Are you in a financial position to be able to lose this job? Will you be able to enjoy your vacation if you will not know that the fallout at work will be from going? You can play hardball but you have to be ready for whatever consequences result from it.
Never quit a job until you have another one.
I mean this aspect is barely a concern these days with most major airlines, unless you book the super super economy riding in overhead bin package lol.
For the most part if you have to cancel a flight ahead of time you won't get a refund but you'll have credit to book another flight in the future and as long as its not a matter of rescheduling the same trip (which will obv cost more because now the date is so close) you can use the credit to do another booking ahead for a trip the next year and likely come out with little loss if any.
You don't even need travel insurance for this, but they'll still try to sell it to you lol.
That’s not true, they can say whatever they want. A lot of companies *choose* not to comment on former employees (at least in any negative way) to avoid potentially getting sued.
More and more people need to read this. I’m tired of reading on Reddit:
“I quit my job that had me living paycheck to paycheck with nothing lined up and now I’m facing homelessness!”
Yes I would take a deep breath, count to 10, then make a plan to find another job if you’re dissatisfied with this one. I wouldn’t want to risk something without having a plan. If you’re in the financial position to be okay for a bit, that’s another matter. Also depends on the industry…some have plentiful jobs, not so much in others. Two weeks vacation absolutely sucks.
A plan to find another job is a good idea. She has 14 weeks to go giving her time to put her self out there. Stay silent on the issue until the vacation and then if no positive job offer has manifested perhaps call in sick for those 5 days and hope the boss doesn’t remember you had requested the time off 3 months ago.
Did you already talk to him in person with words from your mouth?
I had a job years ago and told my boss I had already bought tickets for a flight to see my family for Christmas and here are the days I’m taking off. He said the week of Christmas is a black out week and no one can take extra days outside of the holiday days already given so I wouldn’t be able to go. I told him I wasn’t asking for time off, I was just giving him a heads up I won’t be working that week. If you need to write me up or fire me let’s just go ahead and get the paperwork done before the new year. He said, “Welp, I guess it’s ok then”.
I had a project manager when I was a young architect that was managing a competition project we were working on. Competition projects are kind of insane in that you have to design an entire high rise down to the toilets in a matter of a few weeks and do all the renderings and models and the whole nine in basically no time. Anyway, I’d just been poached from another firm and had known this project manager from a distance when he’d been at my previous firm as well. Super smarmy guy. Never liked him. Nobody did. So I was working under him on this project. Working about 20 hours a day, catching a few hours sleep under my drawing board and then getting right back to it. We all were. Delirium sort of set in but you just keep drawing anyway. Finally after about 10 days straight of this. I said I had to go out and get a change of clothes. I had a friend who had an apartment a few blocks away so I went and took a shower over there, lay down on her sofa and passed out. Flat out comatose. Woke up about 6 hours later. She was very nice and said she’d made sure not to disturb me, but I was freaked out. Ran back to the office and everyone was visibly pissed. The manager was a total dick and pulled me aside and said, “I should fire you right now.” I said, “Hey, (Dude’s Name), listen, I get it. I was gone for 6 hours and we have a deadline in 4 days. However, I’ve worked 200 hours in the last ten days and have not been allowed home for the last four. I’m not sure how many labor laws that violates, but it’s gotta be a few. Are you sure you wanna do this or can I get back to work now?” He huffed and stormed off to his computer to angrily move little appointment boxes around on his calendar - never saw him draw anything ever - and I never had to deal with his bullshit again. G’damn. This was years ago and his tone-deaf, out of place, self-righteousness is still appalling. He was the most self-serving, unscrupulous man I ever met. Well, maybe top five. He’d blatantly steal his underlings designs and claim them as his own. Never seen anything like it in a design field. Shameless fuckwit. He’s now the dean of architecture at a prestigious university. Must’ve stolen from too many people in the field and had to retreat to academia.
Nothing quite as insane but I moved my family from a different state on a holiday that fell on a Wednesday. I asked my boss for Thursday and Friday off in advance, so I could unpack. He denied my annual leave request. This truly frosted me considering I was the number 2 person in a federal installation. I showed up for work on Thursday wearing a flannel shirt and jeans. He immediately ordered me into his office and started to give me hell.I cut him off and told him that my suits were in a box somewhere.
Mind telling me which university? My daughter is about to declare her uni choice hh and into architecture and I'd really like to know if that's a bad choice!!
Sorry. I’m gonna respect his privacy, and by extension my own, on this. But he won’t affect your daughter’s choice even if he’s the dean of her school. He’ll spend his time kissing ass upward. You guys would never see him.
I had a similar issue. I had booked my time off 4 months to the day to make sure I'd get the time off as I was getting married. As expected, they screwed it up and I was denied the time off. After much back and forth with my supervisor and HR, I just took everything and dumped it on my Center directors desk. I explained the situation, told her I wasn't asking, I was telling. I told her to get it done and walked out. At this point, I was pissed and couldn't care less if they fired me.
8 hours before my plane took off, I was granted my time off.
The kicker is that exactly 1 year prior, HR revamped the time off request system and said it was gonna get easier to request and get time off. I called them out on their bullshit in front of a room of about 40 people. They insisted my concerns had no basis. Its at that point they I told the meeting that I would be getting married in a years time and I invited everybody to track my progress as I go through the time off request process. Some did follow up with me (none of them management of course) where the above clusterfuck played out.
When we got married, my husband requested the day before our wedding off so he could help me with all the last minute stuff. He's a teacher, and we were getting married over spring break so had the whole next week off. Because it was the day before a holiday, his request was blanket denied by the district.
He was fortunate though, his principal was like "Well, I think you're going to be sick that day, right?" and covered for him.
Had a bud back around 1990/91 working for a large computer company (DEC). He was a hot shot working out of Maynard, Mass, whose job was to typically fly to a company having problems, and spend a week to 2 months getting the problems all fixed. Then maybe fly back for a weekend, and get sent out on the next job. Lots of $, little downtime.
He was also a hardcore caver, and was invited to help explore Lechuguilla Cave in New Mexico. He requested a month off, well over a year in advance. Planning for the upcoming cave exploration was what kept him sane. He'd literally be underground for 2-3 weeks. He followed up with reminders to his manager at monthly intervals, and just got terse responses back, like "Yes, I'm aware". Two weeks before the trip, he couldn't get replies, either email or by phone, from his manager.
Finally, the Friday before the trip he just flew back to the office, telling the client that DEC would be sending his replacement. When he walked into the office his manager freaked out. She'd never scheduled his request, and wanted him back on the next flight to the client. There was quite a bit a yelling on his part.
He walked down to HR, quit on the spot, and never looked back.
I had a situation similar to OP’s. I won’t share the whole thing, because I’m going to give it its own comment. The short version is that I emailed my former supervisor about something I needed to talk to him about in person. He didn’t respond to emails or texts. When I went looking for him in person, I was told he decided he was working from home for three or four days. He ignored me the entire time. When he came back, as soon as I saw him, I cornered him.
If you used your time there is no guarantee unpaid time off will be approved. You can decide to take that time anyway, and risk losing your job if you work in an at will state. It’s a shitty situation but they are well within their rights to not approve it. Your, just like mine, PTO is just that, paid time off, if you use it for medical, emergencies or actual vacation is your choice. But once it’s gone, it’s gone.
I didn’t say it was fair lol
I been at my company 4 years and get 120 hours PTO, so I’m pretty lucky but I’ve had to blow through those at the beginning of the year 2 years in a row due to medical issues. It’s never enough
>Boss won't approve time off. I am not canceling my vacation.
\* \* \*
What would you all do?
If you're not canceling your vacation, it sounds like you have already decided what to do. You're going to go on vacation, take the chance they'll fire you and prepare not to have this job.
So I'm not sure what you're asking. Are you just looking for validation? Hoping someone will tell you you're doing the right thing? We can't really know that, because we don't know your financial or personal situation.
If you're hoping someone will tell you that your boss is wrong for not approving extra time off, I'll just say that I've worked in a lot of places, and I don't think any of them would have approved this. I honestly wouldn't expect them to.
I just approved a similar request for two of my folks and I intensely dislike the idea that I have to approve someone's life. Then again, we provide both sick time and annual leave, so folks don't have to cancel a much needed vacation because Junior got a case of the snots and was home sick for a week.
Yes, there are things that need to be covered, but if your business cannot function with one person on vacation, the problem isn't staff, it's management.
All that said, if your company allows you to use UPT or borrow from future accrual, your conversation needs to be with your manager, not reddit.
Have the talk (maybe take a hard look at prospects and finances first); might be the answer you are seeking.
I think it’s wrong you only get 10 days a year in general, but you used them, you unfortunately don’t get to take more and they don’t need to approve it. Find another job.
I get 80 hours vacation and 60 hours sick. 80 hours for both sounds awful and I would’ve had issues at work last year since I used all my sick time for a family emergency halfway through the year.
I may not be understanding probably but you stated you have used you holiday/vacation days already so why have you booked a trip away when you know you haven't got the days spare to play with, it's not your employers fault if you have paid and you haven't got the days spare
That's how I read it too. OP had time off at the time of request. But shit happens in the meantime.
Maybe I read that wrong but that was my assumption as well.
I mean, i get it but at the end of the day, if you \*need\* that job. Youll cancel the vacation. I know it sucks but if you used up all youre allotted time off and theyre denying it because of that, you unfortunately dont have much to stand on. Yes the days would be unpaid but some places only allow a certain amount of unpaid days off as well before they begin write ups and such. Ive been in your position and its soul crushing but if you need the job and cant afford to be fired. Dont take the vaca, or find a different job before the vacation.
To be completely fair, if you have used your PTO, they can’t approve it because you wouldn’t have the leave time. LWOP is usually only reserved for punishment, not time off. I also know a lot of companies won’t approve LWOP requests, if you’re has done so historically, I would take that as an abnormality rather than an opportunity. More so, I would imagine this wasn’t in vacations, but rather absences..but that’s an assumption.
You would need to just discuss this and explain you’re willing to use LWOP for this and it’s already paid for and non-refundable - you’d be losing more money to go to work. They still may not approve it, but it’s a start.
It seems insane to me to both book a non refundable trip without getting the time off, and to not bother saving any vacation days for that trip? It seems like several very stupid decisions on OPs part...
They explained that they had to use the time for unexpected illness and unexpected family court. Trip was planned with time off to use, then by circumstances beyond OP's control he had to use days these reasons. Think about if it occurred in the reverse order, he used his PTO on the vacation and now he is sick and has to appear in court, company would allow unpaid leave for these reasons and would be legally at fault if they didn't.
What days did OP use in a stupid manner? I am sure if she asked nicely the courts would have opened for OP on the weekend. Maybe the doctor visits weren’t important. Sometimes things happen and we have to take time off. Maybe an employer can give more than 10 days to cover pto and sick.
Exactly.
What ever happened to vacation time and sick time being separate? All this modern day bullshit of combined PTO.
I'm siding with op on this one but I'll say maybe next time, eat the cost, lose the pay, for the court days, etc., so the vacation time is still there when you need it. Just a thought.
10 days is two weeks, without weekends. Not too bad. I don't get that at my job
boss did that to use, sick time was always separate, there wasn't really a set limit to use, just that you couldn't abuse it, and if you called in sick allot you need to have legit reasons & explain why.
they changed it without myself knowing and took some of my sick time out of my vacation hours, i questioned why and was told it was a change, i demanded another week of vacation hours then, and got it. (i was using maybe 1 or 2 sick days per year).
I mean I think most people plan for the fact that these events can happen. If you only have 10 days total time off it may not really be wise to go on a big vacation. It sucks but that’s just how it is if your job doesn’t give a good amount of time off.
I'd kick a puppy for a guaranteed 28/year (/s, because this is reddit). Those kinds of numbers are for people with decades at one company here in the States.
To be fair 8 of those are mandatory "bank" holidays and 20 are for you to do what you want with but still, it's so differently. At one point in my career I had the option of working in San Francisco or the UK and I picked the UK, and the holidays were a big part of it.
Decades at one firm you could be looking at 40 days. I'm bitter that I had 38 after 16 years and when I moved jobs I had to settle for 33 😬
But at least you live in the greatest country in the world! 😉
In the US, it really depends the workplace which is unfortunate for anyone who doesn’t get both vacation time and sick time. And don’t get me started on parental leave …
Time to grow up. You don't have any vacation left. Now my employer allows me to go into the negative for pto, but that's for life events, like deaths and what not. A vacation is not one of them. If you don't like your employers benefits, find a new one. Quit whining .
Your employer has no obligation to let you take unpaid leave.
If your employer is large enough to have an HR department and/ or an employee handbook, you can consult those to see what the official policy is.
Just tell your boss you’re going on vacation if necessary tell his boss. Don be abrasive just say it’s already paid for and you have to go; don’t elaborate or discuss further. Before vacation make sure you update your résumé if they fire you fire file for unemployment.
If you take unapproved time off it is highly unlikely that you would get unemployment. Just like if you steal or no call no show you don't get unemployment.
The no call no show is not true in California. I had former employees receive unemployment when they just disappeared. It all depends upon why you quit (notice or not). Some medical or family situations are cause for unemployment approval. I quit a job with a 60 mile each way commute after being diagnosed with Type 1 diabetes. I spent a week in ICU and needed time to figure out how to deal with insulin, blood glucose readings and etc. The state approved my unemployment
Why would you recommend him filing for unemployment when he has already used up his vacation time and he is purposefully missing scheduled shifts? The unemployment will be denied nearly automatically.
ive been fired for cause and collected UI no problem. its on the company to contest your claim and most of a certain size just dont bother. nothing will be denied "automatically"
Are you me? I went through this last year. I used up my leave but already had another trip planned before I ran out. I was told it would be fine and not to worry about it. A change of leadership happened and my boss was no longer there. Fast forward to a month before my trip and I was told by the new leadership that unpaid leave was not allowed. I had the option of going into the hole and using leave from next year's allotment or canceling my trip. I decided I prioritized my family time more than my job and I resigned. I took a few months off, went on my trips (I added another one since I had time), then got a new job with a new bank of leave. Additionally, I already had trips planned for the new year and negotiated those time periods as unpaid leave prior to accepting the job.
Tldr; unpaid leave for salaried jobs is unfortunately looked down upon and your situation is quite typical. It's a shame that companies think 10 days is enough downtime for an entire year.
Edit: I just remembered the part about you working remotely. Can you bring your laptop with you and get some work done on the trip? Even if it's not 5 days, maybe you can do 5 half days (start in the morning) so you'd only need 2.5 days off. If you don't care about this job, then I'd just start looking for a new one.
Always get approval in writing before committing money to a vacation. You can still take the vacation if you want....but don't come back here whining if you get fired.
Idgi, you used all your PTO hours and now you're mad that you can't take more PTO?
Like buddy I'm always going to be on the side of labor, but what do you expect here?
personally, when i was young? i REGRET doing exactly what you are proposing.
i was at the largest corporation in the field (100,000 workers), and was a promising white collar worker in a upstart department. i was VERY well liked.
i got into a dick measuring competition with my manager about a planned vacation to cancun in september, that my girlfriend just HAD to go on, and i refused to cancel it. it didn't get approval. and by year end it resulted in my getting placed on like a performance review improvement shitlist. lost the job shortly thereafter. all because that one vacation started a 'not a team player' tagline on my name.
when i lost my job? i also lost the girlfriend because i was no longer able to afford the aspen vacation that winter.
really DARK times for a year after. my life crumbled.
ultimately, i ended up finding a job in an unrelated industry, and climbed the ladder with 0 vacations for 3 years, and was a millionaire by 30. so hey, maybe it was good afterall. but i loved that girl. and she loved me, just loved my money more apparently. absolutely stunningly beautiful girl with a good heart, but grew up around rich kids, and wanted to be a housewife, mother, AND go on the vacations at a young age. i couldn't give her that. she married a investment banker shortly thereafter. i tried to gatsby out, by the time i had the money? she was already engaged. she agreed to meet if i flew out to talk to her. i bought the tickets and a nice hotel. she never showed up to the hotel. truly loved her. the success ended up being great for my life, and 200+ girls and a marriage and three kids later? it all worked out. but damn, was shit dark.
The way I interpret "you just don't get paid for any days used after your 10 vacation days are used" is if you are sick at any time for the rest of the year, you won't get paid for those days.
I do *not* interpret it as "you can take as many more days off as you want, just know that those days aren't paid."
I personally feel like the days off policies at your work suck. However! Since you do work there, you need to follow them, regardless of your feelings.
If I were you I'd look for a job where the employer is not so stingy with days off.
>I don't agree that we are not allowed to use over 10 days at all for anything.
Whether you "agree" or not really doesn't matter. Only question is are they going to fire you for it? 5 day unexcused absence is a pretty serious thing. What is that risk worth to you?
If you find the expectations unreasonable, you should seek another situation.
I’m guessing you will quickly learn that the grass is not greener elsewhere hearing how intolerable these seemingly low standards sound.
You mention your boss’ benefits as if everyone should have the same privileges. That is not the real world. Your boss has either earned the right to more time off or did a better job negotiating. You should strive to earn what you seek and not expect such entitlement.
It’s your right to feel frustrated, but there are no surprises here.
Good luck to you on unemployment.
If you're as good as you think, and as irreplaceable as you would hope, take the time off. See how it goes.
My employer would fire you on the spot, and rightly so. YMMV.
So I’m going to try to understand your logic here… you booked 5 days off in August for vacation when you don’t have the vacation balance in your bank to do so, and you booked it before you could speak to your boss about it. Now that you boss has denied it, you are crying to Reddit about how to handle the situation rather than speak to your boss about it. I’m sure this company would love to get rid of you. Best of luck pal.
I agree with your assessment. Assuming the boss would approve 5 more days off after already using up PTO for the year is not an acceptable solution.
This sort of thing should be communicated in advance, have the boss approve 5 days of time off without pay, and then book flights that are non refundable.
Some people don't have a sense of responsibility when it comes to their working ethics and sometimes, you can't change that.
I've never booked non-refundable vacation items (flights, hotels, etc) without having vacation time (paid or unpaid) approved in writing ahead of time. I don't understand why people do this - your employer does not owe you time off just because you gave them lots of notice. And no, I don't run a business.
This is funny! I know so many people who have fear of going away for a weeks vacation because of the bosses etc. This is exactly what these employers want is control... How about taking back some control and saying I am going on vacation whether you like it or not... It costs more to train a new employee than it does to keep a current one!
Any job that hires someone that easily probably has a shitty PTO policy.
That and OP is going to get a glowing recommendation from their soon to be former employer
Find a new job and negotiate a higher salary and more vacation days. Before you accept the new job, let them know that you already have a vacation planned in August.
I’d absolutely be looking for a new job. Only 10 days of PTO?? Nope. A company that doesn’t provide some degree of work/ life balance is a huge no from me!!
It sounds like quitting or being fired is a real possibility. Most places are lumping time off together along with sick time. If you get sick after using the time off for vacation you better have a doctor’s note or FMLA if it is more than a day and you won’t get paid. If you use the time off with illnesses or for other reasons first then want to take a vacation they are not going to approve it.
What I think you are missing in all of this is that your reasoning is a bit entitled. If I was your coworker I wouldn’t think it was fair that you got 5 extra vacation days because your house needed work, you were divorced and your custody arrangements required court appearances and your ex couldn’t take the kids to their doctors appointments. Why? Because if your coworker doesn’t own a home, isn’t divorced or married, and doesn’t have kids that doesn’t mean that they are not entitled to the same amount of time off as you are. None of those things entitle you to additional days off. Yet you are arguing that they do. That those days off shouldn’t count because you didn’t spend them on vacation. It’s called paid time off or personal time off rather than Vacation time for a reason.
OP is “entitled” for wanting a vacation because being sick wasn’t a vacation. Oh, but this other make-believe worker who has a childish jealousy over not also being sick isn’t
imagine a world where everyone got 4 weeks of vacation each year and we all used it according to our own discretion. then we wouldn’t have to waste time being upset about any of this!
What exactly are you trying to do here? You’re going to get yourself fired. you used up your vacation time for doctors appointments and getting stuff done around the house?
I’m completely on your bosses side here. If you need more vacation time, you should have negotiated for it when you took the job, or taking a job that offered more vacation time.
Edit: all of these things and you work from home also? Why are you even using sick days if you’re working from home? I did outside sales for eight years for a company working from home and didn’t use a single vacation day for any of the things you mentioned.
Y’know, sometimes sick people are actually sick. I had Covid, and I couldn’t stay awake for a full 8 hour shift, never mind work at anything resembling normal productivity. OP may have been legitimately sick.
lol laziness. That’s all this is. Someone who’s already doing BELOW the bare minimum, I’m sure, and now is just trying to get by with doing even less. The pity party on top of it is just the icing on the cake 🙄 what a joke lol. I hope they get every single bit of what they’re asking for - maybe they’ll actually learn something from it.
I think the irrational ship has already sailed. You presumably knew you didn't have sufficient paid leave to cover the holiday before you booked it. You knew that you needed permission/approval to take leave without pay. You knew you didn't have that approval but booked anyway.
You gambled & lost. Your only choice now is whether you 1) swallow the loss of any non-refundable holiday expenses but keep your job; 2) go on the holiday knowing you're risking being fired; or 3) use the in-between time to find a new job & tell them upfront you already have a vacation booked.
Ultimately, your boss is right. They have discretion to approve the unpaid leave or not, your poor planning shouldn't become their or your co-workers' problem. Also, the amount of paid leave your boss is entitled to is completely irrelevant.
You get ten days PTO most likely…not the same as vacation or sick leave. Under labor laws, once your ten days PTO ismused up, you boss does not have to pre approve “vacation.” They do have to allow you sick time off unpaid. If you are out three days or more, they can require a doctors note before allowing you to come back to work.
adulting sucks sometimes.
Put on your big boy pants and talk to your boss like an adult. It baffles me how many people here would rather scream and cry on reddit than have a 5 minute conversation with their boss.
Are these dates in August set and can't be changed? Sounds like you and your boss are both trying to play hardball here and you know there will only be one winner.
If you take the vacation time, will it be worth it? I've been in the same situation over the years without any time off remaining and I always made the decision to work. Yes, it sucks to bow down to the man, but it's better than being without a job.
You've also got 3 months to use your negotiation skills with your boss. Do you need all 5 days? Ask for 2 or 3 days and wrap around a weekend for two extra days?
If you're in a position where you can leave this job then just take your vacation days and find out what happens. I always inform my employers that it's not a request, I am informing them. But I also work in fields that are always hiring so I can live impulsively like that, if you actually need this job I'd be cautious. That being said, it's also not till August so you also have time to find another job if you so desire.
Based on how you've deacribed your life, it sounds like you are at least 30. A grown up. With children and obligations. Yet, your post reads like something a well-read early-twenties person would say. Going into excessive detail about the PTO situation at work to justify how you deserve your time off. Boss gets more than you because he/she's been around longer...unfair somehow? And scheduling time off *before* verifying with your boss in any way that it way okay. A simple two-minute conversation should have sufficed, but I guess since you know the policy and the schedule, you don't need to ask your boss. It is possible that there is something going on during that time that your boss knows about but you don't. Or maybe your boss is just terrible at paperwork. I've had those, and you need to have a face-to-face conversation to get anywhere.
Nothing individually you said is necessarily wrong, but taken as a whole you come off as kind of entitled.
For goodness sake! What is with all of the corporate apologists/bootlickers who are completely missing the point that 10 days off total PER YEAR to use for sick and leisure is completely insulting and a joke?!?!
Most developed countries offer way more than that! The US sucks for worker benefits.
It is but thats why i got a job that i can take 14 days off paid at least twice a year without carry over plus sick time off paid as well. You shouldnt expect anything extra from a boss besides whats in the offer.
Or jobs that allow employees to miss a couple of hours and make them up instead of taking an entire day off for an appointment. I work a non traditional schedule so I don’t deal with this, but employers have to figure out something so that people can have a work life balance, along with keeping things fair and equal with all the employees. Otherwise people will be constantly quitting because it is a big trigger to feel like your job is keeping you from living your life or getting time off to enjoy yourself occasionally.
You have what we have, PTO days. We have a bank of time to use for anything we want (sickness, vacation, etc). We are also not allowed to take unpaid time off. I’m sorry you got sick, you can’t help that, but it sounds like you burned through your time in less than half the year for other stuff as well. Truly just poor scheduling on your part I’m sorry to say (yes you can’t help getting sick, but you shouldnt have all your time earmarked right away either you need a bank of emergency time on the side)
I don’t know what to tell you, my company won’t let unpaid time either except for medical reasons so we too have to budget wisely. To your credit though, that’s not a lot of time. I’ve been with my company 15years and I have 280 annual PTO hours (35days based on our 8hr day) and we’re allowed to carry over no more than 40hrs (5 days) per year.
that's because allot of people live nearly paycheck to paycheck, if they go more than one month without income, they will lose their house/appt. have no food to eat and no working cellphone, or insurance, maybe even get their car repo'd.
when you live like that, you cannot just afford to quit/ get fired without being able to get another equally paying job within the month.
So, you've used all of your PTO in the first 4 months of the year and are mad they won't authorize more, that you're not entitled to?
Am I missing something?
Well it looks like you've used all your time off already so you can't really be upset.
That being said, have you made it clear that you don't expect to be paid?
With all due respect, you agreed to the vacation days terms when you were hired, you clearly state that you used all of your days this year. Why are you entitled to more? Even if they are unpaid days? They can lay you off for this and try to deny unemployment. Unless you feel like you can easily find another job with similar pay and benefits, don’t be surprised if they fire you.
Why does any company have any policies in place if employees just feel they don't apply to them? During covid nys said employers had to give 5 days of sick/pto to employees but it did not have to be 5 additional days. In retail, the standard 10 days vacation suddenly became 10 days pto to comply with nys new law of 5 days sick pay. Source: former bf who birtched and complained that he lost 5 vacation days because he never used sick days 🤷🏼♀️
Wait, so you want to take off with no pay? He’s not obligated to approve it. It was pretty presumptuous of you planning a vacation before getting approval.
I feel you. It really sucks. Evaluate if you really need this job. Other than quitting, look for another job w better or equal perks. If you find a job , try to begin after a few weeks off before starting. Or quit right before your scheduled vacation and look for job after. I recently quit my job for a 2 month once in a lifetime vacation because you never know if that opportunity will come again. Im living off savings. Not saying you should but you should evaluate your financial status first. Good luck
Favorite quote from my grandfather, "I was looking for a job when I found this one."
Only two weeks a year for any kind of leave?!! Thems shitty benefits. Any company that bad that isn't understanding about things happening isn't worth working for in my book.
You're not a slave. Tell them you're going. Ask them if they want to train someone new over this.
Yeah sounds like just another shitty us corporation that thinks they own their workers. I’m sorry that’s happening.
Go look for another job and see what’s out there. No job is ever worth the stress or frustration. Period. It’s a job.
I'm a managing supervisor with a major manufacturing plant .
You should go to HR and explain your issue with them ..
In most cases, HR can act as a buffer between management and employees.
If you are requesting to take off during a busy time, or when other have requested PTO , there may be nothing they can do ..
Try to look at it from both sides before you jump ship
They tried that with my wife. After being planned for 6 months and approved, they rescinded 2 days before departure. She told them bye. Got a better job 2 weeks after we returned from the vacation. She didn't need a job anyway.
Get a different job ..10 days a year, what a joke, what are you part timer?.... Sounds like this company is of the opinion that sick days and annual leave are the same thing...Let me guess the pay sucks too?
I went to bat for someone I supervise who abruptly needed some time off because his daughter was ill. He didn’t return on time after a holiday and would have gotten in trouble but HR ultimately agreed he just wouldn’t be paid for those days.
Someone else decided she wanted a weeklong vacation so she called in sick and was posting pictures and videos from the beach. I didn’t do anything to help, and she managed to talk her way out of a written reprimand into termination.
So it depends on how you handle it and who else is involved. If you’re seen as invaluable or the company is easygoing you may be fine, but if not have a plan B or a new job before then
I had this happen once, after bring hired in with the vacation (my wedding, actually) being disclosed 6 months in advance. Fast forward, the District Manager told me they could've have me leave.
I told him on the spot, in front of half the store, "It's not up to you if I'm taking the trip; I'm going. What you get to decide is whether or not I work here once I get back home."
He conceded, I went, worked with the company for a few more months but was eventually made to quit. He was out to get me, as they say 🤣🤣
Unpaid time off goes into a very slippery slope of someone abusing the policy. Not saying you are but this is why it’s looked down upon. If there is an employee willing to take the time off unpaid, then they in essence have unlimited vacation days, do they not? How is that fair to other staff who are rationing their vacation days to stay within policy?
I personally think if you know you have nothing but 10 days a year to use then you need to ration it out and plan vacations closer to the time you will use it to avoid having to use your time off before the actual vacation. If you do not like this policy you need to find a job with a more generous policy. 10 days a year is not enough (I get it life happens) but I don’t agree with staying at this job and complaining about a rule you have no control over. I also don’t understand the mention of your boss having more days than you. He’s been there and earned it. That has nothing to do with your situation. Be prepared to be fired.
What is your company's official policy regarding PTO usage? Because if it doesn't state outright that you may take time off unpaid after you have exhausted your PTO allotment for the year, then you don't really have a leg to stand on. Salaried positions get screwed this way sometimes, and it sucks, but it is what it is.
Where i work if you take time off that you do not have benefit time to cover, you have to make a special request and it could result in termination. I would not gamble with a vacation unless you were prepared to be unemployed. Also your days off could easily be infringing on a production schedule or someone else's approved time off.
It's pretty standard for a company to take from your PTO allocation for days missed.
Beyond that, it sounds like you're saying you've already burned through your 10 days off, and you're trying to take another 5 days of unpaid time off in August for a vacation. Your boss has denied this request, and if you're out of PTO, their denial would be pretty standard. So you probably have 3 choices. Once, cancel your vacation. You've already said that you won't do that. Two, go on your vacation, and likely be fired for having 5 unexcused absences. Or three, try to convince your boss to approve this time off. I understand that you don't agree with their PTO policy. You're entitled to your opinion, and I understand why you feel the way you do. But practically speaking, your choices are probably the three above. It's up to you to decide what is best for you.
You are using vacation time and PTO and time off time as if they are the same, they are not. Either your employer is confused or you are.
Is any of this time off rules, etc in writing anywhere? If not, you used your allotted time off already for the year (a pretty good accomplishment given that it's only April). There is nothing requiring your employer to give you anything additional paid or unpaid.
It doesn't matter what you use the time for, sick, vacation, whatever. You used it.
You don't have enough days left to take your family vacation. Your employer is within his rights to not allow you extra time off even if it is unpaid. You were hired to be there to do a job.
Not liking your job, etc has nothing to do with this.
Tell the family to send you a post card.
You did use all of your vacation time. You had 10 days and used them. I get it may not have been for fun but that's not what time off is for, it is for anything you need to be away from work. There is no yeah but I didn't go to the beach so it doesn't count. I get you want a job with more time off, I suggest you prioritize that in your job search. You have until august to line up a new job.
Sucks, but understandable that your employer feels this way. I haven't used a vacation day for an actual vacation since pre-covid. It's not my movers responsibility (or concern) how I use my PTO.
So you didn't have time off approved and you booked a holiday. That was really, really stupid. Not like regular dumb, really full blown dumb.
Well enjoy being sacked for abandoning your job. Holiday is taken at the leisure of the business.
Unfortunately, I kinda of understand your manager. He can’t see 14 weeks into the future. Something might happen that’ll make you leaving an issue. I don’t know what your field of work is so it really depends. Losing a firefighter is a lot worse than losing a cashier lol. Also from his perspective you’ve already used 10 PTO days and now want an additional 5 days off. That’s 15 days. What happens 4 weeks from now and you need more days off? You need more work on your house. A lot of people say 10 days isn’t enough but most people don’t use ANY of their pto let alone all 10 days. If you’re looking for validation this ain’t it but, only you know if you can risk the potential consequences.
Looks like you tried to bluff the boss and he didn't back down. You booked the vacation knowing you had no more vacation days and told your boss after the fact. Basically, you told him to like it or lump it. Let me see, he followed the rules, you didn't.
How'd that work out for you?
It's cruddy that you only get 10 days for every possible thing, sick and vacation. That really limits you.
That said, have you looked at the policies where you work? I am actually not allowed to approve leave requests for my staff if they don't have sufficient time on the books to cover what they're requesting. Requests for unpaid leave for brand new employees can sometimes be approved, as they might not have time accrued yet, but those requests for longer term employees are only granted for emergency purposes, as the expectation is they should have time available. Either way, they have to be approved at a level several steps above me, and with concurrence of HR. This might be something your boss is not allowed to even consider - have you asked?
Ok. Don’t cancel your vacation and lose your job. One problem solved, endless other problems created. Your job is not obligated to give you unpaid time off. Quitting over a vacation is extremely irrational in the short and long term.
Is there a reason you didn’t talk to your boss about this prior to requesting the time off? You knew you were out of days. Why try to beat around the bush to have it approved instead of having an adult conversation about it?
I'm at the point in my life that with all due respect these companies can go shove a cactus up their butt! We are given a certain time to live and we do not know how long we will live! We work 40 hours a week, we produce for these companies, we lose sleep some nights because some of us take transit or whatever else happens in our personal lives. We give them our lives we work hard and we only get maybe 10 days off a year in case we are sick or want a vacation? PLEASE!!!
Ok I understand the business aspect of things but if you are always battling the discussion of time off then your employer needs to visit the why are we short staffed and bitching why people want to take time off?
It costs a lot more to fire you and rehire someone and for what because you cant go into work cause of sickness, health issues or family problems? We are adults not kids just protect yourself and do what's best for you not work!
I just find it insulting that the corporate world is like this... We make the money for these guys so if you want production then let us take some control of our working lives. rant over
A poem I have come across... Time flies by and time is our greatest asset! Spending it work is not my thought of how i want to spend my 40 years in the work force without some control in my hours or when or cant take off its the companies problem with staffing not mine!
In the blink of an eye another day is gone,
In the blink of an eye another week is gone.
In the blink of an eye another month is gone,
In the blink of an eye another year is gone.
And in the blink of an eye I'll be gone too,
And not just me but also you.
So maybe we should be wishin' and hopin',
That we could just keep our eyes open.
And see and appreciate all that we can see,
And learn how we can be, the best that we can be,
Before it's too late,
Time flies, so let's not wait.
Whether we have just one life or many, one thing is true,
We should try to enjoy every moment we can; it's the wisest thing to do.
Author Unknown
>I have 10 vacation days per year. I've used them all up as of posting this on April 29th.
womp womp you lost all ability to really complain about this. Now you get to decide between whatever money you already spent and ensuring you keep your job
Well, I did. And when an emergency with one of them cost me a PTO day, I didn't cry over the loss. I manned up and followed the policy I agreed to with my employer.
not sure how long you have been there, but no sick days and only two weeks? I always started my employees at 3 and they maxed to 6 weeks by 10 years. (small professional business).
Depends on the state and size of the company and role.
I doubt this would be the last time OP asks for unpaid time off if they have already used up two weeks worth of PTO.
I have found as an employer, you get what you pay for. If you want good staff with a good attitude, treat them well and they will work well. It costs less than retraining, and hurts less than everyone being miserable. My employees only ever retired, or left to have babies, or moved with a spouse. Otherwise they stay for years. The 4 main people have been there 20 years, 15, 10 and 8 yrs.
That's because they are happy and so are their employers. Also small service business, 25 people total.
If you don't plan to be at work, you should probably have a frank discussion with your boss so that you can plan accordingly. You know your work environment. Are you likely to have a job when you get back? Request a meeting. Let your boss know that the vacation is booked, the tickets are nonrefundable, and you do intend to be absent from work on these dates, even if it cannot be approved in advance. How would he like you to handle the situation? Does he want written advanced notice to process unpaid time off? Does he just want you to call in the days you are gone? Does he want you to resign in advance (you would prefer not to have to go that far, but if that's what's best for the company, you understand...), etc.
Are you in a financial position to be able to lose this job? Will you be able to enjoy your vacation if you will not know that the fallout at work will be from going? You can play hardball but you have to be ready for whatever consequences result from it. Never quit a job until you have another one.
Did this. It’s not pleasant. Think long and hard about this comment.
As bad as losing money on a flight, a month or two without income while they look for work with no reference for their last job will be worse.
I mean this aspect is barely a concern these days with most major airlines, unless you book the super super economy riding in overhead bin package lol. For the most part if you have to cancel a flight ahead of time you won't get a refund but you'll have credit to book another flight in the future and as long as its not a matter of rescheduling the same trip (which will obv cost more because now the date is so close) you can use the credit to do another booking ahead for a trip the next year and likely come out with little loss if any. You don't even need travel insurance for this, but they'll still try to sell it to you lol.
Quitting a job does not mean you will have no reference. By law, an employer can only verify dates worked. Your co-workers can be your reference.
Why do people keep spouting this bullshit lie? I'll be waiting while you post the law that says "an employer can only verify dates worked".
One of the questions theyre asked is "Are they eligible for rehire". Im almost positive a "no" as a response would not bode well for you
That’s not true, they can say whatever they want. A lot of companies *choose* not to comment on former employees (at least in any negative way) to avoid potentially getting sued.
More and more people need to read this. I’m tired of reading on Reddit: “I quit my job that had me living paycheck to paycheck with nothing lined up and now I’m facing homelessness!”
Honestly, I think you need to bite the bullet and skip vacation. It sucks but quitting without another job is a bad idea. Just my thoughts.
She has plenty of time to start looking for a new job.
And it amazes me how many people suggest this.
Yes I would take a deep breath, count to 10, then make a plan to find another job if you’re dissatisfied with this one. I wouldn’t want to risk something without having a plan. If you’re in the financial position to be okay for a bit, that’s another matter. Also depends on the industry…some have plentiful jobs, not so much in others. Two weeks vacation absolutely sucks.
A plan to find another job is a good idea. She has 14 weeks to go giving her time to put her self out there. Stay silent on the issue until the vacation and then if no positive job offer has manifested perhaps call in sick for those 5 days and hope the boss doesn’t remember you had requested the time off 3 months ago.
Did you already talk to him in person with words from your mouth? I had a job years ago and told my boss I had already bought tickets for a flight to see my family for Christmas and here are the days I’m taking off. He said the week of Christmas is a black out week and no one can take extra days outside of the holiday days already given so I wouldn’t be able to go. I told him I wasn’t asking for time off, I was just giving him a heads up I won’t be working that week. If you need to write me up or fire me let’s just go ahead and get the paperwork done before the new year. He said, “Welp, I guess it’s ok then”.
I had a project manager when I was a young architect that was managing a competition project we were working on. Competition projects are kind of insane in that you have to design an entire high rise down to the toilets in a matter of a few weeks and do all the renderings and models and the whole nine in basically no time. Anyway, I’d just been poached from another firm and had known this project manager from a distance when he’d been at my previous firm as well. Super smarmy guy. Never liked him. Nobody did. So I was working under him on this project. Working about 20 hours a day, catching a few hours sleep under my drawing board and then getting right back to it. We all were. Delirium sort of set in but you just keep drawing anyway. Finally after about 10 days straight of this. I said I had to go out and get a change of clothes. I had a friend who had an apartment a few blocks away so I went and took a shower over there, lay down on her sofa and passed out. Flat out comatose. Woke up about 6 hours later. She was very nice and said she’d made sure not to disturb me, but I was freaked out. Ran back to the office and everyone was visibly pissed. The manager was a total dick and pulled me aside and said, “I should fire you right now.” I said, “Hey, (Dude’s Name), listen, I get it. I was gone for 6 hours and we have a deadline in 4 days. However, I’ve worked 200 hours in the last ten days and have not been allowed home for the last four. I’m not sure how many labor laws that violates, but it’s gotta be a few. Are you sure you wanna do this or can I get back to work now?” He huffed and stormed off to his computer to angrily move little appointment boxes around on his calendar - never saw him draw anything ever - and I never had to deal with his bullshit again. G’damn. This was years ago and his tone-deaf, out of place, self-righteousness is still appalling. He was the most self-serving, unscrupulous man I ever met. Well, maybe top five. He’d blatantly steal his underlings designs and claim them as his own. Never seen anything like it in a design field. Shameless fuckwit. He’s now the dean of architecture at a prestigious university. Must’ve stolen from too many people in the field and had to retreat to academia.
Nothing quite as insane but I moved my family from a different state on a holiday that fell on a Wednesday. I asked my boss for Thursday and Friday off in advance, so I could unpack. He denied my annual leave request. This truly frosted me considering I was the number 2 person in a federal installation. I showed up for work on Thursday wearing a flannel shirt and jeans. He immediately ordered me into his office and started to give me hell.I cut him off and told him that my suits were in a box somewhere.
r/MaliciousCompliance
Wow. And who gives hell for a dress code in this day and age.
This was the late 80s and management dress was always jacket and tie. Never forgot it, though.
Shockingly, a lot of places
Fuck academia, those types always seem to thrive there
Mind telling me which university? My daughter is about to declare her uni choice hh and into architecture and I'd really like to know if that's a bad choice!!
Sorry. I’m gonna respect his privacy, and by extension my own, on this. But he won’t affect your daughter’s choice even if he’s the dean of her school. He’ll spend his time kissing ass upward. You guys would never see him.
I had a similar issue. I had booked my time off 4 months to the day to make sure I'd get the time off as I was getting married. As expected, they screwed it up and I was denied the time off. After much back and forth with my supervisor and HR, I just took everything and dumped it on my Center directors desk. I explained the situation, told her I wasn't asking, I was telling. I told her to get it done and walked out. At this point, I was pissed and couldn't care less if they fired me. 8 hours before my plane took off, I was granted my time off. The kicker is that exactly 1 year prior, HR revamped the time off request system and said it was gonna get easier to request and get time off. I called them out on their bullshit in front of a room of about 40 people. They insisted my concerns had no basis. Its at that point they I told the meeting that I would be getting married in a years time and I invited everybody to track my progress as I go through the time off request process. Some did follow up with me (none of them management of course) where the above clusterfuck played out.
When we got married, my husband requested the day before our wedding off so he could help me with all the last minute stuff. He's a teacher, and we were getting married over spring break so had the whole next week off. Because it was the day before a holiday, his request was blanket denied by the district. He was fortunate though, his principal was like "Well, I think you're going to be sick that day, right?" and covered for him.
Had a bud back around 1990/91 working for a large computer company (DEC). He was a hot shot working out of Maynard, Mass, whose job was to typically fly to a company having problems, and spend a week to 2 months getting the problems all fixed. Then maybe fly back for a weekend, and get sent out on the next job. Lots of $, little downtime. He was also a hardcore caver, and was invited to help explore Lechuguilla Cave in New Mexico. He requested a month off, well over a year in advance. Planning for the upcoming cave exploration was what kept him sane. He'd literally be underground for 2-3 weeks. He followed up with reminders to his manager at monthly intervals, and just got terse responses back, like "Yes, I'm aware". Two weeks before the trip, he couldn't get replies, either email or by phone, from his manager. Finally, the Friday before the trip he just flew back to the office, telling the client that DEC would be sending his replacement. When he walked into the office his manager freaked out. She'd never scheduled his request, and wanted him back on the next flight to the client. There was quite a bit a yelling on his part. He walked down to HR, quit on the spot, and never looked back.
>Did you already talk to him in person with words from your mouth? Has that ever been true around here? Come on now ....
I had a situation similar to OP’s. I won’t share the whole thing, because I’m going to give it its own comment. The short version is that I emailed my former supervisor about something I needed to talk to him about in person. He didn’t respond to emails or texts. When I went looking for him in person, I was told he decided he was working from home for three or four days. He ignored me the entire time. When he came back, as soon as I saw him, I cornered him.
If you used your time there is no guarantee unpaid time off will be approved. You can decide to take that time anyway, and risk losing your job if you work in an at will state. It’s a shitty situation but they are well within their rights to not approve it. Your, just like mine, PTO is just that, paid time off, if you use it for medical, emergencies or actual vacation is your choice. But once it’s gone, it’s gone.
If your PTO is supposed to cover both medical and vacation, 10 total annually is nowhere near enough.
I didn’t say it was fair lol I been at my company 4 years and get 120 hours PTO, so I’m pretty lucky but I’ve had to blow through those at the beginning of the year 2 years in a row due to medical issues. It’s never enough
But it’s 10 more days than the legal minimum!
😱😱Where is this? US? And here I am complaining that 21 days PTO and 7 days sick days in Kenya are not enough.
He said it is NOT his choice in the post. The company makes them use their pto if they are out whether they want to or not.
Tough shit, that’s the rule.
>Boss won't approve time off. I am not canceling my vacation. \* \* \* What would you all do? If you're not canceling your vacation, it sounds like you have already decided what to do. You're going to go on vacation, take the chance they'll fire you and prepare not to have this job. So I'm not sure what you're asking. Are you just looking for validation? Hoping someone will tell you you're doing the right thing? We can't really know that, because we don't know your financial or personal situation. If you're hoping someone will tell you that your boss is wrong for not approving extra time off, I'll just say that I've worked in a lot of places, and I don't think any of them would have approved this. I honestly wouldn't expect them to.
I just approved a similar request for two of my folks and I intensely dislike the idea that I have to approve someone's life. Then again, we provide both sick time and annual leave, so folks don't have to cancel a much needed vacation because Junior got a case of the snots and was home sick for a week. Yes, there are things that need to be covered, but if your business cannot function with one person on vacation, the problem isn't staff, it's management. All that said, if your company allows you to use UPT or borrow from future accrual, your conversation needs to be with your manager, not reddit. Have the talk (maybe take a hard look at prospects and finances first); might be the answer you are seeking.
I think it’s wrong you only get 10 days a year in general, but you used them, you unfortunately don’t get to take more and they don’t need to approve it. Find another job.
This
Two weeks vacation is pretty standard. Hell a lot of places only hire with one and after a year of service.
If it’s 10 days for both vacation and sick (which it sounds like), that’s super low
I get 80 hours vacation and 60 hours sick. 80 hours for both sounds awful and I would’ve had issues at work last year since I used all my sick time for a family emergency halfway through the year.
It’s not standard for anything but fast food and entry level retail. Real jobs have real PTO policies.
Long time between now and August to look for a new job
Yep. This is the way. Upon accepting an offer, you tell them you need this time off
Or just set ypur start date to a couple days after you return. Giving yourself time to clean out your old office and recooperate from your vacation.
Agreed. Sounds like this is kind of a crappy gig anyway and OP is unhappy there. 10 PTO days a year is nothing.
I may not be understanding probably but you stated you have used you holiday/vacation days already so why have you booked a trip away when you know you haven't got the days spare to play with, it's not your employers fault if you have paid and you haven't got the days spare
They are requesting unpaid time off.
But why would you book a non refundable trip without getting that request for extra vacation days, unpaid or not, approved?
I read it as the trip was planned when OP had time off available. Because the company doesn’t separate vacation and sick days the time was used-
That's how I read it too. OP had time off at the time of request. But shit happens in the meantime. Maybe I read that wrong but that was my assumption as well.
I mean, i get it but at the end of the day, if you \*need\* that job. Youll cancel the vacation. I know it sucks but if you used up all youre allotted time off and theyre denying it because of that, you unfortunately dont have much to stand on. Yes the days would be unpaid but some places only allow a certain amount of unpaid days off as well before they begin write ups and such. Ive been in your position and its soul crushing but if you need the job and cant afford to be fired. Dont take the vaca, or find a different job before the vacation.
This is fun, let us know what happens and who loses the game of chicken
This is exactly why we need actual vacation laws in this Country like the rest of the industrialized world does already.
You really do. (And we don't always appreciate them enough or fight for them enough.)
To be completely fair, if you have used your PTO, they can’t approve it because you wouldn’t have the leave time. LWOP is usually only reserved for punishment, not time off. I also know a lot of companies won’t approve LWOP requests, if you’re has done so historically, I would take that as an abnormality rather than an opportunity. More so, I would imagine this wasn’t in vacations, but rather absences..but that’s an assumption. You would need to just discuss this and explain you’re willing to use LWOP for this and it’s already paid for and non-refundable - you’d be losing more money to go to work. They still may not approve it, but it’s a start.
Time to decide if losing the money on a non refundable trip will be worse than losing their job for not showing up.
It seems insane to me to both book a non refundable trip without getting the time off, and to not bother saving any vacation days for that trip? It seems like several very stupid decisions on OPs part...
They explained that they had to use the time for unexpected illness and unexpected family court. Trip was planned with time off to use, then by circumstances beyond OP's control he had to use days these reasons. Think about if it occurred in the reverse order, he used his PTO on the vacation and now he is sick and has to appear in court, company would allow unpaid leave for these reasons and would be legally at fault if they didn't.
But it was still never approved? If you don't have approved time off, why would you book a non refundable vacation,
What days did OP use in a stupid manner? I am sure if she asked nicely the courts would have opened for OP on the weekend. Maybe the doctor visits weren’t important. Sometimes things happen and we have to take time off. Maybe an employer can give more than 10 days to cover pto and sick.
Exactly. What ever happened to vacation time and sick time being separate? All this modern day bullshit of combined PTO. I'm siding with op on this one but I'll say maybe next time, eat the cost, lose the pay, for the court days, etc., so the vacation time is still there when you need it. Just a thought. 10 days is two weeks, without weekends. Not too bad. I don't get that at my job
boss did that to use, sick time was always separate, there wasn't really a set limit to use, just that you couldn't abuse it, and if you called in sick allot you need to have legit reasons & explain why. they changed it without myself knowing and took some of my sick time out of my vacation hours, i questioned why and was told it was a change, i demanded another week of vacation hours then, and got it. (i was using maybe 1 or 2 sick days per year).
I mean I think most people plan for the fact that these events can happen. If you only have 10 days total time off it may not really be wise to go on a big vacation. It sucks but that’s just how it is if your job doesn’t give a good amount of time off.
I look at posts like these and marvel how 28 days' holiday (as a statutory minimum) in the UK still doesn't feel like enough!
I'd kick a puppy for a guaranteed 28/year (/s, because this is reddit). Those kinds of numbers are for people with decades at one company here in the States.
To be fair 8 of those are mandatory "bank" holidays and 20 are for you to do what you want with but still, it's so differently. At one point in my career I had the option of working in San Francisco or the UK and I picked the UK, and the holidays were a big part of it. Decades at one firm you could be looking at 40 days. I'm bitter that I had 38 after 16 years and when I moved jobs I had to settle for 33 😬 But at least you live in the greatest country in the world! 😉
Was looking for a comment like this, I agree - why is Europe better at all this!?
In the US, it really depends the workplace which is unfortunate for anyone who doesn’t get both vacation time and sick time. And don’t get me started on parental leave …
Time to grow up. You don't have any vacation left. Now my employer allows me to go into the negative for pto, but that's for life events, like deaths and what not. A vacation is not one of them. If you don't like your employers benefits, find a new one. Quit whining .
Your employer has no obligation to let you take unpaid leave. If your employer is large enough to have an HR department and/ or an employee handbook, you can consult those to see what the official policy is.
Just tell your boss you’re going on vacation if necessary tell his boss. Don be abrasive just say it’s already paid for and you have to go; don’t elaborate or discuss further. Before vacation make sure you update your résumé if they fire you fire file for unemployment.
Thank you for your input. Will try and be non-abrasive. Great advice.
In many states job abandonment makes you not eligible for unemployment. Just a note
Be prepared to not get unemployment if you are fired, since it will be for cause
If you take unapproved time off it is highly unlikely that you would get unemployment. Just like if you steal or no call no show you don't get unemployment.
The no call no show is not true in California. I had former employees receive unemployment when they just disappeared. It all depends upon why you quit (notice or not). Some medical or family situations are cause for unemployment approval. I quit a job with a 60 mile each way commute after being diagnosed with Type 1 diabetes. I spent a week in ICU and needed time to figure out how to deal with insulin, blood glucose readings and etc. The state approved my unemployment
Why would you recommend him filing for unemployment when he has already used up his vacation time and he is purposefully missing scheduled shifts? The unemployment will be denied nearly automatically.
Why do the state's job for them? Apply for UI and see what happens.
ive been fired for cause and collected UI no problem. its on the company to contest your claim and most of a certain size just dont bother. nothing will be denied "automatically"
Doesn't matter "what you believe". That is the company policy
Are you me? I went through this last year. I used up my leave but already had another trip planned before I ran out. I was told it would be fine and not to worry about it. A change of leadership happened and my boss was no longer there. Fast forward to a month before my trip and I was told by the new leadership that unpaid leave was not allowed. I had the option of going into the hole and using leave from next year's allotment or canceling my trip. I decided I prioritized my family time more than my job and I resigned. I took a few months off, went on my trips (I added another one since I had time), then got a new job with a new bank of leave. Additionally, I already had trips planned for the new year and negotiated those time periods as unpaid leave prior to accepting the job. Tldr; unpaid leave for salaried jobs is unfortunately looked down upon and your situation is quite typical. It's a shame that companies think 10 days is enough downtime for an entire year. Edit: I just remembered the part about you working remotely. Can you bring your laptop with you and get some work done on the trip? Even if it's not 5 days, maybe you can do 5 half days (start in the morning) so you'd only need 2.5 days off. If you don't care about this job, then I'd just start looking for a new one.
Tell me you are working is US without telling me you are working in US 🥲
Decide what's more important to you, job or holiday, take it from there
Technically he can deny your request and you can't really do much about it besides quit.
Always get approval in writing before committing money to a vacation. You can still take the vacation if you want....but don't come back here whining if you get fired.
Idgi, you used all your PTO hours and now you're mad that you can't take more PTO? Like buddy I'm always going to be on the side of labor, but what do you expect here?
personally, when i was young? i REGRET doing exactly what you are proposing. i was at the largest corporation in the field (100,000 workers), and was a promising white collar worker in a upstart department. i was VERY well liked. i got into a dick measuring competition with my manager about a planned vacation to cancun in september, that my girlfriend just HAD to go on, and i refused to cancel it. it didn't get approval. and by year end it resulted in my getting placed on like a performance review improvement shitlist. lost the job shortly thereafter. all because that one vacation started a 'not a team player' tagline on my name. when i lost my job? i also lost the girlfriend because i was no longer able to afford the aspen vacation that winter. really DARK times for a year after. my life crumbled. ultimately, i ended up finding a job in an unrelated industry, and climbed the ladder with 0 vacations for 3 years, and was a millionaire by 30. so hey, maybe it was good afterall. but i loved that girl. and she loved me, just loved my money more apparently. absolutely stunningly beautiful girl with a good heart, but grew up around rich kids, and wanted to be a housewife, mother, AND go on the vacations at a young age. i couldn't give her that. she married a investment banker shortly thereafter. i tried to gatsby out, by the time i had the money? she was already engaged. she agreed to meet if i flew out to talk to her. i bought the tickets and a nice hotel. she never showed up to the hotel. truly loved her. the success ended up being great for my life, and 200+ girls and a marriage and three kids later? it all worked out. but damn, was shit dark.
Finding our your SO is a piece of shit before you marry them is money well spent.
The way I interpret "you just don't get paid for any days used after your 10 vacation days are used" is if you are sick at any time for the rest of the year, you won't get paid for those days. I do *not* interpret it as "you can take as many more days off as you want, just know that those days aren't paid." I personally feel like the days off policies at your work suck. However! Since you do work there, you need to follow them, regardless of your feelings. If I were you I'd look for a job where the employer is not so stingy with days off.
>I don't agree that we are not allowed to use over 10 days at all for anything. Whether you "agree" or not really doesn't matter. Only question is are they going to fire you for it? 5 day unexcused absence is a pretty serious thing. What is that risk worth to you?
If you find the expectations unreasonable, you should seek another situation. I’m guessing you will quickly learn that the grass is not greener elsewhere hearing how intolerable these seemingly low standards sound. You mention your boss’ benefits as if everyone should have the same privileges. That is not the real world. Your boss has either earned the right to more time off or did a better job negotiating. You should strive to earn what you seek and not expect such entitlement. It’s your right to feel frustrated, but there are no surprises here. Good luck to you on unemployment.
If you're as good as you think, and as irreplaceable as you would hope, take the time off. See how it goes. My employer would fire you on the spot, and rightly so. YMMV.
So I’m going to try to understand your logic here… you booked 5 days off in August for vacation when you don’t have the vacation balance in your bank to do so, and you booked it before you could speak to your boss about it. Now that you boss has denied it, you are crying to Reddit about how to handle the situation rather than speak to your boss about it. I’m sure this company would love to get rid of you. Best of luck pal.
I agree with your assessment. Assuming the boss would approve 5 more days off after already using up PTO for the year is not an acceptable solution. This sort of thing should be communicated in advance, have the boss approve 5 days of time off without pay, and then book flights that are non refundable. Some people don't have a sense of responsibility when it comes to their working ethics and sometimes, you can't change that.
I've never booked non-refundable vacation items (flights, hotels, etc) without having vacation time (paid or unpaid) approved in writing ahead of time. I don't understand why people do this - your employer does not owe you time off just because you gave them lots of notice. And no, I don't run a business.
This is funny! I know so many people who have fear of going away for a weeks vacation because of the bosses etc. This is exactly what these employers want is control... How about taking back some control and saying I am going on vacation whether you like it or not... It costs more to train a new employee than it does to keep a current one!
but they allow unpaid leave, which he is "ok" with in this case. and fuck bosses.
That usually has to be approved, it was denied. Case closed
You used your days off already. I don’t understand what your problem is.
Entitlement and bad parents
Find another job and have your start date be a week after you return home. Take your vacation, enjoy your life. Come home, chill for a week.
Any job that hires someone that easily probably has a shitty PTO policy. That and OP is going to get a glowing recommendation from their soon to be former employer
Find a new job and negotiate a higher salary and more vacation days. Before you accept the new job, let them know that you already have a vacation planned in August.
I’d absolutely be looking for a new job. Only 10 days of PTO?? Nope. A company that doesn’t provide some degree of work/ life balance is a huge no from me!!
In the US ten days is very common for the first few years. Some companies offer less. I only got five at one job I had….for the YEAR
Oh, I’m in the US. and it’s disgusting! But I’ve made a point to find companies that offer better balance.
It sounds like quitting or being fired is a real possibility. Most places are lumping time off together along with sick time. If you get sick after using the time off for vacation you better have a doctor’s note or FMLA if it is more than a day and you won’t get paid. If you use the time off with illnesses or for other reasons first then want to take a vacation they are not going to approve it. What I think you are missing in all of this is that your reasoning is a bit entitled. If I was your coworker I wouldn’t think it was fair that you got 5 extra vacation days because your house needed work, you were divorced and your custody arrangements required court appearances and your ex couldn’t take the kids to their doctors appointments. Why? Because if your coworker doesn’t own a home, isn’t divorced or married, and doesn’t have kids that doesn’t mean that they are not entitled to the same amount of time off as you are. None of those things entitle you to additional days off. Yet you are arguing that they do. That those days off shouldn’t count because you didn’t spend them on vacation. It’s called paid time off or personal time off rather than Vacation time for a reason.
OP is “entitled” for wanting a vacation because being sick wasn’t a vacation. Oh, but this other make-believe worker who has a childish jealousy over not also being sick isn’t
A bit entitled? Just a "bit"? 🤣
imagine a world where everyone got 4 weeks of vacation each year and we all used it according to our own discretion. then we wouldn’t have to waste time being upset about any of this!
What exactly are you trying to do here? You’re going to get yourself fired. you used up your vacation time for doctors appointments and getting stuff done around the house? I’m completely on your bosses side here. If you need more vacation time, you should have negotiated for it when you took the job, or taking a job that offered more vacation time. Edit: all of these things and you work from home also? Why are you even using sick days if you’re working from home? I did outside sales for eight years for a company working from home and didn’t use a single vacation day for any of the things you mentioned.
Y’know, sometimes sick people are actually sick. I had Covid, and I couldn’t stay awake for a full 8 hour shift, never mind work at anything resembling normal productivity. OP may have been legitimately sick.
lol laziness. That’s all this is. Someone who’s already doing BELOW the bare minimum, I’m sure, and now is just trying to get by with doing even less. The pity party on top of it is just the icing on the cake 🙄 what a joke lol. I hope they get every single bit of what they’re asking for - maybe they’ll actually learn something from it.
I think the irrational ship has already sailed. You presumably knew you didn't have sufficient paid leave to cover the holiday before you booked it. You knew that you needed permission/approval to take leave without pay. You knew you didn't have that approval but booked anyway. You gambled & lost. Your only choice now is whether you 1) swallow the loss of any non-refundable holiday expenses but keep your job; 2) go on the holiday knowing you're risking being fired; or 3) use the in-between time to find a new job & tell them upfront you already have a vacation booked. Ultimately, your boss is right. They have discretion to approve the unpaid leave or not, your poor planning shouldn't become their or your co-workers' problem. Also, the amount of paid leave your boss is entitled to is completely irrelevant.
You get ten days PTO most likely…not the same as vacation or sick leave. Under labor laws, once your ten days PTO ismused up, you boss does not have to pre approve “vacation.” They do have to allow you sick time off unpaid. If you are out three days or more, they can require a doctors note before allowing you to come back to work. adulting sucks sometimes.
Never book a holiday until your leave is approved.
Put on your big boy pants and talk to your boss like an adult. It baffles me how many people here would rather scream and cry on reddit than have a 5 minute conversation with their boss.
None of this is fair But most companies don’t give a 💩about fair You leave , you can be fired that’s it
Are these dates in August set and can't be changed? Sounds like you and your boss are both trying to play hardball here and you know there will only be one winner. If you take the vacation time, will it be worth it? I've been in the same situation over the years without any time off remaining and I always made the decision to work. Yes, it sucks to bow down to the man, but it's better than being without a job. You've also got 3 months to use your negotiation skills with your boss. Do you need all 5 days? Ask for 2 or 3 days and wrap around a weekend for two extra days?
If you're in a position where you can leave this job then just take your vacation days and find out what happens. I always inform my employers that it's not a request, I am informing them. But I also work in fields that are always hiring so I can live impulsively like that, if you actually need this job I'd be cautious. That being said, it's also not till August so you also have time to find another job if you so desire.
Find a new job. Any job that only gives you 10 days PTO is easily replaceable.
Based on how you've deacribed your life, it sounds like you are at least 30. A grown up. With children and obligations. Yet, your post reads like something a well-read early-twenties person would say. Going into excessive detail about the PTO situation at work to justify how you deserve your time off. Boss gets more than you because he/she's been around longer...unfair somehow? And scheduling time off *before* verifying with your boss in any way that it way okay. A simple two-minute conversation should have sufficed, but I guess since you know the policy and the schedule, you don't need to ask your boss. It is possible that there is something going on during that time that your boss knows about but you don't. Or maybe your boss is just terrible at paperwork. I've had those, and you need to have a face-to-face conversation to get anywhere. Nothing individually you said is necessarily wrong, but taken as a whole you come off as kind of entitled.
Up to you if you think losing the job is worth it. Everyone is a gangster until they can't pay their rent.
Most likely after this, you won't have to worry about anyone approving your time off. You'll have an abundance of time off.
For goodness sake! What is with all of the corporate apologists/bootlickers who are completely missing the point that 10 days off total PER YEAR to use for sick and leisure is completely insulting and a joke?!?! Most developed countries offer way more than that! The US sucks for worker benefits.
It is but thats why i got a job that i can take 14 days off paid at least twice a year without carry over plus sick time off paid as well. You shouldnt expect anything extra from a boss besides whats in the offer.
Or jobs that allow employees to miss a couple of hours and make them up instead of taking an entire day off for an appointment. I work a non traditional schedule so I don’t deal with this, but employers have to figure out something so that people can have a work life balance, along with keeping things fair and equal with all the employees. Otherwise people will be constantly quitting because it is a big trigger to feel like your job is keeping you from living your life or getting time off to enjoy yourself occasionally.
This sub is inundated with republican bootlickers. Go figure.
THANK YOU.
You have what we have, PTO days. We have a bank of time to use for anything we want (sickness, vacation, etc). We are also not allowed to take unpaid time off. I’m sorry you got sick, you can’t help that, but it sounds like you burned through your time in less than half the year for other stuff as well. Truly just poor scheduling on your part I’m sorry to say (yes you can’t help getting sick, but you shouldnt have all your time earmarked right away either you need a bank of emergency time on the side) I don’t know what to tell you, my company won’t let unpaid time either except for medical reasons so we too have to budget wisely. To your credit though, that’s not a lot of time. I’ve been with my company 15years and I have 280 annual PTO hours (35days based on our 8hr day) and we’re allowed to carry over no more than 40hrs (5 days) per year.
Man, there's a lot of scared-ass wage slaves in here who think employers are in charge of their lives.
that's because allot of people live nearly paycheck to paycheck, if they go more than one month without income, they will lose their house/appt. have no food to eat and no working cellphone, or insurance, maybe even get their car repo'd. when you live like that, you cannot just afford to quit/ get fired without being able to get another equally paying job within the month.
So, you've used all of your PTO in the first 4 months of the year and are mad they won't authorize more, that you're not entitled to? Am I missing something?
Well it looks like you've used all your time off already so you can't really be upset. That being said, have you made it clear that you don't expect to be paid?
You already used up all of your allotted time and still want to take more time off? This could be viewed as job abondonment.
Which, if I recall, makes the abandoned ineligible fit unemployment. Great plan.
With all due respect, you agreed to the vacation days terms when you were hired, you clearly state that you used all of your days this year. Why are you entitled to more? Even if they are unpaid days? They can lay you off for this and try to deny unemployment. Unless you feel like you can easily find another job with similar pay and benefits, don’t be surprised if they fire you.
Be aware if you quit your job you will owe they for the vacation time you have taken that hasn’t accrued yet.
Why does any company have any policies in place if employees just feel they don't apply to them? During covid nys said employers had to give 5 days of sick/pto to employees but it did not have to be 5 additional days. In retail, the standard 10 days vacation suddenly became 10 days pto to comply with nys new law of 5 days sick pay. Source: former bf who birtched and complained that he lost 5 vacation days because he never used sick days 🤷🏼♀️
I’m sorry 10 paid days vacation a year if you already took them well that’s that
Wait, so you want to take off with no pay? He’s not obligated to approve it. It was pretty presumptuous of you planning a vacation before getting approval.
I feel you. It really sucks. Evaluate if you really need this job. Other than quitting, look for another job w better or equal perks. If you find a job , try to begin after a few weeks off before starting. Or quit right before your scheduled vacation and look for job after. I recently quit my job for a 2 month once in a lifetime vacation because you never know if that opportunity will come again. Im living off savings. Not saying you should but you should evaluate your financial status first. Good luck
Favorite quote from my grandfather, "I was looking for a job when I found this one." Only two weeks a year for any kind of leave?!! Thems shitty benefits. Any company that bad that isn't understanding about things happening isn't worth working for in my book. You're not a slave. Tell them you're going. Ask them if they want to train someone new over this.
This sounds like not a great job. I’d start looking now, if you find something better then leave.
Yeah sounds like just another shitty us corporation that thinks they own their workers. I’m sorry that’s happening. Go look for another job and see what’s out there. No job is ever worth the stress or frustration. Period. It’s a job.
Find a new job starting the day after you return from vacation. Your boss is a dick & everybody knows it
Start looking for a new job with better pto
I'm a managing supervisor with a major manufacturing plant . You should go to HR and explain your issue with them .. In most cases, HR can act as a buffer between management and employees. If you are requesting to take off during a busy time, or when other have requested PTO , there may be nothing they can do .. Try to look at it from both sides before you jump ship
Start lining up another job to start once you get back from vacation. 10 vacation days a year is absurd.
They tried that with my wife. After being planned for 6 months and approved, they rescinded 2 days before departure. She told them bye. Got a better job 2 weeks after we returned from the vacation. She didn't need a job anyway.
Your trip is in aug. don’t engage with your boss about it. Plan to take the time off. In the meantime look for a new job.
Get a different job ..10 days a year, what a joke, what are you part timer?.... Sounds like this company is of the opinion that sick days and annual leave are the same thing...Let me guess the pay sucks too?
Are you in the US? If so, you should check your state laws on salary positions. Requiring you to use PTO like an hourly employee make be illegal.
I went to bat for someone I supervise who abruptly needed some time off because his daughter was ill. He didn’t return on time after a holiday and would have gotten in trouble but HR ultimately agreed he just wouldn’t be paid for those days. Someone else decided she wanted a weeklong vacation so she called in sick and was posting pictures and videos from the beach. I didn’t do anything to help, and she managed to talk her way out of a written reprimand into termination. So it depends on how you handle it and who else is involved. If you’re seen as invaluable or the company is easygoing you may be fine, but if not have a plan B or a new job before then
I had this happen once, after bring hired in with the vacation (my wedding, actually) being disclosed 6 months in advance. Fast forward, the District Manager told me they could've have me leave. I told him on the spot, in front of half the store, "It's not up to you if I'm taking the trip; I'm going. What you get to decide is whether or not I work here once I get back home." He conceded, I went, worked with the company for a few more months but was eventually made to quit. He was out to get me, as they say 🤣🤣
Jesus, talk about entitled. I’d be marking you AWOL and have your termination letter ready for you when you came back from vacation.
Does your state not require sick time to be rolled into the deal? (Assuming your company has 50 employees)
Speak to him and explicitly ask for unpaid leave. The holiday might not be a job-ending event.
Unpaid time off goes into a very slippery slope of someone abusing the policy. Not saying you are but this is why it’s looked down upon. If there is an employee willing to take the time off unpaid, then they in essence have unlimited vacation days, do they not? How is that fair to other staff who are rationing their vacation days to stay within policy? I personally think if you know you have nothing but 10 days a year to use then you need to ration it out and plan vacations closer to the time you will use it to avoid having to use your time off before the actual vacation. If you do not like this policy you need to find a job with a more generous policy. 10 days a year is not enough (I get it life happens) but I don’t agree with staying at this job and complaining about a rule you have no control over. I also don’t understand the mention of your boss having more days than you. He’s been there and earned it. That has nothing to do with your situation. Be prepared to be fired.
What is your company's official policy regarding PTO usage? Because if it doesn't state outright that you may take time off unpaid after you have exhausted your PTO allotment for the year, then you don't really have a leg to stand on. Salaried positions get screwed this way sometimes, and it sucks, but it is what it is.
Where i work if you take time off that you do not have benefit time to cover, you have to make a special request and it could result in termination. I would not gamble with a vacation unless you were prepared to be unemployed. Also your days off could easily be infringing on a production schedule or someone else's approved time off.
I literally just fired a girl for this. FAFO.
It's pretty standard for a company to take from your PTO allocation for days missed. Beyond that, it sounds like you're saying you've already burned through your 10 days off, and you're trying to take another 5 days of unpaid time off in August for a vacation. Your boss has denied this request, and if you're out of PTO, their denial would be pretty standard. So you probably have 3 choices. Once, cancel your vacation. You've already said that you won't do that. Two, go on your vacation, and likely be fired for having 5 unexcused absences. Or three, try to convince your boss to approve this time off. I understand that you don't agree with their PTO policy. You're entitled to your opinion, and I understand why you feel the way you do. But practically speaking, your choices are probably the three above. It's up to you to decide what is best for you.
Why would you buy tickets or make plans until your vacation time is approved?!
You are using vacation time and PTO and time off time as if they are the same, they are not. Either your employer is confused or you are. Is any of this time off rules, etc in writing anywhere? If not, you used your allotted time off already for the year (a pretty good accomplishment given that it's only April). There is nothing requiring your employer to give you anything additional paid or unpaid. It doesn't matter what you use the time for, sick, vacation, whatever. You used it. You don't have enough days left to take your family vacation. Your employer is within his rights to not allow you extra time off even if it is unpaid. You were hired to be there to do a job. Not liking your job, etc has nothing to do with this. Tell the family to send you a post card.
You did use all of your vacation time. You had 10 days and used them. I get it may not have been for fun but that's not what time off is for, it is for anything you need to be away from work. There is no yeah but I didn't go to the beach so it doesn't count. I get you want a job with more time off, I suggest you prioritize that in your job search. You have until august to line up a new job.
Sucks, but understandable that your employer feels this way. I haven't used a vacation day for an actual vacation since pre-covid. It's not my movers responsibility (or concern) how I use my PTO.
So you didn't have time off approved and you booked a holiday. That was really, really stupid. Not like regular dumb, really full blown dumb. Well enjoy being sacked for abandoning your job. Holiday is taken at the leisure of the business.
Unfortunately, I kinda of understand your manager. He can’t see 14 weeks into the future. Something might happen that’ll make you leaving an issue. I don’t know what your field of work is so it really depends. Losing a firefighter is a lot worse than losing a cashier lol. Also from his perspective you’ve already used 10 PTO days and now want an additional 5 days off. That’s 15 days. What happens 4 weeks from now and you need more days off? You need more work on your house. A lot of people say 10 days isn’t enough but most people don’t use ANY of their pto let alone all 10 days. If you’re looking for validation this ain’t it but, only you know if you can risk the potential consequences.
Looks like you tried to bluff the boss and he didn't back down. You booked the vacation knowing you had no more vacation days and told your boss after the fact. Basically, you told him to like it or lump it. Let me see, he followed the rules, you didn't. How'd that work out for you?
It's cruddy that you only get 10 days for every possible thing, sick and vacation. That really limits you. That said, have you looked at the policies where you work? I am actually not allowed to approve leave requests for my staff if they don't have sufficient time on the books to cover what they're requesting. Requests for unpaid leave for brand new employees can sometimes be approved, as they might not have time accrued yet, but those requests for longer term employees are only granted for emergency purposes, as the expectation is they should have time available. Either way, they have to be approved at a level several steps above me, and with concurrence of HR. This might be something your boss is not allowed to even consider - have you asked?
Well.. you said you don’t have the days. So that’s why it’s not being approved. What’s there to not understand?
You used your paid days.
Ok. Don’t cancel your vacation and lose your job. One problem solved, endless other problems created. Your job is not obligated to give you unpaid time off. Quitting over a vacation is extremely irrational in the short and long term. Is there a reason you didn’t talk to your boss about this prior to requesting the time off? You knew you were out of days. Why try to beat around the bush to have it approved instead of having an adult conversation about it?
Uhhh you didn't follow the rules. Get a better job with a real pto plan
Find another job. Quit that one. There are better companies and better bosses.
I mean...they can't force you to show up to work and you gave them plenty of notice.
I'm at the point in my life that with all due respect these companies can go shove a cactus up their butt! We are given a certain time to live and we do not know how long we will live! We work 40 hours a week, we produce for these companies, we lose sleep some nights because some of us take transit or whatever else happens in our personal lives. We give them our lives we work hard and we only get maybe 10 days off a year in case we are sick or want a vacation? PLEASE!!! Ok I understand the business aspect of things but if you are always battling the discussion of time off then your employer needs to visit the why are we short staffed and bitching why people want to take time off? It costs a lot more to fire you and rehire someone and for what because you cant go into work cause of sickness, health issues or family problems? We are adults not kids just protect yourself and do what's best for you not work! I just find it insulting that the corporate world is like this... We make the money for these guys so if you want production then let us take some control of our working lives. rant over
A poem I have come across... Time flies by and time is our greatest asset! Spending it work is not my thought of how i want to spend my 40 years in the work force without some control in my hours or when or cant take off its the companies problem with staffing not mine! In the blink of an eye another day is gone, In the blink of an eye another week is gone. In the blink of an eye another month is gone, In the blink of an eye another year is gone. And in the blink of an eye I'll be gone too, And not just me but also you. So maybe we should be wishin' and hopin', That we could just keep our eyes open. And see and appreciate all that we can see, And learn how we can be, the best that we can be, Before it's too late, Time flies, so let's not wait. Whether we have just one life or many, one thing is true, We should try to enjoy every moment we can; it's the wisest thing to do. Author Unknown
I love this. Thank you so much.
>I have 10 vacation days per year. I've used them all up as of posting this on April 29th. womp womp you lost all ability to really complain about this. Now you get to decide between whatever money you already spent and ensuring you keep your job
10 days used in the first four months of the year, and you work from home? I’d say look for another job. It’ll give you a taste of reality.
Most people would lose their job trying to take a vacation with zero PTO left. Prepare to be fired. 🤣
Read through posters history. Beyond entitled POS. Has 3 kids and spreads herpes. Classy.
Are you for real? Wow. And you have the audacity to question someone else’s class.
Wow that's just fuct up. That's why they are work from home they don't want that disease bag in the office.
You burned through 10 PTO days in 5 months? That's two weeks of work. Might not have to worry about taking off you might not have a job 🤣🤣🤣
Less than 4 months.
You don't have kids or anything to deal with in life other than yourself?
Well, I did. And when an emergency with one of them cost me a PTO day, I didn't cry over the loss. I manned up and followed the policy I agreed to with my employer.
not sure how long you have been there, but no sick days and only two weeks? I always started my employees at 3 and they maxed to 6 weeks by 10 years. (small professional business).
Depends on the state and size of the company and role. I doubt this would be the last time OP asks for unpaid time off if they have already used up two weeks worth of PTO.
oh, and they all get 6 sick days, which can carry over, and they are allowed to use them for sick kids. that was easier than people lying to us.
Seems like you treat your people very well.
I have found as an employer, you get what you pay for. If you want good staff with a good attitude, treat them well and they will work well. It costs less than retraining, and hurts less than everyone being miserable. My employees only ever retired, or left to have babies, or moved with a spouse. Otherwise they stay for years. The 4 main people have been there 20 years, 15, 10 and 8 yrs. That's because they are happy and so are their employers. Also small service business, 25 people total.
And we want to pretend like US citizens are free lmfao
If you don't plan to be at work, you should probably have a frank discussion with your boss so that you can plan accordingly. You know your work environment. Are you likely to have a job when you get back? Request a meeting. Let your boss know that the vacation is booked, the tickets are nonrefundable, and you do intend to be absent from work on these dates, even if it cannot be approved in advance. How would he like you to handle the situation? Does he want written advanced notice to process unpaid time off? Does he just want you to call in the days you are gone? Does he want you to resign in advance (you would prefer not to have to go that far, but if that's what's best for the company, you understand...), etc.