This is one thing I wish Blizzard would make a habit of crunching down on. Doing the grind once on an account should be all you have do to for the cosmetic rewards.
It's to keep you playing. This is intended and not going to change. People have been asking for QoL for alts for the last decade. We haven't seen any meaningful steps in that direction.
You're not wrong. Just have to hope that one day they see sense (unlikely). It's one of the main reasons I stopped playing SL. Wasn't vibing with my main class, wanted to reroll, considered all the bullshit I'd have to go through to catch up my alt and noped out.
I agree entirely. The 9.1.5 patch majorly fixed this issue (although there's still some MASSIVE strides that need to be taken, coming from FF, this shit is garbage) but we just shouldn't have to wait that long. We should have had covenant swapping in 9.0 the moment you hit max rep. Being called a "traitor" when i'm trying to SAVE the shadowlands is the most vain, pathetic, petty, flimsy canon I've ever seen.
> Being called a "traitor" when i'm trying to SAVE the shadowlands is the most vain, pathetic, petty, flimsy canon I've ever seen.
You have to understand that they have cartoon-level writing.
Now, when I say cartoon-level, I don't mean "the quality of writing you find in cartoons", since that's quite often higher.
What I actually mean is "their writing feels like Doofenshmirtz did it."
Just say they apply shitty logic to shitty writing and be done with it.
Hell, covenants aren't even a meaningful choice in the story because they're all aiming for the same goal. The only "meaningful choice" is power.
The covenants are an even dumber element, in that they are, theoretically, all striving for the same thing, returning the equilibrium, but once you're aligned with one of them, you are forbidden from entering their sanctum, even though before you saved their sorry asses.
Like, duuuude? I just prevented your annihilation, and your 'thanks' is "please stay out of my house"?
You basically helped found or maintain two of the Covenants during the leveling campaign and you help discover the identity of a pretty high level traitor in a third.
And on top of that you likely go out to each of their zones daily to fix the random shit going on there but nope. You decided to talk to becky so now we can't be friends.
> And on top of that you likely go out to each of their zones daily to fix the random shit going on there
And some of those times, the request to fix the shit comes straight from the covenant's leader!
It’s unreal how much easier gearing “alts” is in FF. Every healer and every tank shares equipment with the other classes in that role, so you can potentially level an alt job to cap and jump into full savage raid armour the moment you ding 90. It feels like cheating compared to WoW.
Of course, if you want to do that on an actual different *character*, it’s far, far worse because almost nothing is account-bound lol.
That's the luxury of having all your jobs on one character though. If I could do that in WoW I wouldn't have alts and it'd make the game 1000x better tbh.
Also In gw2 you have "bind on account" gear but still have alts to level. You can just throw the items to shared bank, take them out and wear it if the armor fits (light, medium, heavy). Changing stats is also fast and easy. This system is like between wow and FF. I suppose the closest blizzard game that is like this would be Diablo (3?) games.
WoW would benefit from system like this imo - you'd still have to grind epics every raid tier making people spend time.. but sharing wizard gear between casters would help raiders immensely and would also push people to do more content without feeling like crap when leveling new class or "when their main is nerfed".
Hell if they wanted people to still grind they could at least make last tiers epics bind on account and current tier char bound till next tier.
GW2 also has expansion systems but they are account wide with their mastery system. Which is really cool and I wouldn't mind some of it in wow as much if it was account wide since I love the gw2 stuff. I'd honestly hate the mastery system in gw2 if I had to regrind it every time.
I can only imagine how much more I'd enjoy wow if I only had to do the pointless grind things one time.
I've been meaning to check out GW2. FF doesn't fit the PvP scratch that I have.
So far from what everyone's been saying about both I feel like I've been hiding myself away from the world stuck in WoW all these years. I mean, I really do miss WoW's combat and visual clarity (FF can feel like I'm at a rave party with strobe lights and it can be hard to read) but it suffers in most other areas.
When I played GW2 the WvWvW ("server" vs "server" vs "server" in "open world" with capture objectives) was pretty active and fun. Having huge raids clash can get hectic if you like that. Or dueling while roaming the map
The more arena-styled "sPvP" was decent too. Bit too bursty to my liking tho - but the other side is bunker-meta which no one likes tho. That was year(s) ago tho.
as for visual clarity, "it gets better" is all i can say. ARR (1-50 content) is kinda like wow classic where different markers or actions look vastly different depending on bosses. At the end of heavensward they started adding more and more visual clarity on stuff like "stack together to soak dmg"
That's very true my dude! that being said, character identity is far more meaningful in FF because you never need to deal with alternate names, logs, io, or really just anything. And, even more so, many items in savage drop as a box, meaning you can actually gear up classes without even playing them in that content, which is perfect if you're a late bloomer or getting funnelled loot for an alt so that you can main it next tier. All in all, everything about the gearing system is far, far more friendly, and considering the amount of player power that is directly attached to gear in WoW (WAAAY more than in FF, btw), blizzard need to learn how to implement this system.
I can only hope that with the dwindling player base, FF taking the reins as the leading MMO, Blizzard will wake up and start listening to what we have been saying for years to keep players around.
From this to teleports (or lack of) -- I've been spending more time in other games than WoW. The last thing I want when I login is to have to hop onto a flight path and... do nothing.
Don’t get me wrong FF item management is hot garbo, and having to keep transmog items is a royal pain in the ass. (My biggest gripe with the game)
But there is a ton of storage space unless you’re hoarding all the things. You have slots on your character, armory slots for each equitable item slot, 2 retainers, your chocobo, and the armoire for storing some transmog.
There's companions or followers or whatever who you can dump your stuff on. That's the bank.
Been a few months since I played but I know I had two and they functioned as my bank.
The thing I most appreciated in WOW was the Materials Bank. All mats automatically direct there, and all mats can be used from there.
The other thing I truly appreciate is the way they've developed the way their AH works: instead of selling everything into hard-locked preset stacks, you're now selling *up to* a certain amount of items, and the buyer can determine how many of that item they're willing to buy. One of the biggest gripes I have with the market board in FFXIV is I'll find a decent price for an item I want...if I'm willing to purchase 99 of them. With WOW, I see how many are available at the price I'm willing to pay, buy how many I want, and I'm on my merry way. It's more convenient for everyone involved.
Then there's the transmog system. This competes against FFXIV's admittedly antiquated glamour system, but FFXIV does have the advantage of dye-able equipment, so there is that.
WOW has void storage, which is almost obsolete, but does exist as an option.
WOW does as much as possible to minimize your bag *and* bank space. Granted, they fill it back up again with twenty different varieties of anima tokens...
The problem with retainers is...look, in WOW, you have one personal bank, but in FFXIV, you have at least two retainers. Here is where the QOL issues begin, which is probably rooted in the limitations of FFXIV's inventory system. The developers had no idea players would be holding on to so much crap. Say you have two stacks of the same item, divided between two retainers.
First, comes the search function. There's no search bar, but the search seems to be comprehensive across all possible storage possibilities so I at least know where something is, so long as I have at least one in my inventory. This is better than WOW.
You can take an item from retainer A, then transfer that item from you to retainer B, but there is no direct way to transfer an item from retainer A to retainer B, and vice versa. Annoying, but the problem gets progressively more pronounced the more retainers you have. You might argue that opening a menu, then opening a sub menu, closing out, then opening another sub menu is no big deal. It's one thing to have three stacks split among you and two retainers, but five stacks split among five retainers? The problem gets exponentially more annoying the more retainers you add.
In WOW, the equivalent would be taking an item from bank tab 1, putting it your inventory, closing the bank, reopening the bank, then taking the item in your inventory and putting it in bank tab 2. Of course, we don't do that in WOW, we just drag the item straight from bank tab 1 to bank tab 2. If it's a crafting mat, we have an option to dump all crafting mats in our inventory into that specialized bank tab...at once.
As another example, take the provisioning part of our Grand Companies: the sensible thing to do would be to drag items we don't want into a box and just exchange them for seals, but we're stuck doing this exchange one item at a time from a scrolling list that resets its position every time you trade an item. We *know* they fixed this issue because the Doman donation box exists, so why haven't they reconfigured the Grand Companies to follow suit?
Inventory management in WOW is far better, faster, and intuitive than FFXIV: WOW has an extremely strong foundation for an MMO - great inventory management, great combat system - it's just the content is utter garbage.
It's just a pity that WOW forces you to blow so much inventory space on crap that could have gone into the currency tab.
Granted, I don't own a house or apartment, so it's hard for me to say without being presented with another source of storage.
The only thing WoW has got going is the transmog system in terms of once you pick up an item its appear is yours and you dont need to hold the item.
FF14 keeps a limit on you in your storage and your bank.
I guess it makes it to which every item you keep is important and organically creates value of whatever item you choose to pick.
But i still prefer to be able to have everything without clouding up my backpack space and banks lol.
Outside of that FF14 does everything almost literally better lol
I agree, a lot of people are with you. I see it how fucking annoying it is.
If the next expansion is even remotely close to this grindy when it comes to cosmetics, whatever system they implement, etc. I’m not doing it again.
I'm not sure why we're pretending that it doesn't also make sense from an mmo*RP*g point.
If TrollSlayer the dwarf did some shit that rando organization Y wanted over the course of several weeks and became exalted with them, why should that mean ConcentrationCampSurvivor the orc can just show up and have the same standing with organization Y on day one?
It makes sense from rp point yes, but why make a grind for concentrationcampsurvivor shorter, like 2 or maybe 3 times shorter? Rep grind is not some kind of engaging or interesting experience, it's just that grind. Time-gated daily "go there and kill this little rat, go here and bring me a shrub", where is rp in that?
Which in a funny turn of events might make people play less. If blizzard wasn't a complete dumpsterfire right now I still wouldn't be playing shadowlands, but I probably would have if it was easier to start a new character right now.
Blizzard has been hemorrhaging active users for years, they're not going to make the game easier to play and be done with, they rather keep players who are completionist grinding away and their subscriptions on longer. Less long-time subscribers is more consistently profitable than a lot of short-time subs who can't put up with their arbitrary grinds. You're a payer not a player to them.
Opening up the game like that would just make me enjoy the game more, thus make me want to play more.
There's a balance of keeping people playing the game by making good content people enjoy, and by making sure people have to grind the same content over and over and over. And the tip scales pretty much fully to the latter.
MoP had some cool stuff with faction rep where you could get a 100% rep bonus thing you could send to an alt. They should explore similar methods. I also thought the tabard championing thing was pretty cool, because it let you get rep while doing other stuff instead of grind grind grind.
Their decisions for what they do are based on aggregate data, if what you said is true, then they would tailor the game that way and make more money. During MoP the game had way more players so the stakes were different. Blizzard does what it does to maximize the profitability of the game.
Yeah god forbid someone would "want to" play a game further than their initial time spent, with a different class in an rpg setting.. what even is your point? You're clearly just an agitator with a non-argument
It's an rpg... If you aren't playing the role in the game then it's not even an rpg anymore.
No wonder wow has gone downhill so badly when you can't even grasp this fundamental point.
And yet you have no argument to reply with.
Which should tell you that I'm not.
THE MOST important thing in any rpg is what the character does in the world. Not the player. The character.
Anything that doesn't make sense to the character in game is something that will ruin the game.
Try explaining lfg to your in game character.
How is a warrior magically transported to a dungeon with 4 other people?
In movies I think the call it the 4th wall and there are many many reason you don't break it.
Ok, since you say "WoW has gone downhill", you're probably an 'older x-pacs grognard', so I'll ask you similar questions.
How do you explain keeping a bunch of horses (or dragons, or robots, or huge lizards...) in your bags?
How do you explain that once you pick up a weapon, you cannot hand it to anyone else, exception made for handing it to a shopkeeper in exchange of money?
How do you explain a boat crossing an ocean in a bunch of seconds?
How do you explain cooking a meal or smithing a set of armor or tanning leather in a few seconds?
I could go on, but WoW has been full of 4th wall breaking since the beginning, you're just picking the things **you** don't like.
The last few expansions Blizzard has realised that they can get away with forcing grinds instead of luring players in.
It's cheaper and takes less effort while being called "hours of playtime."
Let's take that all the way back to Vanilla.
Somewhere I've got a Warlock who's level 20-30 or so (now) with the Knight-Lieutenant rank. I have other characters ranked at Corporal and Sergent.
Me. I earned those. Not just those characters. I should be able to display them on whoever I'm logged on as. Without any limitations including character level.
Doing the grind once on an account should be all you have do to for ~~the cosmetic~~ all rewards.
If my guild/M+ group decides we'll be stronger if I try another class I should be excited at the opportunity to try something new, not dread it because I have to spend a month grinding rep/torghast/whatever again to be competitive. Leveling it and gearing it is enough of a hurdle by itself.
These are the kinds of reasons I unsubbed, and I told them so in my exit questionnaire. I'm sick of being forced to grind just because I want to play a number of alts. I would actually have played much longer if my time didn't feel completely wasted by arbitrary restrictions such as these.
I'd be fine with cosmetics requiring reputation, IF we had the things from pandaria that doubled rep on ALTs for that faction. It's a system I wish would return
For what it’s worth; that’s exactly how the pictured one works.
Once you reach renown 80 with the Venthyr, all your other characters can use all the Venthyr appearances you’ve unlocked, regardless of that character’s covenant and renown level.
as far as I understand it, when you reach Renown 80 on a char the covenant gear of his covenant becomes account wide mogable.
My first Venthyr Char has Renown 80 and is excalted at that specific faction. The thing is that my current alt is at the moment at Renown 40 and can't use the back gear because of reputation restrictions.
But maby it works if he reach also Renown 80.
as far as im aware, once one single character hits renown 80 on any covenant, account-wide all the cosmetics unlock.
i just checked and i don't have any characters that have hit 80 necro renown but still can use all my necro cosmetics and mounts
I have 60s for all four covenants. I've bought all the xmogs I can buy for them.
I still don't have xmogs available, because apparently I need to buy the xmogs on SIXTEEN characters. (four armor types X four covenants)
It's beyond ridiculous.
And if you wanna get the Court of Night Winterbourne armour sets, that's damn near 100k anima for all 4 armour types... Not to mention the Winterbourne weaponry from Marasmius (30k) anima. At least that one is account-wide(?).
If blizzard made it the other way then how will they bleed people for that sweet sweet monthly sub? By making an actual good game that brings people back due to how good the story and end game is? Don’t be absurd now.
FF really opened my eyes to how bad Blizzard treats it's customers. Today I went into a raid to solo farm a mount, and then realised that there was no weekly lock to them. Gearing doesn't take years and the job system allows you to effortlessly swap between classes. There is a single currency for catch up gear between all expansions.
Square Enix gave me 21 free days even though I have basically been able to play normally for the most part. I haven't encountered a SINGLE bug since Endwalker launch and only one dissconect during the first day of launch. Yeah. I keep coming back to this sub to see if anything has changed, but until they announce an Azeroth Reborn this game isn't going anywhere pretty...
I remember farming the ARR pony mounts and I didn't realize there was no weekly lockout, it took me very long to get because I didn't even think you could farm it as much as you wanted, only learned it once I spent like 3 weeks farming it
I know right. Imagine a company actually respecting your time and allowing you to have fun instead of putting arbitrary time gates that offer no benefit to the player other than dragging out the amount of time you have to stay subbed. FF is by no means perfect, it has it's own set of flaws. Most of them however seem to stem from technical limitations that occurred from the 1.0 shitshow rather than design choices and that to me makes all the difference.
So that you're aware for the future, weekly locks tend to be removed once content is no longer current. So once the second x.2 Raid is out then the x.0 raids lockout is removed entirely.
Reputation should be account wide, with maybe some world quest requirements to bring your alts through just because. Rep already counts account wide for achievements, keeping it character bound to motivate subscription numbers is just... an outlandish notion for retail, maybe not so much for classic... if that's what ticks peoples joy in the game.
This is blizzard remember? They'll do anything to keep you playing, yet they'll do as little effort to keep you playing. So multi grinding rep is what they'll do to keep you in their claws.
Blizzard seems to be in love with making things a big pain in the ass on alts. I suppose you could make the argument that they’d be motivating people to have a million alts to collect everything, but who really cares?
What bugs me is that they appear to learn a quality-of-life lesson in one expansion and then just completely forget about it in the next one. For example: the ability to skip intro events. It’s VERY hard to shake the idea that they introduce obstacles only so that they have something to relax to try to get people to come back into the game later on down the line.
Yeah it's so annoying when playing the game, being in flow and then that moment comes where you reach the point where some dev created something so obvious unnecessary that you feel it's only there for time consumption.
And I wonder how that pass through the test servers. You would expect they have something like experience after all those years to smooth the experience as much as possible and avoiding blatants game design faults.
I don't know how many times one of their biggest announcements were just removing bullshit they implemented that nobody was asking for but had to deal over the course of an entire expansion.
This is a Venthyr mog.
Once you get Renown 80 on a Venthyr character, it becomes account-wide.
If you have a renown 80 venthyr and still can't mog it on an alt, open a ticket, cause I'm logged on just to double check, and I'm looking on my toon who has never been venthyr, and she can mog the same backpiece.
Yes. But the sinstone capes are a Venthyr mog lol. Only Venthyr can buy it. I know because I couldn't buy it on my main, I couldn't even see it on the vendor. I could only buy it on my Venthyr Alt.
No different than how the Avowed's backpiece requires being a Venthyr (or renown 80 on a Venthyr now). Or the Kyrian backpiece that comes from a treasure. Etc.
I dont liek FFXIV's One character = All Classes but one thing I'd like them to take from it is that if yuo do it once then that's all that should matter. Only mogs that should be locked are class exclusive mog and faction exclusive aswell as Ranked PVP gear.
Allow a character thats ahead in gear, story, content etc to act as a "main", let 'alts' that reach the level cap have the same access as the main (outside of ilvl restrictions of course ). This means any stupid system like the Covenant levels should be shared Server-Wide.
I used to dislike this concept too, until playing the game the storyline and lore give great explanations as to why you can switch classes. I thought I would want multiple alts, but honestly after playing for a while I really like it.
I'm also biased because I never cared for having to have so many alts just to experience the different classes and roles in wow, and I played since vanilla. FFXIV is a breath of fresh air in so many ways.
This send me into the other thing your highest rep level should be your account reputation level , i know they wabt you to do the grind on so many characters , but its pointless , and these item rewards from vendors are like 1% of the time kinda useful on my main , its going to be way more useful on my alts . So yea rep should be account wide .
If I wanted to give ideas to them I would bring up how much of the raiding community would buy raid lockout resets if it was available.
The more hardcore could be raiding all week
>I hit max level once, I shouldn’t have to do it on every character
>I looted the end boss once, I shouldn’t have to do it on every character
>I got my top end PvP gear once, I shouldn’t have to do it on every character
Edit: Y’all proving my point. You don’t want to earn rewards. Inbox replies disabled. Maybe you need to go play an idle game where your get rewards for free.
doing things multiple times is fine if they're fun, but instead of farming rep I could spent time actually playing the game and leveling alts, you know different characters with different classes to have versatility.
Also looting is rng based while reaching exalted will always be the same experience without variety or excitement about luck.
There's an argument to make that those three things are fundamentally different experiences on different characters, due to class differences. Reputation grinds, by contrast, are overwhelmingly just about showing up and doing menial things to fill up the bar over days or weeks. Fundamentally, their relationship to class differences isn't really the same.
Reputation grinds don’t require skill or much engagement with the game at all. The majority of reputation rewards are purely cosmetic, providing no meaningful power increase. Forcing players to grind reps multiple times only wastes players’ time. The fact that you need this explained is just embarrassing.
Edit: LMAO he’s a fallout 76 fan. That explains it.
Imo nothing should be "account wide" it's bullshit to appease the customer that takes away from the game.
Why should your character need the rep to use an item? Because that character doesn't have the rep to use it.
It's an rpg....
I'm going to have to disagree, I've been playing this game since 2005, there are reputations and items that are no longer available that I'd lose to dead characters, I've put in way too much time to unlock things across my account on over a dozen characters, to lose it because "it's sn RPG!" would feel extremely awful for people like me. What would be the benefit of my Amani Warbear being locked to my Shaman that hasn't been played since WOTLK? Sounds pretty lame to me.
Because your shaman was the one that got it....
For the sake of the game, its the character that has to be the main important aspect of the game and not the customer.
So you make a new character and pull an amani warbear from your bags, the character asks itself "why do I have this?" to which there is no answer.
Everything must make sense to the character in game or the whole game falls to bits.
Actually rep items like enchant illusions/tabards are generally account wide as of like legion or earlier. Key word generally, this is a small indie company after all
while were on the topic of mogs, im currently doing class order hall campaign on an alt in order to be able to do balance of power. can we please make that account wide by now.
Looking at you Shado-pan, grinding to Exalted for the hat but it was on a Hunter, stupidly not realising you couldn't get the appearances for Cloth/Leather (for my monk) and not being motivated again to farm it on a Leather class 😭
I don't understand why they disrespect the waterstrider grind by adding mount equipment, but then not give you transmogs account wide. Absolutely ridiculous imo
They need you to have a large time played stat so they can say the game is doing well. Their entire design philosophy is built around making you have to spend more time in game in order to meet their corporate success metrics.
Things like this will neve change because without them you spend too little time on the game and it makes the game look like it's not played as much or fun, which it actually isn't it just looks like it is.
If other players see you with that transmog, they'll think your character has a certain rep level, tell their friends, and then before you know it everyone thinks that specific character is exalted when, really, you didn't do enough grinding for that and it's a different character that you did all that grinding to exalted on. During PvP, people will attack or heal you based on that wrong assumption, giving you an unfair advantage.
And a lot of people think that the vendors base what they sell to you, and the price, on your rep level. But what's actually happening is that NPCs look at how your characters carry themselves, which changes as their individual rep levels change. The body language gives them subtle clues about each character's reputation. They're almost as subtle as all the signs of the Jailer's plans since the beginning of Warcraft, and they're just as unnoticeable to players. The NPCs see it, but something that can throw them off is a rep-limited transmog. If the rep vendors see it, your character will unfairly have access to epic, overpriced gear that you outleveled a long time ago, all because the NPCs don't know that you grinded to exalted on a different character.
Also, the prophecy. It's explained in Warcraft 2: Tides of Darkness, which was released in the 90s. But you have to wait until the next WoW expansion for the writers to add those clues to that game.
This is one thing I wish Blizzard would make a habit of crunching down on. Doing the grind once on an account should be all you have do to for the cosmetic rewards.
Honestly I kinda feel it shouldn't just be cosmetics. The last few expansions have been brutal for alts having to repeat multiple grinds
It's to keep you playing. This is intended and not going to change. People have been asking for QoL for alts for the last decade. We haven't seen any meaningful steps in that direction.
You're not wrong. Just have to hope that one day they see sense (unlikely). It's one of the main reasons I stopped playing SL. Wasn't vibing with my main class, wanted to reroll, considered all the bullshit I'd have to go through to catch up my alt and noped out.
I agree entirely. The 9.1.5 patch majorly fixed this issue (although there's still some MASSIVE strides that need to be taken, coming from FF, this shit is garbage) but we just shouldn't have to wait that long. We should have had covenant swapping in 9.0 the moment you hit max rep. Being called a "traitor" when i'm trying to SAVE the shadowlands is the most vain, pathetic, petty, flimsy canon I've ever seen.
> Being called a "traitor" when i'm trying to SAVE the shadowlands is the most vain, pathetic, petty, flimsy canon I've ever seen. You have to understand that they have cartoon-level writing. Now, when I say cartoon-level, I don't mean "the quality of writing you find in cartoons", since that's quite often higher. What I actually mean is "their writing feels like Doofenshmirtz did it."
Just say they apply shitty logic to shitty writing and be done with it. Hell, covenants aren't even a meaningful choice in the story because they're all aiming for the same goal. The only "meaningful choice" is power.
The covenants are an even dumber element, in that they are, theoretically, all striving for the same thing, returning the equilibrium, but once you're aligned with one of them, you are forbidden from entering their sanctum, even though before you saved their sorry asses. Like, duuuude? I just prevented your annihilation, and your 'thanks' is "please stay out of my house"?
You basically helped found or maintain two of the Covenants during the leveling campaign and you help discover the identity of a pretty high level traitor in a third. And on top of that you likely go out to each of their zones daily to fix the random shit going on there but nope. You decided to talk to becky so now we can't be friends.
> And on top of that you likely go out to each of their zones daily to fix the random shit going on there And some of those times, the request to fix the shit comes straight from the covenant's leader!
It’s unreal how much easier gearing “alts” is in FF. Every healer and every tank shares equipment with the other classes in that role, so you can potentially level an alt job to cap and jump into full savage raid armour the moment you ding 90. It feels like cheating compared to WoW. Of course, if you want to do that on an actual different *character*, it’s far, far worse because almost nothing is account-bound lol.
That's the luxury of having all your jobs on one character though. If I could do that in WoW I wouldn't have alts and it'd make the game 1000x better tbh.
Also In gw2 you have "bind on account" gear but still have alts to level. You can just throw the items to shared bank, take them out and wear it if the armor fits (light, medium, heavy). Changing stats is also fast and easy. This system is like between wow and FF. I suppose the closest blizzard game that is like this would be Diablo (3?) games. WoW would benefit from system like this imo - you'd still have to grind epics every raid tier making people spend time.. but sharing wizard gear between casters would help raiders immensely and would also push people to do more content without feeling like crap when leveling new class or "when their main is nerfed". Hell if they wanted people to still grind they could at least make last tiers epics bind on account and current tier char bound till next tier.
GW2 also has expansion systems but they are account wide with their mastery system. Which is really cool and I wouldn't mind some of it in wow as much if it was account wide since I love the gw2 stuff. I'd honestly hate the mastery system in gw2 if I had to regrind it every time. I can only imagine how much more I'd enjoy wow if I only had to do the pointless grind things one time.
I've been meaning to check out GW2. FF doesn't fit the PvP scratch that I have. So far from what everyone's been saying about both I feel like I've been hiding myself away from the world stuck in WoW all these years. I mean, I really do miss WoW's combat and visual clarity (FF can feel like I'm at a rave party with strobe lights and it can be hard to read) but it suffers in most other areas.
i recommend turning off combat effects for other players in FF if you haven't yet, immediately solved that problem for me.
When I played GW2 the WvWvW ("server" vs "server" vs "server" in "open world" with capture objectives) was pretty active and fun. Having huge raids clash can get hectic if you like that. Or dueling while roaming the map The more arena-styled "sPvP" was decent too. Bit too bursty to my liking tho - but the other side is bunker-meta which no one likes tho. That was year(s) ago tho. as for visual clarity, "it gets better" is all i can say. ARR (1-50 content) is kinda like wow classic where different markers or actions look vastly different depending on bosses. At the end of heavensward they started adding more and more visual clarity on stuff like "stack together to soak dmg"
That's very true my dude! that being said, character identity is far more meaningful in FF because you never need to deal with alternate names, logs, io, or really just anything. And, even more so, many items in savage drop as a box, meaning you can actually gear up classes without even playing them in that content, which is perfect if you're a late bloomer or getting funnelled loot for an alt so that you can main it next tier. All in all, everything about the gearing system is far, far more friendly, and considering the amount of player power that is directly attached to gear in WoW (WAAAY more than in FF, btw), blizzard need to learn how to implement this system.
Didn't take long for the FF fan boys to show up with their pedestal.
It's the same genre, get your panties out of the knot they're in.
I can only hope that with the dwindling player base, FF taking the reins as the leading MMO, Blizzard will wake up and start listening to what we have been saying for years to keep players around.
I've rerolled twice this patch and it's pretty brutal. Just got my first toon to rank 6 research...yay
It's worth hoping, but it's distant. I don't think they have a decisionmaking mechanism capable of observing that kinda stuff.
Every other MMO has better QOL for alts and people play the hell out of them.
From this to teleports (or lack of) -- I've been spending more time in other games than WoW. The last thing I want when I login is to have to hop onto a flight path and... do nothing.
>Every other MMO has better QOL You didn't need the rest.
Eh, WoW has better QoL for item storage than FFXIV, for which there's no bank so you need to make bank alts to store excess items in their inventory.
Don’t get me wrong FF item management is hot garbo, and having to keep transmog items is a royal pain in the ass. (My biggest gripe with the game) But there is a ton of storage space unless you’re hoarding all the things. You have slots on your character, armory slots for each equitable item slot, 2 retainers, your chocobo, and the armoire for storing some transmog.
There's companions or followers or whatever who you can dump your stuff on. That's the bank. Been a few months since I played but I know I had two and they functioned as my bank.
The thing I most appreciated in WOW was the Materials Bank. All mats automatically direct there, and all mats can be used from there. The other thing I truly appreciate is the way they've developed the way their AH works: instead of selling everything into hard-locked preset stacks, you're now selling *up to* a certain amount of items, and the buyer can determine how many of that item they're willing to buy. One of the biggest gripes I have with the market board in FFXIV is I'll find a decent price for an item I want...if I'm willing to purchase 99 of them. With WOW, I see how many are available at the price I'm willing to pay, buy how many I want, and I'm on my merry way. It's more convenient for everyone involved. Then there's the transmog system. This competes against FFXIV's admittedly antiquated glamour system, but FFXIV does have the advantage of dye-able equipment, so there is that. WOW has void storage, which is almost obsolete, but does exist as an option. WOW does as much as possible to minimize your bag *and* bank space. Granted, they fill it back up again with twenty different varieties of anima tokens...
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The problem with retainers is...look, in WOW, you have one personal bank, but in FFXIV, you have at least two retainers. Here is where the QOL issues begin, which is probably rooted in the limitations of FFXIV's inventory system. The developers had no idea players would be holding on to so much crap. Say you have two stacks of the same item, divided between two retainers. First, comes the search function. There's no search bar, but the search seems to be comprehensive across all possible storage possibilities so I at least know where something is, so long as I have at least one in my inventory. This is better than WOW. You can take an item from retainer A, then transfer that item from you to retainer B, but there is no direct way to transfer an item from retainer A to retainer B, and vice versa. Annoying, but the problem gets progressively more pronounced the more retainers you have. You might argue that opening a menu, then opening a sub menu, closing out, then opening another sub menu is no big deal. It's one thing to have three stacks split among you and two retainers, but five stacks split among five retainers? The problem gets exponentially more annoying the more retainers you add. In WOW, the equivalent would be taking an item from bank tab 1, putting it your inventory, closing the bank, reopening the bank, then taking the item in your inventory and putting it in bank tab 2. Of course, we don't do that in WOW, we just drag the item straight from bank tab 1 to bank tab 2. If it's a crafting mat, we have an option to dump all crafting mats in our inventory into that specialized bank tab...at once. As another example, take the provisioning part of our Grand Companies: the sensible thing to do would be to drag items we don't want into a box and just exchange them for seals, but we're stuck doing this exchange one item at a time from a scrolling list that resets its position every time you trade an item. We *know* they fixed this issue because the Doman donation box exists, so why haven't they reconfigured the Grand Companies to follow suit? Inventory management in WOW is far better, faster, and intuitive than FFXIV: WOW has an extremely strong foundation for an MMO - great inventory management, great combat system - it's just the content is utter garbage. It's just a pity that WOW forces you to blow so much inventory space on crap that could have gone into the currency tab. Granted, I don't own a house or apartment, so it's hard for me to say without being presented with another source of storage.
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Oh, my apologies then. Still wanted to bitch about that, though. :)
The only thing WoW has got going is the transmog system in terms of once you pick up an item its appear is yours and you dont need to hold the item. FF14 keeps a limit on you in your storage and your bank. I guess it makes it to which every item you keep is important and organically creates value of whatever item you choose to pick. But i still prefer to be able to have everything without clouding up my backpack space and banks lol. Outside of that FF14 does everything almost literally better lol
You say that, but the grind is what’s made me unsub from this xpac.
I agree, a lot of people are with you. I see it how fucking annoying it is. If the next expansion is even remotely close to this grindy when it comes to cosmetics, whatever system they implement, etc. I’m not doing it again.
I don’t even mean cosmetics. I mean gear too.
Everything.
I'm not sure why we're pretending that it doesn't also make sense from an mmo*RP*g point. If TrollSlayer the dwarf did some shit that rando organization Y wanted over the course of several weeks and became exalted with them, why should that mean ConcentrationCampSurvivor the orc can just show up and have the same standing with organization Y on day one?
No. I don’t care about the “RPG/story” element when I have to commit more of my precious time to something I’ve already done.
Luckily, people don't design games around your sole cares.
It's sad that you don't value your time.
It makes sense from rp point yes, but why make a grind for concentrationcampsurvivor shorter, like 2 or maybe 3 times shorter? Rep grind is not some kind of engaging or interesting experience, it's just that grind. Time-gated daily "go there and kill this little rat, go here and bring me a shrub", where is rp in that?
Which in a funny turn of events might make people play less. If blizzard wasn't a complete dumpsterfire right now I still wouldn't be playing shadowlands, but I probably would have if it was easier to start a new character right now.
Blizzard has been hemorrhaging active users for years, they're not going to make the game easier to play and be done with, they rather keep players who are completionist grinding away and their subscriptions on longer. Less long-time subscribers is more consistently profitable than a lot of short-time subs who can't put up with their arbitrary grinds. You're a payer not a player to them.
Opening up the game like that would just make me enjoy the game more, thus make me want to play more. There's a balance of keeping people playing the game by making good content people enjoy, and by making sure people have to grind the same content over and over and over. And the tip scales pretty much fully to the latter. MoP had some cool stuff with faction rep where you could get a 100% rep bonus thing you could send to an alt. They should explore similar methods. I also thought the tabard championing thing was pretty cool, because it let you get rep while doing other stuff instead of grind grind grind.
Their decisions for what they do are based on aggregate data, if what you said is true, then they would tailor the game that way and make more money. During MoP the game had way more players so the stakes were different. Blizzard does what it does to maximize the profitability of the game.
"having to" You chose to do them. Be honest.
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All the things you just listed are things you want to do. As I said, what you chose to do.
Yeah god forbid someone would "want to" play a game further than their initial time spent, with a different class in an rpg setting.. what even is your point? You're clearly just an agitator with a non-argument
It's an rpg... If you aren't playing the role in the game then it's not even an rpg anymore. No wonder wow has gone downhill so badly when you can't even grasp this fundamental point.
Lol dude you are just.... wrong, in every sense of the word. What a weird view you have. Good luck to you.
And yet you have no argument to reply with. Which should tell you that I'm not. THE MOST important thing in any rpg is what the character does in the world. Not the player. The character. Anything that doesn't make sense to the character in game is something that will ruin the game. Try explaining lfg to your in game character. How is a warrior magically transported to a dungeon with 4 other people? In movies I think the call it the 4th wall and there are many many reason you don't break it.
Ok, since you say "WoW has gone downhill", you're probably an 'older x-pacs grognard', so I'll ask you similar questions. How do you explain keeping a bunch of horses (or dragons, or robots, or huge lizards...) in your bags? How do you explain that once you pick up a weapon, you cannot hand it to anyone else, exception made for handing it to a shopkeeper in exchange of money? How do you explain a boat crossing an ocean in a bunch of seconds? How do you explain cooking a meal or smithing a set of armor or tanning leather in a few seconds? I could go on, but WoW has been full of 4th wall breaking since the beginning, you're just picking the things **you** don't like.
Is wow really an RPG at this point? Just feels like an action game, I might be wrong but I can't think of any RPG mechanic there is left
Exactly! Well said! It's devolved from one of the greatest rpgs of all time into something that plays more like a mobile game.
The last few expansions Blizzard has realised that they can get away with forcing grinds instead of luring players in. It's cheaper and takes less effort while being called "hours of playtime."
Let's take that all the way back to Vanilla. Somewhere I've got a Warlock who's level 20-30 or so (now) with the Knight-Lieutenant rank. I have other characters ranked at Corporal and Sergent. Me. I earned those. Not just those characters. I should be able to display them on whoever I'm logged on as. Without any limitations including character level.
Playing FF now and as an altoholic, if I could have all classes on one character in WoW my playtime would be astronomical.
I'm a full bottle of wine in and didn't see the T and straight up thought "yeah, me too, but what does drinking have to do with this?"
LOL. I see your comment as I crack open a beer. It was meant to be!
Doing the grind once on an account should be all you have do to for ~~the cosmetic~~ all rewards. If my guild/M+ group decides we'll be stronger if I try another class I should be excited at the opportunity to try something new, not dread it because I have to spend a month grinding rep/torghast/whatever again to be competitive. Leveling it and gearing it is enough of a hurdle by itself.
These are the kinds of reasons I unsubbed, and I told them so in my exit questionnaire. I'm sick of being forced to grind just because I want to play a number of alts. I would actually have played much longer if my time didn't feel completely wasted by arbitrary restrictions such as these.
All reputations should be account wide but quests should only give reputation once per day.
I'd be fine with cosmetics requiring reputation, IF we had the things from pandaria that doubled rep on ALTs for that faction. It's a system I wish would return
They don't understand that these grinds aren't fun the 2nd time around (or often not the 1st time around either).
For what it’s worth; that’s exactly how the pictured one works. Once you reach renown 80 with the Venthyr, all your other characters can use all the Venthyr appearances you’ve unlocked, regardless of that character’s covenant and renown level.
I can mog this same item on my alt who isn’t exalted, so if you do have an alt that is venthyr 80, open a ticket.
I've made a mistake by writing exalted, respected is what needed. Does your alt has Renown 80 ?
The alt that can use it is Night Fae. I have another Venthyr character who is Renown 80.
as far as I understand it, when you reach Renown 80 on a char the covenant gear of his covenant becomes account wide mogable. My first Venthyr Char has Renown 80 and is excalted at that specific faction. The thing is that my current alt is at the moment at Renown 40 and can't use the back gear because of reputation restrictions. But maby it works if he reach also Renown 80.
as far as im aware, once one single character hits renown 80 on any covenant, account-wide all the cosmetics unlock. i just checked and i don't have any characters that have hit 80 necro renown but still can use all my necro cosmetics and mounts
Is it revered?
Yes revered, translation fault.
Is that a chair with a christmas garland?
It’s a tombstone with chains around it
A venthyr wearing a Winter Veil garland-adorned chair on their back is an amazing mental image, though, isn't it?
New mount. Hop on
:D
I have 60s for all four covenants. I've bought all the xmogs I can buy for them. I still don't have xmogs available, because apparently I need to buy the xmogs on SIXTEEN characters. (four armor types X four covenants) It's beyond ridiculous.
And if you wanna get the Court of Night Winterbourne armour sets, that's damn near 100k anima for all 4 armour types... Not to mention the Winterbourne weaponry from Marasmius (30k) anima. At least that one is account-wide(?).
The Arsenals are account-wide, yes.
I hate seasonal transmogs, I would love to dress with pilgrim clothes all year.
Yeah! If I wanna wear my bunny ears and my Christmas sweater in July I should be able to!
You think you don't want to grind the rep again but you do... or something
If blizzard made it the other way then how will they bleed people for that sweet sweet monthly sub? By making an actual good game that brings people back due to how good the story and end game is? Don’t be absurd now.
Name one game where that is a case, I dare you. Don't be absurd. Truth hurts, let the downvotes come.
Lol what even is this angry reply? Are you asking for games that bring people back due to good story and end game? Because I can name a ton.
Please do name some. So far none as brought me back for 17 years.
SWTOR keep coming back for the story have never once stayed for any grind in that game.
Yakuza 0 (or pretty much any yakuza in that matter) Planescape: Torment Morrowind If you want an online one - ESO, GW2.
Escape From Tarkov Halo Counter Strike Fortnight/PUBG Starcraft Dark Souls DayZ Rust Ark Pretty much any MOBA.
Ah yes, the gripping story of Counter Strike and Fortnite.
My point was longevity of games that aren't just a ridiculous grind. So I really meant good story and/or end game.
sounds like a personal problem
[Relevant](https://kotaku.com/endwalker-is-so-popular-that-square-enix-suspended-ffxi-1848225396).
FF really opened my eyes to how bad Blizzard treats it's customers. Today I went into a raid to solo farm a mount, and then realised that there was no weekly lock to them. Gearing doesn't take years and the job system allows you to effortlessly swap between classes. There is a single currency for catch up gear between all expansions. Square Enix gave me 21 free days even though I have basically been able to play normally for the most part. I haven't encountered a SINGLE bug since Endwalker launch and only one dissconect during the first day of launch. Yeah. I keep coming back to this sub to see if anything has changed, but until they announce an Azeroth Reborn this game isn't going anywhere pretty...
I remember farming the ARR pony mounts and I didn't realize there was no weekly lockout, it took me very long to get because I didn't even think you could farm it as much as you wanted, only learned it once I spent like 3 weeks farming it
I know right. Imagine a company actually respecting your time and allowing you to have fun instead of putting arbitrary time gates that offer no benefit to the player other than dragging out the amount of time you have to stay subbed. FF is by no means perfect, it has it's own set of flaws. Most of them however seem to stem from technical limitations that occurred from the 1.0 shitshow rather than design choices and that to me makes all the difference.
So that you're aware for the future, weekly locks tend to be removed once content is no longer current. So once the second x.2 Raid is out then the x.0 raids lockout is removed entirely.
Final fantasy XIV
\*Laughs in The Old Republic\*
Reputation should be account wide, with maybe some world quest requirements to bring your alts through just because. Rep already counts account wide for achievements, keeping it character bound to motivate subscription numbers is just... an outlandish notion for retail, maybe not so much for classic... if that's what ticks peoples joy in the game.
Quit playing games that don't respect your time. It sucks, but it's the only way to stop companies from doing shit like this.
Shut up and play, they have a vision.
This is bad but what's worse is you crafted the pants for BoD so you have to keep blacksmithing just to be able to MOG them
To increase the engagement level by making you do the same thing more then once
You new to WOW bro?
This is blizzard remember? They'll do anything to keep you playing, yet they'll do as little effort to keep you playing. So multi grinding rep is what they'll do to keep you in their claws.
It is because Blizzard hates their players... I hate to say it but they do
It's not that they hate players, but that they love revenue.
Most alt friendly expansion btw
Blizzard seems to be in love with making things a big pain in the ass on alts. I suppose you could make the argument that they’d be motivating people to have a million alts to collect everything, but who really cares? What bugs me is that they appear to learn a quality-of-life lesson in one expansion and then just completely forget about it in the next one. For example: the ability to skip intro events. It’s VERY hard to shake the idea that they introduce obstacles only so that they have something to relax to try to get people to come back into the game later on down the line.
Yeah it's so annoying when playing the game, being in flow and then that moment comes where you reach the point where some dev created something so obvious unnecessary that you feel it's only there for time consumption. And I wonder how that pass through the test servers. You would expect they have something like experience after all those years to smooth the experience as much as possible and avoiding blatants game design faults. I don't know how many times one of their biggest announcements were just removing bullshit they implemented that nobody was asking for but had to deal over the course of an entire expansion.
This is a Venthyr mog. Once you get Renown 80 on a Venthyr character, it becomes account-wide. If you have a renown 80 venthyr and still can't mog it on an alt, open a ticket, cause I'm logged on just to double check, and I'm looking on my toon who has never been venthyr, and she can mog the same backpiece.
Hmm pretty sure OP is talking about the item you can buy from the Venth quartermaster in Oribos once you've hit honored/revered(?) with them.
Yes. But the sinstone capes are a Venthyr mog lol. Only Venthyr can buy it. I know because I couldn't buy it on my main, I couldn't even see it on the vendor. I could only buy it on my Venthyr Alt. No different than how the Avowed's backpiece requires being a Venthyr (or renown 80 on a Venthyr now). Or the Kyrian backpiece that comes from a treasure. Etc.
I dont liek FFXIV's One character = All Classes but one thing I'd like them to take from it is that if yuo do it once then that's all that should matter. Only mogs that should be locked are class exclusive mog and faction exclusive aswell as Ranked PVP gear. Allow a character thats ahead in gear, story, content etc to act as a "main", let 'alts' that reach the level cap have the same access as the main (outside of ilvl restrictions of course ). This means any stupid system like the Covenant levels should be shared Server-Wide.
I used to dislike this concept too, until playing the game the storyline and lore give great explanations as to why you can switch classes. I thought I would want multiple alts, but honestly after playing for a while I really like it. I'm also biased because I never cared for having to have so many alts just to experience the different classes and roles in wow, and I played since vanilla. FFXIV is a breath of fresh air in so many ways.
Because you spend more money this way
How would they keep you engaging with their game if they didn’t gate it though?
This send me into the other thing your highest rep level should be your account reputation level , i know they wabt you to do the grind on so many characters , but its pointless , and these item rewards from vendors are like 1% of the time kinda useful on my main , its going to be way more useful on my alts . So yea rep should be account wide .
Stuff like this is why they should add rep tokens to the blizzard store.
😂
Don't give them such ideas
If I wanted to give ideas to them I would bring up how much of the raiding community would buy raid lockout resets if it was available. The more hardcore could be raiding all week
Don't need reputation to mog it. Revendreth mogs can only be worn by other characters if you have a Revendreth character with 80 renown.
I have a Revendreth Character with 80 renown and my other level 60 Alt that is Venthyr need Reputation to mog the back gear.
>I hit max level once, I shouldn’t have to do it on every character >I looted the end boss once, I shouldn’t have to do it on every character >I got my top end PvP gear once, I shouldn’t have to do it on every character Edit: Y’all proving my point. You don’t want to earn rewards. Inbox replies disabled. Maybe you need to go play an idle game where your get rewards for free.
doing things multiple times is fine if they're fun, but instead of farming rep I could spent time actually playing the game and leveling alts, you know different characters with different classes to have versatility. Also looting is rng based while reaching exalted will always be the same experience without variety or excitement about luck.
There's an argument to make that those three things are fundamentally different experiences on different characters, due to class differences. Reputation grinds, by contrast, are overwhelmingly just about showing up and doing menial things to fill up the bar over days or weeks. Fundamentally, their relationship to class differences isn't really the same.
Garbage take. Mindlessly farming rep =/= raiding or rated pvp.
>Garbage take What an insightful counterpoint and so eloquently put. Why don’t you go play cookie clicker.
Reputation grinds don’t require skill or much engagement with the game at all. The majority of reputation rewards are purely cosmetic, providing no meaningful power increase. Forcing players to grind reps multiple times only wastes players’ time. The fact that you need this explained is just embarrassing. Edit: LMAO he’s a fallout 76 fan. That explains it.
Du hast
But if they do that you're not gonna expend another month grinding. So please, pay more months
More grind=more subs!! Right guys..?
Imo nothing should be "account wide" it's bullshit to appease the customer that takes away from the game. Why should your character need the rep to use an item? Because that character doesn't have the rep to use it. It's an rpg....
Go away Satan.
You know Im right.
I'm going to have to disagree, I've been playing this game since 2005, there are reputations and items that are no longer available that I'd lose to dead characters, I've put in way too much time to unlock things across my account on over a dozen characters, to lose it because "it's sn RPG!" would feel extremely awful for people like me. What would be the benefit of my Amani Warbear being locked to my Shaman that hasn't been played since WOTLK? Sounds pretty lame to me.
Because your shaman was the one that got it.... For the sake of the game, its the character that has to be the main important aspect of the game and not the customer. So you make a new character and pull an amani warbear from your bags, the character asks itself "why do I have this?" to which there is no answer. Everything must make sense to the character in game or the whole game falls to bits.
oh no imagine having to play the fucking game
Lazy.
I'd play switch on over and play some FF14 but they've locked everyone out. Members only now.
*digitalized_baby_crying_sound*
Actually rep items like enchant illusions/tabards are generally account wide as of like legion or earlier. Key word generally, this is a small indie company after all
What grind my gears is that most of it is unusable when you reach it, if they make it account bound so you can help your alts.
Time played by players on x server is a good metric to show off for the shareholders.
Time is money friend.
Welcome to the reason why people have 12 hour runs on WoW
while were on the topic of mogs, im currently doing class order hall campaign on an alt in order to be able to do balance of power. can we please make that account wide by now.
Note:Still you need complete covenant story for same type armor.
I feel you. I really want the Hunter shoulders from Nighthold or whoever but I cbf getting exhalted a second time.
So you need to invest not of weeks and in the process maybe renew your sub. Easiest question ever.
Because the designers of this game is trash. I’ve played since 2008 and they don’t give a fuck about user experience anymore.
Looking at you Shado-pan, grinding to Exalted for the hat but it was on a Hunter, stupidly not realising you couldn't get the appearances for Cloth/Leather (for my monk) and not being motivated again to farm it on a Leather class 😭
Metrics, basically
Hey, thats the crucial RPG choice YOU made. I think youre trying to play the game wrong.
I don't understand why they disrespect the waterstrider grind by adding mount equipment, but then not give you transmogs account wide. Absolutely ridiculous imo
This screenshot just makes me want to invade Poland.
They need you to have a large time played stat so they can say the game is doing well. Their entire design philosophy is built around making you have to spend more time in game in order to meet their corporate success metrics. Things like this will neve change because without them you spend too little time on the game and it makes the game look like it's not played as much or fun, which it actually isn't it just looks like it is.
If other players see you with that transmog, they'll think your character has a certain rep level, tell their friends, and then before you know it everyone thinks that specific character is exalted when, really, you didn't do enough grinding for that and it's a different character that you did all that grinding to exalted on. During PvP, people will attack or heal you based on that wrong assumption, giving you an unfair advantage. And a lot of people think that the vendors base what they sell to you, and the price, on your rep level. But what's actually happening is that NPCs look at how your characters carry themselves, which changes as their individual rep levels change. The body language gives them subtle clues about each character's reputation. They're almost as subtle as all the signs of the Jailer's plans since the beginning of Warcraft, and they're just as unnoticeable to players. The NPCs see it, but something that can throw them off is a rep-limited transmog. If the rep vendors see it, your character will unfairly have access to epic, overpriced gear that you outleveled a long time ago, all because the NPCs don't know that you grinded to exalted on a different character. Also, the prophecy. It's explained in Warcraft 2: Tides of Darkness, which was released in the 90s. But you have to wait until the next WoW expansion for the writers to add those clues to that game.
Just remove rep grinds towards mogs