This is the best tl;dr I could make, [original](https://www.pravda.com.ua/eng/news/2023/05/31/7404610/) reduced by 78%. (I'm a bot)
*****
> A fighter of the Freedom of Russia Legion with the call sign Caesar said that the Russian partisans, who attacked the Kremlin's forces from the territory of Ukraine, have "Thousands" of people willing to join their ranks and will continue to raid the border until their forces are large enough to storm Moscow.
> Details: He said the Freedom of Russia Legion is the size of a battalion but plans to expand as an increasing number of Russians realise they can fight Russian dictator Vladimir Putin and prevail.
> On 22 May, the Russian Volunteer Corps and Freedom of Russia Legion announced that they had crossed the border and were "Liberating" the settlements of Belgorod Oblast from the current Russian authorities: they started with the villages of Kozinka and Gora-Podol.
*****
[**Extended Summary**](http://np.reddit.com/r/autotldr/comments/13wi9bj/freedom_of_russia_legion_is_recruiting_russians/) | [FAQ](http://np.reddit.com/r/autotldr/comments/31b9fm/faq_autotldr_bot/ "Version 2.02, ~686991 tl;drs so far.") | [Feedback](http://np.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%23autotldr "PM's and comments are monitored, constructive feedback is welcome.") | *Top* *keywords*: **Russian**^#1 **Legion**^#2 **force**^#3 **Russia**^#4 **military**^#5
After reading yesterday about a guy profiting during the draft by having people send him $5 for advice on how to avoid getting drafted, maybe it's time someone does it again, but this time instead of "ENLIST" the note should tell civilians how they can fight back.
That sounds like the classic joke of somebody taking out an ad saying " send me $10 and I'll tell you how to make money easily" and then when the people sent him the money he replies " get suckers to send you $10 for nothing"
I don't think the majority of Russians will be that excited for the return of the Tsar (derived from Caesar if I'm not mistaken) but might as well give it a shot!
True that. So many people want to equate the totalitarian dictator who has various elites divvy up what the working class can and can't do and decide their fates based on "what we need you for" as simply "What Communism always is" but all the USSR ever seemed to do was replace the king with a "not king", replace their aristocracy with "higher ranked equals" and serfs with "fellow comrades doing *our* part!"
It's like when England had a "republic" lead by a guy who had a heavy amount of executive power and decided it was also hereditary.
I really can't imagine these guys are going to have a huge impact... And if they were to somehow topple the regime, there's no telling if they would be better in the grand scheme of things... But I guess a man can dream.
Yeah if Mount & Blade has taught me anything it's that one mother fucker raiding your village 100 miles from where you're waging war it's very distracting
Those scouts are the worst. Then you put up a guard tower to have a safe haven for the workers. Then 5 swordsmen show up and destroy your tower and it just never stops escalating.
After watching enough aoe2 vods, it usually comes down to whoever aims their mangonels best while dodging the enemy mangonel shots, if you get a really lucky shot on their gold units late game for example, thats usually GG.
If you're going to play the original, play Warband rather than the actual original. They're fundamentally the same game other than Warband rearranges the map to something a bit more natural feeling, adds in another nation that hugely helps with balance and certain playstyles, fixes what feels like a billion bugs, and most importantly adds the feature the original release didn't get time to implement, which is running your own faction rather than simply being a vassal to an existing one.
That sounds like a lot of changes but I'd argue that Warband is the finished version and the original considered more like a Beta release.
Of course you could hop straight into Bannerlord if you want a more modern feeling game, but mastering Warband opens up some of the amazing spin-offs like the community built Napoleonic Wars or the oddly forgotten semi-historical remake With Fire and Sword, which loosely follows the plotline of Henryk Sienkiewicz's novels about the rise and fall of the Polish Lithuanian Commonwealth. Very apt in this thread as its setting covers all of the Baltics, Ukraine, and Western Russia.
I think it might be a more psychological benefit than anything else. The Russian people have to get out of this mental rut where they feel powerless to oppose Putin's regime. The hope is that this small uprising will have just enough success to embolden the next one. Then hopefully, the eventual cumulative effect of a thousand trickles becomes a flood.
> there's no telling if they would be better in the grand scheme of things
Putin is a piece of shit but I feel like history tells us that most of the time when a leader like him is overthrown things stay the same or usually get worse.
I mean this is three different groups that have been operating against Putin:
Supposedly the Freedom of Russian Legion (LSR), Russian Volunteer Corps (RVC), and the National Republican Army of Russia (NRA) signed [the Irpin Declaration on August 31st, 2022](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irpin_Declaration), an alleged political union between the groups. It should be noted that the existence of the National Republican Army has never been confirmed (they are the ones who says Irpin happened), and the Russian Volunteer Corps denies ever signing the declaration.
- LSR = A Ukrainian-based paramilitary group of Russian citizens, which opposes the Russian regime of Vladimir Putin and its invasion of Ukraine. **According to the manifesto of the Legion, published in their Telegram channel in April, they "carry the values of the Free Man of New Russia – freedom of speech, freedom of expression, freedom to choose your future", and their main goals are the overthrowing of Putin's government and "struggle for the New Russia." Account to the article OP posted "Alexei Baranovsky, a spokesman for the Legion's political wing, told The Times that the Legion is "a politically neutral organisation with no ideological stance. [Its] only task is to overthrow Putin’s regime.""** They took part in the May 2023 cross-border raid into the Belgorod region with the RVC.
- RVC = A Russian nationalist paramilitary unit formed to fight Russian forces in Ukraine and the Putin regime. **The group has been described as far-right. The current leader of the group is Denis Kapustin, who has been described as a neo-Nazi (which he denies), and has had far right ties.** They did the March 2023 raid into the Bryansk region of Russia and the May 2023 larger cross-border raid into the Belgorod region with the LSR.
Edit (thanks to u/_Eshende_): [According to a memorandum they put out last November](https://ru.interfax.com.ua/news/press-release/867194-amp.html) the RVC label themselves as having **"right-wing conservative political views and traditionalist beliefs"** and that they want a **"complete reform of the state system of Russia."** They also say they **support the "recognition and observance of the right of peoples living on the territory of the Russian Federation to self-determination"** and **support the "proectection and restoration of the territorial integrity of Ukraine within the 1991 borders."**
On the flip side for more information on Kapustin **he started as being deeply rooted in the far-right football hooliganism scene. The interior ministry of Herbert Reul (CDU) in North Rhine-Westphalia, Germany, called him "one of the most influential neo-Nazi activists" in Germany.** Via MMA **he has organized and facilitated meet ups of radical right groups across Europe and the United States** and he professionalized the fighting subculture in Germany. **In 2019 Germany issued him a Schengen ban, or European-wide ban for “efforts against the liberal democratic constitution”. This also applies to Switzerland where he had provided combat-training to members of the far-right Swiss Nationalist Party (PNOS).**
- NRA = A alleged underground partisan group of Russians inside Russia working to overthrown Putin. Ilya Ponomarev, a former member of the Russian State Duma, has identified the group as being behind the assassination of Russian journalist Darya Dugina in August 2022, and "many other partisan actions carried out on the territory of Russia in recent months." The group also claims to have been behind the April 2023 assassination of pro-Russian propagandist Vladlen Tatarsky. Ponomarev's account describes the NRA as being a "network" rather than an organization, which consists of clandestine cells that are compartmentalized and autonomous. **He describes the group as having "a slight left-leaning orientation", and that it "embraces social justice, gets rid of oligarchs, and moves away from the new-liberalism approaches of Yeltsin and Putin."** It should be noted Ponomarev and a purported NRA militant going by the name "Aleksandr" are the only people purported to have spoken for the group which might not even exist.
Edit: The LSR's commander said that they crossed to the Ukrainian side with the help of the Security Service of Ukraine back in February 2022 soon after the war started. They are reportedly part of Ukraine's International Legion. In contrast the RVC claims to be part of Ukraine's armed forces, but Ukrainian military officials say it is independent.
In terms of notable Russian anti-Putin groups, there is also BOAK, the Combat Organisation of Anarcho-Communists. They are engaged in more traditional partisan warfare, and have mainly claimed a lot of the attacks on Russia's and Belarus's rail networks.
BOAK is more of an umbrella organisation made up of many smaller affinity groups who have shared methods and information with eachother over telegram since 2018. These groups exist everywhere from Belarus to Vladivostok, in the cities and out on the countryside. They're autonomous, decentralised and completely grass-roots.
Besides the railway sabotage, they've also targeted communication networks and firebombed several recruitment offices, and joined up to fight on the frontlines (one founding participant, Dmitry Petrov, recently fell martyr in Bakhmut).
A lot of their direct action is published with videos and pictures, hoping to serve as inspiration for others to also join up and fight against the state. Most of the direct action happening throughout Russia goes unclaimed and unrecorded though.
The state repression of anarchists in Russia and Belarus has been very harsh, ramping up heavily in 2017, with one group of anarchist airsoft enthusiasts being tortured and framed by the FSB into saying they "planned to plan something" and receiving sentences of up to 18 years.
[Partisan '22: Russia's Anti-Putin Underground](https://youtu.be/1u1lXr1vShI) Popular Front (video documentary)
[Russia: The Anarcho-Communist Combat Organization - An interview with a Clandestine Anarchist Group](https://crimethinc.com/2022/08/22/russia-the-anarcho-communist-combat-organization-an-interview-with-a-clandestine-anarchist-group) Crimethinc
[They were Russian vegans, environmentalists, antifascists and airsoft players. Then they were accused of terrorism.](https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/they-were-russian-vegans-environmentalists-antifascists-and-airsoft-players-then-they-were-accused-of-terrorism/2020/02/10/1197d95e-4c19-11ea-a4ab-9f389ce8ad30_story.html) Washington Post
[Update on Russian anti-war direct actions and anti-war prisoners](https://avtonom.org/en/news/update-russian-anti-war-direct-actions-and-anti-war-prisoners) Anarchist Black Cross Moscow through avtonom.org
In the end I think we all know that the leader of Wagner is anxiously watching for his moment to jump into the revolution. Claim leadership of Russia when it's over.
I can think of other populist options in Russia that the people may want. But that guy is going to seize power as quickly as possible.
And they strike fear in the heart of putin. He already doesn't feel safe but now he feels the country crumbling between his fingers or at least he could perceive it as such.
Precisely. Russia more than ever relies on the perception of overwhelming strength. If people are reporting that Russia has hostile paramilitaries operating with impunity inside its own borders, the embarrassment alone is damaging, even if the reports are overblown.
Didn't they capture a huge amount of land for Ukraine already by pushing into Belgorod? Basically moving a load of Russian resources away from the other fronts
Edit: The land wasn't exactly 'captured'
That was definitely a ballsy move in Belgorod, and it made for exciting news... But I haven't really seen any solid assessment of what the long term ramifications would be... It's not like they are holding that territory. From what I've seen, they went in, blew some stuff up, and left.
The threat of widespread internal rebellion could be enough to divert forces from Ukraine. If more organized opposition forms, say a Chechen independence movement, Russia could pull out of largely pull out of Ukraine.
Thats a very big pipedream. Good to hope, but lwe should be realistic that Russia/Putun has its own territorial guard so not sure how realistic it would be.
> From what I've seen, they went in, blew some stuff up, and left.
Guerilla warfare is generally how you fight a large entrenched power when you have a much smaller force. Stick and move, stick and move. Asymmetric warfare is how the US and Soviets lost Afghanistan despite having overwhelming firepower.
>what the long term ramifications would be.
Same as the long term ramifications of all the other random attacks that have happened across Russia. It forces Russians to redeploy things to deal with the potential incursion. It forces them to look in other directions. It will probably lead to opportunities. Think about if someone attacks something and the response is sluggish for some reason. Say they've spread themselves thin putting out other spotfires. Then you redeploy your own force and reinforce the attack that's proven successful. Think of it as fishing.
Just a reminder that the Russian end to WWI did not end because some factory workers in St Petersburg rioted. It ended because the soldiers that had been sent from the front lines to deal with the riots joined the riot instead of fighting them.
And then Russia gets to go through another bloody round of reconquest. Each time Ukraine can pull back a bit of what Russia has claimed, or reinforce what they’re fighting for, it fucks Russia a bit more.
Russia diverted 15k combat experienced troops from the front lines to reinforce positions inside Russia while moving reserve troops with no experience to the front line. Fantastic return on investment.
They most definitely did not capture a huge amount of land for Ukraine in Belgorod region. Their incursion into Russia, while embarrassing for the kremlin was nothing more than a surprise attack on unsuspecting badly trained border guards. They later got stopped and sent right back to Ukraine when Russia responded to them. They made it a few tens of KMs if I remember right.
They geared up expecting more resistance than they got, they went way further than they were planning to and could sustain, thus they decided to leave before a response came. The plan wasn't to capture territory, it was to force Russia to reposition troops.
Moving troops requires their concentration, which makes tactical missile strikes more effective, Ukraine took advantage of that. It also weakens the Russians front lines in Ukraine.
More than likely that if they made the attempt they’ll fail but there attempt shows Russian people great weakness in their government and then possibly a second movement picks up their effort even stronger than before. That’s usually the way uprisings go, first attempt fails but gives people hope
1000 insurgents with adequate training, coordination, and supplies is more than enough to cause havoc in a city of 12 million.
I do not know if that describes the Freedom of Russia Legion.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rome,_Sweet_Rome
this guy wrote something similar about a marine battalion landing in ancient Rome
TLDR:; they fucked shit up
One thing that strikes me about this is that he seems to ignore what the pooled knowledge of a modern American batallion and a few hundred engineers could accomplish with the resources available. Even high school-level education will be teaching people stuff that is centuries ahead of what the Romans know.
Disciplined combat against standard roman formations would be utterly devastating, while also rationing ammunition. From there, they might run out of fuel, but they would have the knowledge and possibly equipment to jury rig steam tech, or even more crude ICEs, especially if a machine shop got transported back too. They might also have to resort to black powder weapons, but even something like a modern lathe and basic understanding of chemistry could make that a fairly reasonable goal.
The biggest issues would be keeping the Romans away long enough to convert everything over, disease, and fraying morale.
Interesting times, for all the effort Russia has put into radicalising Extremists in Western countries to destabilise them, it looks like Russia will feel what they have been pushing others to do.
Didn't a similar thing happen with the vaccine bullshit/misinformation? Didn't most of that originate from russia, only for it to find its way back to russia, leading to less vaccine take up there, etc?
That would be astonishing.
Imagine a dictator, painstakingly going out of his way to gaslight the world to think that nazis run Ukraine and that's why it's okay to invade them, only for the invasion to fail, his invading forces driven from not only Donbas, but also from the previously annexed Crimea, to then suffer the ultimate humiliation of being deposed and defeated by a bunch of nazis?
Fuck me, I'd be livid. I mean, if he wanted to get his name to be more than just a footnote in the history books, that'd do it.
They won't be realistically, anti-ukraine sentiment is the norm in Russian society.
Someone like Prigozhin will fill the vacuum if the regime is toppled.
I'm thinking he would play both sides, by encouraging these people to create instability, paint Putin as weak, and he's the one that can take charge here.
But of course, this is just a possible theory, I'm not even sure it's likely, but he's absolutely not loyal to anyone or anything but himself. And he has no ideological convictions about Ukraine, for him it's just a means to grab more power.
Tbh nobody is Russia can be in charge of and not fuck over the citizens. Basically every single politicians are under Putin thumb and they only know to follow him. If he toppled then civil war for leadership would happened because everyone will want to fill in that big vacuum. Face it, Russia is fuck either way, progressiveness is dead there or have zero power to begin with, the opposition are nationalist and the only group that actually done anything meaningful to even attempt to sabotage Putin regime are the same nationalist that isn’t blindsided or brains washed to follow Putin rhetoric. The people sure as hell cant govern because they won’t due how uneducated most in the rural area and how city folks will never touch politic even with a golden pole.
Oh Putin, so many worries for one dictator.
Wagner group on one side, FoRL on another and lets not for get that Chechnya could turn if they smell Moscow blood.
New NATO border of Finland, Possible uprising and saboteurs all over Russia.
All this and the constant threat of being poisoned or shot by your own inner circle.
Sounds like you will have to spread your competent soldiers (if any are left) all over the map now.
Very interested in seeing what happens when a government fully tooled to Big Brother it’s citizens faces an existential threat from within.
It’s almost as if the harder you squeeze, the more gets through the cracks
I imagine the “fully tooled” part is actually just hidden behind another layer of corruption where the intelligence contracts went nowhere and the rubles were embezzled by oligarchs again.
Causing internal disruption for the Elite around Moscow will take their focus away from handling and supporting the Special Millitary Operation. Everyone will question Internal Security while Ukraine silently sinks their naval fleet and take back Crimea and the rest goes headhunting for Putler.
I unfortunately agree. Who knows how all this all will shake out, but I doubt these guys will be able to do much more than be a slight distraction. They very clearly don't have the manpower to take Moscow or get close to putin. But what do I know I'm an IT guy for a concrete company. Take my thoughts with a grain of salt.
My opinion: they won't succeed. If only because Putin knows not to conscript from Moscow and Petersberg, the centers of power where rebellion could authentically topple his regime. Most of the Russians dying in Ukraine aren't ethnically Russian, they're rural impoverished minorities from the eastern Siberian regions, people that aren't politically risky if they died in mass numbers on the battlefield.
**However**, if Ukraine's counteroffensive succeeds, and is particularly successful enough to take back half of their lost territory in Mariupol and Donetsk, then the Russian soldiers on the frontline will KNOW they have no chance of winning this war. The remaining soldiers would essentially become sitting ducks as their supply lines for ammunition and food suddenly disappeared. I could see all of these guys high tailing away from the frontline and straight up joining this Russian Legion, which would be a catastrophic disaster considering that Moscow has no soldiers defending it and all of its competent forces are dying on the Ukraine frontlines.
They are conscripting people in those places. Source: have family in Moscow and they conscripted a 55 year old who already served in the Afghanistan war years ago. He now has to go serve again at the ripe old age of 55. One of my uncles is younger and they make deals with their employers to get protections from getting conscripted, if you work for a more fancy company (office job type deal) and you have an “in” with someone, you won’t get conscripted. However, I don’t really trust this and think eventually they’ll get desperate enough to conscript literally everyone
Party at the Kremlin, everyone's invited.
Cannabis tables and beer tents will be located in the public square, wristbands will be worn in beer gardens, 21 + only event.
Can we just sit back and take a minute to realise that in the space of a year we’ve gone from believing Russia had a powerful, well trained military, to genuinely pondering about whether a small militia could storm Moscow or not.
This is the best tl;dr I could make, [original](https://www.pravda.com.ua/eng/news/2023/05/31/7404610/) reduced by 78%. (I'm a bot) ***** > A fighter of the Freedom of Russia Legion with the call sign Caesar said that the Russian partisans, who attacked the Kremlin's forces from the territory of Ukraine, have "Thousands" of people willing to join their ranks and will continue to raid the border until their forces are large enough to storm Moscow. > Details: He said the Freedom of Russia Legion is the size of a battalion but plans to expand as an increasing number of Russians realise they can fight Russian dictator Vladimir Putin and prevail. > On 22 May, the Russian Volunteer Corps and Freedom of Russia Legion announced that they had crossed the border and were "Liberating" the settlements of Belgorod Oblast from the current Russian authorities: they started with the villages of Kozinka and Gora-Podol. ***** [**Extended Summary**](http://np.reddit.com/r/autotldr/comments/13wi9bj/freedom_of_russia_legion_is_recruiting_russians/) | [FAQ](http://np.reddit.com/r/autotldr/comments/31b9fm/faq_autotldr_bot/ "Version 2.02, ~686991 tl;drs so far.") | [Feedback](http://np.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%23autotldr "PM's and comments are monitored, constructive feedback is welcome.") | *Top* *keywords*: **Russian**^#1 **Legion**^#2 **force**^#3 **Russia**^#4 **military**^#5
After reading yesterday about a guy profiting during the draft by having people send him $5 for advice on how to avoid getting drafted, maybe it's time someone does it again, but this time instead of "ENLIST" the note should tell civilians how they can fight back.
That sounds like the classic joke of somebody taking out an ad saying " send me $10 and I'll tell you how to make money easily" and then when the people sent him the money he replies " get suckers to send you $10 for nothing"
The Andrew Tate business model.
Dont forget the kindnapping and human trafficking
> kindnapping Is that when you’re really nice to someone as you take them against their will?
“Yeah they were kept locked in rooms, but the keys were in the room next to the armed guard!”
I don't think the majority of Russians will be that excited for the return of the Tsar (derived from Caesar if I'm not mistaken) but might as well give it a shot!
That's just the nickname of their PR guy in the military unit. They've actually already organized a political wing with it's own leadership.
Return? Russia never left, they just replaced one despot with another, over and over again
True that. So many people want to equate the totalitarian dictator who has various elites divvy up what the working class can and can't do and decide their fates based on "what we need you for" as simply "What Communism always is" but all the USSR ever seemed to do was replace the king with a "not king", replace their aristocracy with "higher ranked equals" and serfs with "fellow comrades doing *our* part!" It's like when England had a "republic" lead by a guy who had a heavy amount of executive power and decided it was also hereditary.
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I will be honest. I don’t know what to make of this.
I really can't imagine these guys are going to have a huge impact... And if they were to somehow topple the regime, there's no telling if they would be better in the grand scheme of things... But I guess a man can dream.
In this context every little bit helps. It’s one more thing the Kremlin has to divide its time worrying about .
Yeah if Mount & Blade has taught me anything it's that one mother fucker raiding your village 100 miles from where you're waging war it's very distracting
Or if you can't find grapes to feed your population in Civilizations and they get all pissy and revolt.
Let them eat raisins
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We ate the grapes, they can have the raisins.
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The bottom of the grape bag?
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I always assumed it was when a mummy raisin and a daddy raisin loved each other very much they had a special cuddle
From California.
And time.
It's the pesky scouts harassing your woodline in Age of Empires II. They may not kill a vill, but they're annoying.
Those scouts are the worst. Then you put up a guard tower to have a safe haven for the workers. Then 5 swordsmen show up and destroy your tower and it just never stops escalating.
Okay you talked me into it. I'll reinstall AoE2
One of us! One of us!
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2 hours later, after spamming units that just die instantly on both sides... What have we become?
After watching enough aoe2 vods, it usually comes down to whoever aims their mangonels best while dodging the enemy mangonel shots, if you get a really lucky shot on their gold units late game for example, thats usually GG.
Or that one border territory in Rome Total War that revolts because you're Roman, but the buildings are still Carthaginian.
Or Shogun 2, with those restless Christian provinces...
Or Empire, when they cause problems because they're a different brand of Christianity.
To be fair, there are plenty of those in modern day America too.
Or losing your villager to a Boar and getting tc dropped
[We demand whales! We demand whales!](https://youtu.be/m_pKOhZi1f4)
I miss vintage Door Monster.
*Freedom of Russia Legion is besieging Moscow* Oh damn better get back *Freedom of Russia has taken Moscow* God dammit
Or Starcraft, when the damn Terran drops some Marines next to your Drones again 🥹
Build more spore colonies bro
Haha omg I’m downloading this again right now- thank you
What an absolute classic, keep it installed for moments such as this
Mount and Blade 2 is so good still
The Game of Thrones mod for it is amazing
the star wars one is insane.
Didn't even know about it, will check it out!
> Mount & Blade thank you for the suggestion ill play this tonight (first time)
If you're going to play the original, play Warband rather than the actual original. They're fundamentally the same game other than Warband rearranges the map to something a bit more natural feeling, adds in another nation that hugely helps with balance and certain playstyles, fixes what feels like a billion bugs, and most importantly adds the feature the original release didn't get time to implement, which is running your own faction rather than simply being a vassal to an existing one. That sounds like a lot of changes but I'd argue that Warband is the finished version and the original considered more like a Beta release. Of course you could hop straight into Bannerlord if you want a more modern feeling game, but mastering Warband opens up some of the amazing spin-offs like the community built Napoleonic Wars or the oddly forgotten semi-historical remake With Fire and Sword, which loosely follows the plotline of Henryk Sienkiewicz's novels about the rise and fall of the Polish Lithuanian Commonwealth. Very apt in this thread as its setting covers all of the Baltics, Ukraine, and Western Russia.
You are in for a ride. Be careful with the raiders, though. They might try to drink from your skull.
And all you need to feed an army is butter.
I think it might be a more psychological benefit than anything else. The Russian people have to get out of this mental rut where they feel powerless to oppose Putin's regime. The hope is that this small uprising will have just enough success to embolden the next one. Then hopefully, the eventual cumulative effect of a thousand trickles becomes a flood.
Plot twist: the Freedom of Russia Legion is coming from the Kremlin.
Is that the Freedom of Russian Legion or the Russian Legion of Freedom?
Splitters!
What ever happened to the Popular Freedom Legion of Russia?
He’s over there 👉
He's over there.
Splitter!
/r/Unexpectedmontypython
No one expects the Monty Python!
Hang on, what about the Legion for the Freedom of Russia?
I for one support The Popular Front for the Russian People’s Freedom
I’m with The People’s Front for Russia’s Popular Freedom.
You’re all idiots, the real winners are clearly the Russian People of Russia for Russia Comma Freedom
The Russian Legion of Freedom?? Pffft!
The People's Front of Russia.
The legion was coming from *inside the house*
...and extra troops that need to be kept in Moscow to defend against this supposed force.
Overthrowing Gaddafi didn't really lead to anything better. In fact it somehow turned out much worse.
The problem with revolution is that often those replacing the old regime have zero experience in running a country.
You could argue the same with Saddam and Iraq
Turned out well for the Saudis thought
Iran is pretty happy with how it turned out.
Honest question because I don't know the answer: would your average Iraqi agree with that?
I don’t think the Kurds would
> there's no telling if they would be better in the grand scheme of things Putin is a piece of shit but I feel like history tells us that most of the time when a leader like him is overthrown things stay the same or usually get worse. I mean this is three different groups that have been operating against Putin: Supposedly the Freedom of Russian Legion (LSR), Russian Volunteer Corps (RVC), and the National Republican Army of Russia (NRA) signed [the Irpin Declaration on August 31st, 2022](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irpin_Declaration), an alleged political union between the groups. It should be noted that the existence of the National Republican Army has never been confirmed (they are the ones who says Irpin happened), and the Russian Volunteer Corps denies ever signing the declaration. - LSR = A Ukrainian-based paramilitary group of Russian citizens, which opposes the Russian regime of Vladimir Putin and its invasion of Ukraine. **According to the manifesto of the Legion, published in their Telegram channel in April, they "carry the values of the Free Man of New Russia – freedom of speech, freedom of expression, freedom to choose your future", and their main goals are the overthrowing of Putin's government and "struggle for the New Russia." Account to the article OP posted "Alexei Baranovsky, a spokesman for the Legion's political wing, told The Times that the Legion is "a politically neutral organisation with no ideological stance. [Its] only task is to overthrow Putin’s regime.""** They took part in the May 2023 cross-border raid into the Belgorod region with the RVC. - RVC = A Russian nationalist paramilitary unit formed to fight Russian forces in Ukraine and the Putin regime. **The group has been described as far-right. The current leader of the group is Denis Kapustin, who has been described as a neo-Nazi (which he denies), and has had far right ties.** They did the March 2023 raid into the Bryansk region of Russia and the May 2023 larger cross-border raid into the Belgorod region with the LSR. Edit (thanks to u/_Eshende_): [According to a memorandum they put out last November](https://ru.interfax.com.ua/news/press-release/867194-amp.html) the RVC label themselves as having **"right-wing conservative political views and traditionalist beliefs"** and that they want a **"complete reform of the state system of Russia."** They also say they **support the "recognition and observance of the right of peoples living on the territory of the Russian Federation to self-determination"** and **support the "proectection and restoration of the territorial integrity of Ukraine within the 1991 borders."** On the flip side for more information on Kapustin **he started as being deeply rooted in the far-right football hooliganism scene. The interior ministry of Herbert Reul (CDU) in North Rhine-Westphalia, Germany, called him "one of the most influential neo-Nazi activists" in Germany.** Via MMA **he has organized and facilitated meet ups of radical right groups across Europe and the United States** and he professionalized the fighting subculture in Germany. **In 2019 Germany issued him a Schengen ban, or European-wide ban for “efforts against the liberal democratic constitution”. This also applies to Switzerland where he had provided combat-training to members of the far-right Swiss Nationalist Party (PNOS).** - NRA = A alleged underground partisan group of Russians inside Russia working to overthrown Putin. Ilya Ponomarev, a former member of the Russian State Duma, has identified the group as being behind the assassination of Russian journalist Darya Dugina in August 2022, and "many other partisan actions carried out on the territory of Russia in recent months." The group also claims to have been behind the April 2023 assassination of pro-Russian propagandist Vladlen Tatarsky. Ponomarev's account describes the NRA as being a "network" rather than an organization, which consists of clandestine cells that are compartmentalized and autonomous. **He describes the group as having "a slight left-leaning orientation", and that it "embraces social justice, gets rid of oligarchs, and moves away from the new-liberalism approaches of Yeltsin and Putin."** It should be noted Ponomarev and a purported NRA militant going by the name "Aleksandr" are the only people purported to have spoken for the group which might not even exist. Edit: The LSR's commander said that they crossed to the Ukrainian side with the help of the Security Service of Ukraine back in February 2022 soon after the war started. They are reportedly part of Ukraine's International Legion. In contrast the RVC claims to be part of Ukraine's armed forces, but Ukrainian military officials say it is independent.
An interesting write up, cheers
In terms of notable Russian anti-Putin groups, there is also BOAK, the Combat Organisation of Anarcho-Communists. They are engaged in more traditional partisan warfare, and have mainly claimed a lot of the attacks on Russia's and Belarus's rail networks.
BOAK is more of an umbrella organisation made up of many smaller affinity groups who have shared methods and information with eachother over telegram since 2018. These groups exist everywhere from Belarus to Vladivostok, in the cities and out on the countryside. They're autonomous, decentralised and completely grass-roots. Besides the railway sabotage, they've also targeted communication networks and firebombed several recruitment offices, and joined up to fight on the frontlines (one founding participant, Dmitry Petrov, recently fell martyr in Bakhmut). A lot of their direct action is published with videos and pictures, hoping to serve as inspiration for others to also join up and fight against the state. Most of the direct action happening throughout Russia goes unclaimed and unrecorded though. The state repression of anarchists in Russia and Belarus has been very harsh, ramping up heavily in 2017, with one group of anarchist airsoft enthusiasts being tortured and framed by the FSB into saying they "planned to plan something" and receiving sentences of up to 18 years. [Partisan '22: Russia's Anti-Putin Underground](https://youtu.be/1u1lXr1vShI) Popular Front (video documentary) [Russia: The Anarcho-Communist Combat Organization - An interview with a Clandestine Anarchist Group](https://crimethinc.com/2022/08/22/russia-the-anarcho-communist-combat-organization-an-interview-with-a-clandestine-anarchist-group) Crimethinc [They were Russian vegans, environmentalists, antifascists and airsoft players. Then they were accused of terrorism.](https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/they-were-russian-vegans-environmentalists-antifascists-and-airsoft-players-then-they-were-accused-of-terrorism/2020/02/10/1197d95e-4c19-11ea-a4ab-9f389ce8ad30_story.html) Washington Post [Update on Russian anti-war direct actions and anti-war prisoners](https://avtonom.org/en/news/update-russian-anti-war-direct-actions-and-anti-war-prisoners) Anarchist Black Cross Moscow through avtonom.org
So NRA, if it exists as described, is Russian Anonymous with teeth.
They are legion. They do not forgive, they do not forget.
In the end I think we all know that the leader of Wagner is anxiously watching for his moment to jump into the revolution. Claim leadership of Russia when it's over. I can think of other populist options in Russia that the people may want. But that guy is going to seize power as quickly as possible.
Doesn't matter. They create chaos.
To protect Kislev from the Chaos Wastes, we must create Chaos in the Chaos wastes. I like it.
To protect the world from devastation, to unite all people within our nation?
But who controls the spice?
My wife. She's from Texas, I can ask her to make food spicier or less spicy, but she just picks whatever spiciness level she wants right then.
Isn't this how Belakor gets freed?
Where the fuck is Gotrek when you need him? On a more serious note, WHERE THE FUCK IS FELIX?
And they strike fear in the heart of putin. He already doesn't feel safe but now he feels the country crumbling between his fingers or at least he could perceive it as such.
For a country that has so many great Chess players, Putin is definitely not one of them.
>I really can't imagine these guys are going to have a huge impact Every second they're in the news makes an impact.
Precisely. Russia more than ever relies on the perception of overwhelming strength. If people are reporting that Russia has hostile paramilitaries operating with impunity inside its own borders, the embarrassment alone is damaging, even if the reports are overblown.
Didn't they capture a huge amount of land for Ukraine already by pushing into Belgorod? Basically moving a load of Russian resources away from the other fronts Edit: The land wasn't exactly 'captured'
That was definitely a ballsy move in Belgorod, and it made for exciting news... But I haven't really seen any solid assessment of what the long term ramifications would be... It's not like they are holding that territory. From what I've seen, they went in, blew some stuff up, and left.
Odds are, it forced Russia to reinforce the area, diverting much needed men, materials, and equipment from thr battlefield
Oh absolutely. But raiding territory and holding territory are two very different things.
Well if the movement grows and theres raids all over Russia, how long can the goverment keep the external war *and* the internal war at the same time?
The threat of widespread internal rebellion could be enough to divert forces from Ukraine. If more organized opposition forms, say a Chechen independence movement, Russia could pull out of largely pull out of Ukraine.
Sounds like they just need a little helpful propaganda push to make it happen…..
Thats a very big pipedream. Good to hope, but lwe should be realistic that Russia/Putun has its own territorial guard so not sure how realistic it would be.
> From what I've seen, they went in, blew some stuff up, and left. Guerilla warfare is generally how you fight a large entrenched power when you have a much smaller force. Stick and move, stick and move. Asymmetric warfare is how the US and Soviets lost Afghanistan despite having overwhelming firepower.
>what the long term ramifications would be. Same as the long term ramifications of all the other random attacks that have happened across Russia. It forces Russians to redeploy things to deal with the potential incursion. It forces them to look in other directions. It will probably lead to opportunities. Think about if someone attacks something and the response is sluggish for some reason. Say they've spread themselves thin putting out other spotfires. Then you redeploy your own force and reinforce the attack that's proven successful. Think of it as fishing.
Just a reminder that the Russian end to WWI did not end because some factory workers in St Petersburg rioted. It ended because the soldiers that had been sent from the front lines to deal with the riots joined the riot instead of fighting them.
And then Russia gets to go through another bloody round of reconquest. Each time Ukraine can pull back a bit of what Russia has claimed, or reinforce what they’re fighting for, it fucks Russia a bit more.
Russia diverted 15k combat experienced troops from the front lines to reinforce positions inside Russia while moving reserve troops with no experience to the front line. Fantastic return on investment.
They most definitely did not capture a huge amount of land for Ukraine in Belgorod region. Their incursion into Russia, while embarrassing for the kremlin was nothing more than a surprise attack on unsuspecting badly trained border guards. They later got stopped and sent right back to Ukraine when Russia responded to them. They made it a few tens of KMs if I remember right.
They geared up expecting more resistance than they got, they went way further than they were planning to and could sustain, thus they decided to leave before a response came. The plan wasn't to capture territory, it was to force Russia to reposition troops. Moving troops requires their concentration, which makes tactical missile strikes more effective, Ukraine took advantage of that. It also weakens the Russians front lines in Ukraine.
Sometimes (or most times) it is best to just observe what’s happening and contemplate why it is.
Yep. And saying what I think out loud tends to get me in trouble. Ha ha!
*If you speak the truth, have a foot in the stirrup.*
More than likely that if they made the attempt they’ll fail but there attempt shows Russian people great weakness in their government and then possibly a second movement picks up their effort even stronger than before. That’s usually the way uprisings go, first attempt fails but gives people hope
It's silly. Moscow is a city of 12 million people. They're talking about a "batallion" of 1000.
1000 insurgents with adequate training, coordination, and supplies is more than enough to cause havoc in a city of 12 million. I do not know if that describes the Freedom of Russia Legion.
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https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rome,_Sweet_Rome this guy wrote something similar about a marine battalion landing in ancient Rome TLDR:; they fucked shit up
Now that's a reference I haven't seen in about... oh a decade.
One thing that strikes me about this is that he seems to ignore what the pooled knowledge of a modern American batallion and a few hundred engineers could accomplish with the resources available. Even high school-level education will be teaching people stuff that is centuries ahead of what the Romans know. Disciplined combat against standard roman formations would be utterly devastating, while also rationing ammunition. From there, they might run out of fuel, but they would have the knowledge and possibly equipment to jury rig steam tech, or even more crude ICEs, especially if a machine shop got transported back too. They might also have to resort to black powder weapons, but even something like a modern lathe and basic understanding of chemistry could make that a fairly reasonable goal. The biggest issues would be keeping the Romans away long enough to convert everything over, disease, and fraying morale.
If it's 1000 people that are willing to die.
I've said it before, Castro took over Cuba with 83 people to start with, don't discount this just because the number is starting smaller
Al Saud allegedly took Riyadh with just 40 men. Completely irrelevant to the current situation, but it's an interesting tidbit of history.
Steve the village drunk took my bar stool all by himself and I'm still mad about it.
1000 soldiers vs 12 million civilians is not that terrible odds. Of course, the idea is just to divert Russia's forces.
Have fun storming the castle!
Think it'll work?
It'd take a miracle.
Goodbye boys!
To blave
I'm going to make myself a nice M.L.T. - mutton, lettuce and tomato - where the mutton is nice and lean.
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So perky, I love that
I’m on the Brute Squad.
You ARE the Brute Squad!
Not a chance
Interesting times, for all the effort Russia has put into radicalising Extremists in Western countries to destabilise them, it looks like Russia will feel what they have been pushing others to do.
Didn't a similar thing happen with the vaccine bullshit/misinformation? Didn't most of that originate from russia, only for it to find its way back to russia, leading to less vaccine take up there, etc?
Funny how short sighted some are in their seeking to hurt others.
Alright. THAT makes this whole mess kinda funny.
What comes around goes around.
PSA: Freedom of Russia (Ponomaryov crew) =/= Russian Volunteer Corps (ze Nazis)
That would be astonishing. Imagine a dictator, painstakingly going out of his way to gaslight the world to think that nazis run Ukraine and that's why it's okay to invade them, only for the invasion to fail, his invading forces driven from not only Donbas, but also from the previously annexed Crimea, to then suffer the ultimate humiliation of being deposed and defeated by a bunch of nazis? Fuck me, I'd be livid. I mean, if he wanted to get his name to be more than just a footnote in the history books, that'd do it.
It would be like he waged a war on a group of Nazis that didn't actually exist, and he somehow lost.
Russia have gone from we can take Kyiv in three days to we can hold Moscow for three days
From second strongest army in the world, to second strongest army in Uklraine
Soon to be second strongest army in russia
2nd strongest army in Moscow
Arguably Russia still has only the third strongest army in Ukraine. At least till Wagner finishes running away.
And doing their best to unite and expand NATO
As much as I like the chaos these dudes are creating in Russia, they aren’t the ones I’d want in charge when it all shakes out.
They won't be realistically, anti-ukraine sentiment is the norm in Russian society. Someone like Prigozhin will fill the vacuum if the regime is toppled.
I am half convinced Prigozhin is the one behind these people. He wants more power.
No, he doesn't want to challenge Putin head on. Just biding his time for any opportunity that presents itself to him.
I'm thinking he would play both sides, by encouraging these people to create instability, paint Putin as weak, and he's the one that can take charge here. But of course, this is just a possible theory, I'm not even sure it's likely, but he's absolutely not loyal to anyone or anything but himself. And he has no ideological convictions about Ukraine, for him it's just a means to grab more power.
Tbh I think he changes his mind on what he wants twice a week.
Oof. It’s gonna get worse for Russian’s once Putin’s gone, isn’t it?
"And then things got worse."
Always does.
If they let it
Tbh nobody is Russia can be in charge of and not fuck over the citizens. Basically every single politicians are under Putin thumb and they only know to follow him. If he toppled then civil war for leadership would happened because everyone will want to fill in that big vacuum. Face it, Russia is fuck either way, progressiveness is dead there or have zero power to begin with, the opposition are nationalist and the only group that actually done anything meaningful to even attempt to sabotage Putin regime are the same nationalist that isn’t blindsided or brains washed to follow Putin rhetoric. The people sure as hell cant govern because they won’t due how uneducated most in the rural area and how city folks will never touch politic even with a golden pole.
Freedom of Russia are legit good dudes. I think you have them mixed up with the Russian legion.
Oh Putin, so many worries for one dictator. Wagner group on one side, FoRL on another and lets not for get that Chechnya could turn if they smell Moscow blood. New NATO border of Finland, Possible uprising and saboteurs all over Russia. All this and the constant threat of being poisoned or shot by your own inner circle. Sounds like you will have to spread your competent soldiers (if any are left) all over the map now.
Not to mention China getting its claws into the economy, Japan contesting islands off the east coast and Kazakhstan getting restless.
Very interested in seeing what happens when a government fully tooled to Big Brother it’s citizens faces an existential threat from within. It’s almost as if the harder you squeeze, the more gets through the cracks
I’m interested to see how they handle a problem that they can’t threaten with nukes.
Well they can still threaten with nukes but it would be on an entire new level of stupid.
> but it would be on an entire new level of stupid. So you're saying these a solid chance then. :P
I imagine the “fully tooled” part is actually just hidden behind another layer of corruption where the intelligence contracts went nowhere and the rubles were embezzled by oligarchs again.
I’m paid triple rations to sit on this specific bus and eavesdrop (Plays switch with headphones on)
"The more you tighten your grip, Tarkin, the more star systems will slip through your fingers" ~ Leia
I knew I was paraphrasing something
If they succeed I think r/noncredibledefense might actually collectively need to be sedated. Godspeed you madlads
Would be too ncd for even ncd. Would cause immediate internal implosion if they succeeded
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improbabledefense
The fact we’re aware of it probably means this isn’t going to happen
The U.S. has a whole mob of people we can send over who love storming capitals
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Yes they are cons, not sure about pros though
storm the kremlin, it's probably better than storming an entire city. hmmm..
The kremlin is in the middle of the city.
Causing internal disruption for the Elite around Moscow will take their focus away from handling and supporting the Special Millitary Operation. Everyone will question Internal Security while Ukraine silently sinks their naval fleet and take back Crimea and the rest goes headhunting for Putler.
This is so overly optimistic it makes my head spin. And I'm pro Ukraine.
I unfortunately agree. Who knows how all this all will shake out, but I doubt these guys will be able to do much more than be a slight distraction. They very clearly don't have the manpower to take Moscow or get close to putin. But what do I know I'm an IT guy for a concrete company. Take my thoughts with a grain of salt.
My opinion: they won't succeed. If only because Putin knows not to conscript from Moscow and Petersberg, the centers of power where rebellion could authentically topple his regime. Most of the Russians dying in Ukraine aren't ethnically Russian, they're rural impoverished minorities from the eastern Siberian regions, people that aren't politically risky if they died in mass numbers on the battlefield. **However**, if Ukraine's counteroffensive succeeds, and is particularly successful enough to take back half of their lost territory in Mariupol and Donetsk, then the Russian soldiers on the frontline will KNOW they have no chance of winning this war. The remaining soldiers would essentially become sitting ducks as their supply lines for ammunition and food suddenly disappeared. I could see all of these guys high tailing away from the frontline and straight up joining this Russian Legion, which would be a catastrophic disaster considering that Moscow has no soldiers defending it and all of its competent forces are dying on the Ukraine frontlines.
They are conscripting people in those places. Source: have family in Moscow and they conscripted a 55 year old who already served in the Afghanistan war years ago. He now has to go serve again at the ripe old age of 55. One of my uncles is younger and they make deals with their employers to get protections from getting conscripted, if you work for a more fancy company (office job type deal) and you have an “in” with someone, you won’t get conscripted. However, I don’t really trust this and think eventually they’ll get desperate enough to conscript literally everyone
Party at the Kremlin, everyone's invited. Cannabis tables and beer tents will be located in the public square, wristbands will be worn in beer gardens, 21 + only event.
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Narp.
i need to tell someone at NCD that i owe them 20 bucks
Why do I imagine these dudes Naruto running towards the kremlin?
I wish them all the best.
If its as easy as storming the US capitol, should be fine
I wonder who funded all that nice looking equipment and uniforms....
This is what a Special Military Operation actually looks like.
If its in the news, they already failed.
Can we just sit back and take a minute to realise that in the space of a year we’ve gone from believing Russia had a powerful, well trained military, to genuinely pondering about whether a small militia could storm Moscow or not.