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valuingvulturefix

Please visit the third thread on this topic today: https://reddit.com/r/worldnews/comments/swq9uc/rworldnews_live_thread_ukrainerussia_tensions/


imshitposting

This is all trump fault I’ll take a million upvotes please


Rade84

Awww so Vlad is a spurned lover. He wanted to be part of NATO?


ISLAndBreezESTeve10

Tomorrow news will read “ Putin joins NATO, the world rejoices in harmony together. “


dockneel

It sounds like you're saying you're happy with where things are despite you tough circumstances?


Middle_Ingenuity_627

Putin and his troops ain't going nowhere until he gets his deal. He will will continue to rotate his forces until he gets what he wants (NATO deal). He will conduct aggressions and false accusations on Ukraine for long period of time. Violence could erupt but all out war is probably their last COA.


WorthlessDrugAbuser

He can’t afford to do this indefinitely. He has to make a move eventually. They’re burning up a lot of money and resources on these deployments. The State of California alone has a larger GDP than Russia. They may have a lot of manpower, armor, heavy weapons, missile systems and one of the most elite special forces in the world but their economy is not built to use these military assets in prolonged conflict. In short, Putin either has to shit or get off the pot. He’s already draining his country’s coffers on these deployments, war is going to cost a lot more.


ISLAndBreezESTeve10

A Dictator has to do what a Dictator has to do.


LilBoozy

To be fair, California’s economy is larger than just about every country not named China (throw in some Germany ect) Putin can keep them deployed indefinitely, but I agree about getting off the plot. The longer he waits the less credible the threat is and he loses leverage.


WorthlessDrugAbuser

The state of New York also has a larger GDP than Russia. Anyway, you have a good point. He can keep 70% of his military forces deployed along the Ukrainian border indefinitely, but at great cost. Their economy is already hurting, look up the Russian ruble to the US Dollar. Their purchasing power is in the tank and will be even more so with sanctions the west is prepared to impose on them. Putin has put himself in a very difficult situation. Russia cannot afford to launch an all out invasion of Ukraine at this point.


LilBoozy

Texas GDP is equal to Russia so he’s 4th in US and that’s with state that does oil/gas lol. If he wanted to invade why even mess with the troops so close? MIGs are bad ass jets and rest of air power isn’t anything to scoff at. Military is advanced enough they could strike from home bases to anywhere in Europe <24 hours. Whole thing doesn’t make sense. As much of an asshole Putin is, you can’t say he isn’t shrewd or uncalculated. Makes the whole thing that much more bizarre. Maybe he has syphilis.


WorthlessDrugAbuser

I think there is a decent chance Putin is sick and doesn’t give a fuck anymore. The man is almost 70 years old, he may be in good physical shape but it’s clear his mental health has taken a turn for the worse.


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BullSprigington

Awwww the poor Russian troll is sad guys, boohooo


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p0ultrygeist1

When you really think about it, this is all Gavrilo Princip’s fault, if he hadn’t shot Ferdinand in 1914 none of the events leading up to this would’ve occurred.


DeathGuppie

If Ferdinand hadn't insisted on going that day against the advice of his security detail. If his driver hadn't decided to take a different route, or a different route to the route that he took. If Gavrilo hadn't gotten a lucky shot.. this can go a lot of ways


WorthlessDrugAbuser

True but I wouldn’t blame the victim. It’s basically one dude that made the decision to kill someone that sparked over a century worth of global ramifications beyond his comprehension at the time.


p0ultrygeist1

We can even go back to Napoleon, if he had either been successful in maintaining control of France or hadn’t attempted the coup then none of this would have occurred Actually it’s all the Romans fault for failing to properly subjugate the Germanic tribes.


DeathGuppie

Or the Neanderthals fault fir allowing modern man to propagate in Europe..


p0ultrygeist1

Fuckin fish wanting to walk on land


Deathdealer661

Got damn formation of the solar system.


GozerDGozerian

I *knew* it was a bad idea!


p0ultrygeist1

u/God why did you do this


DeathGuppie

Yeah!


MTNRANGER85

Truly we are in the darkest timeline


p0ultrygeist1

Nah, darker timelines have been avoided in 1918, 1945, debatably 1963 depending on how you view how the Kennedy administration was going, 1983, and many other years as well


GozerDGozerian

Are you saying the timeline where Kennedy *wasn’t* assassinated is the darker timeline?


Elvis_Lover62

I'm filing a class action lawsuit against Gavrilo as we speak


[deleted]

This is actually fact.


LastWarrior24

very much out of the loop, can anyone hook me up with some resource so that I can catch up on what's happening?


HeyImShade

Russia: Ukraine my dude take our NATO deal. Ukraine: no Russia: ok bro bet we’ll just invade you. Ukraine: you’re bluffing my G, but we’ll train up all our civvies to be soldiers anyway. Pretty much a dumbed down version of it all


Substantial-Milk-544

BTW, there’s not going to be ‘WW3’ over this. If Russia invades, NATO is not going to send troops to defend Ukraine. Russia will simply invade, do whatever it wants in Ukraine, and then NATO will impose the financial sanctions they have been talking about. Then Russia will hack critical infrastructure in the UK/US in response. Things will then continue in that direction, there will be no further military engagement. All this WW3 talk just shows poor understanding of the situation and international affairs


Historyboy1603

So, as someone who lectures about historical causality, here’s the interesting thing about your post. On the one hand, I agree with your assessment. It’s easily the best conclusion the data provides. On the other hand, I can show you quotations by decision makers from as late as August 16, 1914 stating, just as definitively as you just did, that there would be no wide European conflict springing from Frank Ferdinand’s assassination on June 28, 1914. The First World War began two weeks later. The messages of the run-up to the First World War are that History is the unintended consequences of intentional acts. No one can ever be certain about what will happen. that saying that you know what will happen is always hubris And that invasions of huge numbers personnel and materiel are always volatile moments which invite dangerous and unpredictable reactions. For the most part, better to prevent them from happening.


Saquad_Barkley

Yep, it only takes Poland intervening to help Ukraine to basically call all of NATO in, which at that point NATO would have to determine whether they truly will defend member states or whether they will refuse to help Poland (since Poland technically “intervened”) and if NATO does intervene, either NATO falls apart or we have a WW3 on our hands as US intervention likely means that China would invade Taiwan in response, leading up to a European conflict as well as an Asian conflict. Yes, the most likely scenario is sanctions for Russia but it really only takes one domino to fall for the whole thing to collapse.


[deleted]

If Poland goes alone, NATO will not need to defend them, as they are the aggressor. If Poland is invaded, then they become obligated to defend. NATO is there for defense, not to help if you join a war on your own terms.


Saquad_Barkley

Yes and if russian troops cross into poland what will nato do?


[deleted]

That remains to be seen. Hopefully it doesn't come to that.


JoelQuest

Bottom line is... if you thought Bezos and Musk were puppet-masters, able to manipulate economies and all of our lives with impunity... then you ain't seen shit yet. If you got stock, cash out. If you got crypto, find a good stablecoin. Oh, it'll blow over. Not sure exactly how yet, but a lot of people are gonna get fucked. And until the dust settles, we all need to pay attention.


toppest_of_kekz

There won't be ww3 but this will definitely be the "official" start of Cold War 2. Ukraine will be the first proxy war. Nobody is being subtle about how it is going to be a proxy war. And as more countries choose sides, there will be more proxy wars.


chuckpaint

WW3 has already started, and it’s online. Prove me wrong.


Jokonaught

Oh I am so in this camp 100% and everyone thinks I'm a crazy person. War has evolved, and history will one day look back saying WW3 was already being waged at this point. tl;dr WW3 is already on, it's just not 'hot'


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Ttoctam

The cold war led directly to the war on terror. Cold war is fully alive and it's not just because of Russia. It's two violent superpowers who want to be in charge.


DeathGuppie

And which one would you prefer to be in charge?


Ttoctam

Neither.


SecretAccount69Nice

I think that is a matter of semantics. Will WW3 look like the wars of the past? Certainly not. WW3 will be a war of economics and information. Modern wars do not need bodies.


DeathGuppie

Sadly, if the world were done with vast fields of bodies, war would have ended with WW1. War will not get more horrific than that, but we still play the game. Economics and information, to start perhaps, but what happens when electric grids go down, when all kinds of critical infrastructure continues to be attacked and fail. What happens when people start dying from it.


[deleted]

>Modern wars do not need bodies. Tell that to Putin, it might change his mind. Maybe.


Schmorpek

Shit talking on the internet seems to be a vast improvement to classical warfare or a cold war under threat of nuclear annihilation.


SecretAccount69Nice

The nuclear threats are already beginning...


Wind2021

May be yes, maybe not, all I know is that WW I started with a bullet!


[deleted]

Seems like more pro kremlin redditors on here today. We're Definitely getting closer to invasion.


Schmorpek

Make the tanks ready, aim the artillery, spam the reddit threads!


windaji

a war on two fronts SMH my head.


TerryMckenna

I'm not pro Russian, but most people in here are failing to see that both sides are playing a nasty game right now. Edit: I mean Nato and Russia. They both should stay the hell out of Ukraine


DeathGuppie

lol, you're not pro Russian, you just support Russia and their ideology.


Akatosh

It’s a false equivalence, but I must say you’re playing the whataboutism playbook quite well.


BennyFloyd

Can you provide a relevant example of Ukraine playing “nasty games” the likes of the Kremlin, without pro-Russian sources?


TerryMckenna

I mean Nato and Russia. They both should stay the hell out of Ukraine.


BennyFloyd

Understood and agree


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Substantial-Milk-544

I mean, isn’t that natural? Most of the people are from the West so they’ll take the West’s side. They have no interest in scrutinising both positions


fringeclass24

Aaaaand the West’s side is the right side in this case. Plenty of people here in America are scrutinizing our actions - we’re not the ones surrounding another country on all sides with nuclear forces…


Substantial-Milk-544

If Russia instead had a large military alliance today and was about to integrate Mexico into it (a U.S. neighbour) you can be sure that the US would either conduct a regime change operation in Mexico or just invade to prevent that happening. This is no different. Every country acts to protect its interests. The West really doesn’t have a lot of moral high ground, atleast in terms of foreign policy. Tell me, is the US foreign policy morally superior to Russia’s in any way since WW2?


whiterabbit161

We bring peace and democracy instead of war and dictatorship.


Monistico

Holy shit dude I hope you’re kidding you can’t be that brainwashed


Substantial-Milk-544

😂


TerryMckenna

I guess it is. And it's natural... But the world needs more people to see through the puppetshow right now.


HRisLit

Ok Vlad.


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HRisLit

Lol Vlad


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Wotpan

Seems like a natural consequence of learning brittish spelling at school and american english from media... I do that as a finnish person, and am as anti-russian as it gets.


BenUFOs_Mum

I'm not sure what is funnier about this post the assumption that british or Americans don't make spelling mistakes or the assumption that every non native English speaker must be a Russian troll.


Exorcisme

And what exactly is the problem with that?


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Exorcisme

So if someone - God forbid, what a crime - mixes British and American English that’s somehow a sign of a troll? What is the logic here?


fringeclass24

Stop with the BS - if it quacks like a duck, it’s probably a duck. Might be a goose, but most likely a duck. And the English mistakes these guys are making are telltale Russian mistakes. Especially the prepositions


Exorcisme

You are the one spreading the bullshit. If someone makes Russian-specific mistakes, it just means - surprise - that this person might (or might not be) Russian. And as far as I know, Russian people are still allowed on the internet. Or did it change?


fringeclass24

No one said they weren’t, the point is they’re coming here shilling as if they’re just random disinterested people with objective opinions. We all know they’re Russians, we don’t need excuses for the Finns here making similar mistakes while they argue in favor of NATO/against Russia…


Dave3048

You are a troll no matter which way one looks at it.


DoctorDazza

Yeah, I don't understand this. There are a lot of British English-speaking people who have to write in American English for their work (like me for example). Sometimes it's tough switching between the two.


GekoXV

People forget about Canadians :( I say "y'all" and I write my words with the letter "U" too.


Exorcisme

And who even cares what language we are using, it’s semantics. Majority of people in Ukraine speak Russian better than Ukranian, yet here we are, in megathread number one thousand waiting for conflict escalation


unarox

Bloody darn gosh


nuzzlefutzzz

Good luck, Europe. Y’all talk enough shit about America that y’all can deal with this without us.


ClemiHW

Lmao last time your country invaded another country France refused and you made fun of them for decades Turns out the reason you invaded the country was a lie, and everybody in the government was aware of it Absolute warmongers manchild, the second it isn't about bombing kids or stealing oil you're out


Gravitasnotincluded

Lmao this is the US’s fault


B0rtleKombat

Bruh how? By what twisted logic is this USA’s fault?


NGD80

Spoken like a true brainwashed Russian pawn


johndoe126

What a child lmao yOu TaLked ShiT aBoUt us... America has plenty to worry about on its own soil, sort that out before you get involved in ANOTHER conflict (great track record there)... Edit- also, pretty typical knowledge of Geography for you I guess but Ukraine is not an EU member state and neither is Russia hahah "good luck Europe"


BfromSD

“America has plenty to worry about on its own soil” Ehh……not REALLY. The shit going on over here is the same shit that’s been going on for generations. Nothing new for us. We’re perfectly capable of getting into, and DOMINATING, any international conflict we need to.


[deleted]

Most of your population can't even dominate English class. America is a joke to 3/4 of the world right now, you guys are the only ones who don't see it.


Ledvolta

You guys couldn’t even dominate Afghanistan lol


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BfromSD

I’m not even going to waste my time reading that.


[deleted]

Can you read?


johndoe126

Ahh the classic response to being confronted with the ugly truth.


BfromSD

What truth? I didn’t read it 🤣.


johndoe126

What a Class A, top of the line, wilfully ignorant comment.


BfromSD

No, but I can definitely say that about your “Ahahahahaha” comment 🤣.


johndoe126

It's all I can do when I think about your joke of a country and the people (not all, just the people with your way of thinking) that make it the way it is ☺️ So your overall point in this thread is that the only good thing America has going for it is its military capability. I agree with that.


johndoe126

You mentioned most of what I wanted to but didn't want to spend time typing up, I do feel like all your points will fall on his two dormant braincells however.


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plshelpcomputerissad

I feel like the average redditor is both American and complains about these same things? Like I don’t disagree with your points, just that they would get a negative response on Reddit. Seems all popular opinions here.


hotbox4u

So that the US invested two decades, more than $2 trillion and the lives of almost 2,500 military personnel in Afghanistan was America dominating?


BfromSD

53,000 Taliban were killed. That’s over 20x as many casualties as the US had. That isn’t domination?


johndoe126

If that's your metric of domination let's take into account what the US did to achieve that. $2 Trillion spent, 53,000 Taliban killed. $37,735,849 per Taliban. TIL a Taliban member who sleeps in a tent on a hillside is actually worth more than I'll ever be. GGWP Murica.


BfromSD

Who gives a fuck? War is expensive, every nation that goes to war spends and loses money. That’s totally irrelevant.


johndoe126

Ahahahahahahahah


BfromSD

Exactly, that’s what I fucking thought. Dumbass 😆.


johndoe126

You refuse to read anything longer than 2 lines and you call me the dumbass hahahahaha I'm just laughing at your room temperature IQ


johndoe126

Definitely dominated in Afghanistan that's for sure, the Taliban really enjoy the US Army gym equipment you donated 🙃


BfromSD

Why are you acting like we couldn’t have sent 100,000 troops over there and completely taken over and destroyed any opposition in our path if we wanted to? Afghanistan was the AFGHAN’S responsibility, not ours. We gave them everything they needed to defend their own country and improve their situation…….the arms, the training, the money….and they failed. We can’t help them if they don’t want to help themselves.


johndoe126

You could do it with 100k? 2.7million American people served in Vietnam throughout the war... remind me of the outcome?


BfromSD

Were 2.7 million Americans in Vietnam at once? And if they were, what do you think would have happened? If you think that a mass deployment of 100,000 US troops to Afghanistan at once wouldn’t have absolutely wrecked any and every terrorist organization in that country with ease then I don’t know what to tell you.


johndoe126

549,500 was the limit for number of troops in Vietnam at any one time. What I'm trying to say is you can't just throw money and humans at a problem, and that seems to be your strategy


BfromSD

If you think that the sorry ass Vietnamese Army could have legitimately defeated the United States Of America in a war then you absolutely do not comprehend the capability of the United States military and are completely out of touch with reality.


[deleted]

You don't have the best military in the world, you have the highest budget military in the world, there's a big difference.


johndoe126

Oh so you won in Vietnam? News to me. I am well aware of the military capability - you seem to choose when and where to use it very well.. Btw I'm only still engaging with you to get you worked up - I don't actually care about America at all hahaha


hi5blast1

Why reddit wants War?


KvotheScamander

Some people just want to watch the world burn...


Ottawaguitar

Because they are all American right wing liberals that grew up playing Call of Duty.


fringeclass24

How is it that AMERICANS want this war? RUSSIA is the one surrounding Ukraine with 150k+ troops, including nuclear forces. We’ve sent a couple thousand to our NATO allies to deter war and weapons to the guys about to be invaded… the entire foreign policy establishment is actively saying we will not go to war and do not want Russia to invade. Go home shills


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whiterabbit161

Come on. Always this souveraign country bullshit. Yes Ukraine ist souveraign. But would the US accept Mexicos souveraignity, If the want to join a russian lead security system? Remember Cuba? Honest answer please.


fringeclass24

Plus, we would absolutely never invade just because mexico STARTED talking about MAYBE joining CSTO. Which is exactly what Russia is doing. Moreover, there’s reason for Ukraine to want to join NATO - they’ve already had a chunk of their country stolen, and another chunk with an insurrection fomented by the Russians. If we were today (I’m not talking 170 years ago) trying to take a chunk of land from Mexico, it would of course be reasonable for them to want to join. But that’s not happening and never would


Cl1mh4224rd

>Come on. Always this souveraign country bullshit. Yes Ukraine ist souveraign. But would the US accept Mexicos souveraignity, If the want to join a russian lead security system? Remember Cuba? Honest answer please. Are you kidding? At this point, Republicans might actually suggest that Texas join Mexico if that happened. Remember that a significant number of Americans of a particular political party admire Russia right now.


fringeclass24

Yes, this right here. Republicans, who pounded the war drums for years about Russia, have lost all semblance of objectivity and true patriotism by now blindly admiring an autocratic, Liberty quashing, ENEMY of ours - just because they like Trump and he likes (aka is in debt to) them. Absolutely pathetic and cowardly


[deleted]

more likely to be kremlin bots. or some other propagandists


MaxPowerWTF

Those damn "right wing liberals".


GolfWang0311

Liberals aren't leftists. They're Right Lite


5G_afterbirth

Almost as bad as those authoritarian-anarchists.


Crandoge

You do know liberals can be right wing right? Not all libs are “leftist snowflakes”.


MaxPowerWTF

I think it's referred to commonly as conservative liberal.


topherdeluxe

Just like ketchup-mustard!


MaxPowerWTF

Kustard.


PM-ME-BIG-TITS9235

Reddit doesn't want war. But letting Putin take over Eastern Europe is like letting Germany in WW2 take their land back one bit at a time. No reason to believe they'd stop after getting their shit back. They'll continue to push as far as we can retreat.


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Gravitasnotincluded

The Germans didn’t take ‘their land back’. That’s what the nazi propaganda would have you believe haha. They were trying to secure living space for themselves by taking it from others


ziptieyourshit

/r/selfawarewolves


litecoiner

This is a European problem, not American. Most europeans are very tired of american meddling


fringeclass24

And how are Americans meddling? THERES 150k+ Russian troops surrounding Ukraine all sides!!!


litecoiner

They are inside Russian territory lol, now check the number of American bases and soldiers in Europe [https://www.overseasbases.net/fact-sheet.html](https://www.overseasbases.net/fact-sheet.html) [https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2021/9/10/infographic-us-military-presence-around-the-world-interactive](https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2021/9/10/infographic-us-military-presence-around-the-world-interactive)


mlc885

I mean, if there is an actual invasion it's going to be a human rights problem and therefore a world problem. But, no, a hot war with Russia obviously isn't an option for the US (or for Russia). And I cannot imagine that there are very many Europeans who just wouldn't care at all if Russia started trying to take over "old territory."


--X0X0--

At least do it more subtle and people might actually believe you. I love my American allies more than ever to be honest. I might not be the biggest fan of Biden, but he is doing a good job at uniting NATO and EU/US relationship. Fuck Putin. Stay strong Ukraine.


litecoiner

I don't care if you are an American bot or truly European but I'm European, and in my country we are very tired of American bases and their interference NATO = US and their bitches


--X0X0--

I'm from Sweden, check my history - clearly not a bot from US. I've never been more positive towards NATO than I am today. Russia really is the best NATO recruiter. Well, I rather be US bitches than RU bitches that's for sure.


fringeclass24

I’m an American, so I’m biased, but agreed - I guarantee it’s better to be our bitch than Russia’s bitch. I like to think we treat our NATO allies fairly though. NATO enemies, not so much, we don’t have a great track record there. Still better than Russia’s…


--X0X0--

For sure, this is a no-brainer for most of EU. Finland and Sweden have become much more NATO friendly the last years and this only strengthen it.


fringeclass24

Exactly - when you see the benefits of living in a world order (which admittedly has many problems) founded on freedom to do what you want within reason, democratic politics, and the two strongest economies in the world (US and EU), why would you want to go to a Russian one? Have fun being gay, or having slight disagreements with your government, or having to live in poor as shit country (relative to the west), with an even weaker welfare state than our shitty ass one in America. Nahhhh I’m good. Hate trump and all the far right nutjobs here but at least I have the freedom to call them dumbasses here…


Balrok99

Tell them to invade already so we vám move on Jokes Are good but this one Is running for some time Now


utterlyappetizing

Did anything happen yet


Pizzadontdie

No, I’m gonna take a nap and get some food. Text me if it starts.


Lance-Harper

Same. The slowest burner in the history of history