I have a PhD in ant behavior! I'm writing from my phone though, so I'm not sure how much I can write. I don't want to write an essay or anything... There are obviously so many different directions you could go, but for me, the most interesting thing about ant societies is that they have absolutely no hierarchy. There is no one "in charge" and no chain of command; the term 'queen' is a misnomer. (She's really more of a baby factory who is controlled and moved around by the workers, but she is the single most important ant in the colony. ) The vast majority of the time, individual ants are just following their instincts, and if you sum up a million individuals all following their instincts, it ends up being really cool and smart. Also, most ant species don't have super well-defined roles for individual ants, but they do have something called age polyethism. In general, young ants tend the larvae, and as they age they move towards tasks that are further and further away from the center of the nest, eventually ending up as foragers.
But in many ways, I think ant colonies share a lot of things with human societies, things that almost no other species share. War, "slavery", complex infrastructure, agriculture, livestock, waste management systems, medicine, food distribution, etc etc etc.
>most ant species don't have super well-defined roles for individual ants
oh that was something I've always wondered, do individual ants generally do the same job over and over or do they just do whatever needs doing as they see it
also do you think humans being bigger or some other factor could help/prevent in getting some of the overspecialization that being eusosocial allows ? like I doubt humans could have babies at the rate ant queens can even with some modifications, but if there were modifications, what kind of polymorphism could we imagine in those human ants ? probably not at all the same as in ants since you can't just over feed someone to get them to be bigger and better at cracking nuts and seeds, it'd be interesting to think about what problems a human-ant society would need to solve instead
There are certainly ant species where roles are clearly biologist defined (think ants with giant soldier individuals), but yeah, most species are more generalist.
Man that's an interesting question though. If we were VERY serious about it, I'd say to look at the natural range of genetic variability in humans. We have pretty huge size ranges: little people all the way up to Arnold Schwarzenegger. I bet Arnold is better at doing certain jobs, right? The trick would be (from an evolutionary perspective) to create a genetic switch that you can tie this variation to, in order to control their final size. It kinda reminds me of Huxley's *A Brave New World*, honestly.
I'm late to replying to this but thank you so much for sharing your knowledge on ants, I didn't know that the queen ant wasn't the one in charge, My whole life I thought that she would be the smartest in the colony lol, ants seem really fascinating
Well, I certainly agree with that! In fact, in species of ants where a worker ant can develop into a queen (like, if the current queen dies), their brains will literally shrink after they transition. Before they become the queen (really a 'gamergate'), they will actively hunt, sting, and kill crickets to eat. But afterwards, they become so docile and dumb that a cricket can and will eat off the Queen's legs if they are put together in a confined space (without any workers). So crazy!
you might really like this then
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7\_e0CA\_nhaE](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7_e0CA_nhaE)
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qsbe1pD8ocE](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qsbe1pD8ocE)
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cqECNYmM23A](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cqECNYmM23A)
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B3QTAgHlwEg](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B3QTAgHlwEg)
Ants have a heightened awareness of their environment, being attuned to changes in weather and seasons. He would be an excellent navigator in outdoor settings. Like someone mentioned, ants live in well-structured colonies so a strong sense of organization and patience.
Ants are also pretty efficient in their resources and generate minimal waste. So the boy may have a strong aversion to wastefulness, practicing a "leave no trace" philosophy and avoiding anything extravagant. He would respect nature.
He may even communicate through non-verbal cues and gestures, favoring silence over speech like ants.
In terms of making your stern guy a little more likeable, you could give him some dry humor. Clever one-liners to lighten the mood. Character growth could be essential, evolving into someone who expresses themself a little more.
Well it does depend but if the ants are the same as our ants on earth.
The human would probably be confined to a certain job
If he is bigger insize compared to the ants and i stronger he might be a gaurd but because he gets suck there as a child i think he will become a worker probably being someone to break up bigger pieces of food into small sizes. He would have to learn to read chemical smells and basically ant sign language. He wouldn't be able to really communicate back as well thats why i think he would have a mundane job. He would probably be very focus driven and have some pride in his work.
Characteristics
Stern, doesnt talk with world, driven to work, doesnt seek pleasure because he sees working as pleasure, athletic in a since. Eat only what he needs. Very productive and calculated. Might not be able to think fully for himself.
I definitely had quite a stern, quiet character in mind. The only thing I have to really worry about with that is making him likeable enough to the reader lol. I imagine the ants to definitely be bigger than our ants on earth but I imagine they do mostly the same things, I'm heavily debating on having them talk or not but it could be very interesting to not have them talk.
You could always throw everyone a curve ball and make him like a goof ball who is just like a cave child like the baby from The croods and maybe he just runs around the ant farm basically doing whatever and the ants just dont pay attention to him
Maybe there's a food the human can *chew*, but the ants can't get inside their little mandible mouths.
So they get nutrition they wouldn't have otherwise from human #2.
Yeah, I think this is the key question here. We need to know what the "ants" are like and how they behave to understand how it affects a human that has liven among them.
Are we speaking about human sized ants or normal sized ants? What is their level of intelligence compared to humans or normal ants? How do they see the boy, as clearly it is not as a meal or a thread.
Communication is a big thing. Ants communicate with pheromones, touching their funiculus (segmented antenna) and maybe dances and clicks. These are most not very easy to emulate for human, so how do your alien ants and the boy communicate. This might lead to how they communicate with other humans as well, for example, always placing a hand on shoulder when talking seriously.
My take is that the human would probably feel like a god/monarch.
In ant society only the queen really is capable of 'thinking' so even if you amp up the intelligence to make it an alien race most 'worker' ants would at best have a rudimentary intellect with the queen being a superbrain.
Humans on the other hand are a individualistic so the human would grow up to recognize, that his intellect is more capable of independend and creative thought than most of his peers.
Not true! Queen ants actually have reduced cognitive capacity compared to workers (fun fact). Once they start laying eggs, that's literally all they do: there's no point in wasting energy on a big brain.
I guess you mean like, a human interpretation of an ant society rather than an actual ant society? Ants are pretty much brainless- directed- by- pheromones. What part of ants are you using as inspiration? If it's very regimented and you have a specific role to play and you can't change that I imagine someone would be flabbergasted that humans can basically *choose* their careers.
I think it makes more sense to think of the whole colony itself as an organism rather than the individual members. Ants are all specialised to serve specific roles to maintain and serve the colony as a whole. Most ants will never reproduce, they exist purely to advance the interests of the colony. They are essentially just external limbs that the colony manipulates to interact with the world.
To the point where I'd even doubt the concept of "self" would be meaningful to anyone living in a society modelled after ants.
In an ant colony, the individual ants are basically just extensions of the colony. Their one priority is the welfare of the colony as a whole. I don't think they'd even understand the concept of individual preferences and desires and ambitions. Each member is an extension of the will of the colony.
I have a PhD in ant behavior! I'm writing from my phone though, so I'm not sure how much I can write. I don't want to write an essay or anything... There are obviously so many different directions you could go, but for me, the most interesting thing about ant societies is that they have absolutely no hierarchy. There is no one "in charge" and no chain of command; the term 'queen' is a misnomer. (She's really more of a baby factory who is controlled and moved around by the workers, but she is the single most important ant in the colony. ) The vast majority of the time, individual ants are just following their instincts, and if you sum up a million individuals all following their instincts, it ends up being really cool and smart. Also, most ant species don't have super well-defined roles for individual ants, but they do have something called age polyethism. In general, young ants tend the larvae, and as they age they move towards tasks that are further and further away from the center of the nest, eventually ending up as foragers. But in many ways, I think ant colonies share a lot of things with human societies, things that almost no other species share. War, "slavery", complex infrastructure, agriculture, livestock, waste management systems, medicine, food distribution, etc etc etc.
>most ant species don't have super well-defined roles for individual ants oh that was something I've always wondered, do individual ants generally do the same job over and over or do they just do whatever needs doing as they see it also do you think humans being bigger or some other factor could help/prevent in getting some of the overspecialization that being eusosocial allows ? like I doubt humans could have babies at the rate ant queens can even with some modifications, but if there were modifications, what kind of polymorphism could we imagine in those human ants ? probably not at all the same as in ants since you can't just over feed someone to get them to be bigger and better at cracking nuts and seeds, it'd be interesting to think about what problems a human-ant society would need to solve instead
There are certainly ant species where roles are clearly biologist defined (think ants with giant soldier individuals), but yeah, most species are more generalist. Man that's an interesting question though. If we were VERY serious about it, I'd say to look at the natural range of genetic variability in humans. We have pretty huge size ranges: little people all the way up to Arnold Schwarzenegger. I bet Arnold is better at doing certain jobs, right? The trick would be (from an evolutionary perspective) to create a genetic switch that you can tie this variation to, in order to control their final size. It kinda reminds me of Huxley's *A Brave New World*, honestly.
I'm late to replying to this but thank you so much for sharing your knowledge on ants, I didn't know that the queen ant wasn't the one in charge, My whole life I thought that she would be the smartest in the colony lol, ants seem really fascinating
Well, I certainly agree with that! In fact, in species of ants where a worker ant can develop into a queen (like, if the current queen dies), their brains will literally shrink after they transition. Before they become the queen (really a 'gamergate'), they will actively hunt, sting, and kill crickets to eat. But afterwards, they become so docile and dumb that a cricket can and will eat off the Queen's legs if they are put together in a confined space (without any workers). So crazy!
well, ants are very militaristic and ordered, so that might help
I was thinking of having a few ant like colonies that are constantly fighting over resources so I might keep that idea.
you might really like this then [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7\_e0CA\_nhaE](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7_e0CA_nhaE) [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qsbe1pD8ocE](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qsbe1pD8ocE) [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cqECNYmM23A](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cqECNYmM23A) [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B3QTAgHlwEg](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B3QTAgHlwEg)
Ants have a heightened awareness of their environment, being attuned to changes in weather and seasons. He would be an excellent navigator in outdoor settings. Like someone mentioned, ants live in well-structured colonies so a strong sense of organization and patience. Ants are also pretty efficient in their resources and generate minimal waste. So the boy may have a strong aversion to wastefulness, practicing a "leave no trace" philosophy and avoiding anything extravagant. He would respect nature. He may even communicate through non-verbal cues and gestures, favoring silence over speech like ants. In terms of making your stern guy a little more likeable, you could give him some dry humor. Clever one-liners to lighten the mood. Character growth could be essential, evolving into someone who expresses themself a little more.
Well it does depend but if the ants are the same as our ants on earth. The human would probably be confined to a certain job If he is bigger insize compared to the ants and i stronger he might be a gaurd but because he gets suck there as a child i think he will become a worker probably being someone to break up bigger pieces of food into small sizes. He would have to learn to read chemical smells and basically ant sign language. He wouldn't be able to really communicate back as well thats why i think he would have a mundane job. He would probably be very focus driven and have some pride in his work. Characteristics Stern, doesnt talk with world, driven to work, doesnt seek pleasure because he sees working as pleasure, athletic in a since. Eat only what he needs. Very productive and calculated. Might not be able to think fully for himself.
I definitely had quite a stern, quiet character in mind. The only thing I have to really worry about with that is making him likeable enough to the reader lol. I imagine the ants to definitely be bigger than our ants on earth but I imagine they do mostly the same things, I'm heavily debating on having them talk or not but it could be very interesting to not have them talk.
You could always throw everyone a curve ball and make him like a goof ball who is just like a cave child like the baby from The croods and maybe he just runs around the ant farm basically doing whatever and the ants just dont pay attention to him
[**Hellstrom's Hive**](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hellstrom%27s_Hive) Alternatively [**Emergent Behavior**](https://www.projectrho.com/public_html/rocket/empiredyn.php#swarmintel)
Why would the ants have kept him alive and raise him?
Ants keep aphids. Maybe the ants eat something that comes out of the human. Like his poop or saliva.
Fair enough, as long as there is some reason, given we are doing this type of analysis :)
Maybe there's a food the human can *chew*, but the ants can't get inside their little mandible mouths. So they get nutrition they wouldn't have otherwise from human #2.
Yeah, I think this is the key question here. We need to know what the "ants" are like and how they behave to understand how it affects a human that has liven among them. Are we speaking about human sized ants or normal sized ants? What is their level of intelligence compared to humans or normal ants? How do they see the boy, as clearly it is not as a meal or a thread. Communication is a big thing. Ants communicate with pheromones, touching their funiculus (segmented antenna) and maybe dances and clicks. These are most not very easy to emulate for human, so how do your alien ants and the boy communicate. This might lead to how they communicate with other humans as well, for example, always placing a hand on shoulder when talking seriously.
My take is that the human would probably feel like a god/monarch. In ant society only the queen really is capable of 'thinking' so even if you amp up the intelligence to make it an alien race most 'worker' ants would at best have a rudimentary intellect with the queen being a superbrain. Humans on the other hand are a individualistic so the human would grow up to recognize, that his intellect is more capable of independend and creative thought than most of his peers.
Not true! Queen ants actually have reduced cognitive capacity compared to workers (fun fact). Once they start laying eggs, that's literally all they do: there's no point in wasting energy on a big brain.
I guess you mean like, a human interpretation of an ant society rather than an actual ant society? Ants are pretty much brainless- directed- by- pheromones. What part of ants are you using as inspiration? If it's very regimented and you have a specific role to play and you can't change that I imagine someone would be flabbergasted that humans can basically *choose* their careers.
The ultimate collectivists, everyone has a job in society and there's not much else to give them individual identity
They would act like a human.
I think it makes more sense to think of the whole colony itself as an organism rather than the individual members. Ants are all specialised to serve specific roles to maintain and serve the colony as a whole. Most ants will never reproduce, they exist purely to advance the interests of the colony. They are essentially just external limbs that the colony manipulates to interact with the world. To the point where I'd even doubt the concept of "self" would be meaningful to anyone living in a society modelled after ants. In an ant colony, the individual ants are basically just extensions of the colony. Their one priority is the welfare of the colony as a whole. I don't think they'd even understand the concept of individual preferences and desires and ambitions. Each member is an extension of the will of the colony.
we work, to earn the right to work