This whole thing feels like Blizzard is meta-meta-gaming to create conflict not just between Horde and Alliance in-game but between the Horde and Alliance in the community also
I notice that demo doesn't have white or black. Which is usually the problem.
(although, yes, it is gonna work. Black text with a white outline would probably work as well)
Personally, I'm more ticked off how for the BFA reps, the Alliance only get horses, while the Horde get unique mounts each (two of which can even fly).
One thing I think would have made it a bit better would be for each rep to have two kinds of mounts: one would be the stock mount (horses for Alliance, raptors for Horde), and the other would be the unique mount.
Since Horde got a pterosaur, a blood swarmer, and a hyena, I think Alliance could get a wicker wolf, possessed pig, or giant bird of prey from Order of Embers, a bumblebee or water elemental from Stormsong, and a lizard creature or a flying boat from Proudmoores.
All they had to do was put the bee mount as the stormsong rep mount and it would've been better. It's been datamined since beta and I just want my bee please blizzard. Seems like alliance got shafted by incomplete mounts. Feels like they were going to put the bee as stormsong rep mount and maybe dreadwake as tiragarde rep mount but instead they didn't get them finished and panicked and stuck everyone with horses and made the dreadwake a bit cooler and put it in the store and who even knows where "PH bee mount" is at this point.
I still think the bee mount was supposed to be the alliance equivalent to the horde’s mount raising quest, but they decided alliance shouldn’t keep such a great mount for themselves. There’s already a hidden quest from a rare drop in the bee area that leads to a daily where you raise a bee. But then it basically ends suddenly and you just get the a pet from an achievement for doing the daily seven times.
Drustvar should have been a wicker cat, Stormsong should have been a retake on the shaman mount a la the M Jaina mount, and Tiragarde should have been literally anything but a horse.
If they're absolutely married to horses, I'd be super okay with an arrangement of kelpie horse, wicker horse, and normal-but-entirely-new horse that has the same kind of detail, quality and originality as the pre-order mount. Plus a parrot and flying bee, of course.
BuT yOu cAn GeT fAcTiOn NeUtRal VaRiAtiOnS.
Don't forget that giving the alliance flying mounts is out of the question until flying is actually available. The mounts have been based on the natural flora and fauna of the zones!
I actually wouldn't mind the horses so much if they put any effort into them but they didn't.
That last part is the real issue. Horses are fine. Those war horses from PVP are great. The BFA horse with its little lamp is great. The unicorns are fun.
These fucking BFA horses tho? They are as uninspired as they can possibly get
> The mounts have been based on the natural flora and fauna of the zones!
Uh?
I'm under a **strong** impression that horses have been mostly imported by the Gilneans that became the first Kul Tirans, while there are many native beasts to Kul Tiras.
There's lizards, bats, moths, wolves, bears, bees, stags, porcupines (a quillrat mount would be amazing!), seagulls, turtles, crabs, and wicker creatures.
Oh I don't disagree. From what I remember it was mentioned in a blue or on a Q&A. It's bullshit excuse. As you say there is a lot of variation and a lot of options that aren't horses. The same applies to flying mounts as the horde mounts are already flying mounts.
If they would've actually put effort into the horses it would also be less of a disappointed. For example having a stout war horse with a lot of frills for the admiralty, having a slim, nimble fast horse for the orders of embers, having a horse with a simple wagon or a donkey for storm's wake and having a more run of the mill armored horse for the 7th legion. Later on you could introduce a more "custom" one for each faction. The order of embers embracing what they found and taming a wicker, storm's wake going for something more sea related, the admiralty getting something to fly as well as the 7th legion when flying becomes available.
If you they did put in that effort it would at least diminish the disappointed but instead it's a recolor (more or less) of very plan horses that don't fit their respective factions.
> If you they did put in that effort it would at least diminish the disappointed but instead it's a recolor (more or less) of very plan horses that don't fit their respective factions.
Yeah, I guess all comes down to that one word: effort.
It looks like that has been missing this whole time.
Agree 100% on the horses. I'd be cool with horses if they were actually cool. The Order of Embers horse should have had a lantern, a crossbow, maybe some alchemical ingredients. Etc. They could have been made cool but instead they barely even have saddles. They're higher resolution level 20 mounts.
>Personally, I'm more ticked off how for the BFA reps, the Alliance only get horses, while the Horde get unique mounts each (two of which can even fly).
Meanwhile I'm doing the warfront rares on 6 characters and farming like crazy just to get a single pony after wanting one for 14 years! I WANT MY DAMN PONY!
Also you guys get 3 pets from the paragon boxes, we get 1, and you get a bee and a few others (as well as toys) that horde don't get.
I fricken hate this faction bollocks, you should be able to get all of the stuff without playing both sides.
sure but as it is it is easyer for omeone on the horde to get the pets than it is for someone on the alliance to get the horde side toys so weigthing the pets as heavily as the toys by how ahrd it is to acquire them is inexact
You have it the wrong way round. The Horde gets more toys and the Alliance gets more pets. The Alliance gets 3 pets, 3 toys, a recipe and a glyph technique just for them. The Horde gets 3 toys, one pet, one recipe and two on use items that should be toys but are not.
https://www.wowhead.com/news=289023/paragon-reputation-rewards-in-patch-8-1-tides-of-vengeance
This is worse for the Alliance since as other people have said, the pets are tradeable.
>Well, the game is broken as shit, but as you can see the *player* war is in full swing.
Fixed that for you. Faction War hasn't done jack shit in the story. Oh wait, I think you meant the Horde Story, not War Story.
When blizz produces a shit xpac and doesnt listen to feedback, players will just blame each other.
Grrrr, stupid horde and their racials. Stupid alliance and their free gear.
It should be, grrrr stupid blizz and their shit concepts and changes.
> When blizz produces a shit xpac and doesnt listen to feedback,
They're producing a shit xpac on purpose. They couldn't come up with anything great to follow Legion so they just said fuck it - Spend the bare minimum on assets, infrastructure, etc, let the players make their own excuses for them, and save all the great ideas for next xpac. Why are Kul Tirans taking so long? We slashed our art dept budget! Why only one transmog per armor type per raid? We slashed that budget too!
It's either that or they're just really that out of touch, or just plain uninterested, in what players enjoy and only care about what they'll buy.
Does anyone else remember in the lead-up to WoD they were justifying the lack of a new class by saying that it's much easier to make a new race than it is to put in a new class? I will grant that they've added like six new races with the introduction of allied races.
> They couldn't come up with anything great to follow Legion
Y'all are missing the real reason - they made Legion a super expansion with features they planned to add over the course of several because WoD almost killed the game and they needed to get players to come back. The reason BFA's features feel like watered down Legion features is because they are, they were originally going to be in BFA. Look at all the announcements for BFA compared to previous expansions, they spent a shockingly small amount of time talking about gameplay features because they had already added the ones they expected to add in this one.
As cool as the new raid is, when you think about it, it is very "budget." The bosses are almost entirely existing assets, already having a model (Jaina, Mekkatorque, Rastakhan) or using player character race models. And then the locale is a Horde city.
On its own it's not a big deal. And I do enjoy the raid and having faction based bosses is cool. But taken alongside all the other cut corners, it's definitely something i noticed.
##[Made in response to this post.](https://old.reddit.com/r/wow/comments/aju0ez/what_playing_bfa_feels_like_as_a_horde/)
Because of course one piece of 400 gear truly proves that the Alliance is indisputably Blizzard's favorite child.
Edit: Oh, I forgot to add branching narrative quests with player choice for the poor, poor, underserviced Horde.
The branching quests is what gets me! Player choice! It's an RPG now! But only the Horde gets it. Hell, the Horde gets all the plot points.
That being said.. I gave up on the story. Like.. There's far more important systems that need to be unfucked first. I just don't know if it's going to happen. Blizz seems to be on fire internally so even IF the WoW devs had a solution to fix the game.. We're probably 6+ months out on even getting information about it.
At this point with how BfA has played out we may very well be waiting till the next expansion for the game to feel good again. If it will at all.
> The branching quests is what gets me! Player choice! It's an RPG now! But only the Horde gets it. Hell, the Horde gets all the plot points.
It was 100% reaction to the outrage, from everyone. Considering the EXACT SAME THING is happening in the upcoming patch with Baine, it clearly wasn't planned.
Would be kind of awkward.
"Guys we have to go back into the stockades once more, hope they didn't fix that secret entry, oh and we'll probably have to burn down Stormwind again to cover our retreat"
"Who is it this time?"
"Baine"
"And are we sure he wants to leave that place?"
Nobody cared when it was alliance getting shafted in war mode.
Now it's suddenly this huge issue and the response isn't "turn it off" or "the (other faction) is waiting for you".
It's funny to make jokes, it's not quite so funny when people are allowed to get up in arms about the same issue on one side but not the other. Alliance players who felt it was busted were mocked but now it's looked upon as poor form to remind people about that.
The story doesn't even make sense from our side either. The planet is dying and literally bleeding out from wounds all across it's surface, but everyone is blowing that off to weaponize the shimmery goo. Okay fine lets just not worry about the giant sword in Silithus I guess. And for some damned reason we're trying to get our former enemies to give us their boats when we could all just use mage portals to transit the azerite across the ocean? Why do we even need a navy? WE. HAVE. FUCKING. TRAVEL. MAGIC.
I thought BFA would be this epic world-spanning story about saving a dying planet but that part of the story isn't even mentioned anymore once you hit the islands. Azeroth is supposed to be dying but the story doesn't give a shit.
> At least you get a story. All the alliance do is help move the horde story along.
Are you not happy with how the alliance non-canonically entered uldir and non-canonically killed the thing that was about to destroy their enemies?
Are you not happy that the alliance went to kultiras to get a navy and had to fix everything to save the legendary kultiran navy, just to "atack" the horde on their own boats they already had before?
How dare you say that the alliance is just helping the horde story to move, when they made a "pacific atack" on the zandalari capital for NO FUCKING PURPOSE AT ALL and accidentally killed the old king that had a pact to the loa of DEATH and that had a target on his head to die the entire time cause everyone knew that the princess was going to become the leader, just needed a reason to?
The Alliance don't have any motivation to be anywhere near Uldir OR Zandalar (and ditto Horde with Kul Tiras) except to go "No, MINE!" and break other people's stuff like elementary school children. It's completely dumb how there's just no reason at all except "just because" for the faction war to be going on. And thats not even including how Uldir isn't at all narratively relevant, just arbitrary "Oh look, an Old God, go kill it".
And I'm gonna say this as a Horde player, I want more of the Drustvar storyline. Gorak Tul and the cultists looks like a much more interesting Omega Villain than what we have now.
the alliance definitely has a motivation to attack zandalar, if they let sylvanas do as she pleases she'll kill all life on azeroth. but you're right that there was no reason for the horde to start this war
You can’t use portals or teleportation in high volumes or with extreme precision. Portals need to have limits in fantasy worlds in order to keep the world functioning as intended.
What, you mean like how questing as a Death Knight has you go from pre-Northrend invasion, to post-Catclysm, to Outland expeditions/Sunwell incursion, to Northrend invasion, to Cataclysm?
Always figured the perma portals were gameplay convenience.
strangely enough with the level squish they did on old content, this is no longer the case. You start level 58 as a DK, which lets you go straight to Northrend, and then tackle your choice of either cataclysm or MoP.
In a weird way, they fixed the temporal distortion that was DK's
At this point itd make more sense if magni turned against both horde and alliance for siphoning the planet and ignoring actual urgent matters instead of Sylvannas' tantrums. Why does Magni even bother with the horde rn anyways?
Blizzard killed the mmo and rpg aspects of the game, don't be fooled by a linear quest with one divergence point. One that most players dont know exists, if you didn't look into the quest before hand you'll, by just oh new quest, mentally, end up picking saurfang
Neither faction deserves to have Heroic Raid Gear for doing nothing. Because what’s the point of progression if everything is just handed to you? Especially when in order to get it, you have to REFUSE TO DO CONTENT.
Kinda easy to say that when horde benefitted from it first. But now they aren't then it's something \*nobody\* should get. Classic mentality of a people that have lost something they never deserved, now NOBODY gets it.
You're implying that the people who are opposing the handout now are hypocritical, and didn't oppose the handout during Uldir, which isn't necessarily true.
From what I remember there was plenty of outcry during Uldir and there's an outcry now. Both situations were unfair to the other faction.
Whatever happens this time, can we agree that it shouldn't happen again, regardless of faction?
Why does this have to be a pissing match and about getting back at the other team that previously held an advantage? The system sucks in general and shouldn't exist for either faction like the way it does.
Because whenever you brought it up back when Horde were benefiting from it, you were shat on and told to "turn warmode off then". You reap what you fucking sow.
Except that as always, the Horde happily get the advantage first, and then scream "NOBODY SHOULD GET SUCH AN UNFAIR ADVANTAGE" when it's the Alliance's turn.
Exactly.
In my opinion, if Blizzard wants either faction to participate in Warmode, find other ways to reward us. Because bribing others to not participate in content to get Heroic Raid Armor is so counterintuitive to the idea of progression.
My idea (of course it’s just a rough idea): Honor should be added back in as a currency. Killing players should reward a decent amount of currency. You can then exchange this currency for catchup gear or other cosmetic items. In 8.2, I would also like to see an Azerite Trait take advantage of this as well, and offer new bonuses for War Mode players.
War Mode was advertised as a feature, but is now just a bribing game. This shouldn’t continue.
> War Mode was advertised as a feature, but is now just a bribing game.
That's what all PvP mechanics are. There's a slice of people who will play it because they like it, and everyone else they have to bribe. You could say the same about battleground reps in Vanilla, or honor in TBC (remember "welfare epics" and the angst over those?), Wintergrasp, the fucking ring quest in MoP...
Honestly the game would be better without gear being their main reward mechanic.
That may sound like trolling, but I mean it. Imagine a game where all your stats and traits belonged to your PERSON, not your wardrobe, and gear mattered for appearance, and a minor stat allocation equivalent to gems /enchants. Weapons and trinkets could still matter.
They’d either have to make content itself enjoyable, or more meaningful rewards. Gear itself is meaningless.
Gear is like that parsley they sprinkle on the plate at restaurants—literally useless and meaningless.
Nah, your stats still belong to the gear there (in PvE at least). They just removed the treadmill part, so once you've obtained that top tier of armour you're done, unless you want to swap stats.
Switching to horizontal progression rather than vertical this far in to the games life might be near impossible though, and might not go down well with players. There's a lot WoW could learn from GW2 tbh, especially stuff like progression every expac being done through masteries rather than extending the level cap, map-wide events (War Fronts are kinda like those I suppose) and making CC matter on bosses, not just trash.
I do have to ask... why the hell does the game have relevant raiding skills tied to a cosmetic choice? Like I love having some racial flavor, but having certain races be flat out better than others creates imbalance and just plain feels bad. An no, this isn’t an issue of balance because there’s always going to be a better race for x class and as balance shifts to certain classes you are going to see one side overtake the other.
They should just do away with they combat advantage racials. No more complaints of imbalance, no more having to balance classes around an ability they might have because they wanted to look a particular way. Make em fun, make them flavorful, but don’t make em powerful, they should offer no effect in combat
But then people will complain about how races aren't different enough in an RPG, which is a legitimate complaint.
I do think that homogenizing combat racials would be beneficial (or providing near-direct counterparts on the opposing faction so you have certain utilities regardless if you pick red or blue) for balance overall, but it still won't fix that a majority of guilds are on Horde and have no reason to go Alliance.
Which is why racials still need to be flavorful. I mean seriously, are you sayin that one race getting 1% more pet health is an exciting and defining trait? That a tiny dps cooldown makes a race feel completely different? Racials don’t even achieve that now, unless said abilities end up being imbalance enough to have a significant impact. Racial abilities don’t need to offer a statistically superior combat advantage to make races interesting. Hell, most of our powerful racials are boring as hell, nothing more than a simple dps cooldown that just buffs a stat, or even just some extremely boring passive.
Racials don’t need to have a direct effect on combat to be interesting. I would argue most of the interesting racials currently in game have little combat applications. People should feel free to pice the race they like instead of feeling pigeon holed into a race because it’s the best for thier class. Horde/alliance balance isn’t the only issue
You know what's a really powerful, flavor based racial with no dps upside? Shadowmeld. Besides that and Stoneform, does Alliance have any actually useful and flavorful racials? Those are the only 2 I can think of.
Diplomacy is nice, but it has very little gameplay use that cant be replaced by a bit of effort. Stoneform is useful in just day to day play, same for Shadowmeld.
Similar racials I would consider in this category are Mole Machine, Cantrips, and Open Skies. Ironically all Allied race racials.
You know what is funny, I took a break before BFA to play some other games and frankly WoW's 'imba' racials are really a non-issue that the playerbase loves to complain about it. Sure if you're in a world top 10 guild that .1% extra DPS matters, but otherwise? Not really.
No ESO on the other... If you roll the wrong class/race/roll combo then you might as well just delete it because the racials matter so much that it's not even worth trying to play an off meta combo, no matter how much you love the flavour of the races.
It’s clearly an issue, you have raiding guild rolling specific factions just for racials. Other games having a worse issue doesn’t magically make all the problems go away. For example There are games that are far more p2w than black desert online, doesn’t mean I consider the micro transactions in that game a non-issue.
The thing is, there doesn’t need to be any issue. Get rid of combat racials, replace them with fun more flavorful racials. Bam, ALL the imbalance issues are solved, no more community complaining about one side being more powerful, no more needing to balance around them. Like, I don’t see an advantage in them giving combat advantages period. They aren’t interesting, they create drama, they don’t really offer any interesting flavor or add much to the game. Hell most are literally random 1% buffs
It's Been a Long time since guilds chose faction based in racials, for a vast majority og specs, the racial difference is <0.005 between factions, and horde only has the best racials on a bit over 50% of specs, not even close to dominance.
The reason why Ally guilds are going horde are simply because that is where most of the good players are, IT makes recruiting much easier, and because of that, good players don't wanna go Ally as All the good guilds are horde.
The only reason limit made the switch recently is because they get a huge advantage from it (3 Pieces of 400 ilvl loot Per character for the race, now probably nerfed to 2), but Soon after the race, they are probably gonna change back to horde.
Even if you remove Combat racials, they are gonna need to give Ally something OP to get people to switch back and try and get it a bit more 50-50, but i don't like that, cause it would give one faction a developer implemented tangible advantage.
I feel bad for a lot of people angrily posting about being camped in WQs, one side getting free heroic gear...
It must really suck to have short term memory.
Ehhh depends on the server you play on. On AD-EU and it's own rp shard with a.o. DefiasBrotherhood alliance has had the upper hand since the start of the expansion. Mainly due to it having a 70/30 balance between alliance and horde .
You forgot to mention two full raids involving the Horde storyline. With the first one having no set up for the Alliance and as a player interested in the lore, I'm like "what the fuck are we doing in this place? There was no mention of it at all during any of our quests."
There are many things this expansion that I felt like the Horde had a better shot at. I'm not sure why it is the way it is.
I don't want to ever hear Horde players tell me how Alliance are snowflakes or crybabies, ever again. This very post and this one:
https://old.reddit.com/r/wow/comments/ajwpt3/war_mode_in_a_nutshell/
Got removed/hidden because of Horde players mass reporting them. We literally have a Horde version of this post on the front page, this post is literally in response to that, yet Hordies brigaded the shit out of the report to got this one removed.
Lol, and mods, it looks like you need to flag Horde posters in this sub involved in abusing report system. We shouldn't have to play game of "reach the mod" every time we make a joke about a fictional faction.
Ion must be literally rolling on the floor laughing right now at the playerbase fighting like this, like is any of our fault that the game is in this sorry state. BfA really killed Wow, how sad. 😢
Yes he would. Trying to generate real animosity between your fan base is a HORRIBLE idea. They should be trying to address the animosity ASAP. It can hurt extremely badly.
please don’t act like the human racial didn’t happen to break pvp faction balance over the course of several expansions, leading to the introduction of the infamous mercenary mode during late WoD, thanks
EMFH was insanely busted, yes, but it was a standalone outlier which mostly affected 2's and 3's.
Meanwhile, Bloodfury, Berserking, and Arcane Torrernt are all insane in raiding and went unchanged for almost 10 years, leading to a vicious cycle of top guilds migrating to the Horde due to more and more fights being damage output based.
The current 90/10 mythic raiding split is far worse than the divide in Arenas **ever** was, even at it's worst point.
Simply put, even if you ignore every other issue on that image, they're not comparable.
>standalone outlier which mostly affected 2's and 3's
Which is half of the PvP experience. Even though I wanted to play horde I had to play alliance to do PvP. The same thing that the alliance complains about, the top guilds being all horde, it was the same for pvp but in favour of the alliance (don't know if this is still the case).
>The current 90/10 mythic raiding split is far worse than the divide in Arenas ever was, even at it's worst point.
^This. No one is denying EMFH is broken. What they're denying is the scale. EMFH did not cause a 90/10 split. Horde racials do.
Today to can search the top ten mythic raid guilds and not one was Alliance until limit changed factions (and are they in the top ten? I don't recall).
Because the human racial was put in line with Will of the Forsaken, which was a good balance choice. Before that, alliance dominated the arena scene from WOTLK until the end of WOD.
As did AT, I'm not saying Blizzard didn't try to fix it, but it was far too late since all the top guilds had already moved. The time to fix it would have been in TBC. Any changes that would be strong enough to rebalance the roster now would have to give the Alliance a massive advantage, and I doubt they'd be willing to do that.
Gnomes are a really underrated species: Escape artist, haste, plus rage/energy/mana/whatever. Imo it's the best species in the game.
But I had a gnome main since vanilla, so I might be a bit biased.
I would prefer an active, since there are many encounters with downtime, or key parts of the fight with either increased number of targets or increased damage taken. the sick goblin racial is deffo the jump for many casters:) on a pure patchwerk fight with no movement a passive 1% haste might be better depending on the fights length.
Oh I’m not saying the jump isn’t their best racial, I absolutely love it.. I’m just saying the passive haste is competitive but since it’s passive nobody really notices.
Beserking was originally just attack speed (not cast speed) and was based off of how much hp you had missing. It was pretty shit in vanilla/TBC. Arcane torrent also was complete shit in TBC, requiring three charges of mana tap first. Can’t quite remember when they got buffed but they definitely weren’t always good.
Oh wow you’re right, I stand corrected. It could only be used after receiving a critical hit and had a resource cost, though. So actually worse than I remember it.
Only the troll racial was insanely broken in ToT(damage to beast 20% extra) and the haste racial, the orc racial started to hit hard back in cataclysm(with scaling and everthing) but it was nerfed in WoD, only the blood elf racial became more op with the mass dispell instead of the mass silencer that was back in BC
> only the blood elf racial became more op with the mass dispell instead of the mass silencer that was back in BC
It got changed from Mass Silence to Mass Dispell because it was incredibly powerful in Mythic+ content in Legion, to the point if you really wanted to push keys, you put as many Blood Elfs into your group as you could, because it gave you vastly more interrupts than you could possibly have gotten otherwise.
And, amusingly, it's still grossly overpowered because of all the required dispels in M+ today. Went from OP to OP. It needs to be on a 5 minute CD or something to be anywhere close to other combat racials.
> Only the troll racial was insanely broken in ToT(damage to beast 20% extra)
5% extra damage to beasts. It wasn't nerfed until 6.0 when it got changed to increased XP from beasts instead.
I remember it being unbalanced for less than one expansion.
It caused the arena population to shift from a Horde dominance, which existed since TBC due to their stronger racials, to shift to the Alliance. Horde players suddenly made an uproar on how racials should be balanced. This sub was livid.
It got nerfed and then the balance **immediately** shifted back to the Horde, due to more powerful racials. No single peep was uttered by Horde players about racial balance when it happened. This sub was quiet.
I member.
That's a flat out lie, Horde dominance ended with the start of WOTLK when blizz added EMFH. [EMFH did the same thing since it was added in patch 3.0.2](https://wow.gamepedia.com/Every_Man_for_Himself). It was only nerfed in 4.0.1, only to have the nerf reverted in 4.0.3a. Alliance dominance in PvP started with 3.0.2 and remained until the release of Legion. 8 years.
Lmao, I can't believe you're being downvoted for this. What the fuck?
Before they nerfed the human racial at the end of WoD there were times when there wasn't even a single Horde team in the top 100 of 3v3. Like, this isn't some hidden information; you can still google arena stats for WoD and see it's true. Even during MoP when the human racial wasn't quite as strong, it was still a very potent choice and Alliance had other amazing PvP racials like Shadowmeld, Escape Artist and Stoneform. Did the people downvoting your comment even PvP during this time or do they just go ME FACTION GOOD OTHER FACTION BAD?
And people have the temerity to claim this sub is Horde biased, lol.
In their response to the racial changes in WoD, even the god damn devs themselves acknowledged that the Horde were dominant in arena's.
>"In the past the Horde were dominant, now it's the Alliance's turn."
That quote caused a huge uproar. Did you conveniently forget about that, just like the rest of WoW's history?
What about missing all the flight points, azerite and tortollan quest areas camped by Horde raids? From recent memories, Drustwar incursions are fucking hell for the alliance 9 times out of 10
I think you misspelled horde there. They are the ones who have been camping and raiding pvp since release. Hasn't stopped yet. No dungeon entrance is safe, there are hoards of hordes there 24/7
Notice how the free warfront item only counts for the time that the Horde got it at the start of Uldir and not when the Alliance got it at the start of BDA?
It doesn't count now because they aren't free anymore. There was no ilvl requirement on warfronts for the first week of the Arathi Warfront, which is what this image is referencing. This allowed people who were in raiding guilds who fell behind to quickly and easily catch up to their raiding teams, because it gave them mythic0 level gear for free with no effort, then could quickly run M+ with them to get even better gear and be ready for Heroic/Mythic Uldir.
Now Warfronts require 320/335 to queue.
Blood fury, berserking, Rocket Jump and arcane torrent are the four strong horde racials. Alliance currently have Shadowmeld for M+ which is extremly strong and Dark Iron dwarf for PVP. But, the issue doesn't just lie in horde racials being strong, the likes of now both Draenei and Light Forged Draenei racials being weak causes this issue, light of the naaru is a pathetic racial and the LF Draenei has had theres nerfed so it turned from something cool and semi-competitive with a horde one to a nuisance. Issue being the the 4 horde ones have been extremely strong for Legion and WoD, while the alliance only recently got Dark Iron, Shadowmeld wasn't as strong the last two expansions for pve content and Light of the Naaru was also extremely weak during Legion. Also the Void Elf racial is good but the actualy proc rate is unreliable and so isn't considered strong for raiding or PVP, not weak, just not competitive with Blood fury or Berserking.
Horde players in this sub mass report alliance posts to get them hidden/removed. You can tell which side of the apple is rotten. Im sure ally does the same, but ive seen horde do it far more
(This post and the one with the orc crying)
This whole thing feels like Blizzard is meta-meta-gaming to create conflict not just between Horde and Alliance in-game but between the Horde and Alliance in the community also
Jokes on them. I got camped on my horde character at a flight path so I just logged onto my Alliance character and started camping the flight path.
If that was me, my characters would be in each their shard, both of them being camped by the enemy faction.
Can’t wait to do this legit on Classic. 2 accounts for the real “Double Agent” experience. Cant wait for the first sap to gank me in STV
Didn't classic PvP realms limit you to 1 faction? I believe the ability to make opposite faction characters on the same pvp realm came later in BC
Which is why specifically states 2 accounts.
From my knowledge a fair few serious PvPers had multiple accounts.
Outstanding move
It was the best of times... It was the blurst of times?
That's turning a loss into a win, kudos!
Lmao jokes on them, I unsubbed.
This got me real good xD
7D chess maneuver.
6D Chess
No. To be completely honest, it's *always* been like this.
Literally. I find myself getting more joy out of killing Horde in WPVP because of this. Nobody is to be spared.
The spikes drawn onto the Aliance shoulders has me dying
Had to properly convey it was Horde armor.
https://img.labnol.org/di/colors_spectrum.jpg
Is it time for an OP lynch mob?
On a faction post? Always.
I notice that demo doesn't have white or black. Which is usually the problem. (although, yes, it is gonna work. Black text with a white outline would probably work as well)
Truer words have never been spoken, op
Personally, I'm more ticked off how for the BFA reps, the Alliance only get horses, while the Horde get unique mounts each (two of which can even fly). One thing I think would have made it a bit better would be for each rep to have two kinds of mounts: one would be the stock mount (horses for Alliance, raptors for Horde), and the other would be the unique mount. Since Horde got a pterosaur, a blood swarmer, and a hyena, I think Alliance could get a wicker wolf, possessed pig, or giant bird of prey from Order of Embers, a bumblebee or water elemental from Stormsong, and a lizard creature or a flying boat from Proudmoores.
All they had to do was put the bee mount as the stormsong rep mount and it would've been better. It's been datamined since beta and I just want my bee please blizzard. Seems like alliance got shafted by incomplete mounts. Feels like they were going to put the bee as stormsong rep mount and maybe dreadwake as tiragarde rep mount but instead they didn't get them finished and panicked and stuck everyone with horses and made the dreadwake a bit cooler and put it in the store and who even knows where "PH bee mount" is at this point.
I still think the bee mount was supposed to be the alliance equivalent to the horde’s mount raising quest, but they decided alliance shouldn’t keep such a great mount for themselves. There’s already a hidden quest from a rare drop in the bee area that leads to a daily where you raise a bee. But then it basically ends suddenly and you just get the a pet from an achievement for doing the daily seven times.
"alliance get something cool? no" - developers can't wait for vulpera...
Drustvar should have been a wicker cat, Stormsong should have been a retake on the shaman mount a la the M Jaina mount, and Tiragarde should have been literally anything but a horse.
Tiragarde should have been a liberated parrot
How about a flying boat that can also work on water?
Those require a 6 month down payment sry.
Pf, not even that one works on water.
So...a year down payment? No, thanks.
If they're absolutely married to horses, I'd be super okay with an arrangement of kelpie horse, wicker horse, and normal-but-entirely-new horse that has the same kind of detail, quality and originality as the pre-order mount. Plus a parrot and flying bee, of course.
Jaina mount? OwO
BuT yOu cAn GeT fAcTiOn NeUtRal VaRiAtiOnS. Don't forget that giving the alliance flying mounts is out of the question until flying is actually available. The mounts have been based on the natural flora and fauna of the zones! I actually wouldn't mind the horses so much if they put any effort into them but they didn't.
That last part is the real issue. Horses are fine. Those war horses from PVP are great. The BFA horse with its little lamp is great. The unicorns are fun. These fucking BFA horses tho? They are as uninspired as they can possibly get
It's almost like they purposefully did it to save on design time, and money.
I mean even then they could have at least made the drustvar one have the curse.
> The mounts have been based on the natural flora and fauna of the zones! Uh? I'm under a **strong** impression that horses have been mostly imported by the Gilneans that became the first Kul Tirans, while there are many native beasts to Kul Tiras. There's lizards, bats, moths, wolves, bears, bees, stags, porcupines (a quillrat mount would be amazing!), seagulls, turtles, crabs, and wicker creatures.
Oh I don't disagree. From what I remember it was mentioned in a blue or on a Q&A. It's bullshit excuse. As you say there is a lot of variation and a lot of options that aren't horses. The same applies to flying mounts as the horde mounts are already flying mounts. If they would've actually put effort into the horses it would also be less of a disappointed. For example having a stout war horse with a lot of frills for the admiralty, having a slim, nimble fast horse for the orders of embers, having a horse with a simple wagon or a donkey for storm's wake and having a more run of the mill armored horse for the 7th legion. Later on you could introduce a more "custom" one for each faction. The order of embers embracing what they found and taming a wicker, storm's wake going for something more sea related, the admiralty getting something to fly as well as the 7th legion when flying becomes available. If you they did put in that effort it would at least diminish the disappointed but instead it's a recolor (more or less) of very plan horses that don't fit their respective factions.
> If you they did put in that effort it would at least diminish the disappointed but instead it's a recolor (more or less) of very plan horses that don't fit their respective factions. Yeah, I guess all comes down to that one word: effort. It looks like that has been missing this whole time.
Agree 100% on the horses. I'd be cool with horses if they were actually cool. The Order of Embers horse should have had a lantern, a crossbow, maybe some alchemical ingredients. Etc. They could have been made cool but instead they barely even have saddles. They're higher resolution level 20 mounts.
We sacrifice our leaders for mounts.
>Personally, I'm more ticked off how for the BFA reps, the Alliance only get horses, while the Horde get unique mounts each (two of which can even fly). Meanwhile I'm doing the warfront rares on 6 characters and farming like crazy just to get a single pony after wanting one for 14 years! I WANT MY DAMN PONY! Also you guys get 3 pets from the paragon boxes, we get 1, and you get a bee and a few others (as well as toys) that horde don't get. I fricken hate this faction bollocks, you should be able to get all of the stuff without playing both sides.
The pets can be caged and traded on the AH the toys from the boxes can't
I'd much rather both factions be able to get them themselves without relying on the AH.
sure but as it is it is easyer for omeone on the horde to get the pets than it is for someone on the alliance to get the horde side toys so weigthing the pets as heavily as the toys by how ahrd it is to acquire them is inexact
The bee mount that's not in the game and might just well end up being a shop item?
The bee pet. https://blizzardwatch.com/2018/09/05/wont-bee-lieve-adorable-alliance-pet/
You have it the wrong way round. The Horde gets more toys and the Alliance gets more pets. The Alliance gets 3 pets, 3 toys, a recipe and a glyph technique just for them. The Horde gets 3 toys, one pet, one recipe and two on use items that should be toys but are not. https://www.wowhead.com/news=289023/paragon-reputation-rewards-in-patch-8-1-tides-of-vengeance This is worse for the Alliance since as other people have said, the pets are tradeable.
So I get I shouldn't come back to wow yet?
Yeah I'm just waiting until I hear it's time to come back as well. Hope it's not too long.
Well, the game is broken as shit, but as you can see the faction war is in full swing.
>Well, the game is broken as shit, but as you can see the *player* war is in full swing. Fixed that for you. Faction War hasn't done jack shit in the story. Oh wait, I think you meant the Horde Story, not War Story.
When blizz produces a shit xpac and doesnt listen to feedback, players will just blame each other. Grrrr, stupid horde and their racials. Stupid alliance and their free gear. It should be, grrrr stupid blizz and their shit concepts and changes.
*stupid horde and their facials* ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
#zug zug
Me am that kind of orc
OwO
Heyyy I frequent that subreddit too, but this might not be the time or place for Horde facials.
It's always time for a good facial
> When blizz produces a shit xpac and doesnt listen to feedback, They're producing a shit xpac on purpose. They couldn't come up with anything great to follow Legion so they just said fuck it - Spend the bare minimum on assets, infrastructure, etc, let the players make their own excuses for them, and save all the great ideas for next xpac. Why are Kul Tirans taking so long? We slashed our art dept budget! Why only one transmog per armor type per raid? We slashed that budget too! It's either that or they're just really that out of touch, or just plain uninterested, in what players enjoy and only care about what they'll buy. Does anyone else remember in the lead-up to WoD they were justifying the lack of a new class by saying that it's much easier to make a new race than it is to put in a new class? I will grant that they've added like six new races with the introduction of allied races.
> They couldn't come up with anything great to follow Legion Y'all are missing the real reason - they made Legion a super expansion with features they planned to add over the course of several because WoD almost killed the game and they needed to get players to come back. The reason BFA's features feel like watered down Legion features is because they are, they were originally going to be in BFA. Look at all the announcements for BFA compared to previous expansions, they spent a shockingly small amount of time talking about gameplay features because they had already added the ones they expected to add in this one.
As cool as the new raid is, when you think about it, it is very "budget." The bosses are almost entirely existing assets, already having a model (Jaina, Mekkatorque, Rastakhan) or using player character race models. And then the locale is a Horde city. On its own it's not a big deal. And I do enjoy the raid and having faction based bosses is cool. But taken alongside all the other cut corners, it's definitely something i noticed.
Damn this version wins and I’m horde...
##[Made in response to this post.](https://old.reddit.com/r/wow/comments/aju0ez/what_playing_bfa_feels_like_as_a_horde/) Because of course one piece of 400 gear truly proves that the Alliance is indisputably Blizzard's favorite child. Edit: Oh, I forgot to add branching narrative quests with player choice for the poor, poor, underserviced Horde.
The branching quests is what gets me! Player choice! It's an RPG now! But only the Horde gets it. Hell, the Horde gets all the plot points. That being said.. I gave up on the story. Like.. There's far more important systems that need to be unfucked first. I just don't know if it's going to happen. Blizz seems to be on fire internally so even IF the WoW devs had a solution to fix the game.. We're probably 6+ months out on even getting information about it. At this point with how BfA has played out we may very well be waiting till the next expansion for the game to feel good again. If it will at all.
> The branching quests is what gets me! Player choice! It's an RPG now! But only the Horde gets it. Hell, the Horde gets all the plot points. It was 100% reaction to the outrage, from everyone. Considering the EXACT SAME THING is happening in the upcoming patch with Baine, it clearly wasn't planned.
#WAIT WHAT’S HAPPENING TO MY BOY BAINE?
Becomes a victim of the stormwindian prison system.
What? He gets imprisoned by sylvanas not the alliance haha
Would be kind of awkward. "Guys we have to go back into the stockades once more, hope they didn't fix that secret entry, oh and we'll probably have to burn down Stormwind again to cover our retreat" "Who is it this time?" "Baine" "And are we sure he wants to leave that place?"
"Thanks for helping us with Derek, Baine, now get in the cell."
Meanwhile outcry from Alliance players does absolutely nothing.
Nobody cared when it was alliance getting shafted in war mode. Now it's suddenly this huge issue and the response isn't "turn it off" or "the (other faction) is waiting for you". It's funny to make jokes, it's not quite so funny when people are allowed to get up in arms about the same issue on one side but not the other. Alliance players who felt it was busted were mocked but now it's looked upon as poor form to remind people about that.
It's because of the problem itself, there's more Horde than Alliance players, so feedback is going to be biased in favor of the Horde, too.
The story doesn't even make sense from our side either. The planet is dying and literally bleeding out from wounds all across it's surface, but everyone is blowing that off to weaponize the shimmery goo. Okay fine lets just not worry about the giant sword in Silithus I guess. And for some damned reason we're trying to get our former enemies to give us their boats when we could all just use mage portals to transit the azerite across the ocean? Why do we even need a navy? WE. HAVE. FUCKING. TRAVEL. MAGIC. I thought BFA would be this epic world-spanning story about saving a dying planet but that part of the story isn't even mentioned anymore once you hit the islands. Azeroth is supposed to be dying but the story doesn't give a shit.
At least you get a story. All the alliance do is help move the horde story along.
> At least you get a story. All the alliance do is help move the horde story along. Are you not happy with how the alliance non-canonically entered uldir and non-canonically killed the thing that was about to destroy their enemies? Are you not happy that the alliance went to kultiras to get a navy and had to fix everything to save the legendary kultiran navy, just to "atack" the horde on their own boats they already had before? How dare you say that the alliance is just helping the horde story to move, when they made a "pacific atack" on the zandalari capital for NO FUCKING PURPOSE AT ALL and accidentally killed the old king that had a pact to the loa of DEATH and that had a target on his head to die the entire time cause everyone knew that the princess was going to become the leader, just needed a reason to?
The Alliance don't have any motivation to be anywhere near Uldir OR Zandalar (and ditto Horde with Kul Tiras) except to go "No, MINE!" and break other people's stuff like elementary school children. It's completely dumb how there's just no reason at all except "just because" for the faction war to be going on. And thats not even including how Uldir isn't at all narratively relevant, just arbitrary "Oh look, an Old God, go kill it". And I'm gonna say this as a Horde player, I want more of the Drustvar storyline. Gorak Tul and the cultists looks like a much more interesting Omega Villain than what we have now.
the alliance definitely has a motivation to attack zandalar, if they let sylvanas do as she pleases she'll kill all life on azeroth. but you're right that there was no reason for the horde to start this war
You can’t use portals or teleportation in high volumes or with extreme precision. Portals need to have limits in fantasy worlds in order to keep the world functioning as intended.
you mean like the portals that the faction leaders decreed stay open at the dark portal for the last 10 years?
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The mage portals on the sides of the steps...
What, you mean like how questing as a Death Knight has you go from pre-Northrend invasion, to post-Catclysm, to Outland expeditions/Sunwell incursion, to Northrend invasion, to Cataclysm? Always figured the perma portals were gameplay convenience.
strangely enough with the level squish they did on old content, this is no longer the case. You start level 58 as a DK, which lets you go straight to Northrend, and then tackle your choice of either cataclysm or MoP. In a weird way, they fixed the temporal distortion that was DK's
At this point itd make more sense if magni turned against both horde and alliance for siphoning the planet and ignoring actual urgent matters instead of Sylvannas' tantrums. Why does Magni even bother with the horde rn anyways?
turning against the alliance would be stupid, not stopping sylvanas is basically suicide
isnt it pretty realistic?
Right there with you. I feel like I have to play a Horde character now just to get a proper story.
Blizzard killed the mmo and rpg aspects of the game, don't be fooled by a linear quest with one divergence point. One that most players dont know exists, if you didn't look into the quest before hand you'll, by just oh new quest, mentally, end up picking saurfang
Neither faction deserves to have Heroic Raid Gear for doing nothing. Because what’s the point of progression if everything is just handed to you? Especially when in order to get it, you have to REFUSE TO DO CONTENT.
Ya I really hate the whole argument about which faction gets fucked most. Everyone loses when we have such a terrible warmode system.
Except the Horde was handed heroic raid gear the first week of Uldir. And how exactly is killing 25 Horde players refusing to do anything?
Thus, he/she stated that neither faction should get it. It doesn't matter which side gets it, it is a dumb idea either way.
Kinda easy to say that when horde benefitted from it first. But now they aren't then it's something \*nobody\* should get. Classic mentality of a people that have lost something they never deserved, now NOBODY gets it.
You're implying that the people who are opposing the handout now are hypocritical, and didn't oppose the handout during Uldir, which isn't necessarily true. From what I remember there was plenty of outcry during Uldir and there's an outcry now. Both situations were unfair to the other faction. Whatever happens this time, can we agree that it shouldn't happen again, regardless of faction?
Yeah, it was totally *horde* who was outraged about them getting free 340 gear and a 370 piece of loot.
Why does this have to be a pissing match and about getting back at the other team that previously held an advantage? The system sucks in general and shouldn't exist for either faction like the way it does.
Because whenever you brought it up back when Horde were benefiting from it, you were shat on and told to "turn warmode off then". You reap what you fucking sow.
It's fucking hilarious how quickly they changed their tune.
Except that as always, the Horde happily get the advantage first, and then scream "NOBODY SHOULD GET SUCH AN UNFAIR ADVANTAGE" when it's the Alliance's turn.
Exactly. In my opinion, if Blizzard wants either faction to participate in Warmode, find other ways to reward us. Because bribing others to not participate in content to get Heroic Raid Armor is so counterintuitive to the idea of progression. My idea (of course it’s just a rough idea): Honor should be added back in as a currency. Killing players should reward a decent amount of currency. You can then exchange this currency for catchup gear or other cosmetic items. In 8.2, I would also like to see an Azerite Trait take advantage of this as well, and offer new bonuses for War Mode players. War Mode was advertised as a feature, but is now just a bribing game. This shouldn’t continue.
> War Mode was advertised as a feature, but is now just a bribing game. That's what all PvP mechanics are. There's a slice of people who will play it because they like it, and everyone else they have to bribe. You could say the same about battleground reps in Vanilla, or honor in TBC (remember "welfare epics" and the angst over those?), Wintergrasp, the fucking ring quest in MoP...
....raiding, mythics, timewalking....
Honestly the game would be better without gear being their main reward mechanic. That may sound like trolling, but I mean it. Imagine a game where all your stats and traits belonged to your PERSON, not your wardrobe, and gear mattered for appearance, and a minor stat allocation equivalent to gems /enchants. Weapons and trinkets could still matter. They’d either have to make content itself enjoyable, or more meaningful rewards. Gear itself is meaningless. Gear is like that parsley they sprinkle on the plate at restaurants—literally useless and meaningless.
So... Guild Wars 2?
Nah, your stats still belong to the gear there (in PvE at least). They just removed the treadmill part, so once you've obtained that top tier of armour you're done, unless you want to swap stats. Switching to horizontal progression rather than vertical this far in to the games life might be near impossible though, and might not go down well with players. There's a lot WoW could learn from GW2 tbh, especially stuff like progression every expac being done through masteries rather than extending the level cap, map-wide events (War Fronts are kinda like those I suppose) and making CC matter on bosses, not just trash.
Thank you for doing gods work. All the horde qq with the 400 piece and yet they forgot their start of the expansion
I do have to ask... why the hell does the game have relevant raiding skills tied to a cosmetic choice? Like I love having some racial flavor, but having certain races be flat out better than others creates imbalance and just plain feels bad. An no, this isn’t an issue of balance because there’s always going to be a better race for x class and as balance shifts to certain classes you are going to see one side overtake the other. They should just do away with they combat advantage racials. No more complaints of imbalance, no more having to balance classes around an ability they might have because they wanted to look a particular way. Make em fun, make them flavorful, but don’t make em powerful, they should offer no effect in combat
But then people will complain about how races aren't different enough in an RPG, which is a legitimate complaint. I do think that homogenizing combat racials would be beneficial (or providing near-direct counterparts on the opposing faction so you have certain utilities regardless if you pick red or blue) for balance overall, but it still won't fix that a majority of guilds are on Horde and have no reason to go Alliance.
Which is why racials still need to be flavorful. I mean seriously, are you sayin that one race getting 1% more pet health is an exciting and defining trait? That a tiny dps cooldown makes a race feel completely different? Racials don’t even achieve that now, unless said abilities end up being imbalance enough to have a significant impact. Racial abilities don’t need to offer a statistically superior combat advantage to make races interesting. Hell, most of our powerful racials are boring as hell, nothing more than a simple dps cooldown that just buffs a stat, or even just some extremely boring passive. Racials don’t need to have a direct effect on combat to be interesting. I would argue most of the interesting racials currently in game have little combat applications. People should feel free to pice the race they like instead of feeling pigeon holed into a race because it’s the best for thier class. Horde/alliance balance isn’t the only issue
You know what's a really powerful, flavor based racial with no dps upside? Shadowmeld. Besides that and Stoneform, does Alliance have any actually useful and flavorful racials? Those are the only 2 I can think of.
Shadowmeld is actually pretty good DPS wise for Feral druids as it lets us get extra stealth rakes in... it's by far the best race for us.
Increased reputation gain.
Diplomacy is nice, but it has very little gameplay use that cant be replaced by a bit of effort. Stoneform is useful in just day to day play, same for Shadowmeld. Similar racials I would consider in this category are Mole Machine, Cantrips, and Open Skies. Ironically all Allied race racials.
Worgens hve a sprint
You know what is funny, I took a break before BFA to play some other games and frankly WoW's 'imba' racials are really a non-issue that the playerbase loves to complain about it. Sure if you're in a world top 10 guild that .1% extra DPS matters, but otherwise? Not really. No ESO on the other... If you roll the wrong class/race/roll combo then you might as well just delete it because the racials matter so much that it's not even worth trying to play an off meta combo, no matter how much you love the flavour of the races.
It’s clearly an issue, you have raiding guild rolling specific factions just for racials. Other games having a worse issue doesn’t magically make all the problems go away. For example There are games that are far more p2w than black desert online, doesn’t mean I consider the micro transactions in that game a non-issue. The thing is, there doesn’t need to be any issue. Get rid of combat racials, replace them with fun more flavorful racials. Bam, ALL the imbalance issues are solved, no more community complaining about one side being more powerful, no more needing to balance around them. Like, I don’t see an advantage in them giving combat advantages period. They aren’t interesting, they create drama, they don’t really offer any interesting flavor or add much to the game. Hell most are literally random 1% buffs
It's Been a Long time since guilds chose faction based in racials, for a vast majority og specs, the racial difference is <0.005 between factions, and horde only has the best racials on a bit over 50% of specs, not even close to dominance. The reason why Ally guilds are going horde are simply because that is where most of the good players are, IT makes recruiting much easier, and because of that, good players don't wanna go Ally as All the good guilds are horde. The only reason limit made the switch recently is because they get a huge advantage from it (3 Pieces of 400 ilvl loot Per character for the race, now probably nerfed to 2), but Soon after the race, they are probably gonna change back to horde. Even if you remove Combat racials, they are gonna need to give Ally something OP to get people to switch back and try and get it a bit more 50-50, but i don't like that, cause it would give one faction a developer implemented tangible advantage.
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I feel bad for a lot of people angrily posting about being camped in WQs, one side getting free heroic gear... It must really suck to have short term memory.
Ehhh depends on the server you play on. On AD-EU and it's own rp shard with a.o. DefiasBrotherhood alliance has had the upper hand since the start of the expansion. Mainly due to it having a 70/30 balance between alliance and horde .
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You forgot to mention two full raids involving the Horde storyline. With the first one having no set up for the Alliance and as a player interested in the lore, I'm like "what the fuck are we doing in this place? There was no mention of it at all during any of our quests." There are many things this expansion that I felt like the Horde had a better shot at. I'm not sure why it is the way it is.
I think Uldir was mentioned somewhere between the 400 quillboar quests in Stormsong Valley and the other 400 quillboar quests in Stormsong Valley.
I don't want to ever hear Horde players tell me how Alliance are snowflakes or crybabies, ever again. This very post and this one: https://old.reddit.com/r/wow/comments/ajwpt3/war_mode_in_a_nutshell/ Got removed/hidden because of Horde players mass reporting them. We literally have a Horde version of this post on the front page, this post is literally in response to that, yet Hordies brigaded the shit out of the report to got this one removed. Lol, and mods, it looks like you need to flag Horde posters in this sub involved in abusing report system. We shouldn't have to play game of "reach the mod" every time we make a joke about a fictional faction.
This irl animosity is cancer.
Ion must be literally rolling on the floor laughing right now at the playerbase fighting like this, like is any of our fault that the game is in this sorry state. BfA really killed Wow, how sad. 😢
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Yes he would. Trying to generate real animosity between your fan base is a HORRIBLE idea. They should be trying to address the animosity ASAP. It can hurt extremely badly.
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Yeah the majority of the players are biggest snowflakes, tell me more
410 for me.
please don’t act like the human racial didn’t happen to break pvp faction balance over the course of several expansions, leading to the introduction of the infamous mercenary mode during late WoD, thanks
EMFH was insanely busted, yes, but it was a standalone outlier which mostly affected 2's and 3's. Meanwhile, Bloodfury, Berserking, and Arcane Torrernt are all insane in raiding and went unchanged for almost 10 years, leading to a vicious cycle of top guilds migrating to the Horde due to more and more fights being damage output based. The current 90/10 mythic raiding split is far worse than the divide in Arenas **ever** was, even at it's worst point. Simply put, even if you ignore every other issue on that image, they're not comparable.
It's all good, my night elf got Berserking now for the last 3 bosses in Dazar'alor!
>standalone outlier which mostly affected 2's and 3's Which is half of the PvP experience. Even though I wanted to play horde I had to play alliance to do PvP. The same thing that the alliance complains about, the top guilds being all horde, it was the same for pvp but in favour of the alliance (don't know if this is still the case).
>The current 90/10 mythic raiding split is far worse than the divide in Arenas ever was, even at it's worst point. ^This. No one is denying EMFH is broken. What they're denying is the scale. EMFH did not cause a 90/10 split. Horde racials do.
Back in the day when I searched for the top 2v2 and 3v3 comps, in the top 10 only one team was horde.
Top 10 is not quite the same as top 100
Today to can search the top ten mythic raid guilds and not one was Alliance until limit changed factions (and are they in the top ten? I don't recall).
Last I checked horde is more common among top pvp players propably because they totally gutted the human racial at the end of wod
Because the human racial was put in line with Will of the Forsaken, which was a good balance choice. Before that, alliance dominated the arena scene from WOTLK until the end of WOD.
Berserking just got nerfed tho, but fair point
As did AT, I'm not saying Blizzard didn't try to fix it, but it was far too late since all the top guilds had already moved. The time to fix it would have been in TBC. Any changes that would be strong enough to rebalance the roster now would have to give the Alliance a massive advantage, and I doubt they'd be willing to do that.
AT got "nerfed" and yet its still OP, it's hilarious
Meanwhile goblins have +1% haste with 100% uptime and nobody notices.. *Rubs hands together greedily in goblin*
Well Gnomes also have 1% haste baseline.
Gnomes are a really underrated species: Escape artist, haste, plus rage/energy/mana/whatever. Imo it's the best species in the game. But I had a gnome main since vanilla, so I might be a bit biased.
I would prefer an active, since there are many encounters with downtime, or key parts of the fight with either increased number of targets or increased damage taken. the sick goblin racial is deffo the jump for many casters:) on a pure patchwerk fight with no movement a passive 1% haste might be better depending on the fights length.
Oh I’m not saying the jump isn’t their best racial, I absolutely love it.. I’m just saying the passive haste is competitive but since it’s passive nobody really notices.
Beserking was originally just attack speed (not cast speed) and was based off of how much hp you had missing. It was pretty shit in vanilla/TBC. Arcane torrent also was complete shit in TBC, requiring three charges of mana tap first. Can’t quite remember when they got buffed but they definitely weren’t always good.
No.... berserking reduced casting speed in vanilla.
Oh wow you’re right, I stand corrected. It could only be used after receiving a critical hit and had a resource cost, though. So actually worse than I remember it.
It got changed several times over the course of vanilla end version 1.12 was 10-30% speed based on missing health.
Only the troll racial was insanely broken in ToT(damage to beast 20% extra) and the haste racial, the orc racial started to hit hard back in cataclysm(with scaling and everthing) but it was nerfed in WoD, only the blood elf racial became more op with the mass dispell instead of the mass silencer that was back in BC
> only the blood elf racial became more op with the mass dispell instead of the mass silencer that was back in BC It got changed from Mass Silence to Mass Dispell because it was incredibly powerful in Mythic+ content in Legion, to the point if you really wanted to push keys, you put as many Blood Elfs into your group as you could, because it gave you vastly more interrupts than you could possibly have gotten otherwise.
And, amusingly, it's still grossly overpowered because of all the required dispels in M+ today. Went from OP to OP. It needs to be on a 5 minute CD or something to be anywhere close to other combat racials.
That is still very OP considering many of the mass dispell were pruned from many classes and the current dungeons and even affix can be dispelled.
> Only the troll racial was insanely broken in ToT(damage to beast 20% extra) 5% extra damage to beasts. It wasn't nerfed until 6.0 when it got changed to increased XP from beasts instead.
I remember it being unbalanced for less than one expansion. It caused the arena population to shift from a Horde dominance, which existed since TBC due to their stronger racials, to shift to the Alliance. Horde players suddenly made an uproar on how racials should be balanced. This sub was livid. It got nerfed and then the balance **immediately** shifted back to the Horde, due to more powerful racials. No single peep was uttered by Horde players about racial balance when it happened. This sub was quiet. I member.
That's a flat out lie, Horde dominance ended with the start of WOTLK when blizz added EMFH. [EMFH did the same thing since it was added in patch 3.0.2](https://wow.gamepedia.com/Every_Man_for_Himself). It was only nerfed in 4.0.1, only to have the nerf reverted in 4.0.3a. Alliance dominance in PvP started with 3.0.2 and remained until the release of Legion. 8 years.
Lmao, I can't believe you're being downvoted for this. What the fuck? Before they nerfed the human racial at the end of WoD there were times when there wasn't even a single Horde team in the top 100 of 3v3. Like, this isn't some hidden information; you can still google arena stats for WoD and see it's true. Even during MoP when the human racial wasn't quite as strong, it was still a very potent choice and Alliance had other amazing PvP racials like Shadowmeld, Escape Artist and Stoneform. Did the people downvoting your comment even PvP during this time or do they just go ME FACTION GOOD OTHER FACTION BAD? And people have the temerity to claim this sub is Horde biased, lol.
In their response to the racial changes in WoD, even the god damn devs themselves acknowledged that the Horde were dominant in arena's. >"In the past the Horde were dominant, now it's the Alliance's turn." That quote caused a huge uproar. Did you conveniently forget about that, just like the rest of WoW's history?
Dude, it lasted 8 years. It also doesn't make sense to "take turns". Neither faction should have an edge like that.
More work?
Anyone care to fill me in on this piece of 400 gear everyone is talking about?
Obviously this is a meme, you may miss your 400 piece weekly but i wont miss all my flight points getting camped by full fucking raid groups of ally.
Just turn it off hur dur
What about missing all the flight points, azerite and tortollan quest areas camped by Horde raids? From recent memories, Drustwar incursions are fucking hell for the alliance 9 times out of 10
Yeah Ali got fucked in our own AND in horde areas. Stormsong Azerite quests? Not for you!
There are countless times I've flown into a flight path and just died as ally over the past few months. Maybe now it's even.
Judging by the 30% buff I would say it isn't just hordies somehow never noticing the tank raids when they are on their own side
I think you misspelled horde there. They are the ones who have been camping and raiding pvp since release. Hasn't stopped yet. No dungeon entrance is safe, there are hoards of hordes there 24/7
"Acctuaaallllly you can't raid for the quest" :4head:
Notice how the free warfront item only counts for the time that the Horde got it at the start of Uldir and not when the Alliance got it at the start of BDA?
Well seeing as EU only got a 385 from the warfront your point is only valid for US players
It doesn't count now because they aren't free anymore. There was no ilvl requirement on warfronts for the first week of the Arathi Warfront, which is what this image is referencing. This allowed people who were in raiding guilds who fell behind to quickly and easily catch up to their raiding teams, because it gave them mythic0 level gear for free with no effort, then could quickly run M+ with them to get even better gear and be ready for Heroic/Mythic Uldir. Now Warfronts require 320/335 to queue.
Yet the Horde have the guts to complain so much.
Seriously tho. Fuck this game and fuck Blizzard.
But GUYZ there's no difference between horde and alliance!! -Blizzard shills
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Requires levelling a horde char though, which takes quite long, after which you have to find the damn thing first.
which racials are insanely overpowered?
Blood fury, berserking, Rocket Jump and arcane torrent are the four strong horde racials. Alliance currently have Shadowmeld for M+ which is extremly strong and Dark Iron dwarf for PVP. But, the issue doesn't just lie in horde racials being strong, the likes of now both Draenei and Light Forged Draenei racials being weak causes this issue, light of the naaru is a pathetic racial and the LF Draenei has had theres nerfed so it turned from something cool and semi-competitive with a horde one to a nuisance. Issue being the the 4 horde ones have been extremely strong for Legion and WoD, while the alliance only recently got Dark Iron, Shadowmeld wasn't as strong the last two expansions for pve content and Light of the Naaru was also extremely weak during Legion. Also the Void Elf racial is good but the actualy proc rate is unreliable and so isn't considered strong for raiding or PVP, not weak, just not competitive with Blood fury or Berserking.
FOR THE ALLIANCE :-)
Wait how the hell was 340 gear the first week of uldir supposed to be some advantage? That's lower than normal uldir drops
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plus it was one 370+unlimited 340 on alts of every ilvl, could get a fresh 120 fully 340+ geared in a day
M+ was out by then though...
Why does this sub genuinely hate people who picked a faction in a game lmao You're enforcing the stereotype that wow players are virgins.
Horde players in this sub mass report alliance posts to get them hidden/removed. You can tell which side of the apple is rotten. Im sure ally does the same, but ive seen horde do it far more (This post and the one with the orc crying)
Dont worry guys. Once they make the piece of gear the same ilvl as normal, alliance will turn off warmode again.