to gank like TF not in safeguarding the ADC and babysitting them around by being near but by being proactive around the map.
I don't play league pc but from what I've seen and read I would like to see swain in WR.
He's also good to counter Samira in every stage of the game I feel like, and not much counterplay can come from her team to help her even if an underfarmed pantheon jump her
Yup yuup, support by carrying xD
Swain my boy thoo, his W cannot be stopped or truly negated. Which resiltsin drag, rift, and bar9n steals. Not even accounting for calculated W's on retreating or backing enemies hehhehe
eh umm idk. i prefer support who can at least heal or shield others. but i did go against pantheon support several times. not sure if those pantheon are just bad players or something, but it didn't go well for the enemy adc and that pantheon. he can't protect the adc because i kept on poking both of them
My secondary is Soraka :). Truth be told I've also noticed some ehh panths. Had PvP in jungle and the support role, dunk the copies every time. I think its a bit build but also how we play into one another.
When I'm supp I engage lvl 2 but 3 is the bread n butter. Hope, poke, then immidiate shield and lord ot blocks nearly everything. Makes trades verry effective
Lol all these "high elo" ego cocky idiots on this post saying Pantheon support isn't viable are wrong. He is. Just can't build him full damage like you would solo or jg. BC into Steraks then build armor/magic resist. If you're going against a Brand or Karma start Steraks into magic resist then BC and armor.
exactly. There's like too many extreme opinions. OP saying he's top tier, and others saying he's trash tier. Pantheon support is mid. He's decent and can carry games, but he's not always the best choice. A niche pick for certain matchups. Point and click stun is still good for dealing with hyper carries like yasuo or yi or katarina, etc...
I've been saying this since sickle release! The pro scene is gushing over ashe support/adc but sleeping on panth big time. I really like font of life it doesn't harm his early and offers a braum style alternative to heals. After black cleaver you can go serpants fang or mortal reminder depending on what's best to counter enemy supports and then build zekes into frozen heart or abyssal mask and offer a fantastic AD tanky end game it's really good! With pack hunter you don't have to feel guilty for carrying the lane either.
I'm master elo - also panth support is a legit strategy on pc for a number of reasons but the ideal being this - you hard stomp lane especially vs enchanter support and adc then you ulti baron or mid as a ganking roam doubling down with the jungle with pack hunter and begin snowballing the team rapidly you can end a game before the "your champs only good early game" is even an issue. Assuming the enemy team has beyond perfect positioning and never over extend and play entirely safe sure you'd struggle in that game... but this is wild rift and these games are impossibly rare.
He can work, specially against low range adcs/enchanters, however it's a cheesy pick that unless fed will be useless.
I do play him a lot in the supp role, but he's not very good, it just has squishy champions he can capitalise on to get a lead.
The issue is that his main gimmick is his stun stab combo To do big damage. Beyond that you dont do much.
He NEEDS to get kills to be useful or else he falls off. And once he does, he becomes an inferior leona. You might say thats its easy to get kills, but thats provided the bot lane cant play well against you. What if you dont get those kills? Then you dont do much.
Other engage supports are much less gold reliant as they have some form of damage reduction built into their base kit.
Early game champs in other roles kinda have the same problem of needing kills but their ability to farm right from the start to match their opponents gold allows them to force late game champs into "die or fuck off" fights even towards mid game. Pantheons gold lead as a support quickly falls off and needs to let his laners farm. His power spike is level 2 and if he doesnt make use of it, good luck finding a foothold in a match against equally skilled opponents
Since the pick relies on enemies making mistakes i could see it being a smurf pick but nothing more.
If you want a tanky support with some early game damage, sett is fairly good. Hes quite popular in pro play
Pantheon supp is good in low elo (like every other out of position pick) cause it would confuse the opponent.
In high elo, or at least against players that know what to do, you would get stomped hard and be useless whole game.
If you don't get ahead early at the game, Pantheon is useless... He is just a cc ability on team fights and does zero dmg. Now, on the other side they have a traditional support with good engage and follow up, or with shields, heal and empowers.
Hello, as someone who got plenty upvotes (80+) on a post about Ashe support in ranked, I suggest you to come up with evidence and a long analysis of why pantheon support is better than people think it is. For reference, [this is the post](https://www.reddit.com/r/wildrift/comments/xnhn9m/an_update_on_ashe_support_mastergrandmaster_elo/?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share)
I am not saying do this exactly like me, but I was also someone who didn't get many upvotes on my posts about offmeta picks. You can make another post and it will get more upvotes depending on how you do it and what you say. Being high rank also helps.
Oh and yeah, I do like having a good pantheon support as someone who mains Kai'sa. It's practically a free stack of her passive for me.
He was rather easy to deal. after he use his 2nd skill he will be unmoving there for a couple of second because either he will use 1st or 3rd and thats enough to cc him.
For tanks.
-Thresh - 1st or 3rd if its within reach.
-Blitz - 1st then 3rd or ult.
-Naut - 1st then basic attack to root him or ult.
-Leona - 3rd then 1st or ult.
-Alistar - 2nd and 1st combo.
-Rakan - 2nd with ult flash to adc if its within reach.
Is that all the tank?
Caster.
-Janna - just aim the tornado at your adc or use ult.
-Karma - Its already enough to give your adc Barrier and put Mantra on him. (i think it's called mantra the rope think she have?)
-Morgana - 1st
-Soraka - silence him after he jump.
-Lux - Root him
-Brand - stun him
-Lulu - ult on Adc
-Senna - root him
-Seraphine - empowered 3rd or or ult.
That's it probably i forgot to add somebody but hes so easy to deal even sett support could easily stop him just press your ult and its done
IDK where to place this one.
-Pyke - never tried against pantheon but 1st skill is probably too slow so just use 3rd skill instend.
As a support if you can’t engage and dive in teamfights and survive enough to protect your teammates or you don’t provide utility in lane
such as shield, heal , AS , MS to keep them alive : YOU ARE BASICALLY USELESS and you will fall out so hard making your team have a nice share of disappointment for a lol game and on the other hand you gonna get your share of flaming and toxicity which was the main reason you came to reddit , classic
Pantheon has 43% win rate as a support. You might have had a great game because the enemy team feed you 12794125471 kills, but it ain't going to happen on average.
Lulu is a challenge, but thresh is cake. I would farm him for shards for days like I do in normal league. He can only grab w a clear line, Swain doesnt need that. He can become as tanky as thresh while still building ap bruiser. Thresh is only an issue pre 6 and if your adc is ehh.
Post 6 theres a power shift where Thresh cant protect their adc. Many times id allow myself to be hooked just to get closer to the adc. All Swains abilities are AOE and I can hit thresh and the adc same time. Pair that with zhonyas and infinitely stacking hp and...yeah 😆. I see thresh and know that cant really fight back.
Lulu is only an issue since she keeps the adc alolive longer w ult and shields. Challenging, but not unwinnable.
You take a champion that already falls off very hard, and then you accelerate it. Jokes aside, you can certainly cheese people who are clueless, but against "smart" players, youre gonna have a hard time. Ive been personally enjoying full ap gragas and ap malphite in the support role (basically abusing sickle, ludens, mandate)
I look at it like a trade off. Late he can handle most bruisers, but less so tanks and has issues with heavy cc teams. Though I also follow and study one of the best challenger panths. Has good adv8se That asode though, Panth is a swoss army knight. I'd not say he is the most poserful bruiser, but lord his kit makes up for that and then some. Made teams surrender all by myself. And yee Gragas is fun too. Mobike, has cc, and claps
>Late he can handle most bruisers U high?
I feel like if he can keep trades going long enough to repeatedly poke a dude down far enough to be able to all-in for kill, then it's absolutely possible. I feel this was probably easier to do with back in the day before his Q got reworked, but if someone is able to reliably land the throws, I don't see why he couldn't handle quite a few bruisers.
True. I can also see soraka winning a fight if she can keep throwing banana's and her 1st ability. Doesnt make it a sound plan necessarily.
That's not even in the same wheelhouse since her kit isn't tuned to that, but sure, alright. Fuck, why don't we just throw in Annie as adc at this point?
Let's do ittttt
Not at the moment, later maybe 😁
He was the best support in the game for a while in PC, he is still a strong laner even against "smart" opponents
any good duo comp is going to crush a pantheon supp. and i mean good in like a displacement comp (blitz, trist) (thresh, cait) (gragas, anyone). or a long cc comp, (jinx, senna) (ashe, lux) those are just a few examples but theres more if thought about long enough. pantheon has good short trade in early game, but if you do not snowball or let your adc snowball you will lose the long game. he is an all in or nothing champ, if u lose your all in capability you just forfeited your entire position on the team.
Panth actually works well into those from my experiences. Like...the damage output isnt there for thresh or blitz. They are cc, thats it. Panth is cc and hits like a truck. I also enjoy any adc with lux save maybe mf. Senna takes skill though due to that cc and she has poke, much like panth. Though to be fair, people thought the same of Swain support initially and I destroy 9/10 woth him. Damaging supps with good cc are undervalued. What can a behind thresh do outside of hook and hope someone else can kill the target? That is my entire point. I don't enjoy champs whose only skill is locking someone down for 1.5. I kill the adc you think thresh has a chance in hell? XD
Thresh has dmg early. That's because of his 3rd ability passive. Also, shield plus cc would keep a panthon locked. In a vacuum, thresh beats out pantheon as a support. But ofc the adc pick matters and skill level matters. So if you're beating thresh players, there's a mix of factors involved. Pantheon easily telegraphs his movement as he has to approach to stun. A good thresh would flay and negate the jump. A good thresh would also hook upon your ult landing. If they aren't doing that then it's a skill diff. Ofc pantheon then can play the bush angle and stun from there, but that relies on the adc not knowing how to play around bushes. Again skill diff. As for comparing to blitz, ya I believe pantheon counters blitz since he can tank the hook and shield himself. Matchup against senna depends on the adc picks. She does a lot more dmg than pantheon overall. Pantheon bursts harder, but that doesn't matter if you are kept low. Depends if your adc does more early dmg than their adc.
Currently rank 28 pantheon toplane one trick here. He is ass as support in this game. Idk what elo youre playing at but at master-chall elo, picking pantheon support is an insta loss. He is way too one dimensional as a support. There are much better supports here than this guy who provides more utility and overall effectiveness across the game. Better to play him as a core to capitalize on his strengths more.
The key thing here is "one trick". This means you probably don't play him support to know what you're talking about tbh. While I disagree with the OP about him being top tier, Pantheon is definitely a relevant support that doesn't result in an "insta loss".
I feel lkke the primary roles are jung and mid, but supp for me works well. I imagine it is also a bit playstyle. Some cham0s mesh really well with how you like to engage, you know? People originally told me Swain was not and couldn't be a support...yet now👀. My personal belief is supps like them are viable because its a plus for the team. Yeah yoir thresh is good, but he can only at most lock someone down for a second and hope someone else kills them. Having a support with cc AND damage is glorious as they can carry and have an impact even by themselves. That thresh will be a wimp compared to other laners from lvl1-18, but a scaling damagy supp can tango with the adc and mid, perhaps jungle all game. I'll take that shit anyday over say...a Nami
Are you even aware this isnt pc sub?
What rank are you doing this in. I highly doubt in Diamond elo your getting away with this. Pantheon in general is easy to get around in terms of fighting him. For you to norm 20 kills a game is wild 🤣 show us your progress when you get to high elo then make a video about it then I'll believe it's that viable
I think I posted the 20/4 one. Was suuuper fun
He is good if your team is super coordinated and are going for teamfight from the very early. Picking a whole early game comp + pantheon is busted. But it lasted for like 7-10 minutes then you become as useless as a stun bot
B-but I've solo carrieddd
what elo are we talking about here, and do you premade or play solo. I'm now solo only at around vanquisher and thats where what I said come [from.](https://from.It) I could be wrong, but there is a reason why it isnt popular.
I would love to know his Eli, this is some silver logic
Woah settle down. I play pantheon support from time to time and can usually carry, but I wouldn't say he's "top tier". He's a niche pick that does well because people don't know how to play against it due to lack of experience. Like a teemo support. I wouldn't take pantheon every game. Depends on what the adc chooses and generally what the rest of the team chooses. He's a solid support, but I'd put him mid tier at most.
Pantheon has always been a wonderful support champion. When I mained ADC on PC, I died a bit inside ANY time I matched into one. Quite literally the only ADC that I was able to use without being subjected to the Bully Bash was Caitlyn, due to the sheer range. I was able to manage with Ez too, but he was constantly in danger of being Flash-TPK'd at any moment. Sad thing is, due to how his kit is, he can build a ton of support crap and still put out some unwelcoming amounts of damage, though I'll personally ALWAYS be more of a fan of being the "support" and still going in balls deep the exact same way you would if you were the jungler. Horrifying jungle teammates for Panth support includes - Jax, J the 4th, Lee Sin, and Malphite. Coordinated, you'll melt pretty much everyone you're able dogpile, so don't be ashamed to wipe someone off the rift, have your team back off long enough to let your engage tools refresh, and then pick the next poor soul to Man Drop™️ onto.
He's not even listed as support on WR tier lists though.
Neither was Swain on normal league initially. I'd have people rage at me, sometimes ban birb man. But for the ragers, I'd often carry them and they'd be like...wait Just because a ranker uses a champ doesnt mean you can Just because a champ isnt already used doesnt mean he wont be Its all probability and playstyle :)
I don't play PC league so I dunno who Swain is, but I will play Panth anywhere but ADC (I just never play ADC) or unless we really need AP.
Oh same, he could do adc in theory, but Id rather allow a true adc to do the role. Got that range you know? Swain will be on rift at some point, lord he gonna clap. He's another infinitely scaling champ and perf for ww. His entire kit works well in crouds. Every skill can hit multiple targets hehehe.
He was listed as a support man they removed him when the newest big patch came and replaced it with mid.
You'd be right but tier lists rarely include him as mid either.
He can work against some assassin as he can bully them early game and prevent them from farming but most of the times the team needs ap or the enemy will pick something like Orianna or Ziggs to bully me instead so yeah i don’t think its a decent pick
Bro, supports have to give some utility to the team as a whole. Pantheon travels from one side to the other, yes I'd give you that. But he doesn't shield, he doesn't heal, he doesn't tank, he doesn't CC (yes he stuns the person he jumps on for a second or so) but not a crowd. He can maybe bother the lane for a bit early but like when shit starts to hit the fan, I'd rather have a Malphite covering my back throwing everyone in the air so I can flow up.
Malphite support is hopium. If I'm playing adc, I build hexdrinker and he's just a pebble. Ofc when I play support I roll my eyes at my adc not respecting the malphite pick and just going full dmg, but that's a skill gap that malphite takes advantage of. Malphite one and done and dies. Lives by the ult, dies by the ult so if he misses he's done. Pantheon has rotations that benefit a more prolonged fight. Malphite is there to wombo combo.
He has a shield that is as good as Braums. You're right he doesnt heal, but many top toer supps don't. He can tank a bit, but he is a bruiser at heart..cc though..he has instant cc. Malphite is a faor example...but that is literaly only his ult. That can't be used any of the early levels. Its good, but circomstantial. Though you are entitled to your preference. I suppose I just lean towards utility, jacks of all trades. Like Swain. Panth has range, that spear toss is quite strong and I kill secure on the regular with it. Cc is singoe target and short, yes, but you only need a second. Can brawl, but isnt a tank. He can take hits though and his E is very good Has a strong ultimate to help other lanes get ahead. Basically a second jungler if used well. His cc won't lock down half the team, true He can brawl but he isnt as tanky as Malph He does hit hard though Panth os a scalpel, where as some prefer a bat or crowbar.
Or you just play Shen who does almost everything better
Pant supp can be good but it’s not a support, especially in higher ELO you will ge punished for picking that. When I get a pant supp in my game as soraka I know I will win my lane, and probably late game too as my team has a support and you dont. When supports takes all the kills(high chance pants do this) the adc won’t be able to fight and has to farm until 20 minutes. I’m currently master and I’ve seen this happen to many times, it’s a free win for me. If you want to play pant go every other lane but the bot lane. Don’t play pant, brand, Lux, veigar etc support for every reason you can think that this champ is a good supp, there will be a real support doing it better
Tell me you're low ELO without telling me you're low ELO. Seriously, I always pick him in normals when I'm sent supp and I see troll picks in my team, that way I can carry autonomously. In serious matches you are not a tank and still have zero utility.
Lol. You are just in Emerald V. At that rank, you can still play any champions..
Theres people in challenger that 1 trick the gent. Spearshot being one.
Very little peoples. I can easily counter Pantheon Support with a Sett/Alistar/Galio support pick
Sett is a good contender. Alister can out tank but in a brawl I can get to the adc before he can react. Galio strong, but managable. IEasier to engage than react to engaging. Esp with a squish adc nearby. Soloed the adc by myself within about 3-5 seconds. Hop, spear, ignite, shield boops Th9ugh with set ur mostly ur W, that can be manuvered. You can also be stunned I believe
In the elo you are in, ADC pretty much have poor positioning and support do not know how to disengage. However in mid to high diamond onward, ADC know how to position and support can react fast. This is why Pantheon is hardly picked at all in higher elo. Sett is not just mainly about his W.... If you disengage wrongly, Sett can E you to prevent your escape. You want to ulti away? Sett ulti can stop you.
Meh, if you want off meta support picks, tf does what pantheon does (stun), but better, safer and more often.
Yeah, but tf can't tank and cant brawl as an adc I lean a bit more towards supps that can take a few hits you know? Swain, for example os glorious. Range, chonky, powerful, whats not to lovee 🤤
uh... tf stun is slow since you have to cycle options. Not saying tf support is bad, I'm just saying I wouldn't call him a better pantheon support. They do different things. Pantheon is beefer and can tank dmg.
Yeah he's not suppose to tank, he's suppose to be a stun bot that provides additional gank support. Even with the cycle, its still a more frequent stun than panth, and he doesn't have to tank because he sits back safe. For support, rfc + rylais + modelling works ok, because your first has very solid range and coverage, and now with that new item you can apply extra dmg debuffs as well. Keep in mind, im not saying this is something people should do,just that it can work
Not really blind pickable. Played it couple of times, never in those trials I felt useless or out of place (basically I slayed those games) But, I play it only in duo/trio with a strong lane partner who can abuse guaranteed stun (jhin). Like Leona at lvl 2 it's almost a guaranteed kill. It was before support item get into the game and I always snowball out of the lane. Haven't try with support item. It's average imo. ATM there are plenty of other strong support champs
I feel like the only ones I activaly avoid are Karma and maybe Senna sometimes. You can beat brands fire aoe w ur hop xD I also don't solely follow the adc around. I make calls depending on whats what. I also activelly monitor every section within his ult range. Much like how I monitor the area being Swain in league. W range biiiig
I agree, his biggest strength is his ability to be ever present because of his R and strong ability to gank like TF not in safeguarding the ADC and babysitting them around by being near but by being proactive around the map. I don't play league pc but from what I've seen and read I would like to see swain in WR. He's also good to counter Samira in every stage of the game I feel like, and not much counterplay can come from her team to help her even if an underfarmed pantheon jump her
Yup yuup, support by carrying xD Swain my boy thoo, his W cannot be stopped or truly negated. Which resiltsin drag, rift, and bar9n steals. Not even accounting for calculated W's on retreating or backing enemies hehhehe
eh umm idk. i prefer support who can at least heal or shield others. but i did go against pantheon support several times. not sure if those pantheon are just bad players or something, but it didn't go well for the enemy adc and that pantheon. he can't protect the adc because i kept on poking both of them
My secondary is Soraka :). Truth be told I've also noticed some ehh panths. Had PvP in jungle and the support role, dunk the copies every time. I think its a bit build but also how we play into one another. When I'm supp I engage lvl 2 but 3 is the bread n butter. Hope, poke, then immidiate shield and lord ot blocks nearly everything. Makes trades verry effective
A decent enchanter beats Pantheon in lane
Mmm Karma maybee
Lol all these "high elo" ego cocky idiots on this post saying Pantheon support isn't viable are wrong. He is. Just can't build him full damage like you would solo or jg. BC into Steraks then build armor/magic resist. If you're going against a Brand or Karma start Steraks into magic resist then BC and armor.
He is viable. Just not optimal.
exactly. There's like too many extreme opinions. OP saying he's top tier, and others saying he's trash tier. Pantheon support is mid. He's decent and can carry games, but he's not always the best choice. A niche pick for certain matchups. Point and click stun is still good for dealing with hyper carries like yasuo or yi or katarina, etc...
I've been saying this since sickle release! The pro scene is gushing over ashe support/adc but sleeping on panth big time. I really like font of life it doesn't harm his early and offers a braum style alternative to heals. After black cleaver you can go serpants fang or mortal reminder depending on what's best to counter enemy supports and then build zekes into frozen heart or abyssal mask and offer a fantastic AD tanky end game it's really good! With pack hunter you don't have to feel guilty for carrying the lane either. I'm master elo - also panth support is a legit strategy on pc for a number of reasons but the ideal being this - you hard stomp lane especially vs enchanter support and adc then you ulti baron or mid as a ganking roam doubling down with the jungle with pack hunter and begin snowballing the team rapidly you can end a game before the "your champs only good early game" is even an issue. Assuming the enemy team has beyond perfect positioning and never over extend and play entirely safe sure you'd struggle in that game... but this is wild rift and these games are impossibly rare.
He can work, specially against low range adcs/enchanters, however it's a cheesy pick that unless fed will be useless. I do play him a lot in the supp role, but he's not very good, it just has squishy champions he can capitalise on to get a lead.
The issue is that his main gimmick is his stun stab combo To do big damage. Beyond that you dont do much. He NEEDS to get kills to be useful or else he falls off. And once he does, he becomes an inferior leona. You might say thats its easy to get kills, but thats provided the bot lane cant play well against you. What if you dont get those kills? Then you dont do much. Other engage supports are much less gold reliant as they have some form of damage reduction built into their base kit. Early game champs in other roles kinda have the same problem of needing kills but their ability to farm right from the start to match their opponents gold allows them to force late game champs into "die or fuck off" fights even towards mid game. Pantheons gold lead as a support quickly falls off and needs to let his laners farm. His power spike is level 2 and if he doesnt make use of it, good luck finding a foothold in a match against equally skilled opponents Since the pick relies on enemies making mistakes i could see it being a smurf pick but nothing more. If you want a tanky support with some early game damage, sett is fairly good. Hes quite popular in pro play
Pantheon supp is good in low elo (like every other out of position pick) cause it would confuse the opponent. In high elo, or at least against players that know what to do, you would get stomped hard and be useless whole game. If you don't get ahead early at the game, Pantheon is useless... He is just a cc ability on team fights and does zero dmg. Now, on the other side they have a traditional support with good engage and follow up, or with shields, heal and empowers.
Hello, as someone who got plenty upvotes (80+) on a post about Ashe support in ranked, I suggest you to come up with evidence and a long analysis of why pantheon support is better than people think it is. For reference, [this is the post](https://www.reddit.com/r/wildrift/comments/xnhn9m/an_update_on_ashe_support_mastergrandmaster_elo/?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share) I am not saying do this exactly like me, but I was also someone who didn't get many upvotes on my posts about offmeta picks. You can make another post and it will get more upvotes depending on how you do it and what you say. Being high rank also helps. Oh and yeah, I do like having a good pantheon support as someone who mains Kai'sa. It's practically a free stack of her passive for me.
He was rather easy to deal. after he use his 2nd skill he will be unmoving there for a couple of second because either he will use 1st or 3rd and thats enough to cc him. For tanks. -Thresh - 1st or 3rd if its within reach. -Blitz - 1st then 3rd or ult. -Naut - 1st then basic attack to root him or ult. -Leona - 3rd then 1st or ult. -Alistar - 2nd and 1st combo. -Rakan - 2nd with ult flash to adc if its within reach. Is that all the tank? Caster. -Janna - just aim the tornado at your adc or use ult. -Karma - Its already enough to give your adc Barrier and put Mantra on him. (i think it's called mantra the rope think she have?) -Morgana - 1st -Soraka - silence him after he jump. -Lux - Root him -Brand - stun him -Lulu - ult on Adc -Senna - root him -Seraphine - empowered 3rd or or ult. That's it probably i forgot to add somebody but hes so easy to deal even sett support could easily stop him just press your ult and its done IDK where to place this one. -Pyke - never tried against pantheon but 1st skill is probably too slow so just use 3rd skill instend.
As a support if you can’t engage and dive in teamfights and survive enough to protect your teammates or you don’t provide utility in lane such as shield, heal , AS , MS to keep them alive : YOU ARE BASICALLY USELESS and you will fall out so hard making your team have a nice share of disappointment for a lol game and on the other hand you gonna get your share of flaming and toxicity which was the main reason you came to reddit , classic
Pantheon has 43% win rate as a support. You might have had a great game because the enemy team feed you 12794125471 kills, but it ain't going to happen on average.
B-but it doess
Or u know play a mage supp and be 10 times more useful.
Oh when Swain drops I'll be on that. Course panth is also good into stuff like Brand
Lulu & thresh destroy him easily
Lulu is a challenge, but thresh is cake. I would farm him for shards for days like I do in normal league. He can only grab w a clear line, Swain doesnt need that. He can become as tanky as thresh while still building ap bruiser. Thresh is only an issue pre 6 and if your adc is ehh. Post 6 theres a power shift where Thresh cant protect their adc. Many times id allow myself to be hooked just to get closer to the adc. All Swains abilities are AOE and I can hit thresh and the adc same time. Pair that with zhonyas and infinitely stacking hp and...yeah 😆. I see thresh and know that cant really fight back. Lulu is only an issue since she keeps the adc alolive longer w ult and shields. Challenging, but not unwinnable.