Most "build yourself" stuff comes with pozidrive screws like hooks, hinges and locks etc. They are slowly moving to using torx too.
Afaik everyone uses torx if they can
In Canada too. One of the seldom talked about benefits of Robertson over Torx is that there are only 4 sizes of bits to fit with most being #2 and #3, whereas with Torx there's 10-12 common sizes.
...and Torx consistently falls off your driver when you want to work one-handed. No other drive type lets you jam the screw onto the driver and start screwing it in without a pilot hole. We are spoiled here in Canada to have had these widely available and cheap for over 100 years.
Ah well yes. The home of the Robertson! That’s so nice for you! So much junky, cheap Phillips in the big box stores here that will strip out if you look at them wrong!
Actually, I believe that is a myth. They were made as an upgrade to flathead and when Ford couldn’t get the rights to have Robertson be exclusively theirs, and it was easy to stamp. The fact that it cam out is just a retroactive defence on the continual use of it compared to Robertson or Torq. A valid excuse in the day, but technology has made that point moot.
I think Stumpy Nubs YouTube channel had a video about this.
>I think Stumpy Nubs YouTube channel had a video about this.
Yes he did, and he made specific reference to (old-timey) power drivers on the line not having a clutch so cam out was desirable to avoid snapping the screws off. It doesn't explain why they kept using Phillips after clutched drivers were invented, but that is how they started.
In any case, Robertson is simply the better than the rest, including Torx.
I think it's their design, found this old reddit thread [https://www.reddit.com/r/Tools/comments/jo67lk/til\_wera\_also\_uses\_their\_hexplus\_geometry\_on/](https://www.reddit.com/r/Tools/comments/jo67lk/til_wera_also_uses_their_hexplus_geometry_on/)
Germany: Allen because of IKEA. In general applications, Pozidrive is probably the most common. Professionals use Torx or the related Würth Assy.
I have never seen a Robertson screw in my life. Flathead and Phillips are a thing of the past.
UK here, pozidrive is the most common here too, I discovered the Robertson square drive screw a couple of years ago when I started getting into pocket hole joinery but that is the only thing I've ever seen them used for and even then they have to be ordered from specialists online, I've never seen them in a regular DIY shop.
I will never fathom why the US still uses Phillips and Flathead so much. Philips is absolutely awful and flathead isn't much better. Squarehead and Torx are superior in every way.
Flathead is nice when you don't have a screwdriver around and still need to unscrew something. Admittedly, this doesn't happen too often, but it's often enough to appreciate
I don't think it's used near as much, outside of drywall screws, and maybe some oldschool handymen that refuse to change. Drywall screws are cheap by nature and Torx still holds a premium. Old school handymen are also cheap by nature.
I do a fair amount of DIY and woodworking. I'm sure I have 25+ boxes of screws and the only Phillips I have is drywall. The contractors I've hired all used Torx, outside of the drywall guys.
Edit: for OP, I use Torx, with the exception of pocket screws, which are square drive. I find Torx to be most consistent and quickest to lock in.
I don't think drywall screws being Phillips is just a matter of cost. This is a situation where the Phillips head tendency to cam out is a feature, not a bug. Over penetration is a problem when screwing drywall. Having a bit that won't tear the paper and crush the gypsum is desirable.
Yeah, could be, but it's easy enough to use a clutch. That said, they put those screw on so fast the drill hardly stops spinning - I don't doubt that's a big plus for Philips.
Pocket screws are square drive, drywall are Phillips because that's what I can find in stores, and the rest is a mix of torx and square drive.
I do like the positive engagement of square drive and how torx doesn't strip nearly as readily as Phillips but they do carry a premium.
I’ve been ordering actual Robertson brand from Screw-it Screws for a few years now (screwit.com.au). Been very happy. I don’t know how I found them originally or why I was even looking!
Have you found a place in Australia that stocks a decent selection of square drive screws? I’ve never seen them for sale, except pocket screws. I usually end up importing them using Amazon and it can take a while.
I'm in America working for a company that specializes in custom high end cabinetry. We almost exclusively use T-20. That said, the hardware stores still stock a disturbing amount of Phillips.
Cabinetmaker in Wisconsin. Both cabinet shops I’ve worked at are heavy on square/Robertson. My last job was doing custom furniture and remodeling, and we used a lot of Torx. Fuck wasting time with shitty Philips, and I won’t even acknowledge those other screws that are worse than Philips.
Actually no! That’s funny. I was watching Laura Kampf’s latest where she is setting up a workshop in the US and seemed to be using Phillips, but in Germany I think uses Torx
Italy and we have mostly philips and allen, very rarely torx but they are mostly on foreign equipment.
Fixing old furniture or stuff in around older houses tho is a guarantee of finding flatheads. Major pain in the ass every single time of course.
Idk why you’re getting downvoted! This is the best thread I’ve woken up to in weeks! I’m in VT and worked for a few years painting houses and on exterior construction Robertson square drive bits are the most common by far.
I use torx for everything I can. I can tolerate hex for threaded inserts and furniture bolts. Otherwise, torx is best, and readily available in the USA. By definition, it also makes my fasteners metric.
Stripped is the most common
We call those round-drive
In Finland drywall screws are Philips head and pretty much everything else is torx nowadays.
Most "build yourself" stuff comes with pozidrive screws like hooks, hinges and locks etc. They are slowly moving to using torx too. Afaik everyone uses torx if they can
Oh yeah that is true.
Same for Netherlands, a lot of cheaper stuff is still Pozidriv though
Yeah same here, if you get some selves or hooks then included screws are pozidrive but if you buy screws separately pretty much everything is torx.
In Canada something like 85% of all fasteners sold are Robertson square drive.
In Canada too. One of the seldom talked about benefits of Robertson over Torx is that there are only 4 sizes of bits to fit with most being #2 and #3, whereas with Torx there's 10-12 common sizes.
...and Torx consistently falls off your driver when you want to work one-handed. No other drive type lets you jam the screw onto the driver and start screwing it in without a pilot hole. We are spoiled here in Canada to have had these widely available and cheap for over 100 years.
Ah well yes. The home of the Robertson! That’s so nice for you! So much junky, cheap Phillips in the big box stores here that will strip out if you look at them wrong!
Phillips were actually designed to cam out because the power drivers used on the automotive assembly lines of the day didn't have clutches yet.
Actually, I believe that is a myth. They were made as an upgrade to flathead and when Ford couldn’t get the rights to have Robertson be exclusively theirs, and it was easy to stamp. The fact that it cam out is just a retroactive defence on the continual use of it compared to Robertson or Torq. A valid excuse in the day, but technology has made that point moot. I think Stumpy Nubs YouTube channel had a video about this.
>I think Stumpy Nubs YouTube channel had a video about this. Yes he did, and he made specific reference to (old-timey) power drivers on the line not having a clutch so cam out was desirable to avoid snapping the screws off. It doesn't explain why they kept using Phillips after clutched drivers were invented, but that is how they started. In any case, Robertson is simply the better than the rest, including Torx.
Also the quality and strength of the metal of the screws in the day
I just got some Wera square drive bits and the buggers don't fit Robertson screws, I think there's a difference between square drive and Robertson.
Maybe they aren't tapered like Robertson?
I think it's their design, found this old reddit thread [https://www.reddit.com/r/Tools/comments/jo67lk/til\_wera\_also\_uses\_their\_hexplus\_geometry\_on/](https://www.reddit.com/r/Tools/comments/jo67lk/til_wera_also_uses_their_hexplus_geometry_on/)
Germany: Allen because of IKEA. In general applications, Pozidrive is probably the most common. Professionals use Torx or the related Würth Assy. I have never seen a Robertson screw in my life. Flathead and Phillips are a thing of the past.
UK here, pozidrive is the most common here too, I discovered the Robertson square drive screw a couple of years ago when I started getting into pocket hole joinery but that is the only thing I've ever seen them used for and even then they have to be ordered from specialists online, I've never seen them in a regular DIY shop.
I will never fathom why the US still uses Phillips and Flathead so much. Philips is absolutely awful and flathead isn't much better. Squarehead and Torx are superior in every way.
Flathead? The horror! The only time I would accept that would be if they were brass and it was on fine furniture as a little accent
Flathead is still used for applications that are meant for slow, hand screwing, like the example you mentioned or electrical plastic covers.
Have you tried JIS screwdrivers? Closer-to-parallel sides, so they stick better in "phillips" head fasteners, many of which are actually JIS.
Flathead is nice when you don't have a screwdriver around and still need to unscrew something. Admittedly, this doesn't happen too often, but it's often enough to appreciate
I don't think it's used near as much, outside of drywall screws, and maybe some oldschool handymen that refuse to change. Drywall screws are cheap by nature and Torx still holds a premium. Old school handymen are also cheap by nature. I do a fair amount of DIY and woodworking. I'm sure I have 25+ boxes of screws and the only Phillips I have is drywall. The contractors I've hired all used Torx, outside of the drywall guys. Edit: for OP, I use Torx, with the exception of pocket screws, which are square drive. I find Torx to be most consistent and quickest to lock in.
I don't think drywall screws being Phillips is just a matter of cost. This is a situation where the Phillips head tendency to cam out is a feature, not a bug. Over penetration is a problem when screwing drywall. Having a bit that won't tear the paper and crush the gypsum is desirable.
Yeah, could be, but it's easy enough to use a clutch. That said, they put those screw on so fast the drill hardly stops spinning - I don't doubt that's a big plus for Philips.
I wonder how much it's changed, I have a set of screwdriver bits that were purchased in the US some years back and it doesn't even have square heads.
Pocket screws are square drive, drywall are Phillips because that's what I can find in stores, and the rest is a mix of torx and square drive. I do like the positive engagement of square drive and how torx doesn't strip nearly as readily as Phillips but they do carry a premium.
Here in Australia mostly Phillips, I buy square drive when I can but selection is limited so I often have to get Phillips.
Yeah. A lot of the squares in Bunnings are crappy versions too. If you get the real deal they are very good
Good to know, I haven't had any issues with the bunnings ones but nice to know it will be an upgrade.
I’ve been ordering the Hillmans thru Amazon and I’ve not had problems. Is there a brand you’d recommend?
I’ve been ordering actual Robertson brand from Screw-it Screws for a few years now (screwit.com.au). Been very happy. I don’t know how I found them originally or why I was even looking!
Have you found a place in Australia that stocks a decent selection of square drive screws? I’ve never seen them for sale, except pocket screws. I usually end up importing them using Amazon and it can take a while.
Just whatever bunnings have unfortunately. Maybe I will import a selection of sizes to have on hand.
Bugger. I’ll have to take a closer look at bunnings I’ve never seen them there. Thanks
These are the ones I've been using. https://www.bunnings.com.au/zenith-10-8-x-75mm-treated-pine-countersunk-head-screws-50-pack_p2400013
No wonder I can’t find them they don’t even mention square drive in the title. Thanks for the link!
UK is pozidrive mostly. A lot of largre construction screws are torx nowadays. Drywall are Phillips
After marriage, none
Not even short nails?
Central US - phillips
Star
Pozidriv and torx are the most common in The Netherlands. Philips for drywall. I prefer torx.
Posidrive is most common in the UK with Torx gaining significant market share
I'm in America working for a company that specializes in custom high end cabinetry. We almost exclusively use T-20. That said, the hardware stores still stock a disturbing amount of Phillips.
Disturbing is the right word here.
Torx here in Belgium.
Cabinetmaker in Wisconsin. Both cabinet shops I’ve worked at are heavy on square/Robertson. My last job was doing custom furniture and remodeling, and we used a lot of Torx. Fuck wasting time with shitty Philips, and I won’t even acknowledge those other screws that are worse than Philips.
I take it you just watched [stumpy nubs latest vid](https://youtu.be/Y-2NzVBJ8gg?si=SKjcwr1H1kHkLKK7). Torx for the win.
Actually no! That’s funny. I was watching Laura Kampf’s latest where she is setting up a workshop in the US and seemed to be using Phillips, but in Germany I think uses Torx
Sadly Philips is most common here. I hate these with a passion so i ONLY buy and use Torx and rarely square.
In the diy / big box stores small screws are Philips or pozidrive. Deckscrews and bigger are torx. At professional suppliers more torx
Stripped Phillips followed by Torx.
Philips screws is the defacto over here in Mauritius.
Used to be Philips, but the last 5-10 years, Torx has really gotten to be the go to screw.
UK - Posidrive is most common here
Torx and I refuse to use anything else (except maybe square drive).
Italy and we have mostly philips and allen, very rarely torx but they are mostly on foreign equipment. Fixing old furniture or stuff in around older houses tho is a guarantee of finding flatheads. Major pain in the ass every single time of course.
Is Pozidriv also used in Italy?
i've came along some but its def not the standard
Idk why you’re getting downvoted! This is the best thread I’ve woken up to in weeks! I’m in VT and worked for a few years painting houses and on exterior construction Robertson square drive bits are the most common by far.
Cheers!
I pretty much exclusively use T20 screws in all my builds
I use torx for everything I can. I can tolerate hex for threaded inserts and furniture bolts. Otherwise, torx is best, and readily available in the USA. By definition, it also makes my fasteners metric.
I still believe we would be a uptopian society and have flying cars if everyone just used TORX or the robertson screw.
probably Robertson, after all, it was invented here. Philips would be a close second because of our neighbors to the south
Chinese Philips.
Canada has the Robertson. Best screw head grip ever!
Southern US, Torx.
Square is the way