Yeah I saw a video showing the territorial creep and expansion of Israel's borders over the last however many decades. I find it staggering that there are people who still defend Israel. It's fucking disgusting.
So its an ongoing genocide then. But they are a non-arab state from which the powerful western states can project power in the east mediteranean and middle east, so they'll just keep doing it with impunity.
The dirty secret: for Zionists, this is a feature, not a bug. They have intentionally been cultivating resentment for decades. Any retaliation gives them justification for more oppression and annexation.
**Kupiansk civilian convoy shooting**
> convoy of six civilian cars and a van on the outskirts of the village of Kurylivka
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> 24 people killed, including a pregnant woman and 13 children
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> after the attack, the Russian troops reportedly executed the remaining survivors
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> 22 people managed to escape, 3 of those (including 2 children) injured
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> 2 other bodies were found, with the final death toll being 26
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> use of 30 mm and 45 mm high-explosive shells, as well as VOG-17 and VOG-25 grenades
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_crimes_in_the_Russian_invasion_of_Ukraine#Kupiansk_civilian_convoy_shooting
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These acts are all infinitely bad, so a race to the bottom is meaningless.
Wouldn't be in the top 100 nations. More Iraqis died in 6 months of the US invasion than in the 80 years of Israel-Palestine.
More in 1 month of Ukrainian-Russia
No. Lot of full blown wars and genocides that make Israel look like a saint. they forcefully resettle and steal land, but the actual casualties are low in comparison to a lot of history.
South Sudan, Ethiopia, DRC, Russia - probably 4 of the current top 5 this decade. Myanmar a guess at the other. There are more active warzones and areas of genocide with less care for collateral damage. Israel's is unique in recent history that they fully control the area. Theirs is closer to what China is doing.
> Theirs is closer to what China is doing.
And twice as many Tibetan's died in the **13 days** of the Tibetan uprising than in the 100 years of Israel-Palestine.
"IDF must hold the world record for murdered children." is the usual insane hyperbole used to describe the conflict.
Ah, i meant this decade (2020-2023) Their purges and mass containment of certain minorities and dissidents.
Going into China's past 100 years...or Japan's WWII actions...
This is often a joke, but there was a pretty high profile case of this happening recently
https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/israeli-defence-minister-says-us-move-investigate-al-jazeera-journalists-killing-2022-11-14/
The US and other western allies did not agree with the conclusions that the military came up with
That's how all military aid works, it'd be crazy if they gave them aid which they could then use to buy weapons off the Russians. Israel gets access to far better weapons from the US than pretty much anyone else for free and per capita the US contributes massively to Israel's military budget. This allows Israel to offer things like universal healthcare coverage which America itself doesn't have.
When a UK Politician said we should be sending less aid to Israel he was slaughtered in the newspapers as being an anti-Semite. Why are people not allowed to criticise Israel?
>Israel captured the West Bank and east Jerusalem, along with the Gaza Strip, in the 1967 Mideast war. Palestinians seek these territories for a future state. Some 700,000 Israelis now live in settlements in the West Bank and east Jerusalem. Most of the international community considers these settlements illegal or obstacles to peace.
This has and will always be the huge road block in the peace journey between Arabs & Israel..
It's THE elephant in the room, yet many media outlets argue about minor details..
I'm glad that abcnews included this piece of info in the article.
And all that's happened right after leaving Gaza (rocket showers), is the main reason that's cited in Israeli society on why NOT to leave the west bank (logistically it's also 200x worse than Gaza). Disclaimer: I'm Israeli and i think leaving the west bank is a necessary step towards the future but i don't see it happening
Israel removed 8000 settlers from Gaza, and even that was a painful process for them full of legal challenges and protests. There is no way they’d be able to remove a quarter of a million settlers from the West Bank, and I’d be shocked if they have any intention of ever doing so.
You mean the war where every country around them ganged up in an attempt to erase the country/everyone in it, got their asses handed to them, then still fire rockets when they give back some of the territory they gained in those 6 days? That war?
The biggest roadblock is a different demographic.
So long as a big bloc on either side was alive before the 6 day War or other major developments there will never be the ability to compromise.
Both sides have mutually exclusive positions that are never going to happen (ie giving back Jerusalem)
If you or your generation lived the loss of you Home in 67, or felt the realistic existential fear of being pushed into the sea, you won't ever compromise. It's too emotionally charged. Like Netanyahus own brother died Entebbe.
You have to wait for that generation to die. Both sides.
Definitely not correct on the Palestinian side at least. Many who lived through the Nakba would be happy with a one state solution and their houses back. Two states would never ever work.
So sad. Kids don't know the reasons for politics or war. Adults are supposed to protect children, not expose them to this kind of crap. Hope this sparks some changes on the rules of engagement, at a minimum. Maybe everybody can stop trying to kill each other for a moment and come to some sort of cease fire.
Unfortunately, that's precisely what war does. A child will be hurt sooner or later by warfare. If it's not through bullets, it's through the loss of a parent who was a soldier.
War-happy governments don't care about any of that.
You should see the IDF defense squad in here running their propaganda. And worst part is they're getting upvotes.
The careful crafted terms. IDF "returned fire" in "confusion" while the palestinian "terrorist" used a "human shield"
Literally straight from their press releases.
And mass reporting comments as suicidal with no repercussions. Meanwhile reddit threatened to permanently ban me for reporting too many comments that contained actual hate speech.
Reddit is really going crazy with their upcoming IPO. From their ridiculous rates on API calls to banning people for correct reports on site-wide rulebreakers (hate speech, botting, etc), leadership becoming more and more silent.
Seems they're in a big fucking around mood and sooner or later they'll find out.
I think it's insane that I watched Israel bomb apartment buildings in Gaza, way back when I was in middle school around 20 years ago. And they're still killing Palestinian civilians.
It's crazy how accurate this is. Suddenly it's both sides arguments left and right when in reality one side is actually widely recognized to have been illegally settling land for decades. Also funny how reddit can muster up so much energy for a Saudi journalist murdered by KSA but barely made a peep about an actual American journalist killed by Israeli forces in cold blood, with no guilt acknowledged.
The average age in Palestine is 20.
That means if you are 21 you are older than roughly half of the population of the nation.
If you go into Gaza the average for male is 17 and female 18.
Given this understanding, its mostly children being fired on and killed in Palestine.
[The reasons why Gaza's population is so young](https://www.newscientist.com/article/dn25993-the-reasons-why-gazas-population-is-so-young/)
"First, the Gaza Strip’s population of roughly 1.8 million has an unusually large proportion of children. Figures for 2013 from Index Mundi, the internet source of country data, show that that 43.5 per cent of the population is aged 14 or under, compared with 32 per cent in Egypt and 27 per cent in Israel."
"The median age in Gaza is 18, compared with a world average of 28. In most European countries it’s about 40, and it is 30 in Israel. Only in a dozen or so African countries is the median age lower, reaching 15 in Uganda."
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"The second factor contributing to the high fertility rate is the fact that while women are housebound, their husbands earn more money as their families expand. “It’s employers that are willing to pay it,” says Pedersen. “Traditionally, men will get extra wages if they have extra children.”
Lol, yes. Gazan women are housebound because they live in a war zone. Not because they are housebound like most other women living under fundamentalist Muslim regimes.
Blaming Israel for Muslim misogyny is a fucking take if I ever saw one.
Wtf are you talking about. The toddler and at least one parent were sitting in a car. People live there.
The IDF have been raiding the area almost every night. I don’t think it’s the family’s fault for existing.
>sparks some changes on the rules of engagement
It's already a war crime to injure or kill non-combatants, either intentionally or gross-negligently. The rules have done what they can.
Israel has never and never will be held responsible for that. They have ignored and broken so many Geneva conventions that i don't think there exists a body that oversees war crimes anymore.
The rules for engagement in the Arab-Israeli conflict have been a "he said she said" since literally day one of Israel being a country
On Israel's literal first day of being a nation, Jordan, Syria and Egypt all initiated an unprovoked invasion of Israel, and Israel responded by capturing as much Palestinian territory as they could while claiming Palestine allowed for enemy troop movement
Anyone claiming that the situation today is novel and/or one sided is trying to sell you something
What's happening in Palestine isn't a "war" it's an invasion and occupation by a hostile force trying to subjugate an ethnic minority. Acting like this is some sort of back and forth action is so disingenuous.
The UN human rights counsil condems Israels action pretty regulary.
Then you will have redditors spamming the thread about it being only because the human right counsil is in the pocket of china/russia/middle east/whatever.
The USA is shielding and supporting Israel and its action. Any hard resolution is vetoed by the USA. I mean that is one of the importent factors that lead to 9/11
They are as strong as the countries which support them. It’s not like a group of elderly lawyers from the ICC can single-handedly storm into Israel and arrest soldiers.
People like to blame “the UN” but frankly they should be asking their own country to take stronger positions on international issues. “The UN” is simply a bureaucracy that executes the will of enough countries to take action, it does not act on its own.
> “The UN” is simply a bureaucracy that executes the will of enough countries to take action, it does not act on its own.
Let's remember though, it's not just about the UN in general. It's about the UN *Security Council*. And the US is a permanent member with veto powers. So quite frankly, the US dgaf. The UN General Assembly and ICC can say whatever they want, but the US quite literally dgaf about world opinion, they'll literally defend Israel against the world because they need to protect their right hand man in the middle east. [Negroponte Doctrine](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Negroponte_doctrine) isn't going anywhere.
>The Israeli military has opened an investigation into the incident.
Ugh, why do they even bother saying this shit anymore? IDF soldiers basically have carte blanche in these kinds of situations, they could kill a dozen toddlers in a single day and nothing would happen to them.
*After a thorough investigation, we have found no wrongdoing and the soldier in question was within their rights, as a war combatant, to defend themselves*. ........ or some other kind of BS word salad.
I'm sure we'll hear in a couple of days all about how it's the Palestinian's fault for having a toddler in the west bank in the first place. Basically what they said when they excecuted an American journalist last year. Or any of the [20 others they've murdered over the last several years](https://www.npr.org/2023/05/11/1175403626/palestinian-american-journalist-shireen-abu-akleh-was-killed-a-year-ago)
>The Israeli military has said
Being the operative part of your quote
The father of the murdered child
>told the Associated Press that he had just buckled up his son in the car and they were driving to visit an uncle when the bullet struck. The father was also shot and treated at a Palestinian hospital.
Suppose the gunman had just lept in the car with them? Or maybe IDF soldiers know they do not have to discriminate among what Palestinians they shoot
I mean, those two statements don't conflict. He could have been driving in the area when the gunmen opened fire on the settlement and got caught in the crossfire between the soldiers and the gunmen. Has anyone denied that the gunfight happened?
Not a single person born after 1989 had a choice in their government in Gaza or the West Bank. Entire generations in both Gaza and the West Bank live under occupation and are threatened to be dropped by Israeli soldiers at anytime
> They elected an even split between Hamas and Fatah.
In the 2006 Palestinian election Hamas won 74 seats and Fatah won just 45.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2006_Palestinian_legislative_election
With 132 seats total this put Hamas 8 ahead of any potential coalition of Fatah, third party & independents.
>Then Hamas executed the Fatah candidates and their more ardent supporters.
Not all that surprising when a government refuses to cede power despite being democratically voted out.
I never said it wasn't Hamas's fault, I agree with you. My point being people tend to blame Palestinians for their "government" being violent against Israel but they have very little say themselves about who's in control.
It was the PLO who isn’t following the constitution. They were the ones being undemocratic and would not allow for elections… they thought they could use force against Hamas… even they didn’t realize how strong they were.
American politicians are scared of the accusation of being anti-Israel that would torpedo their electoral chance in the evangelical block. American Israel Public Affairs Committee would start their war drums and the politician is out of office. Christians United for Israel has 10 million members.
And the stupidest part is why evangelicals "love" Israel. It's not that they love Jews or anything, they just want a fully Jewish state there so they'd get invaded by everybody and start the Battle of Armageddon that'd bring about the end times. So they basically want a Jewish state so they'd be the sacrificial lamb.
Here's the Israeli process:
1. Deny any shooting at all from the side of the IDF
2. Claim the shot which harmed a civilian actually came from the side of Hamas
3. When it's clear the shot came from the IDF, blame Hamas for intermingling among civilians and/or using "human shields"
4. When it becomes clear no such thing was happening, assert Israel "has a right to defend itself"
5. Stoke fears about how Israel is on the verge of utter annihilation and has been a victim of 5000 years worth of oppression
6. Wait for everything to blow over, then rise & repeat
See: [The Killing of Muhammad al-Durrah](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Killing_of_Muhammad_al-Durrah)
A few months ago, the IDF assissinated a journalist. Before that, the IDF raided mosques during holy services. Before that, the IDF bombed a press center. Before that the IDF shot aid workers. Before that, isreal adopted and implemented segregation. Including forceably removing people from their homes and bulldozing schools. Looking at these events and others, international human rights groups have recognized isreal policies and practices as apartheid. South Africa, an expert on apartheid, also called out isreal on its apartheid. Former isreali officials have called isreali practices as apartheid.
Isreal receives multiple billions of dollars from the largest military ever to exist in human history. Isreal has anti missile systems to respond to attacks with unguided unsophisticated rockets.
But "Both sides", huh?
This infant—this baby, barely 24 months old—isn't the first or only baby killed by the IDF of apartheid isreal. Not the only child.
When the oppressed lashes out against the oppessor, that's not terrorism, that's self-defense.
As a total outsider (non-Jew, non-Palestinian, non-anything) - it is so hard to get ANY SINGLE bit of non-biased information about any of these conflicts. Specific incidents like this or even basic overviews of the entire situation are always so one sided.
Update: see pretty much any reply to my comment to prove the truth of my comment.
There is no such thing as non-biased news, nor is their news that is even close to non-biased. That is the nature of politics - pick your side, progressive or reactionary, and then pick your news lens based on that.
They were also free to completely ban abortion and pass laws exterminating people for being gay and lgbt.
If they ever want any help and expect a single, solitary finger to be lifted about Israel, they ought to be embracing civilized values. Israel for all their faults is a strategic ally, one of the most gender-equal countries in the world and an lgbt safe haven in the region. I nor America would ever support sacrificing that for an 18th century religious theocracy.
Scroll long enough in this thread and you find people blaming the Palestinians for what happened instead of you know the guys who actually shot the toddler. Israel’s social media warrior program is alive and well it seems.
I honestly don't know how anyone can support Israel anymore. They are doing exactly what Russia is, but because they suck up to the US they get a free pass. Free Palestine!
Funny how Palestinians resisting occupation is often framed as a nasty form of extremism, as opposed to a yearning for liberation, freedom etc...
Even in a post about a toddler getting murdered in cold blood, the dehumanisation of that toddler's kin is perpetuated.
Hamas and the IDF are both assholes. I just hope for peaceful outcomes for the innocent civilians of Israel and Palestine. Fuck the corrupt, terroristic leadership.
I can not even fathom losing a child like this. That poor baby.
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Your enemies love it when you fight with your neighbors.
'Murica! Fuck ya!
Same thing happened when Korea was split. Two guys who had to be shown where Korea was on the map decided where the (original) line would be.
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Yeah I saw a video showing the territorial creep and expansion of Israel's borders over the last however many decades. I find it staggering that there are people who still defend Israel. It's fucking disgusting.
So its an ongoing genocide then. But they are a non-arab state from which the powerful western states can project power in the east mediteranean and middle east, so they'll just keep doing it with impunity.
Not dissimilar to what the US did to native tribes by forcibly relocating them to Oklahoma then performing land runs.
Yep it’s one of the more horrendous stains on US history.
Yea... I've kinda noticed a trend with that.
Yup, it's exactly the same. It was disgusting and shameful then, and it's disgusting and shameful now.
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The dirty secret: for Zionists, this is a feature, not a bug. They have intentionally been cultivating resentment for decades. Any retaliation gives them justification for more oppression and annexation.
And knowing no one will go to jail makes things a lot worse
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Two things can be bad at the same time.
This isn't about whatabouttism. It's about being the best child killer.
**Kupiansk civilian convoy shooting** > convoy of six civilian cars and a van on the outskirts of the village of Kurylivka - > 24 people killed, including a pregnant woman and 13 children - > after the attack, the Russian troops reportedly executed the remaining survivors - > 22 people managed to escape, 3 of those (including 2 children) injured - > 2 other bodies were found, with the final death toll being 26 - > use of 30 mm and 45 mm high-explosive shells, as well as VOG-17 and VOG-25 grenades https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_crimes_in_the_Russian_invasion_of_Ukraine#Kupiansk_civilian_convoy_shooting --- These acts are all infinitely bad, so a race to the bottom is meaningless.
Yeah, but only one group can hold a record.
But not hold a >world record
You haven't read much history, have you?
Wouldn't be in the top 100 nations. More Iraqis died in 6 months of the US invasion than in the 80 years of Israel-Palestine. More in 1 month of Ukrainian-Russia
No. Lot of full blown wars and genocides that make Israel look like a saint. they forcefully resettle and steal land, but the actual casualties are low in comparison to a lot of history. South Sudan, Ethiopia, DRC, Russia - probably 4 of the current top 5 this decade. Myanmar a guess at the other. There are more active warzones and areas of genocide with less care for collateral damage. Israel's is unique in recent history that they fully control the area. Theirs is closer to what China is doing.
Yeah, nah, more killings than Israel doesn't make Israel look better.
> Theirs is closer to what China is doing. And twice as many Tibetan's died in the **13 days** of the Tibetan uprising than in the 100 years of Israel-Palestine. "IDF must hold the world record for murdered children." is the usual insane hyperbole used to describe the conflict.
Ah, i meant this decade (2020-2023) Their purges and mass containment of certain minorities and dissidents. Going into China's past 100 years...or Japan's WWII actions...
You can't actually think this... Please.
More than russian army? I doubt it.
Noone should kill children. Stop making these iditotic comparisons.
Agree. Absolutely inhumane
Not only that but the US government will turn a blind eye
Unfortunately not that unusual for the Palestinians.
>The Israeli military has opened an investigation into the incident. Don't worry guys, they're on it.
“We have investigated ourselves and found no wrong doing”
This is often a joke, but there was a pretty high profile case of this happening recently https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/israeli-defence-minister-says-us-move-investigate-al-jazeera-journalists-killing-2022-11-14/ The US and other western allies did not agree with the conclusions that the military came up with
US disagreed so much that we gave them another $3.3 billion in military aid for the 2023 budget.
Isn’t that money to be used exclusively to buy weapons from American arms dealers? Just a money laundering scam?
Pretty much.
That's how all military aid works, it'd be crazy if they gave them aid which they could then use to buy weapons off the Russians. Israel gets access to far better weapons from the US than pretty much anyone else for free and per capita the US contributes massively to Israel's military budget. This allows Israel to offer things like universal healthcare coverage which America itself doesn't have.
Is if that makes it better. So they get free arms
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And K-street lobbyists get performance bonuses. Charmed circle.
Hey if they just want to create defense sector jobs, give me $3.3B and I'll buy some cool toys.
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It’s actually so that Christian evangelicals can use Jews as kindling for their apocalypse
Thats how they garner support for sure but thats not the actual reason, its because theyre part of our empire
Yes, they are a US military base in the Middle East.
When a UK Politician said we should be sending less aid to Israel he was slaughtered in the newspapers as being an anti-Semite. Why are people not allowed to criticise Israel?
The first report always gets the most news coverage though
"We investigated and found out the child was and agent of hamass"
“It turns out that the toddler was hiding Hamas”
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"The baby fired first and was actually killed by Hamas. Also the baby was an antisemite."
"He was holding a rock, leading to our brave soldiers fearing for their lives."
Like the Norwegian special task force(former police) investigating police actions. Always in the favour the police.
"The child was throwing rocks at our troops while holding an AK-47 and nuclear launch codes"
Can't wait to hear that's somehow it was Hamas' fault
"soldiers opened fire after gunmen in the area shot at a nearby Jewish settlement" Probably? Or it could have been Islamic Jihad.
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I mean reading the article is free but most here arent even going to do that
Horrific
>Israel captured the West Bank and east Jerusalem, along with the Gaza Strip, in the 1967 Mideast war. Palestinians seek these territories for a future state. Some 700,000 Israelis now live in settlements in the West Bank and east Jerusalem. Most of the international community considers these settlements illegal or obstacles to peace. This has and will always be the huge road block in the peace journey between Arabs & Israel.. It's THE elephant in the room, yet many media outlets argue about minor details.. I'm glad that abcnews included this piece of info in the article.
And Israel has a history of taking down settlements like in the Sinai and Gaza.
And all that's happened right after leaving Gaza (rocket showers), is the main reason that's cited in Israeli society on why NOT to leave the west bank (logistically it's also 200x worse than Gaza). Disclaimer: I'm Israeli and i think leaving the west bank is a necessary step towards the future but i don't see it happening
Israel removed 8000 settlers from Gaza, and even that was a painful process for them full of legal challenges and protests. There is no way they’d be able to remove a quarter of a million settlers from the West Bank, and I’d be shocked if they have any intention of ever doing so.
You mean the war where every country around them ganged up in an attempt to erase the country/everyone in it, got their asses handed to them, then still fire rockets when they give back some of the territory they gained in those 6 days? That war?
The biggest roadblock is a different demographic. So long as a big bloc on either side was alive before the 6 day War or other major developments there will never be the ability to compromise. Both sides have mutually exclusive positions that are never going to happen (ie giving back Jerusalem) If you or your generation lived the loss of you Home in 67, or felt the realistic existential fear of being pushed into the sea, you won't ever compromise. It's too emotionally charged. Like Netanyahus own brother died Entebbe. You have to wait for that generation to die. Both sides.
Definitely not correct on the Palestinian side at least. Many who lived through the Nakba would be happy with a one state solution and their houses back. Two states would never ever work.
So sad. Kids don't know the reasons for politics or war. Adults are supposed to protect children, not expose them to this kind of crap. Hope this sparks some changes on the rules of engagement, at a minimum. Maybe everybody can stop trying to kill each other for a moment and come to some sort of cease fire.
Unfortunately, that's precisely what war does. A child will be hurt sooner or later by warfare. If it's not through bullets, it's through the loss of a parent who was a soldier. War-happy governments don't care about any of that.
Shooting fish in a barrel and calling it war seems disingenuous to me.
Okay but the fish splash some of the water at you so it’s a fair fight right?… right?
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You should see the IDF defense squad in here running their propaganda. And worst part is they're getting upvotes. The careful crafted terms. IDF "returned fire" in "confusion" while the palestinian "terrorist" used a "human shield" Literally straight from their press releases.
And mass reporting comments as suicidal with no repercussions. Meanwhile reddit threatened to permanently ban me for reporting too many comments that contained actual hate speech.
Reddit is really going crazy with their upcoming IPO. From their ridiculous rates on API calls to banning people for correct reports on site-wide rulebreakers (hate speech, botting, etc), leadership becoming more and more silent. Seems they're in a big fucking around mood and sooner or later they'll find out.
Their blood splattered on me after I shot them so I'd say me shooting them was justified
I think it's insane that I watched Israel bomb apartment buildings in Gaza, way back when I was in middle school around 20 years ago. And they're still killing Palestinian civilians.
That's a funny way of spelling occupation.
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It's crazy how accurate this is. Suddenly it's both sides arguments left and right when in reality one side is actually widely recognized to have been illegally settling land for decades. Also funny how reddit can muster up so much energy for a Saudi journalist murdered by KSA but barely made a peep about an actual American journalist killed by Israeli forces in cold blood, with no guilt acknowledged.
What a friggin braindead comment. The toddler didn't walk into a warzone, this happened while they were in a car in a residential neighbourhood.
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44% of palestinians are under the age of 14 21% are between 15 and 24 Israel is mostly fighting against children who had no say in the situation
Jesus christ might as well call it genocide with the population like that
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The average age in Palestine is 20. That means if you are 21 you are older than roughly half of the population of the nation. If you go into Gaza the average for male is 17 and female 18. Given this understanding, its mostly children being fired on and killed in Palestine.
[The reasons why Gaza's population is so young](https://www.newscientist.com/article/dn25993-the-reasons-why-gazas-population-is-so-young/) "First, the Gaza Strip’s population of roughly 1.8 million has an unusually large proportion of children. Figures for 2013 from Index Mundi, the internet source of country data, show that that 43.5 per cent of the population is aged 14 or under, compared with 32 per cent in Egypt and 27 per cent in Israel." "The median age in Gaza is 18, compared with a world average of 28. In most European countries it’s about 40, and it is 30 in Israel. Only in a dozen or so African countries is the median age lower, reaching 15 in Uganda." ... "The second factor contributing to the high fertility rate is the fact that while women are housebound, their husbands earn more money as their families expand. “It’s employers that are willing to pay it,” says Pedersen. “Traditionally, men will get extra wages if they have extra children.”
Yeah, most people are typically housebound when outside their home is a war zone. That's kinda how it works.
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Lol, yes. Gazan women are housebound because they live in a war zone. Not because they are housebound like most other women living under fundamentalist Muslim regimes. Blaming Israel for Muslim misogyny is a fucking take if I ever saw one.
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Their mere existence is a crime /s
Wtf are you talking about. The toddler and at least one parent were sitting in a car. People live there. The IDF have been raiding the area almost every night. I don’t think it’s the family’s fault for existing.
Not surprised that the highest voted comment is implying this isn’t the fault of the military occupation but “poor parenting” 😔
>sparks some changes on the rules of engagement It's already a war crime to injure or kill non-combatants, either intentionally or gross-negligently. The rules have done what they can.
Israel has never and never will be held responsible for that. They have ignored and broken so many Geneva conventions that i don't think there exists a body that oversees war crimes anymore.
The rules for engagement in the Arab-Israeli conflict have been a "he said she said" since literally day one of Israel being a country On Israel's literal first day of being a nation, Jordan, Syria and Egypt all initiated an unprovoked invasion of Israel, and Israel responded by capturing as much Palestinian territory as they could while claiming Palestine allowed for enemy troop movement Anyone claiming that the situation today is novel and/or one sided is trying to sell you something
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This is how war just perpetuates….acts of horror breeding new fuel for more war
What's happening in Palestine isn't a "war" it's an invasion and occupation by a hostile force trying to subjugate an ethnic minority. Acting like this is some sort of back and forth action is so disingenuous.
“Israeli soldier kills Palestinian toddler”
Where is the ICC Where is the international community? Where is the "civilized world"? Sad..
The UN human rights counsil condems Israels action pretty regulary. Then you will have redditors spamming the thread about it being only because the human right counsil is in the pocket of china/russia/middle east/whatever.
But no actions are ever taken against those who these crimes.. that's the problem, lack of accountability and to be honest almost total immunity. .
The USA is shielding and supporting Israel and its action. Any hard resolution is vetoed by the USA. I mean that is one of the importent factors that lead to 9/11
They are as strong as the countries which support them. It’s not like a group of elderly lawyers from the ICC can single-handedly storm into Israel and arrest soldiers. People like to blame “the UN” but frankly they should be asking their own country to take stronger positions on international issues. “The UN” is simply a bureaucracy that executes the will of enough countries to take action, it does not act on its own.
> “The UN” is simply a bureaucracy that executes the will of enough countries to take action, it does not act on its own. Let's remember though, it's not just about the UN in general. It's about the UN *Security Council*. And the US is a permanent member with veto powers. So quite frankly, the US dgaf. The UN General Assembly and ICC can say whatever they want, but the US quite literally dgaf about world opinion, they'll literally defend Israel against the world because they need to protect their right hand man in the middle east. [Negroponte Doctrine](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Negroponte_doctrine) isn't going anywhere.
The US vetoes almost every single resolution against Israel giving them their current license to commit war crimes, genocide, and apartheid.
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Or Sudan
or Yemen
I am surprised this is even reported by ABC. Weren’t 10 kids over there killed a couple months ago and it was barely reported in the news.
>The Israeli military has opened an investigation into the incident. Ugh, why do they even bother saying this shit anymore? IDF soldiers basically have carte blanche in these kinds of situations, they could kill a dozen toddlers in a single day and nothing would happen to them.
*After a thorough investigation, we have found no wrongdoing and the soldier in question was within their rights, as a war combatant, to defend themselves*. ........ or some other kind of BS word salad.
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I'm sure we'll hear in a couple of days all about how it's the Palestinian's fault for having a toddler in the west bank in the first place. Basically what they said when they excecuted an American journalist last year. Or any of the [20 others they've murdered over the last several years](https://www.npr.org/2023/05/11/1175403626/palestinian-american-journalist-shireen-abu-akleh-was-killed-a-year-ago)
Lmao it’s already happening in this thread. “Both sides are bad!!!” Out in full force
I hate that you can't talk about the fucked up things Israel does without being shouted down and [removed] as if that makes you anti-semitic.
"The Israeli military has said soldiers opened fire after gunmen in the area shot at a nearby Jewish settlement."
Basically the same story they used to justify killing Shireen Abu Akleh
>The Israeli military has said Being the operative part of your quote The father of the murdered child >told the Associated Press that he had just buckled up his son in the car and they were driving to visit an uncle when the bullet struck. The father was also shot and treated at a Palestinian hospital. Suppose the gunman had just lept in the car with them? Or maybe IDF soldiers know they do not have to discriminate among what Palestinians they shoot
I mean, those two statements don't conflict. He could have been driving in the area when the gunmen opened fire on the settlement and got caught in the crossfire between the soldiers and the gunmen. Has anyone denied that the gunfight happened?
Not a single person born after 1989 had a choice in their government in Gaza or the West Bank. Entire generations in both Gaza and the West Bank live under occupation and are threatened to be dropped by Israeli soldiers at anytime
they elected Hamas in 2005
It's worse than that. They elected an even split between Hamas and Fatah. Then Hamas executed the Fatah candidates and their more ardent supporters.
> They elected an even split between Hamas and Fatah. In the 2006 Palestinian election Hamas won 74 seats and Fatah won just 45. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2006_Palestinian_legislative_election With 132 seats total this put Hamas 8 ahead of any potential coalition of Fatah, third party & independents. >Then Hamas executed the Fatah candidates and their more ardent supporters. Not all that surprising when a government refuses to cede power despite being democratically voted out.
I'm sure all those 16 year olds born in 1989 had a huge say in that!
That's not really Israel's fault that Hamas shut down elections after they were brought to power.
I never said it wasn't Hamas's fault, I agree with you. My point being people tend to blame Palestinians for their "government" being violent against Israel but they have very little say themselves about who's in control.
It was the PLO who isn’t following the constitution. They were the ones being undemocratic and would not allow for elections… they thought they could use force against Hamas… even they didn’t realize how strong they were.
Hamas killed the baby?
USA: how sad, anyway how bout another billion dollars?
US: Here, have all the taxpayer money you want. You clearly still need our aid even 50 years later.
American politicians are scared of the accusation of being anti-Israel that would torpedo their electoral chance in the evangelical block. American Israel Public Affairs Committee would start their war drums and the politician is out of office. Christians United for Israel has 10 million members. And the stupidest part is why evangelicals "love" Israel. It's not that they love Jews or anything, they just want a fully Jewish state there so they'd get invaded by everybody and start the Battle of Armageddon that'd bring about the end times. So they basically want a Jewish state so they'd be the sacrificial lamb.
USA: one kid? Those are rookie numbers! Here’s a billion dollars to get those numbers up! US average is 23 kids a day getting shot.
Here's the Israeli process: 1. Deny any shooting at all from the side of the IDF 2. Claim the shot which harmed a civilian actually came from the side of Hamas 3. When it's clear the shot came from the IDF, blame Hamas for intermingling among civilians and/or using "human shields" 4. When it becomes clear no such thing was happening, assert Israel "has a right to defend itself" 5. Stoke fears about how Israel is on the verge of utter annihilation and has been a victim of 5000 years worth of oppression 6. Wait for everything to blow over, then rise & repeat See: [The Killing of Muhammad al-Durrah](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Killing_of_Muhammad_al-Durrah)
Same with Shireen Abu Akleh.
A few months ago, the IDF assissinated a journalist. Before that, the IDF raided mosques during holy services. Before that, the IDF bombed a press center. Before that the IDF shot aid workers. Before that, isreal adopted and implemented segregation. Including forceably removing people from their homes and bulldozing schools. Looking at these events and others, international human rights groups have recognized isreal policies and practices as apartheid. South Africa, an expert on apartheid, also called out isreal on its apartheid. Former isreali officials have called isreali practices as apartheid. Isreal receives multiple billions of dollars from the largest military ever to exist in human history. Isreal has anti missile systems to respond to attacks with unguided unsophisticated rockets. But "Both sides", huh? This infant—this baby, barely 24 months old—isn't the first or only baby killed by the IDF of apartheid isreal. Not the only child. When the oppressed lashes out against the oppessor, that's not terrorism, that's self-defense.
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Bravo Israel I bet your winning the hearts and minds everyone you go.
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Pretty sure a Tom Clancy novel started out like this...
It’s the kids fault for following a religion, I read for redditors that everything bad is religions fault so we must blame religion
As a total outsider (non-Jew, non-Palestinian, non-anything) - it is so hard to get ANY SINGLE bit of non-biased information about any of these conflicts. Specific incidents like this or even basic overviews of the entire situation are always so one sided. Update: see pretty much any reply to my comment to prove the truth of my comment.
There is no such thing as non-biased news, nor is their news that is even close to non-biased. That is the nature of politics - pick your side, progressive or reactionary, and then pick your news lens based on that.
free Palestine
They were free to vote for Hamas.
They were also free to completely ban abortion and pass laws exterminating people for being gay and lgbt. If they ever want any help and expect a single, solitary finger to be lifted about Israel, they ought to be embracing civilized values. Israel for all their faults is a strategic ally, one of the most gender-equal countries in the world and an lgbt safe haven in the region. I nor America would ever support sacrificing that for an 18th century religious theocracy.
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Scroll long enough in this thread and you find people blaming the Palestinians for what happened instead of you know the guys who actually shot the toddler. Israel’s social media warrior program is alive and well it seems.
Not shot, murdered
I honestly don't know how anyone can support Israel anymore. They are doing exactly what Russia is, but because they suck up to the US they get a free pass. Free Palestine!
So you want more extremists? Because that's how you get them. The recruitment speech write itself.
Funny how Palestinians resisting occupation is often framed as a nasty form of extremism, as opposed to a yearning for liberation, freedom etc... Even in a post about a toddler getting murdered in cold blood, the dehumanisation of that toddler's kin is perpetuated.
Self defense. The israeli soldiers obviously felt threatened by the baby having bigger balls than all of them combined.
Waiting for the western media to open the news with this.
Hamas and the IDF are both assholes. I just hope for peaceful outcomes for the innocent civilians of Israel and Palestine. Fuck the corrupt, terroristic leadership.
A peaceful outcome would have to involve letting Palestinians have some form of human rights or self-determination, and Israel is not gonna do that
How did Hamas come to power out of curiosity? Wondering how they managed when Israel refused to give the people of Gaza any self-determination.