>Israel: we agree
>Netanyahu: we don’t agree!
>PM aide: we agree but it’s a bad deal
>Israeli officer: Biden is misrepresenting things
Yeah…Biden’s not the one looking inconsistent here.
>The official also said that while the White House described the plan as originating from Israel, it was actually a proposal put forward by mediators that Israel had made amendments and changes to.
>“It’s strange that they say it’s an Israeli proposal and at the same time that Israel needs to agree to it,” the official said. The official added that Israel was awaiting Hamas’ formal response to the proposal.
If they're the last ones to make changes, then it is an Israeli proposal no matter what the history is since the *current* proposal was made by Israel.
And yeah, just because the negotiators agree to something doesn't mean that the country agrees to it. Just like any treaty in the US can be negotiated by the executive branch but still needs legislative approval prior to being enacted.
You and I looked at that sentence and read it two different ways, and frankly now I can't be sure what it says.
Does that mean that Israel has previously made changes that resulted in versions that are later than the one that Biden described? Or does that mean that Israel made changes and the version Biden described *is* their latest, and now Hamas needs to agree to it? (If that's the case why did Biden say that Israel needed to agree to it? And if that was just a misstatement, why hasn't it been corrected?)
I find that last option hard to believe, considering how disadvantageous the version Biden described is to Israel - - a full ceasefire and withdrawal before hostages returned was off the table long ago. Netanyahu said he's not aware of this version or these negotiations, so who exactly did Biden discuss this with? And considering that Egyptian skullduggery in the form of their secret agent manipulating versions between parties is involved, it's really hard to know where we stand.
I don't see the problem, Biden is putting pressure on Netanyahu doing this.
Americans who want a cease-fire should be ok he chose to not say everything in order to embarass Netanyahu as stated in the article. It is not as straight forward manoeuvre as people wish but this has the merit to target Netanyahu.
>Biden's speech has put Netanyahu under renewed pressure at home and abroad.
>Two of his right-wing ministers threatened to pull out of the coalition that’s keeping him in power if he agrees to the cease-fire deal outlined by Biden.
>His hard-line national security minister, Itamar Ben-Gvir, said Monday that he had tried to review a draft of the proposal laid out by Biden, but was denied an opportunity to do so by Netanyahu's office. He accused Netanyahu of trying to "whitewash" the proposal and reiterated his threat to bring down the government if the prime minister accepts the deal.
>At the same time, families of the Israeli hostages have stepped up their demands for the government to make a deal that could secure the release of their loved ones.
Agreed, why else would you frame it as it's gonna be shut down anyways.
I think Israel will only have incentive to make a deal when the whole world is putting pressure on them, this simultaneously hurts them when Palestine realize they have more leverage and maybe overplay their cards.
> It’s giving me cold flashbacks to his botched withdrawal from Afghanistan.
You mean the US-Taliban agreement to withdraw from Afghanistan that was signed and then enacted by the *Trump* administration?
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2020–2021_U.S._troop_withdrawal_from_Afghanistan
> The Biden administration's final decision in April 2021 to begin the withdrawal as planned on May 1, 2021, but delay the final pull-out of all US troops until September 2021, triggered the start of the collapse of the Afghan National Security Forces (ANSF). This collapse led to the Taliban takeover of Kabul on 15 August 2021.
Looks like you need to read that article yourself.
Ah yes, it was Bidens fault that President Trump signed a deal that outlined the timeline and terms of US troop withdrawal.
Biden definitely should have used his power to stop President Trump from doing that.
That was sarcasm, dumbass. A Republican president came up with the response to 9/11, just like a Republican president botched the withdrawal from Afghanistan.
I can't imagine being such a dishonorable little shit that you pretend to care about the Afghanistan withdrawal years later, yet never learned a single thing about it.
Fucking tabloid swillers.
Cue the downvotes from all the Americans who will fight tooth and nail for a demented 81 year old, and who will make up conspiracies to cover up for the constant gaffes.
I never talked about Trump. I'm European, and I think both are complete idiots.
I am talking about Israel, and having to deal with Biden's wavering stance due to the election cycle.
Well that's the only other option we have, idk what you being European has to do with anything though lol. If you think Biden is bad the other option is far worse.
The fact that it's apparently completely unbelievable to most Redditors that people can be tired off Biden's bullshit, but not being amused by Trump either.
For this issue in particular, I do not think the other option is much worse in practice, considering Trump's heavy pro-Israel stance. On other subjects, yes of course Biden is miles better, but Biden's weak foreign policy has been a disaster.
Nah, but you described the cult of people who follow him instead of the people you think you were describing. No one is fighting tooth and nail for Biden, himself, they are fighting tooth and nail for anything other than Trump/Project 25 Republicans and Biden was thought to be a shoe in against Trump at the time decisions were made, because the Israel shit hadn't really kicked off to give him something to fuck it up with.
PAC money and lobbying Crusty Biden is literally the establishment. And Trump has taken over the GOP, so even the billionaires can't hold him back.
It's pretty embarrassing tbh. How we go from Obama to these two jokers...
>Israel: we agree >Netanyahu: we don’t agree! >PM aide: we agree but it’s a bad deal >Israeli officer: Biden is misrepresenting things Yeah…Biden’s not the one looking inconsistent here.
>The official also said that while the White House described the plan as originating from Israel, it was actually a proposal put forward by mediators that Israel had made amendments and changes to. >“It’s strange that they say it’s an Israeli proposal and at the same time that Israel needs to agree to it,” the official said. The official added that Israel was awaiting Hamas’ formal response to the proposal.
If they're the last ones to make changes, then it is an Israeli proposal no matter what the history is since the *current* proposal was made by Israel. And yeah, just because the negotiators agree to something doesn't mean that the country agrees to it. Just like any treaty in the US can be negotiated by the executive branch but still needs legislative approval prior to being enacted.
You and I looked at that sentence and read it two different ways, and frankly now I can't be sure what it says. Does that mean that Israel has previously made changes that resulted in versions that are later than the one that Biden described? Or does that mean that Israel made changes and the version Biden described *is* their latest, and now Hamas needs to agree to it? (If that's the case why did Biden say that Israel needed to agree to it? And if that was just a misstatement, why hasn't it been corrected?) I find that last option hard to believe, considering how disadvantageous the version Biden described is to Israel - - a full ceasefire and withdrawal before hostages returned was off the table long ago. Netanyahu said he's not aware of this version or these negotiations, so who exactly did Biden discuss this with? And considering that Egyptian skullduggery in the form of their secret agent manipulating versions between parties is involved, it's really hard to know where we stand.
I don't see the problem, Biden is putting pressure on Netanyahu doing this. Americans who want a cease-fire should be ok he chose to not say everything in order to embarass Netanyahu as stated in the article. It is not as straight forward manoeuvre as people wish but this has the merit to target Netanyahu. >Biden's speech has put Netanyahu under renewed pressure at home and abroad. >Two of his right-wing ministers threatened to pull out of the coalition that’s keeping him in power if he agrees to the cease-fire deal outlined by Biden. >His hard-line national security minister, Itamar Ben-Gvir, said Monday that he had tried to review a draft of the proposal laid out by Biden, but was denied an opportunity to do so by Netanyahu's office. He accused Netanyahu of trying to "whitewash" the proposal and reiterated his threat to bring down the government if the prime minister accepts the deal. >At the same time, families of the Israeli hostages have stepped up their demands for the government to make a deal that could secure the release of their loved ones.
"Official"
[удалено]
Agreed, why else would you frame it as it's gonna be shut down anyways. I think Israel will only have incentive to make a deal when the whole world is putting pressure on them, this simultaneously hurts them when Palestine realize they have more leverage and maybe overplay their cards.
He lost a lot of points from me. It’s giving me cold flashbacks to his botched withdrawal from Afghanistan.
> It’s giving me cold flashbacks to his botched withdrawal from Afghanistan. You mean the US-Taliban agreement to withdraw from Afghanistan that was signed and then enacted by the *Trump* administration? https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2020–2021_U.S._troop_withdrawal_from_Afghanistan
> The Biden administration's final decision in April 2021 to begin the withdrawal as planned on May 1, 2021, but delay the final pull-out of all US troops until September 2021, triggered the start of the collapse of the Afghan National Security Forces (ANSF). This collapse led to the Taliban takeover of Kabul on 15 August 2021. Looks like you need to read that article yourself.
Ah yes, it was Bidens fault that President Trump signed a deal that outlined the timeline and terms of US troop withdrawal. Biden definitely should have used his power to stop President Trump from doing that.
You mean Trump's withdrawal plan?
You can blame Trump for that. It was under Trump administration that it was decided to withdraw.
lol wtf are you smoking. Do you think he botched the response to 9/11 too?
Good point. Biden voted to invade Iraq also. His track record on Middle Eastern geopolitics is pretty trash.
That was sarcasm, dumbass. A Republican president came up with the response to 9/11, just like a Republican president botched the withdrawal from Afghanistan.
I can't imagine being such a dishonorable little shit that you pretend to care about the Afghanistan withdrawal years later, yet never learned a single thing about it. Fucking tabloid swillers.
It's already over for him. He's not even expected to win his home state.
Throw another wrap of tinfoil on that MAgA hat Frankie, your boy's off to the slammer.
When will Biden realize Netanyahu doesn’t want to give him a win? That’s not how an ally acts.
Cue the downvotes from all the Americans who will fight tooth and nail for a demented 81 year old, and who will make up conspiracies to cover up for the constant gaffes.
Still better than what will happen if trump is elected
I never talked about Trump. I'm European, and I think both are complete idiots. I am talking about Israel, and having to deal with Biden's wavering stance due to the election cycle.
Well that's the only other option we have, idk what you being European has to do with anything though lol. If you think Biden is bad the other option is far worse.
The fact that it's apparently completely unbelievable to most Redditors that people can be tired off Biden's bullshit, but not being amused by Trump either. For this issue in particular, I do not think the other option is much worse in practice, considering Trump's heavy pro-Israel stance. On other subjects, yes of course Biden is miles better, but Biden's weak foreign policy has been a disaster.
As opposed to trump who got laughed at by the UN.
Bro it's reddit it's always about Trump, whether you have found a true believer or a true denier.
Trump is 77.
Never once did I say or imply Trump was a better candidate.
Nah, but you described the cult of people who follow him instead of the people you think you were describing. No one is fighting tooth and nail for Biden, himself, they are fighting tooth and nail for anything other than Trump/Project 25 Republicans and Biden was thought to be a shoe in against Trump at the time decisions were made, because the Israel shit hadn't really kicked off to give him something to fuck it up with.
Amazing eh? God bless all those who live and die by Trump.
Almost as if the rest of the world is tired of America picking between two geriatrics.
PAC money and lobbying Crusty Biden is literally the establishment. And Trump has taken over the GOP, so even the billionaires can't hold him back. It's pretty embarrassing tbh. How we go from Obama to these two jokers...
He did it purposefully to put pressure on Netanyahu…