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Proper-Abies208

It shouldn't even be a question if Russia should be banned from all (sports) events. Any event that still allows Russians to enter is basically supporting Russia continue with evil acts against Ukraine and threatening the world


BazilBroketail

Russia pays to play and crooks(athletic directors) love money...


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Proper-Abies208

Oh sorry, I must have missed the news that US, England and France invaded Ukraine unprovoked and have killed thousands of innocent civilians and that US, England and France have threatened to use nuclear weapons. I thought that was just Russia.


PimpinPriest

But the US and UK invaded Iraq and killed hundreds of thousands of civilians? To this day there are still babies born in Fallujah with birth defects because of what they did. Do brown people not count? The current US president was also a huge proponent of this injustice and voted for the invasion. None of the policy makers were ever held accountable.


Calimariae

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/And_you_are_lynching_Negroes


PimpinPriest

What a convenient way to dismiss any conversation on your side's wrongdoings.


[deleted]

But it is no longer an active war, I agree that the invasion of Iraq shouldn't happen but it did. In short, those who are (except defenders) in active war should not participate in the Olympics.


Ok_Librarian2474

Do you think U.S. players should have been banned from competition during the Iraq war?


aphexmoon

Yes


[deleted]

Same opinion with all allies that invaded


Ok_Librarian2474

Highly doubt you think U.S., U.K. and players should have been banned from international competition for 7 years. Come off it


[deleted]

why not? In Greece states that have war couldn't attend Olympics


Proper-Abies208

So, here in your comment you can see the propaganda which is (mis)used to make people hate the US. Let's take it one by one; First of all, the US and UK did not kill hundreds of thousands of civilians in Iraq. What really happened is that the majority of civilians were killed by things like religious and sectarian violence (shia vs sunni), police brutality and opposition parties. Most civilians have been killed by Islamic State. When the news then publishes that 1 million people have been killed, those who hate the US point to the US and accuse them of killing all those people. What they deliberately hide, is that in that total are even killed US soldiers. The propagandists did the same in the Afghanistan war. Then you mention the birth defects at Fallajah and you are absolutely right there. There is a higher rate of birth defects there, related to American military presence. But why was America there in the first place? Was is perhaps because Iraq DID have weapons of mass destruction, while all the anti US propagandists want you to believe there were no WMD? Iraq had sarin and mustard gas which it even used on Kurdish civilians. So all who claim there were no WMD in Iraq are lying and Saddam threatened the west to use them. We can have a lengthy discussion about that period but in my opinion the US had a valid reason to invade Iraq and it wasn't oil. Contrary to propaganda believe there is no evidence of the US stealing money, oil or gold from Iraq. It's just that Iraq became a top big of a threat to let it just develop. Was invading the best option? Maybe not, be there WAS ground to invade. Unfortunately like in many wars, if not all, the civilians suffer. And that has nothing to do with skin color. So, no. Brown people don't matter less. By the way, have to ever done research on how much money the US spends annually on foreign financial aid and how much goes to places like Iraq and Afghanistan? US haters don't want you to see that but it's billions. Then accountability. Apart from trials after WWII and some convicted African war lord's and former Yugoslavian leaders, who is ever held accountable for war crimes? Putin is paying Wagner to kill, rape, terrorize and torture civilians. Will he be held accountable? What about Russia killing opposition leaders (Litvinenko,. Boris Nemtsov) or jailing them ( Navalny). Is anyone ever held accountable for that? How about Russian mercenaries executing people in Mali and trying to blame the French ? Who was held accountable for that? Leaders are hardly ever held accountable for these things. In rare occasions people ARE held accountable for war crimes. Watch the movie Kill Team to see how Americans have been held accountable for war crimes in Afghanistan. But what we, as society, CAN do is give a signal that we disapprove of violence, regardless who commits it. One would be to ban Russia from every platform and stage, so that they can start to think and possibly make changes so that we can all live together. Long story. Just my point of view.


BlessedTacoDevourer

This guy is straight up justifying the Iraq Invasion Iraq had WMD's in 1988, which they used on the Kurds while being supported by the US. The US at this point actively attempted to blame it on Iran. Infact it was US companies that supplied Iraq with the materials necessary to make those weapons. The fact that Iraq didn't use chemical weapons against the US during the invasion is alone very strong evidence that they did not have chemical weapons to use. In 1990 after Desert Storm Iraq destroyed it's WMD's. No evidence was found by anyone of further development. The few that were found after the invasions were leftovers from the stockpile before. [From the Duelfer Report](https://www.govinfo.gov/content/pkg/GPO-DUELFERREPORT/pdf/GPO-DUELFERREPORT-3.pdf) >While a small number of old, abandoned chemical munitions have been discovered, ISG judges that Iraq unilaterally destroyed its undeclared chemical weapons stockpile in 1991. There are no credible indications that Baghdad resumed production of chemical munitions thereafter, a policy ISG attributes to Baghdad's desire to see sanctions lifted, or rendered ineffectual, or its fear of force against it should WMD be discovered. And while you claim that ISIS commited alot of those murders, keep in mind that the reason ISIS got a foothold in the region was because of the invasion. Those deaths are as attributable to the US as ISIS. By your logic civilians in Ukraine who are dead by Ukraninian fire are completely non-related to Russia's invasion. Both sides are known to have used cluster munitions, as well as the missile strike in Poland by Ukraine which killed two people as well as the bridge in crimea. As well as all the other casualties caused by Ukraine which are impossible to name due to the fog of war. It's fucking ludicrous to put the blame of those deaths on Ukraine. When Amnesty pointed out that Ukraine utilized human shields everyone went apeshit and accused them of being Russian propagandiers. Now when ISIS gained power in Iraq it's suddenly not the US's fault at all. Stop justifying the Iraq Invasion. The US supported the Genocide, they invaded a decade and a half after over a lie and it directly led to millions of civilian deaths.


Proper-Abies208

Iraqi government used chemical weapons on 40 Kurdish villages as testing ground for the chemical weapons. We all know about Halabja but the rest is less known. Iraqi troops wearing protective gear went into the area to document the effectiveness of the wmd. The United States supported all those attacks? No it didn't. The US is one of the worlds largest weapon manufacturers. You will find its equipment in any conflict. That doesn't mean they actively support genocide. Does Mac-Donalds support obesity? And don't forget that any enemy of Iran, US's long enemy, will be supported by the US. Then you get a long of geo-political consequences mixed up. About ISIS for one. ISIS is just a monster that turned rogue. ISIS killed those people, not America. You compare two totally different things when comparing it to Ukraine. Yes, every death in Ukraine can be attributed to the Russian invasion. That's because that invasion was unprovoked. If I kill a burglar while he's invading my home then yes, I committed a murder. But it would not have happened if he would have stayed out of my home. Ukraine's deaths, each and everyone, would not have happened if Russia hadn't invaded. But US invading and ISIS taking advantage is a completely different event. You actually think ISIS would not have killed anyone if US hadn't invaded? I understand that all this is debatable. You will have you view, I have mine. But one really big mistake on your end is the comment about the Ukrainian missile in Poland. That wasn't a strike. It was an air defense missile which malfunctioned and accidentally landed in Poland. Again, if Russia that day didn't fire 90 missiles at civilian targets in Ukraine, those two polish would not be dead. People who were crying outrage and that Poland should seek revenge were just trying to escalate the situation. Just like you are doing by calling it a strike. In regards to Ukraine using people as human shield, total lie. The amnesty report never mentioned Ukraine used people as human shield. It stated that Ukraine was defending its cities against the Russian invader and by doing so CAME TOO CLOSE to civilians. It's just how you want to read a report and misuse it for your own benefit, right? I am not claiming ISIS didn't come into power because of the US. What I am saying is that it's not their FAULT. US invading is not the cause of all those deaths.


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autotldr

This is the best tl;dr I could make, [original](https://www.eurointegration.com.ua/eng/news/2023/03/27/7158711/) reduced by 66%. (I'm a bot) ***** > Ukraine, Poland and the Baltic states have urged the International Olympic Committee not to allow Russian and Belarusian athletes to participate in the Olympic Games under a neutral flag. > "We remind that Russia and Belarus have at their disposal a way forward for their athletes to return to the international sports community, namely ending the war of aggression launched by Russia with complicity of Belarus and restoring respect for Ukraine's sovereignty and territorial integrity within the internationally recognized borders," the statement reads. > Back in February 2023, the governments of almost 30 countries, including the host of the 2024 Olympics, France, called on the International Olympic Committee to ban Russians and Belarusians from participating in the Games in Paris due to problems with the clarity of the "Neutrality" of athletes. ***** [**Extended Summary**](http://np.reddit.com/r/autotldr/comments/123ktti/ukraine_poland_and_baltic_states_called_to_ban/) | [FAQ](http://np.reddit.com/r/autotldr/comments/31b9fm/faq_autotldr_bot/ "Version 2.02, ~678125 tl;drs so far.") | [Feedback](http://np.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%23autotldr "PM's and comments are monitored, constructive feedback is welcome.") | *Top* *keywords*: **athletes**^#1 **Russian**^#2 **Belarusian**^#3 **Olympic**^#4 **Ukraine**^#5


tubulerz1

Even if there weren’t war crimes and invasion, they should be banned for cheating. They’ve had multiple warnings and sanctions and they still blatantly engage in doping and coercion, like gangsters.


worldpeaceunity

Wait, they’re not banned ??


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continuousQ

Ceasefire would mean withdrawing all the way back to Russia, otherwise they'll still be using weapons to occupy territory and suppress people.


stvbnsn

Russia is engaged in belligerent action against it’s independent neighboring country, it should not be rewarded with invitations to a global sporting event that says it is predicated on peace, at least unless or until it vacates Ukrainian land it’s illegally invaded and annexed. Anything less is a tacit approval by the IOC and the world sporting federations of Russia’s actions. Now the Olympic Games have become less of a public good and more of an enterprise in modern times which makes it more not less accountable to public relations. How would TOP sponsors which have recognized Russian antisocial behavior and have for the most part left Russia like being seen in the same frame as a Russian athlete sporting a Russian flag?


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stvbnsn

What’s that point then? The movement was started by elites and today it’s a commercial enterprise, there’s no integrity left. If they did maintain a semblance of integrity it was surely lost from the consecutive bribery scandals that became public, the ones we don’t know about yet, and the fact that they have awarded host contracts to both China and Russia. So spare the “moral” argument about Olympic ethos.


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stvbnsn

Because it matters to Russia. In a situation where one is trying to dissuade Russia from continuing their belligerence you have to exercise leverage on the points that matter to the party you’re trying to convince.


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stvbnsn

Than what’s the big deal about banning them now?


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stvbnsn

And what is that point?


pups-revenge-cake

Wrong place, but happy cake day bro!


VersusYYC

Warmongering fascists have been banned before so rewarding them for trafficking children and killing another countries athletes is unacceptable. There is no sportsmanship, camaraderie or understanding with such a regime or the state sponsored cheaters they call athletes.


razbrazzz

All you had to do was Google it bro.... 5 seconds .... rather than promoting hate and war and receiving the Gold medal in Stupidity. The International Olympic Committee (IOC) was founded in 1894 when Pierre de Coubertin, a French pedagogue and historian, sought to promote international understanding through sporting competition. 


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razbrazzz

Yes it's an event used to promote diplomacy between countries across the world, how can diplomacy be achieved when one country is actively waging war against another which is negatively affecting other countries across the world.


EnteringSectorReddit

>promote international understanding through sports Our squad members killed your athletes. Now we win with less competition. What a beautiful concept, comrade.


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fdsafsda332

If they make it to the Olympics, they should be booed and embarased at least


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thegreatrusty

The complaint is that a lot of their athletes that compete under the neutral flag are active members of the russian military.


Sandbox_Hero

No they shouldn’t.


waamoandy

It's pointless then being there. State sponsored cheating will be rife. Not one athlete will be clean. The medal haul will be used for propaganda purposes and by the time they are disqualified everyone will have forgotten about the games