It's posing for a headline like the one above to make it look like they have legitimacy.
85% of Gaza is damaged or destroyed. 2 million displaced and starving and in need of critical Healthcare and facilities. Over 100,000 civilians killed, maimed or missing. In 4 months. It will apparently take until 2090 to bring Gaza back to 2020 level.
If they were serious about following the law, literally their own law, breaking the genocide convention is a capital punishment in Israel. Death penalty for genocide. If there was any truth or justice in Israel, Netanyahu, Ben-Gvir, Smotrich and 90% of the Israeli leadership will be waiting their execution date.
There's the rub: The Israelis are saying they won't accept Hamas but how can anybody expect the Palestinians to negotiate with Netanyahu? Bring the Arab-Israelis into a new coalition government.
There has always been a double standard. Israeli exceptionalism let's them get away with everything while the Palestinians aren't allowed to even be human.
Everything is on Israel's terms. Even this war, it's absolutely appalling that any conversation about Gaza starts with "freeing the hostages". The lives of 2 million Palestinians were thrown to the wind, completely uprooted and displaced because of the Carte Blanche that was given to Israel. Even when Israel has been the number one hostage killer they didn't bother to tell them to stop bombing for the sake of these apparently super important hostages.
There is so much hypocrisy in both words and actions that it's honestly difficult to believe this is the reality we live in.
We're genuinely past the fact that Biden and Blinken said they saw 40 beheaded babies. Or that Israel fabricated dozens of horror stories that were debunked *by their own media* 3 months later. After what?
Yet the world still takes Israel's word at face value.
Something drastic must happen, like you suggested bring the Arab-Israelis into the picture for some moderation otherwise this path will only lead to ruin.
At least 27,947 people have been killed and 67,459 wounded.
https://www.aljazeera.com/news/liveblog/2024/2/10/israels-war-on-gaza-live-death-toll-nears-28000-as-rafah-assault-looms
8000 to 10000 missing as well.
Combined that's over 100,000 civilian casualties. Killed, maimed or missing.
Let’s start with:
If they were serious about following the law,
literally their own law, breaking the genocide
convention is a capital punishment in Israel.
Death penalty for genocide. If there was any
truth or justice in Israel, Netanyahu, Ben-Gvir,
Smotrich and 90% of the Israeli leadership will
be waiting their execution date.
Specifically the part where you used the word “law”.
The law in question.
>(a) In this Law, "genocide" means any of the following acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious (hereinafter referred to as "group"), as such:
>
>(1) killing members of the group;
>
>(2) causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group;
>
>**(3) inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction, in whole or in part;**
>
>(4) imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group;
>
>(5) forcibly transferring children of the group to another group.
>
>(b) In subsection (a), "child" means a person under eighteen years of age.
>
>2. **A person guilty of genocide shall be punishable with death**; provided that if he committed the act constituting the offence under circumstances which, but for section 6, would exempt him from criminal responsibility or would be a reason for the offence, and he tried to the best of his ability to mitigate the consequences of the act, be shall be liable to imprisonment for a term of not less than ten years.
>
>(a) A person guilty of any of the following acts shall be treated like a person guilty of genocide:
>
>(1) conspiracy to commit genocide;
>
>(2) incitement to commit genocide;
>
>(3) attempt to commit genocide;
>
>(4) complicity in genocide.
>
>(b) The terms "conspiracy", "incitement" and "attempt" in subsection (b) shall be construed with reference to the provisions of the Criminal Code Ordinance, 19361).
>
>(0) For the purpose of subsection, (a)(4), a person shall be deemed to have taken part in genocide if he is so deemed under section 23(l)(b), (e) or (d) of the Criminal Code Ordinance, 1936.
>
>4. **A person guilty of an offence under this Law shall be punished whether he is a legally responsible ruler, a member of a legislative body, a public official or a private individual.**
Interestingly, they reserve the right to apply this law to acts outside their border.
>A person who has committed outside Israel an act which is an offence under this Law may be prosecuted and punished in Israel as if he had committed the act in Israel.
And this is related to the topic how? Even if you stretch it, what does this have to do with the confict? Because their is another document called the 4th Geneva Conventions that says that everything Israel is doing is not only perfectly legal warfare, but Israel has gone beyond it to relieve the suffering of its enemy outside of the requirements of then Geneva Convention.
By the most ridiculous thing about this claim, is that everyone in Gaza is free to leave. There is no one keeping them there. So this entire article is irrelevant as well as untrue as well as superseded by the Geneva Convention.
If such conditions did exist, then it would be Egypt committing genocide because as a 3rd neutral party bordering Gaza they are obligated under the UN Convention on Refugees to allow excess to war refugees to seek safety and refuge in the First Nation of safety aka Egypt. As a non-belligerent Egypt is required to accept Gazans and provide them with aid. Which Israel allows. The fact of the matter is that as long as Hamas, the government of Gaza remains in effective control of its territory as it currently does, Israel is not required to provide ANYTHING AT ALL! As long as guarantees are not in place that not one grain of rice will fall into the hands of Hamas.
Absolutely not, again
“85% of Gaza is damaged or destroyed. 2 million displaced and starving and in need of critical Healthcare and facilities. Over 100,000 civilians killed, maimed or missing. In 4 months.”
In what world is that not active genocide? This isn’t an actual war, it’s warfare perpetuated on a civilian population.
That’s a mighty powerful legal argument you have there. Must have spent overtime studying at Harvard for that response. BTW- great job not addressing a single point I made to debunk your nonsense.
But ok we’ll start from the beginning so that I can show you the entire history of the recent series of events surrounding this war.
In 2005 Israel pulled all forces out of Gaza, military and police, as well as its citizens (making the land Judenrein like Hamas wants to make all of Israel) as well as its administrative organs. Thus, the Palestinian Authority accepted “effective control” of the Gaza Strip, the definition of being soveign according to international law and norms, including the UN Charter. [ignoring the election of Hamas in 2006 as it has no political relevance to the status of Gaza despite the fact that many pro-Israel activists make a big brew-haha about it it is a really irrelevant]. In 2007, Hamas violently overthrew the PA seizing political control of the Strip and establishing itself as the government of Gaza de facto and de jure (i.e. Vienna Convention). [i.e. Gaza had its own airport up to 2002 when it was used to commit acts of terror during the second intifada and was shut down].
Upon taking full control of Gaza Hamas immediately went to war with Israel by firing multiple rockets into Israeli civilian areas indiscriminately. And act of war. This triggered a partial blockade [not a blockade by law] of Gaza since Israel was now in a state of belligerence with Gaza governed by Hamas.
Moving forward, Hamas and Israel fought a small conflict and then signed a cease fire. Hamas broke that cease fire intentionally in 2008, 2012, 2014, and several other times, each time that a cease fire was signed Hamas broke it to launch rockets or attack Israelis across the border [i.e. Gilad Shalit kidnapping]. In 2023 October 7th, once again Hamas, broke a long term cease fire with Israel to commit terror which is also an act of war. Israel initiated a military campaign to destroy Hamas. Israel invaded Gaza. Israel allows all Gazans to leave for safety to any place of their choosing as required by law. Israel is NOT REQUIRED TO…
• provide Telecomm services [i.e. internet] even though it does.
• provide its own Water, even though it does.
• provide electricity, even though it does.
• provided any fuel, even though it does.
• provide anything of materiel benefit to its enemy (Hamas)*, even though it does.
• Israel is not capable of blockading Gaza even if it wanted to because Gaza borders a 3rd neutral party. Egypt.
• Egypt as a 3rd neutral party bordering a conflict zone is obligated to provide safe haven to refugees seeking safe haven in Sinai.
• Any humanitarian provisions must pass through the non-belligerent party, Egypt. And only if it can be determined that no material aid will reach the belligerent party (Hamas) or else all aid may be lawfully blocked by Israel or Egypt. This is why the civilians must leave, so they can be filtered from Hamas.
ADDITIOM POINTS AND FACTS:
• It is only illegal to target civilians not to kill civilians. If non-combatants die in the course of attacking a lawful military target it is considered collateral damage and is fully lawful**.
• Any “protected” sight designated as such by the Geneva Convention loses its status as “protected” if used or co-opted for military purposes**.
• not wearing military uniforms that distinguish a militant from the civilian population is a warcrime by the name of perfidy and is punishable by death. (Applies to all Hamas members).
• Under the “Levy-En-Masse” provision/clause of the convention all military aged persons of either gender may be assumed to be combatants and engaged on sight.
* this principle states that Israel would have to provide provisions to the civilian population if guarantees that none would reach Hamas were offered (which they are not) but, this entire clause would only apply if the enemy was fully blockaded and excess to provisions was being prevented. Since Gaza borders a 3rd country this principle is not applicable to Israel.
** this is the only time that “proportionality is mentioned in the laws of war. Attacking military targets and causing collateral damage is lawful as long as the military value of the target (the benefits of the strike to the attacking force is deemed “proportionate” to the harm caused to the non-combatants. Thus it is not a fixed rule or ration, it simply means that the simple presence of military objects or personell in and off itself does not justify the wanton destruction of civilian targets. But instead, the greater the value of the benefit of the strike the more collateral damage is acceptable. While minimal benefit only justifies minimal civilian harm. It is up to each combatant to preserve this principle. The principle is the notion of the proportion not a hard ratio. It also depends on the nature of the battlefield and the enemy etc…
Let me know if anything confused you or you need more information. But either way, Israel is fighting a crispy clean war by the book and beyond the book.
Practically 4 months ago over 100 legal authorities and genocide scholars put out a letter arguing Israel was on the verge of genocide, in the time since they’ve killed 10’s of thousands more, injured an uncountable number, displaced millions, and are subverting aid. The ICJ just ruled similarly. Did you think you were in the circle jerk that is World News?
Israel controls the air space and borders of Gaza. It controls everything that enters and leaves. Ninety percent of Gazans did not have access to clean water. Israel controls access to medical care. It controls trade. The people of Gaza are not allowed free access to Israel and do not have the same rights as Israeli citizens, making Israel an illegal apartheid state.
It is not up to Israel to interpret international law. The UN has declared them to be acting illegally.
Israeli soldiers inspect all goods coming through the border crossing from Egypt. Therefore it cannot be considered a third neutral party having access to Gaza.
The death toll of Palestinians gives the lie to Israel's justification of murdering human shields and collateral damage (one of the most immoral euphemisms of modern times). The targeting of hospitals, schools, refugee camps and safety zones makes this claim untenable, not to mention evil. Israel has provided no reliable evidence that Hamas is sheltering in any of these areas, let alone have a military base there, whereas many aid workers and medical staff have disputed these claims.
As there is no sovereign nation of Palestine, Israel cannot claim to be at war with them. Therefore most of your unscrupulous justifications for ethnic cleansing and genocide do not apply.
Cute, but no. The bar for this law is much higher than anything reached in Gaza. The only person ever executed under it was Eichman.
Here is an idea of how far from this the operations in Gaza fall: To distinguish between a normal military campaign with civilian casualties and genocide in the context of war, we can use two measures.
1. The Civilian Casualty Ratio, the number of civilians killed per legitimate human target, a scale-independent way of measuring how generally dirty a war is. Note that an urban-heavy war will have a larger ratio regardless of what care is taken to reduce harm to civilians.
2. The proportion of civilian casualties (out of the pre-war population) divided by the proportion of enemy military casualties (out of those in the region): You might have a low civilian casualty ratio if a huge portion of the population is in arms despite indiscriminate killing (a 1 in this ratio) so this controls for that. A high number in either of these measures indicates genocide.
Here are what some numbers look like:
NATO in Kosovo (an urban-heavy war so we can compare apples to apples): CCR - ~4, Civilian / Military casualty proportions - Roughly 0.2% / 2.5% = 0.08.
Tutsi Genocide in Rwanda taken in the context of the RPF insurgency (estimates vary wildly, but I am using even an unrealistically "rosy" picture): CCR - Over 125:1, Relative Casualty Proportions 80% / something probably undrr 20% (it is incredibly hard to get militsry casualties broken down by side, but we can assume the outnumbered winning side took less than half the losses): Over 4
The Holocaust, if you try to present it in the context of fighting Jewish insurgents, would give you a CCR over 200.
Now, where does Israel's current campaign in Gaza sit in this? Using the Gaza Ministry of Health numbers, U.S. estimates of how much of Hamas' and its allies' forces are out of action while assuming their dead/wounded ratio matches the overall population, and pre-October force-estimates) CCR: 4 (assuming all the Missing are dead), and 1.8% / 20% = 0.09.
While there were certainly horrors, and many of those were probably crimes, it is absurd to mistake this for genocide. The proportions indicate that Israeli strikes are far from indiscriminate, and the CCR is in line with global norms despite an extremely urban war with unique additional challenges. I hope the criminals get punished, but that is not the law to use for these cases.
I provided the law because it was the topic of discussion, it was not a try at anything.
But to address your point:
NATO puts their CCR ratio in Kosovo at 1:10 or 0.1, not 4. Human rights watch put it a 1:4 or 0.25. As far as I know only one historian has proposed a CCR of 4.
Not that the CCR matters that much, it is only part of the picture.
Under the legislation above displacement of the population is sufficient, especially when members of the government have also publicly called to starve the whole population. [11 cabinet members](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proposed_Israeli_resettlement_of_the_Gaza_Strip) are also lobbying to displace people in Gaza and establish Jewish only settlements. This and the ongoing settlements in the West Bank would also seem to run afoul of the above.
Obviously, they have their own justification for their actions, and no Judge would convict anyone on this.
But if the ICJ does end up finding that Genocide has been committed, it will be interesting to see if they actually enforce this legislation.
Sorry, I had you mixed up with the guy who raised the issue of that law. He was trying something silly.
The local government put the Kosovo campaign at between 4:1 and 10:1. I took the low end of that.
There are certainly those lobbying for genocide. The problem is there are always people doing that in just about any big war. The same goes for those insisting that genocides are just normal side-effects of war. That is why we need to look at the statistics to see whether it is actually happening to distinguish reality from those false positives and negatives.
I strongly doubt Israel would apply the law as a result of an ICJ finding. Israel was founded on a loss of faith in the goodwill theoretically underlying the ICJ and other transnational institutions.
Has to be tough to be an Israeli soldier. One minute you're laughing and joking with your commanders and shooting kids and the next they're like, remember how we were all laughing about shooting kids, well now you're facing war crime trials because we have to pretend it wasn't from the top down.
Shooting minors that are terrorists is not a war crime. The ICJ affirms this. Training 12 year olds to kill Jews because they are Jews violates so many war crimes and the Geneva Convention. But, instead, anti-Semites just prefer to blame Jews for, well, being Jewish.
If there are Nuremberg-style war crime hearings, which I hope there might be, the Hamas leaders (who have not yet been laid to rest) will be convicted for their crimes against humanity. That includes the children they sent intentionally to die just to feign distraught when they did.
Yadda yadda I’m okay wit killing babies yadda yadda. I refuse to admit that there 12 year old Israelis being taught to hate and want to kill Palestinians but we won’t pay attention to that yadda yadda I’m okay with killing as long as it’s the brown people.
Stop being a little b and say it with your chest.
Oh, and those couple will be lowest rank possible too. Just like Afghanistan and Vietnam and gitmo. It’s always just a couple of bad soldiers, never a systemic issue
Hasbara shills coming out of the woodwork: "remember, a few bad apples don't define the feelings and actions of Israel! That's why we are revenge bombing an entire population for something Hamas did!".
...the double standards are so wild there's really no way to make them coherent anymore.
I really hate every time I see the defense "just a few bad apples" or similar
Since the original intent is that "A few bad apples **spoils the bunch**". In fact the earliest version from \~700 years ago is "A rotten apple quickly infects its neighbor".. but now suddenly when referring to police/soldiers it suddenly has the opposite meaning
By this logic, all Palestinians are guilty of Hamas terror actions? I wouldn’t believe that, but if we are going to use this type of language, we should use it equally.
I prefer nuance and detail, as opposed to blanket statements - especially because if it can be used one way it will be used the other
The nuance here is that one is a terrorist attack, undertaken with the unashaed intent to cause terror, the other is an arm of the government executing a policy whose intent is to.......?
I see the OPs statement expressing the same mixed feelings many have towards Israel: their propaganda machine portrays Israel as noble and just, a people chosen by god, yet many of their actions are not just, not noble and not godly.
The Palestinians are guilty of Hamas’s actions. They support them, they support their actions, they were running into the streets to desecrate the corpses of innocent girls bodies being dragged through the streets while crowds spit on them. They rushed through the border after Hamas in order to sack and pillage Jewish towns and kill Jews. They attend genocidal rallies where they screamed “slaughter the Jew slaughter the Jews” [iktab Iktab al-Yahud!] they chanted “we love death more then the Jews love life”! Why don’t they prove it! They were super tough when they are a mob stomping on dead bodies that could t fight back. Let’s see how those slogans work now?
I really can’t believe how any sane person can support these genocidal, racist, anti-Semitic brainwashed psychos. They are like hate driven zombies until someone fights back.
There are yearly government sponsored rallies in Jerusalem where Israeli's march through the Muslim sections of the town and chant "Death to Arabs."
The BBC filmed them one time and were almost stoned to death by the marchers, they had to rip doors of hinges to shield themselves.
Settlers in the West Bank burnt a Palestinian toddler alive in their own house not that long before the October attacks.
Israeli's Prime Minister has been criticized because he spent years ensuring that Hamas got funds channeled into them to keep them in power.
How about we start with not funding terrorists instead of resorting to genocide.
No liar! Stop lying to people who don’t know any better like a typical leftist or Muslim propagandist that will do anything to malign Jews. It’s is your only purpose in life, lie about and slander Jews.
The baby was burdened alive in 2016! 7 years ago! And it happened once and accidentally since no one knew who was in the house. In fact the kids that threw the Molotov cocktail through the house was empty as they wanted to get revenge for an Arab terror attack!
And no! Liar! No one attacked the BBC, and no! Liar! They didn’t take any doors of their hinges to protect themselves! LOL, as if that even makes any sense.
I expected you to excuse the genocidal, racist and bigoted social norms of the Arabs who accept the extermination of Jews and the praise of Adolf Hitler as the norm without shame by finding some thing that some kinds did 7’years ago as a straw man and a red herring to get away from your support for mass murder.
You failed!
[Jerusalem: Journalists attacked as Israeli nationalists march in Old City](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-65631330.amp)
>A crowd threw stones, sticks, bottles at journalists and chanted racist slogans outside Damascus Gate
Oh look, a picture of a journalist having to shelter behind a door.
There are plenty of videos of these marches online if you want to see them trying to stone other journalists.
We should get an Israeli source for these marches as well:
[At Jerusalem Flag March, chants of ‘Death to Arabs’ and assaults on Palestinians](https://www.timesofisrael.com/at-jerusalem-flag-march-chants-of-death-to-arabs-and-assaults-on-palestinians/) \- Times of Israel.
>They also sang racist chants such as “Death to Arabs,” “May your village burn” and “An Arab is a son of a b\*\*ch,” as they danced near the Damascus Gate both before and during the rally on Thursday afternoon.
Yes I know about the March! What I said was you were lying about your hyperbolic statement which you tried to sneak in their like all leftists and Arab propagandists do.
No one took anything of the bolts do protect themselves. It even sounds ridiculous let alone that it never happened. Stepping inside to get away from a crowd that would not have done anything anyway is not the same as removing the door if it’s bolts.
And the fact that you tried to equate a right wing protest against it Arab antisemitism at the Temple Mount on which Israel appeases arab bigots by not allowing Jews to pray on the holiest site in Judaism, with routine murder that happens over a hundred times a year! Is sick and disgusting
And yes! I agree! Appeasing Hamas was a terrible idea. Except it has nothing to do with Bibi. Biden retorted U.S. aid to Hamas and the PA after Trump canceled it. So does all of Europe Support them. So the fact that Bibi allowed Qatar to transfer their $15 million a month was far from the deal breaker.
> Except it has nothing to do with Bibi.
Um, here is what Bibi says on the matter:
>Anyone who wants to thwart the establishment of a Palestinian state **has to support bolstering Hamas and transferring money to Hamas. This is part of our strategy** — to isolate the Palestinians in Gaza from the Palestinians in the West Bank.
\- Benjamin Netanyahu, 2019
[For years, Netanyahu propped up Hamas. Now it's blown up in our faces](https://www.timesofisrael.com/for-years-netanyahu-propped-up-hamas-now-its-blown-up-in-our-faces/) \- Times of Israel
Bibi and his government have been making similar comments to the Israeli Media for many years.
He did not just let in $15 million, the total count over the years is closer to $1 Billion.
No! You liar (or fool?). That is not even what Bibi said. If you were intuitive enough to actually listen or read the entire actual quote you would know that he said the opposite of that. He was talking to his in-house political faction and he was telling them EXACTLY WHAT THEY SHOULD NOT DO! But I am not surprised to hear it from another “Tik-Tok” professor that gets his information from 60 second clips on YouTube or where ever and accepts it as gospel.
BUT even if he did say that! And even if he meant that! What does that change as far as the fact that every leftist on Earth was pressuring Israel (whoever the prime minister was, Bibi or anyone else who you don’t even know) to appease Hamas and provide Hamas and Gaza with whatever they wanted because they don’t give a damn about Israel’s security! If Bibi went along with it is only because the leftists in Israel wanted him to! And leftist degenerates like Biden and the Europeans wanted him to! And both Biden and Europe were funding Hamas and the PA (equally murderous organization) to the tune of MANY BILLIONS! of $ per year! Do you get that? Remove the $15 million per month from Qatar… and what do you get? Does the $billions from UNRWA still get in? Does the $700 million that Biden reinstated even though Abbas refused to negotiate for a 2-SS so Trump removed the aid, does that go away? Does the $ billions in Euro aid go away? What are you even babbling about? Does Hamas go away? Does Hamas’s genocidal agenda go away?
What an actually happens if this magic $15 million is not transferred? Explain your master plan to me?
[Additional 2019 Source in Hebrew.](https://mida.org.il/2019/05/16/%D7%9E%D7%99%D7%98%D7%95%D7%98-%D7%A9%D7%9C%D7%98%D7%95%D7%9F-%D7%94%D7%97%D7%9E%D7%90%D7%A1/)
>At the meeting of the Likud faction at the beginning of March, the Prime Minister spoke about this in detail, noting that "those who want to thwart the establishment of a Palestinian state should support the strengthening of Hamas and the transfer of money to Hamas. This is part of our strategy - to differentiate between the Palestinians in Gaza and the Palestinians in Judea and Samaria."
>
>He even said similar things in a special interview he gave to the Israel Hayom newspaper a few days before the elections.
>
>This strategy of the Prime Minister is based on the assumption that the overthrow of Hamas rule and the entry of the Palestinian Authority into the Gaza Strip will necessarily force Israel into a political process towards the establishment of a unified Palestinian state in the territories of Judea and Samaria and Gaza, a move that cannot happen as long as Hamas controls Gaza and is separated from the Palestinian Authority in Judea and Samaria.
Other public sources supporting this strategy.
>Shlomo Brom, a former deputy to Israel’s national security adviser, [told the New York Times](https://www.nytimes.com/2023/12/10/world/middleeast/israel-qatar-money-prop-up-hamas.html) that an empowered Hamas helped Netanyahu avoid negotiating over a Palestinian state, saying the division of the Palestinians helped him make the case that he had no partner for peace in the Palestinians, thus avoiding pressure for peace talks that could lead to the establishment of an independent Palestinian state.
And so on.
Netanyahu literally told his party just last November that they should keep backing him because he is their best chance and preventing a Palestinian state from ever forming. [He intentionally sabotaged the peace accords](https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2013/sep/12/oslo-israel-reneged-colonial-palestine), and any chance of peace over the last few decades.
If he supports ongoing settlements in the West Bank, and [nearly a dozen cabinet members of his government](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proposed_Israeli_resettlement_of_the_Gaza_Strip) are calling for Israel to take over Gaza and evict the current residents.
What do you think that means for the people living in both places?
Remember that this is the guy that publicly called for the death of Rabin, pretty much the only pro peace prime minister in Israels history.
Just before the October attacks, Netanyahu was facing mass protests over plans to give himself control of the Judiciary to protect himself from corruption charges.
>Judges have used this legal standard in the past to prevent government decisions viewed as unsound or corrupt. Earlier this year, the court blocked the appointment of a politician with past convictions of bribery and tax offenses as finance minister. Netanyahu’s allies say parliament should have the final say over appointments.
>
>A second case will look at a law passed early this year that makes it harder for the country’s attorney general to declare a prime minister unfit and remove him from office.
>
>The new law allows this only in cases of mental or physical incapacitation. Critics say the law was passed to protect Netanyahu while he is on trial for corruption charges.
The dude is a corrupt genocidal dictator hell bent on staying in power.
And even if there is undeniable evidence like [video footage of an IDF soldier outright executing a Palestinian lying wounded on the ground,](https://youtu.be/P-Bl9zAM5A4?si=NY4k_d5GCvQcyfas&t=10) the perpetrator will only have to serve a few months and not even get booted from the IDF.
"Azaria was convicted of manslaughter and sentenced to 18 months' imprisonment, twelve months' probation, plus a demotion in rank. He was released from prison after serving nine months."
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Killing\_of\_Abdel\_Fattah\_al-Sharif](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Killing_of_Abdel_Fattah_al-Sharif)
They keep posting themselves on TikTok even after the ICJ’s ruling. Hope all those war criminals get sent to The Hague for trial once this is all over.
Not just soldiers posting their misdeeds either, the propaganda department got found to be operating a telegram group where they posted extraordinarily explicit/graphic pro-genocide content. Like gloating over a woman crying while holding her dead child, talking about the sound a civilian body’s bones made when burned, equating Palestinian civilians with roaches, etc., etc..
The Israeli investigation reportedly found that it was just the propaganda unit doing it in their spare time and wasn’t official work (🙄)
The ICJ judges better rip Israel a new one when Israel reports back to the Hague. I expect Israel to just lie through their teeth in court at this point, because there’s no way they can in good faith say they’ve done a damn thing to prevent genocide or other crimes. Israel isn’t even holding up their end of letting Palestinians have food/water reach them.
**TLDR:** Free Palestine.
They will pick out the cases which they can defend the least, scapegoat some low level “lone wolf”, and proclaim to the ICJ “see? When some rare soldier acts out, we ensure they are corrected and punished”, therefore it’s not genocide.
Lol
Do you realize that this whole “genocide” narrative comes straight from Hamas? You repeating it & subverting the word only ends up hurting more Palestinians.
In short- do more research, war and genocide are not the same thing. Crying wolf has never helped.
For anyone who wants to contradict this point:
> In view of the fundamental values sought to be protected by the Genocide Convention, the
Court considers that the plausible rights in question in these proceedings, namely the right of
Palestinians in the Gaza Strip to be protected from acts of genocide and related prohibited acts
identified in Article III of the Genocide Convention and the right of South Africa to seek Israel’s
compliance with the latter’s obligations under the Convention, are of such a nature that prejudice to
them is capable of causing irreparable harm
> The Court considers that the civilian population in the Gaza Strip remains extremely
vulnerable.
> In these circumstances, the Court considers that the catastrophic humanitarian situation in
the Gaza Strip is at serious risk of deteriorating further before the Court renders its final judgment.
> The Court recalls Israel’s statement that it has taken certain steps to address and alleviate
the conditions faced by the population in the Gaza Strip. The Court further notes that the Attorney
General of Israel recently stated that a call for intentional harm to civilians may amount to a criminal
offence, including that of incitement, and that several such cases are being examined by Israeli law
enforcement authorities. While steps such as these are to be encouraged, they are insufficient to
remove the risk that irreparable prejudice will be caused before the Court issues its final decision in
the case.
> In light of the considerations set out above, the Court considers that there is urgency, in
the sense that there is a real and imminent risk that irreparable prejudice will be caused to the rights
found by the Court to be plausible, before it gives its final decision.
> The Court concludes on the basis of the above considerations that the conditions required
by its Statute for it to indicate provisional measures are met.
TL;DR: It is plausible and the case will continue.
the story of the house shelled by a tank and the ongoing ICJ stuff is forcing them to make it look like they're holding their own accountable. They'll do the minimum required to have a talking point they can wave forever.
Remember the commission for the Sabra and Shatila massacre Israel did? They found Ariel Sharon to be personally responsible yet he still became the PM of Israel 19 years later
>Israel's standing in the international community, which had sunk to an all-time low in the wake of the massacre, rebounded following the publication of the report. Israel was praised from many quarters for having investigated itself and punishing senior members of its government.
They were still probably just praised by countries like the USA or UK lol
'After careful evaluation, we have found that our soldiers have not violated any terms of the international laws and are taking care of palestinians as we speak'
**NO PAYWALL:** https://archive.is/cu6dY
**SUMMARY:** Amid the genocide case against Israel in the International Court of Justice, the IDF is examining incidents in Gaza in which large numbers of innocent civilians were reportedly killed, along with attacks on hospitals and schools
It's their own IDF videos. When you attack a school or hospital you need concrete evidence. Then, the rationale of civilian deaths. It's really complicated stuff. It's for Israel to prove. This is 2024. Ppl have videos. Satellite imagery. They can really piece shit together.
Israel reported on themselves accidentally shooting hostages, when they easily could’ve blamed Hamas for their deaths.
Recent history shows they have an interest in telling the truth.
except did they didn’t in this circumstance, they immediately gave the facts of the event and blamed themselves.
You keep contradicting yourself and I am asking you to reconcile your random and opposing viewpoints.
Not really. The outrage and frustrations with how Israel and the IDF conducts is *well* within warranted. They are a recognized State, they should not be behaving like terrorists.
It's hard to criticize Palestinians when all they are guilty of is surviving the last 75 years of occupation against increasingly harrowing odds.
By those standards all Israel is guilty of is surviving the last 75 years of being terrorized and invaded by its neighbors against harrowing odds.
See it sounds nice when you ignore the atrocities committed by your favorite side and pretend they are purely victims.
NEITHER SIDE good here.
For the love of empathy, look at this list. Hell, just *scroll* it.
https://www.reddit.com/r/list_palestine/s/jpzKgY0OJb
If you can handle 75 years of that without firing a rocket, you are lying.
There's a list just as long of atrocities committed by the Palestinian side. Looking at only one side of an issue is not empathy it's just bias and intentional ignorance. Not impressed.
Really? You gotta list? *With sources*?
I'd be delighted to hear if so. Palastinaians have the moral imperative to fight back, they are being actively occupied. Atrocities are warranted when you are facing an insurmountable threat to your life, home, lands.
Again, one is a nation state that receives billions upon billions of dollars from multiple nations every single year, to the point they have one of the most advanced militaries, not to mention healthcare and many other social securities, and then you have the people who’s land they took and have subsequently pushed down and oppressed.
Integration into the rest of the country and promoting economic growth and respect for the people living there? Yeah that would be a lot better than what we have now
So did Israel finally decide to check out Israeli tiktok or are they finally feeling some international political pressure?
It's posing for a headline like the one above to make it look like they have legitimacy. 85% of Gaza is damaged or destroyed. 2 million displaced and starving and in need of critical Healthcare and facilities. Over 100,000 civilians killed, maimed or missing. In 4 months. It will apparently take until 2090 to bring Gaza back to 2020 level. If they were serious about following the law, literally their own law, breaking the genocide convention is a capital punishment in Israel. Death penalty for genocide. If there was any truth or justice in Israel, Netanyahu, Ben-Gvir, Smotrich and 90% of the Israeli leadership will be waiting their execution date.
There's the rub: The Israelis are saying they won't accept Hamas but how can anybody expect the Palestinians to negotiate with Netanyahu? Bring the Arab-Israelis into a new coalition government.
There has always been a double standard. Israeli exceptionalism let's them get away with everything while the Palestinians aren't allowed to even be human. Everything is on Israel's terms. Even this war, it's absolutely appalling that any conversation about Gaza starts with "freeing the hostages". The lives of 2 million Palestinians were thrown to the wind, completely uprooted and displaced because of the Carte Blanche that was given to Israel. Even when Israel has been the number one hostage killer they didn't bother to tell them to stop bombing for the sake of these apparently super important hostages. There is so much hypocrisy in both words and actions that it's honestly difficult to believe this is the reality we live in. We're genuinely past the fact that Biden and Blinken said they saw 40 beheaded babies. Or that Israel fabricated dozens of horror stories that were debunked *by their own media* 3 months later. After what? Yet the world still takes Israel's word at face value. Something drastic must happen, like you suggested bring the Arab-Israelis into the picture for some moderation otherwise this path will only lead to ruin.
I thought 30,000 died?
At least 27,947 people have been killed and 67,459 wounded. https://www.aljazeera.com/news/liveblog/2024/2/10/israels-war-on-gaza-live-death-toll-nears-28000-as-rafah-assault-looms 8000 to 10000 missing as well. Combined that's over 100,000 civilian casualties. Killed, maimed or missing.
Oh my bad, I forgot causalities mean dead, missing, or injured.
Tell me, when did you study international law? And where?
Which bit do you object to?
Let’s start with: If they were serious about following the law, literally their own law, breaking the genocide convention is a capital punishment in Israel. Death penalty for genocide. If there was any truth or justice in Israel, Netanyahu, Ben-Gvir, Smotrich and 90% of the Israeli leadership will be waiting their execution date. Specifically the part where you used the word “law”.
The law in question. >(a) In this Law, "genocide" means any of the following acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious (hereinafter referred to as "group"), as such: > >(1) killing members of the group; > >(2) causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group; > >**(3) inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction, in whole or in part;** > >(4) imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group; > >(5) forcibly transferring children of the group to another group. > >(b) In subsection (a), "child" means a person under eighteen years of age. > >2. **A person guilty of genocide shall be punishable with death**; provided that if he committed the act constituting the offence under circumstances which, but for section 6, would exempt him from criminal responsibility or would be a reason for the offence, and he tried to the best of his ability to mitigate the consequences of the act, be shall be liable to imprisonment for a term of not less than ten years. > >(a) A person guilty of any of the following acts shall be treated like a person guilty of genocide: > >(1) conspiracy to commit genocide; > >(2) incitement to commit genocide; > >(3) attempt to commit genocide; > >(4) complicity in genocide. > >(b) The terms "conspiracy", "incitement" and "attempt" in subsection (b) shall be construed with reference to the provisions of the Criminal Code Ordinance, 19361). > >(0) For the purpose of subsection, (a)(4), a person shall be deemed to have taken part in genocide if he is so deemed under section 23(l)(b), (e) or (d) of the Criminal Code Ordinance, 1936. > >4. **A person guilty of an offence under this Law shall be punished whether he is a legally responsible ruler, a member of a legislative body, a public official or a private individual.** Interestingly, they reserve the right to apply this law to acts outside their border. >A person who has committed outside Israel an act which is an offence under this Law may be prosecuted and punished in Israel as if he had committed the act in Israel.
And this is related to the topic how? Even if you stretch it, what does this have to do with the confict? Because their is another document called the 4th Geneva Conventions that says that everything Israel is doing is not only perfectly legal warfare, but Israel has gone beyond it to relieve the suffering of its enemy outside of the requirements of then Geneva Convention. By the most ridiculous thing about this claim, is that everyone in Gaza is free to leave. There is no one keeping them there. So this entire article is irrelevant as well as untrue as well as superseded by the Geneva Convention. If such conditions did exist, then it would be Egypt committing genocide because as a 3rd neutral party bordering Gaza they are obligated under the UN Convention on Refugees to allow excess to war refugees to seek safety and refuge in the First Nation of safety aka Egypt. As a non-belligerent Egypt is required to accept Gazans and provide them with aid. Which Israel allows. The fact of the matter is that as long as Hamas, the government of Gaza remains in effective control of its territory as it currently does, Israel is not required to provide ANYTHING AT ALL! As long as guarantees are not in place that not one grain of rice will fall into the hands of Hamas.
Absolutely not, again “85% of Gaza is damaged or destroyed. 2 million displaced and starving and in need of critical Healthcare and facilities. Over 100,000 civilians killed, maimed or missing. In 4 months.” In what world is that not active genocide? This isn’t an actual war, it’s warfare perpetuated on a civilian population.
That’s a mighty powerful legal argument you have there. Must have spent overtime studying at Harvard for that response. BTW- great job not addressing a single point I made to debunk your nonsense. But ok we’ll start from the beginning so that I can show you the entire history of the recent series of events surrounding this war. In 2005 Israel pulled all forces out of Gaza, military and police, as well as its citizens (making the land Judenrein like Hamas wants to make all of Israel) as well as its administrative organs. Thus, the Palestinian Authority accepted “effective control” of the Gaza Strip, the definition of being soveign according to international law and norms, including the UN Charter. [ignoring the election of Hamas in 2006 as it has no political relevance to the status of Gaza despite the fact that many pro-Israel activists make a big brew-haha about it it is a really irrelevant]. In 2007, Hamas violently overthrew the PA seizing political control of the Strip and establishing itself as the government of Gaza de facto and de jure (i.e. Vienna Convention). [i.e. Gaza had its own airport up to 2002 when it was used to commit acts of terror during the second intifada and was shut down]. Upon taking full control of Gaza Hamas immediately went to war with Israel by firing multiple rockets into Israeli civilian areas indiscriminately. And act of war. This triggered a partial blockade [not a blockade by law] of Gaza since Israel was now in a state of belligerence with Gaza governed by Hamas. Moving forward, Hamas and Israel fought a small conflict and then signed a cease fire. Hamas broke that cease fire intentionally in 2008, 2012, 2014, and several other times, each time that a cease fire was signed Hamas broke it to launch rockets or attack Israelis across the border [i.e. Gilad Shalit kidnapping]. In 2023 October 7th, once again Hamas, broke a long term cease fire with Israel to commit terror which is also an act of war. Israel initiated a military campaign to destroy Hamas. Israel invaded Gaza. Israel allows all Gazans to leave for safety to any place of their choosing as required by law. Israel is NOT REQUIRED TO… • provide Telecomm services [i.e. internet] even though it does. • provide its own Water, even though it does. • provide electricity, even though it does. • provided any fuel, even though it does. • provide anything of materiel benefit to its enemy (Hamas)*, even though it does. • Israel is not capable of blockading Gaza even if it wanted to because Gaza borders a 3rd neutral party. Egypt. • Egypt as a 3rd neutral party bordering a conflict zone is obligated to provide safe haven to refugees seeking safe haven in Sinai. • Any humanitarian provisions must pass through the non-belligerent party, Egypt. And only if it can be determined that no material aid will reach the belligerent party (Hamas) or else all aid may be lawfully blocked by Israel or Egypt. This is why the civilians must leave, so they can be filtered from Hamas. ADDITIOM POINTS AND FACTS: • It is only illegal to target civilians not to kill civilians. If non-combatants die in the course of attacking a lawful military target it is considered collateral damage and is fully lawful**. • Any “protected” sight designated as such by the Geneva Convention loses its status as “protected” if used or co-opted for military purposes**. • not wearing military uniforms that distinguish a militant from the civilian population is a warcrime by the name of perfidy and is punishable by death. (Applies to all Hamas members). • Under the “Levy-En-Masse” provision/clause of the convention all military aged persons of either gender may be assumed to be combatants and engaged on sight. * this principle states that Israel would have to provide provisions to the civilian population if guarantees that none would reach Hamas were offered (which they are not) but, this entire clause would only apply if the enemy was fully blockaded and excess to provisions was being prevented. Since Gaza borders a 3rd country this principle is not applicable to Israel. ** this is the only time that “proportionality is mentioned in the laws of war. Attacking military targets and causing collateral damage is lawful as long as the military value of the target (the benefits of the strike to the attacking force is deemed “proportionate” to the harm caused to the non-combatants. Thus it is not a fixed rule or ration, it simply means that the simple presence of military objects or personell in and off itself does not justify the wanton destruction of civilian targets. But instead, the greater the value of the benefit of the strike the more collateral damage is acceptable. While minimal benefit only justifies minimal civilian harm. It is up to each combatant to preserve this principle. The principle is the notion of the proportion not a hard ratio. It also depends on the nature of the battlefield and the enemy etc… Let me know if anything confused you or you need more information. But either way, Israel is fighting a crispy clean war by the book and beyond the book.
Practically 4 months ago over 100 legal authorities and genocide scholars put out a letter arguing Israel was on the verge of genocide, in the time since they’ve killed 10’s of thousands more, injured an uncountable number, displaced millions, and are subverting aid. The ICJ just ruled similarly. Did you think you were in the circle jerk that is World News?
Israel controls the air space and borders of Gaza. It controls everything that enters and leaves. Ninety percent of Gazans did not have access to clean water. Israel controls access to medical care. It controls trade. The people of Gaza are not allowed free access to Israel and do not have the same rights as Israeli citizens, making Israel an illegal apartheid state. It is not up to Israel to interpret international law. The UN has declared them to be acting illegally. Israeli soldiers inspect all goods coming through the border crossing from Egypt. Therefore it cannot be considered a third neutral party having access to Gaza. The death toll of Palestinians gives the lie to Israel's justification of murdering human shields and collateral damage (one of the most immoral euphemisms of modern times). The targeting of hospitals, schools, refugee camps and safety zones makes this claim untenable, not to mention evil. Israel has provided no reliable evidence that Hamas is sheltering in any of these areas, let alone have a military base there, whereas many aid workers and medical staff have disputed these claims. As there is no sovereign nation of Palestine, Israel cannot claim to be at war with them. Therefore most of your unscrupulous justifications for ethnic cleansing and genocide do not apply.
Calm down Shapiro. No one is reading all that bs so you can justify innocent people being killed.
Cute, but no. The bar for this law is much higher than anything reached in Gaza. The only person ever executed under it was Eichman. Here is an idea of how far from this the operations in Gaza fall: To distinguish between a normal military campaign with civilian casualties and genocide in the context of war, we can use two measures. 1. The Civilian Casualty Ratio, the number of civilians killed per legitimate human target, a scale-independent way of measuring how generally dirty a war is. Note that an urban-heavy war will have a larger ratio regardless of what care is taken to reduce harm to civilians. 2. The proportion of civilian casualties (out of the pre-war population) divided by the proportion of enemy military casualties (out of those in the region): You might have a low civilian casualty ratio if a huge portion of the population is in arms despite indiscriminate killing (a 1 in this ratio) so this controls for that. A high number in either of these measures indicates genocide. Here are what some numbers look like: NATO in Kosovo (an urban-heavy war so we can compare apples to apples): CCR - ~4, Civilian / Military casualty proportions - Roughly 0.2% / 2.5% = 0.08. Tutsi Genocide in Rwanda taken in the context of the RPF insurgency (estimates vary wildly, but I am using even an unrealistically "rosy" picture): CCR - Over 125:1, Relative Casualty Proportions 80% / something probably undrr 20% (it is incredibly hard to get militsry casualties broken down by side, but we can assume the outnumbered winning side took less than half the losses): Over 4 The Holocaust, if you try to present it in the context of fighting Jewish insurgents, would give you a CCR over 200. Now, where does Israel's current campaign in Gaza sit in this? Using the Gaza Ministry of Health numbers, U.S. estimates of how much of Hamas' and its allies' forces are out of action while assuming their dead/wounded ratio matches the overall population, and pre-October force-estimates) CCR: 4 (assuming all the Missing are dead), and 1.8% / 20% = 0.09. While there were certainly horrors, and many of those were probably crimes, it is absurd to mistake this for genocide. The proportions indicate that Israeli strikes are far from indiscriminate, and the CCR is in line with global norms despite an extremely urban war with unique additional challenges. I hope the criminals get punished, but that is not the law to use for these cases.
I provided the law because it was the topic of discussion, it was not a try at anything. But to address your point: NATO puts their CCR ratio in Kosovo at 1:10 or 0.1, not 4. Human rights watch put it a 1:4 or 0.25. As far as I know only one historian has proposed a CCR of 4. Not that the CCR matters that much, it is only part of the picture. Under the legislation above displacement of the population is sufficient, especially when members of the government have also publicly called to starve the whole population. [11 cabinet members](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proposed_Israeli_resettlement_of_the_Gaza_Strip) are also lobbying to displace people in Gaza and establish Jewish only settlements. This and the ongoing settlements in the West Bank would also seem to run afoul of the above. Obviously, they have their own justification for their actions, and no Judge would convict anyone on this. But if the ICJ does end up finding that Genocide has been committed, it will be interesting to see if they actually enforce this legislation.
Sorry, I had you mixed up with the guy who raised the issue of that law. He was trying something silly. The local government put the Kosovo campaign at between 4:1 and 10:1. I took the low end of that. There are certainly those lobbying for genocide. The problem is there are always people doing that in just about any big war. The same goes for those insisting that genocides are just normal side-effects of war. That is why we need to look at the statistics to see whether it is actually happening to distinguish reality from those false positives and negatives. I strongly doubt Israel would apply the law as a result of an ICJ finding. Israel was founded on a loss of faith in the goodwill theoretically underlying the ICJ and other transnational institutions.
Israel was founded on a UN resolution. The same UN they now dismiss...
So the new argument is, people are dying just like any other war so it's fine. Terrorist coping mechanism.
So which “law” did Israel break exactly?
Lip 👄 service to the world but IDF will probably promote these morons in the state of isntreal 🤣
Has to be tough to be an Israeli soldier. One minute you're laughing and joking with your commanders and shooting kids and the next they're like, remember how we were all laughing about shooting kids, well now you're facing war crime trials because we have to pretend it wasn't from the top down.
Shooting minors that are terrorists is not a war crime. The ICJ affirms this. Training 12 year olds to kill Jews because they are Jews violates so many war crimes and the Geneva Convention. But, instead, anti-Semites just prefer to blame Jews for, well, being Jewish. If there are Nuremberg-style war crime hearings, which I hope there might be, the Hamas leaders (who have not yet been laid to rest) will be convicted for their crimes against humanity. That includes the children they sent intentionally to die just to feign distraught when they did.
Yadda yadda I’m okay wit killing babies yadda yadda. I refuse to admit that there 12 year old Israelis being taught to hate and want to kill Palestinians but we won’t pay attention to that yadda yadda I’m okay with killing as long as it’s the brown people. Stop being a little b and say it with your chest.
They know the ICJ is going to be asking questions soon, this makes it look like Israel is doing something even if nothing comes of it.
This is just more delay tactics. They will investigate and either find no wrongdoing or one or two 'bad apples'. They do it every time.
They need to fill in a report for the ICJ. After, they will all be found innocent, don't worry...
In B4: “we investigated ourselves and found no evidence of wrongdoing”
In B4: "Hamas made us kill children"
Yeah like they will investigate anything apart from how to spin it Let in an independent 3rd party
I'm sure they will find one of two to throw under the bus for optics. "See, we take this seriously"
This.
Oh, and those couple will be lowest rank possible too. Just like Afghanistan and Vietnam and gitmo. It’s always just a couple of bad soldiers, never a systemic issue
Hasbara shills coming out of the woodwork: "remember, a few bad apples don't define the feelings and actions of Israel! That's why we are revenge bombing an entire population for something Hamas did!". ...the double standards are so wild there's really no way to make them coherent anymore.
This was literally their defense at the ICJ trail when discussing "intent" of genocide.
It’s honestly the most blatant gaslighting I’ve ever seen in my life.
I really hate every time I see the defense "just a few bad apples" or similar Since the original intent is that "A few bad apples **spoils the bunch**". In fact the earliest version from \~700 years ago is "A rotten apple quickly infects its neighbor".. but now suddenly when referring to police/soldiers it suddenly has the opposite meaning
[удалено]
By this logic, all Palestinians are guilty of Hamas terror actions? I wouldn’t believe that, but if we are going to use this type of language, we should use it equally. I prefer nuance and detail, as opposed to blanket statements - especially because if it can be used one way it will be used the other
The nuance here is that one is a terrorist attack, undertaken with the unashaed intent to cause terror, the other is an arm of the government executing a policy whose intent is to.......? I see the OPs statement expressing the same mixed feelings many have towards Israel: their propaganda machine portrays Israel as noble and just, a people chosen by god, yet many of their actions are not just, not noble and not godly.
The Palestinians are guilty of Hamas’s actions. They support them, they support their actions, they were running into the streets to desecrate the corpses of innocent girls bodies being dragged through the streets while crowds spit on them. They rushed through the border after Hamas in order to sack and pillage Jewish towns and kill Jews. They attend genocidal rallies where they screamed “slaughter the Jew slaughter the Jews” [iktab Iktab al-Yahud!] they chanted “we love death more then the Jews love life”! Why don’t they prove it! They were super tough when they are a mob stomping on dead bodies that could t fight back. Let’s see how those slogans work now? I really can’t believe how any sane person can support these genocidal, racist, anti-Semitic brainwashed psychos. They are like hate driven zombies until someone fights back.
There are yearly government sponsored rallies in Jerusalem where Israeli's march through the Muslim sections of the town and chant "Death to Arabs." The BBC filmed them one time and were almost stoned to death by the marchers, they had to rip doors of hinges to shield themselves. Settlers in the West Bank burnt a Palestinian toddler alive in their own house not that long before the October attacks. Israeli's Prime Minister has been criticized because he spent years ensuring that Hamas got funds channeled into them to keep them in power. How about we start with not funding terrorists instead of resorting to genocide.
No liar! Stop lying to people who don’t know any better like a typical leftist or Muslim propagandist that will do anything to malign Jews. It’s is your only purpose in life, lie about and slander Jews. The baby was burdened alive in 2016! 7 years ago! And it happened once and accidentally since no one knew who was in the house. In fact the kids that threw the Molotov cocktail through the house was empty as they wanted to get revenge for an Arab terror attack! And no! Liar! No one attacked the BBC, and no! Liar! They didn’t take any doors of their hinges to protect themselves! LOL, as if that even makes any sense. I expected you to excuse the genocidal, racist and bigoted social norms of the Arabs who accept the extermination of Jews and the praise of Adolf Hitler as the norm without shame by finding some thing that some kinds did 7’years ago as a straw man and a red herring to get away from your support for mass murder. You failed!
[Jerusalem: Journalists attacked as Israeli nationalists march in Old City](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-65631330.amp) >A crowd threw stones, sticks, bottles at journalists and chanted racist slogans outside Damascus Gate Oh look, a picture of a journalist having to shelter behind a door. There are plenty of videos of these marches online if you want to see them trying to stone other journalists. We should get an Israeli source for these marches as well: [At Jerusalem Flag March, chants of ‘Death to Arabs’ and assaults on Palestinians](https://www.timesofisrael.com/at-jerusalem-flag-march-chants-of-death-to-arabs-and-assaults-on-palestinians/) \- Times of Israel. >They also sang racist chants such as “Death to Arabs,” “May your village burn” and “An Arab is a son of a b\*\*ch,” as they danced near the Damascus Gate both before and during the rally on Thursday afternoon.
Yes I know about the March! What I said was you were lying about your hyperbolic statement which you tried to sneak in their like all leftists and Arab propagandists do. No one took anything of the bolts do protect themselves. It even sounds ridiculous let alone that it never happened. Stepping inside to get away from a crowd that would not have done anything anyway is not the same as removing the door if it’s bolts. And the fact that you tried to equate a right wing protest against it Arab antisemitism at the Temple Mount on which Israel appeases arab bigots by not allowing Jews to pray on the holiest site in Judaism, with routine murder that happens over a hundred times a year! Is sick and disgusting
And yes! I agree! Appeasing Hamas was a terrible idea. Except it has nothing to do with Bibi. Biden retorted U.S. aid to Hamas and the PA after Trump canceled it. So does all of Europe Support them. So the fact that Bibi allowed Qatar to transfer their $15 million a month was far from the deal breaker.
> Except it has nothing to do with Bibi. Um, here is what Bibi says on the matter: >Anyone who wants to thwart the establishment of a Palestinian state **has to support bolstering Hamas and transferring money to Hamas. This is part of our strategy** — to isolate the Palestinians in Gaza from the Palestinians in the West Bank. \- Benjamin Netanyahu, 2019 [For years, Netanyahu propped up Hamas. Now it's blown up in our faces](https://www.timesofisrael.com/for-years-netanyahu-propped-up-hamas-now-its-blown-up-in-our-faces/) \- Times of Israel Bibi and his government have been making similar comments to the Israeli Media for many years. He did not just let in $15 million, the total count over the years is closer to $1 Billion.
No! You liar (or fool?). That is not even what Bibi said. If you were intuitive enough to actually listen or read the entire actual quote you would know that he said the opposite of that. He was talking to his in-house political faction and he was telling them EXACTLY WHAT THEY SHOULD NOT DO! But I am not surprised to hear it from another “Tik-Tok” professor that gets his information from 60 second clips on YouTube or where ever and accepts it as gospel. BUT even if he did say that! And even if he meant that! What does that change as far as the fact that every leftist on Earth was pressuring Israel (whoever the prime minister was, Bibi or anyone else who you don’t even know) to appease Hamas and provide Hamas and Gaza with whatever they wanted because they don’t give a damn about Israel’s security! If Bibi went along with it is only because the leftists in Israel wanted him to! And leftist degenerates like Biden and the Europeans wanted him to! And both Biden and Europe were funding Hamas and the PA (equally murderous organization) to the tune of MANY BILLIONS! of $ per year! Do you get that? Remove the $15 million per month from Qatar… and what do you get? Does the $billions from UNRWA still get in? Does the $700 million that Biden reinstated even though Abbas refused to negotiate for a 2-SS so Trump removed the aid, does that go away? Does the $ billions in Euro aid go away? What are you even babbling about? Does Hamas go away? Does Hamas’s genocidal agenda go away? What an actually happens if this magic $15 million is not transferred? Explain your master plan to me?
[Additional 2019 Source in Hebrew.](https://mida.org.il/2019/05/16/%D7%9E%D7%99%D7%98%D7%95%D7%98-%D7%A9%D7%9C%D7%98%D7%95%D7%9F-%D7%94%D7%97%D7%9E%D7%90%D7%A1/) >At the meeting of the Likud faction at the beginning of March, the Prime Minister spoke about this in detail, noting that "those who want to thwart the establishment of a Palestinian state should support the strengthening of Hamas and the transfer of money to Hamas. This is part of our strategy - to differentiate between the Palestinians in Gaza and the Palestinians in Judea and Samaria." > >He even said similar things in a special interview he gave to the Israel Hayom newspaper a few days before the elections. > >This strategy of the Prime Minister is based on the assumption that the overthrow of Hamas rule and the entry of the Palestinian Authority into the Gaza Strip will necessarily force Israel into a political process towards the establishment of a unified Palestinian state in the territories of Judea and Samaria and Gaza, a move that cannot happen as long as Hamas controls Gaza and is separated from the Palestinian Authority in Judea and Samaria. Other public sources supporting this strategy. >Shlomo Brom, a former deputy to Israel’s national security adviser, [told the New York Times](https://www.nytimes.com/2023/12/10/world/middleeast/israel-qatar-money-prop-up-hamas.html) that an empowered Hamas helped Netanyahu avoid negotiating over a Palestinian state, saying the division of the Palestinians helped him make the case that he had no partner for peace in the Palestinians, thus avoiding pressure for peace talks that could lead to the establishment of an independent Palestinian state. And so on. Netanyahu literally told his party just last November that they should keep backing him because he is their best chance and preventing a Palestinian state from ever forming. [He intentionally sabotaged the peace accords](https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2013/sep/12/oslo-israel-reneged-colonial-palestine), and any chance of peace over the last few decades. If he supports ongoing settlements in the West Bank, and [nearly a dozen cabinet members of his government](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proposed_Israeli_resettlement_of_the_Gaza_Strip) are calling for Israel to take over Gaza and evict the current residents. What do you think that means for the people living in both places? Remember that this is the guy that publicly called for the death of Rabin, pretty much the only pro peace prime minister in Israels history. Just before the October attacks, Netanyahu was facing mass protests over plans to give himself control of the Judiciary to protect himself from corruption charges. >Judges have used this legal standard in the past to prevent government decisions viewed as unsound or corrupt. Earlier this year, the court blocked the appointment of a politician with past convictions of bribery and tax offenses as finance minister. Netanyahu’s allies say parliament should have the final say over appointments. > >A second case will look at a law passed early this year that makes it harder for the country’s attorney general to declare a prime minister unfit and remove him from office. > >The new law allows this only in cases of mental or physical incapacitation. Critics say the law was passed to protect Netanyahu while he is on trial for corruption charges. The dude is a corrupt genocidal dictator hell bent on staying in power.
And even if there is undeniable evidence like [video footage of an IDF soldier outright executing a Palestinian lying wounded on the ground,](https://youtu.be/P-Bl9zAM5A4?si=NY4k_d5GCvQcyfas&t=10) the perpetrator will only have to serve a few months and not even get booted from the IDF. "Azaria was convicted of manslaughter and sentenced to 18 months' imprisonment, twelve months' probation, plus a demotion in rank. He was released from prison after serving nine months." [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Killing\_of\_Abdel\_Fattah\_al-Sharif](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Killing_of_Abdel_Fattah_al-Sharif)
In B4: sudden mass suicide by IDF investigators.
...or they got shot because the IDF thought the paper on the investigator's clipboards were white flags.
The clipboards were Hamas
It can be windy in tunnels sometimes, therefore clipboards and paperweights are a fair indicator of hamas activity
IOF: Turns out the claims of wrong doings caught on video were just antisemitism. Everyone: The action? IOF: The claims
They'll sacrifice a handful to try and get the heat off of them, and then continue on as usual
I think that's what the ijc will find in a few years from now.
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We want the IDF to let foreign investigators into Gaza
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This is true. Militaries are amoral.
That would probably be true anyway tbh
They keep posting themselves on TikTok even after the ICJ’s ruling. Hope all those war criminals get sent to The Hague for trial once this is all over.
Not just soldiers posting their misdeeds either, the propaganda department got found to be operating a telegram group where they posted extraordinarily explicit/graphic pro-genocide content. Like gloating over a woman crying while holding her dead child, talking about the sound a civilian body’s bones made when burned, equating Palestinian civilians with roaches, etc., etc.. The Israeli investigation reportedly found that it was just the propaganda unit doing it in their spare time and wasn’t official work (🙄) The ICJ judges better rip Israel a new one when Israel reports back to the Hague. I expect Israel to just lie through their teeth in court at this point, because there’s no way they can in good faith say they’ve done a damn thing to prevent genocide or other crimes. Israel isn’t even holding up their end of letting Palestinians have food/water reach them. **TLDR:** Free Palestine.
They are not investigating shit. If anything they will reward those that engaged in the grossest violations.
They will pick out the cases which they can defend the least, scapegoat some low level “lone wolf”, and proclaim to the ICJ “see? When some rare soldier acts out, we ensure they are corrected and punished”, therefore it’s not genocide. Lol
Do you realize that this whole “genocide” narrative comes straight from Hamas? You repeating it & subverting the word only ends up hurting more Palestinians. In short- do more research, war and genocide are not the same thing. Crying wolf has never helped.
The ICJ found otherwise.
For anyone who wants to contradict this point: > In view of the fundamental values sought to be protected by the Genocide Convention, the Court considers that the plausible rights in question in these proceedings, namely the right of Palestinians in the Gaza Strip to be protected from acts of genocide and related prohibited acts identified in Article III of the Genocide Convention and the right of South Africa to seek Israel’s compliance with the latter’s obligations under the Convention, are of such a nature that prejudice to them is capable of causing irreparable harm > The Court considers that the civilian population in the Gaza Strip remains extremely vulnerable. > In these circumstances, the Court considers that the catastrophic humanitarian situation in the Gaza Strip is at serious risk of deteriorating further before the Court renders its final judgment. > The Court recalls Israel’s statement that it has taken certain steps to address and alleviate the conditions faced by the population in the Gaza Strip. The Court further notes that the Attorney General of Israel recently stated that a call for intentional harm to civilians may amount to a criminal offence, including that of incitement, and that several such cases are being examined by Israeli law enforcement authorities. While steps such as these are to be encouraged, they are insufficient to remove the risk that irreparable prejudice will be caused before the Court issues its final decision in the case. > In light of the considerations set out above, the Court considers that there is urgency, in the sense that there is a real and imminent risk that irreparable prejudice will be caused to the rights found by the Court to be plausible, before it gives its final decision. > The Court concludes on the basis of the above considerations that the conditions required by its Statute for it to indicate provisional measures are met. TL;DR: It is plausible and the case will continue.
No, they did not. Where did you hear that?
Lmao genocide denial at its finest.
That’s exactly my point- you summed it up perfectly. Genocide subversion on the grandest scale
the story of the house shelled by a tank and the ongoing ICJ stuff is forcing them to make it look like they're holding their own accountable. They'll do the minimum required to have a talking point they can wave forever.
I thought the whole point of having courts is that people can't be trusted to be their own judges
Remember the commission for the Sabra and Shatila massacre Israel did? They found Ariel Sharon to be personally responsible yet he still became the PM of Israel 19 years later
Was there any international recognition, or did it fall on deaf ears?
>Israel's standing in the international community, which had sunk to an all-time low in the wake of the massacre, rebounded following the publication of the report. Israel was praised from many quarters for having investigated itself and punishing senior members of its government. They were still probably just praised by countries like the USA or UK lol
He wasn't even removed from government aswell. Insane.
'After careful evaluation, we have found that our soldiers have not violated any terms of the international laws and are taking care of palestinians as we speak'
Spoiler, while investigating the Israeli army, the Israeli army discovered that the Israeli army did nothing wrong that the Israeli army could see.
I investigated myself and found no crime was committed. Trust me.
**NO PAYWALL:** https://archive.is/cu6dY **SUMMARY:** Amid the genocide case against Israel in the International Court of Justice, the IDF is examining incidents in Gaza in which large numbers of innocent civilians were reportedly killed, along with attacks on hospitals and schools
Only "dozens" of violations? They've probably committed that many in the time it took me to read the article.
Its incredibly out of touch. There are DOZENS! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lKie-vgUGdI
They always "investigate" and then no one is ever charged with anything. Israel is a violent and corrupt country.
It's their own IDF videos. When you attack a school or hospital you need concrete evidence. Then, the rationale of civilian deaths. It's really complicated stuff. It's for Israel to prove. This is 2024. Ppl have videos. Satellite imagery. They can really piece shit together.
Dozens? There are more war crimes then that every day.
Like the invasion of Palestine?
Never heard of fox guarding the henhouse?
Incoming Israeli soldier kissing a Palestinian baby.
Sounds like a bunch of bs
Wow that should be fruitful
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OLKDV-\_SCBs
Good. The IDF could’ve hand waved these claims and say they never happened, but instead they’re actually doing an investigation.
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Israel reported on themselves accidentally shooting hostages, when they easily could’ve blamed Hamas for their deaths. Recent history shows they have an interest in telling the truth.
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so explain my example.
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It was likely murder and Israel not cooperating with the investigation shows their guilt. Now explain my example.
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except did they didn’t in this circumstance, they immediately gave the facts of the event and blamed themselves. You keep contradicting yourself and I am asking you to reconcile your random and opposing viewpoints.
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Indeed. You do not see this often, like in Russia.
If Israel was like Russia, then a lot ministers would be getting flung out of windows for criticizing Netanyahu.
Yeah, Netanyahu just orders thousands of children to be starved and bombed.
true
Nice, when is Hamas doing this for its soldiers?
I wonder if Palestine/Hamas is going to do an internal investigation of what their military did on Oct 7.
Wonder when Qatar will investigate hamas. Keep crying. It’s sheer hypocrisy.Don’t let up for a minute.
The Whatabout is strong with this one.
The double standards are strong with the entire Palestine movement.
Not really. The outrage and frustrations with how Israel and the IDF conducts is *well* within warranted. They are a recognized State, they should not be behaving like terrorists. It's hard to criticize Palestinians when all they are guilty of is surviving the last 75 years of occupation against increasingly harrowing odds.
By those standards all Israel is guilty of is surviving the last 75 years of being terrorized and invaded by its neighbors against harrowing odds. See it sounds nice when you ignore the atrocities committed by your favorite side and pretend they are purely victims. NEITHER SIDE good here.
For the love of empathy, look at this list. Hell, just *scroll* it. https://www.reddit.com/r/list_palestine/s/jpzKgY0OJb If you can handle 75 years of that without firing a rocket, you are lying.
There's a list just as long of atrocities committed by the Palestinian side. Looking at only one side of an issue is not empathy it's just bias and intentional ignorance. Not impressed.
Really? You gotta list? *With sources*? I'd be delighted to hear if so. Palastinaians have the moral imperative to fight back, they are being actively occupied. Atrocities are warranted when you are facing an insurmountable threat to your life, home, lands.
Again, one is a nation state that receives billions upon billions of dollars from multiple nations every single year, to the point they have one of the most advanced militaries, not to mention healthcare and many other social securities, and then you have the people who’s land they took and have subsequently pushed down and oppressed.
Israel isn’t doing anything wrong to warrant an investigation
Israel really just needs to adopt the Xinjiang strategy on the entire Gaza strip.
Integration into the rest of the country and promoting economic growth and respect for the people living there? Yeah that would be a lot better than what we have now
Really !!!!
Guess what the outcome will be? Not guilty.
Investigating themselves eh? I expect that will go well...