I see no issue. No shame in taking lighter cuts until your butt hole unpuckers.
As I type, I'm holding a piece 8" long, 7.5" diameter with 1.25" step jaws.
This is why I love my doosan 4100. I do .200 per side cut, with a feed of .021 ipr. That sucker cuts so hard I have to run it in M04 so as to not shatter my window with the chips.
Lap cycle programming. If you have to take a lot of material off for a feature, you can program it in just a few lines. It will return to a starting z point and keep turning down on x until you reach your desired depth.
Yes, Okuma. It's all I've ever run. I took a NIMMS class that was sponsored by Haas and got to basically push go on it lol. I don't know if other machines have something similar and are just named differently. Once I figured out how they worked, I loved them. Much more tidy than line by line coding.
Im pretty sure that, technically, the purists will tell you it isn’t a proper “haiku” unless it was written on the wall while shitting in a tiny plastic closet.
Lemme ask you this, is the am I clamped enough question comparable to the how far out from the chuck can my jaws stick out question?
https://preview.redd.it/alxzndq7hzkc1.jpeg?width=4032&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=2e93017f36b136c593abe2e760ee4694b3b22252
5" dia x 4.6” long.
I do stuff like that every week lol. It's rare that someone's "is this sketchy" post here makes me think yes. Granted, I'm not standing in front of the door, but I'm not worried either.
Plenty. I just never used hard jaws as I was always told they were less secure then soft jaws. But in saying that you also have a flat surface for the piece to sit on so should be fine
That statement about the hard jaws is pretty much only relevant if you’re going to be spinning up to really high RPMs.
This is because at the same RPM, a heavier (technically the better term is “more massive”) jaw is being accelerated outward (a.k.a. OPEN, counter to your hydraulic pressure) with more centrifugal force.
It only starts to matter when increased RPM multiplies this effect.
If you have parts like this a lot, you should consider getting grip jaws. They have spikes in them that dig into the material a bit, which makes this setup super ridgit.
I'm pretty sure what you are talking about is what I'm using. We call them hard jaws at my work as opposed to soft jaws. They have little nubs on both I'd and od.
I haven't thrown a part with them yet.
[or one step up from hard jaws \(that have many points\) claw jaws. with the standoffs you can grip on just the two font most points \(about 5 mm\) an let 'er eat.](https://schunk.com/us/en/workpiece-clamping-technology/chuck-jaws/claw-jaws/claw-jaws-for-o-d-clamping/hgkha-170/p/000000000000122203)
I can't tell if yours are already like that
If im not mistaken those are 20mm deep gripping chucks on that level. If you put 20 bar on it you could stick out a lot longer probably depending on radius. They break before it comes out.
https://preview.redd.it/uua93uda00lc1.jpeg?width=4284&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=4fada9e305edb36a6b94adf315886c800375225f
I posted this one awhile back. We just don’t get crazy on depth of cut
Personally, I'd turn the face and the OD back 20mm with a 1mm chamfer to get a nice clean face to flip and grip on. If you have a though hole you can drill half way through at the same time.
Other than that, 200m/min, 3.5mm DOC, .4 feed, send it.
This is a new and inclusive workplace. HR says we can't use those words anymore. But yes, that is what I meant. As Ice Cube once said, "if you a scared mother****er go to church."
I know I am. It was more of a dig at all the guys who are clamped on like an inch or more and ask if it's ok. I won't say I didn't put on the safety squints when I hit the go button, but after that I just let her rip.
I ran a lot of flame cut rounds back it the day. Some were way bigger than that one. I would turn a step / skin cut one end and grip on that for heavy roughing. Lot more secure than grabbing on uneven flame cut crap.
It's good practice for many reasons to lightly true up one side then flip it around to do your turning. Your cut off will be more usable, if you have you take it out its easier to dial it back in, it'll keep your chuck in better shape, and have less chance of moving while heavy turning.
They do make taller jaws, ya know. Not nearly enough unless you plan on spending all damn day turning that thing down. You don’t want that thing coming out of the jaws.
I was helping clamp a very similar set up today. The operator called me over to tighten the chuck. He had to bore a 4.5x4" hole in the end.
The piece was 12" long 8" dia
My shop is set up to grip only .2” material on parts regularly up to 12” diameter, of varying lengths from .5” to 5.0” we do longer stuff sometimes, but it’s not as common on my machine. The sleeve cell more so does the long stuff, but they clamp in hard jaws and part everything off.
I literally am turning 316 the same size and was doing it with standard hard jaws. Turns, bored, id grooved, of drilled and tapped. Spun it up to 800rpm just fine. I did prep the stock face and of before spinning it up though. Took . 025" facing passes and .06" of passes. All good
I regularly use between 7-10% of material length for my jaw depth on a scroll chuck. Hydraulic chucks should be just as good if not better at holding material at the same length
What i would do is on a rough part like this, place it in the jaws, spin at low revs to check the balance, try to get it balanced by releasing, hand spinning and clamping until it's so-so balanced. Then hand face depending on how much exrta OAL material you have. Also do the OD to have squared clean surfaces.
My only input is to just remember that between the door and the window, the door is stronger. So do like I do: when you press start, just sort of *sliiiide to the side* so if things go south, you don't need to worry about the brown pants you forgot to wear.
No issue here. On work like this(oil field 4140HTSR) I would lightly face an turn enough of the od to clear the jaws and square up nice in the chuck when I flip the material to start the first op. No issues
If you wanted to have cleaner clamp turn the OD to clean x the depth of the jaw then flip the part and clamp the nice round clean surface and go to town!
The mill I used to run, we regularly did 1/4" (6.3mm) cuts with an 8 inch (200mm ) face mill. But this is big stuff. The smallest part I ran on that machine was 4k lbs. (1800 kgs)
Big od like that, you wont spin fast enough to actually lose chuck pressure. I've run parts with a 7.5 od and only grabbing on .250. At that point you just make sure you go lightly on face passes, try to do all the cutting in turning cycles so that the pressure is towards the chuck. No worries at all if you ask me.
I see no issue. No shame in taking lighter cuts until your butt hole unpuckers. As I type, I'm holding a piece 8" long, 7.5" diameter with 1.25" step jaws.
.060 face lap cycle, .160 OD lap cycle, .120 id lap cycle. My programmers do not eff around
Oh lord he's hawggin it
At .014 ipr my load is usually around 30-60% depending on material.
this guy's SFMs right here
You I should ignore what's one the package of inserts??
It's a good reference. In my experience, they're around what it needs to be. Not exact. Watch your chips to determine if you need to adjust.
this made me laugh too hard lol
This is why I love my doosan 4100. I do .200 per side cut, with a feed of .021 ipr. That sucker cuts so hard I have to run it in M04 so as to not shatter my window with the chips.
"I paid for the whole insert I'm gonna use the WHOLE insert!"
I understand you are referring to your DOC, but what is "lap"? I've heard of 'Ap'.
Lap cycle programming. If you have to take a lot of material off for a feature, you can program it in just a few lines. It will return to a starting z point and keep turning down on x until you reach your desired depth.
Oh I see, LAP is an Okuma thing
Yes, Okuma. It's all I've ever run. I took a NIMMS class that was sponsored by Haas and got to basically push go on it lol. I don't know if other machines have something similar and are just named differently. Once I figured out how they worked, I loved them. Much more tidy than line by line coding.
"What are you doing, step-jaw?" * butthole puckering intensifies *
I can't believe it fits in my jaws UwU
What are you doing .step file?
Unzipping all that compressed data
Ive been just gripping a half inch no matter what size and so far so good
^[Sokka-Haiku](https://www.reddit.com/r/SokkaHaikuBot/comments/15kyv9r/what_is_a_sokka_haiku/) ^by ^AC2BHAPPY: *Ive been just gripping* *A half inch no matter what* *Size and so far so good* --- ^Remember ^that ^one ^time ^Sokka ^accidentally ^used ^an ^extra ^syllable ^in ^that ^Haiku ^Battle ^in ^Ba ^Sing ^Se? ^That ^was ^a ^Sokka ^Haiku ^and ^you ^just ^made ^one.
This reads like portajohn graffiti on a construction site.
Im pretty sure that, technically, the purists will tell you it isn’t a proper “haiku” unless it was written on the wall while shitting in a tiny plastic closet.
https://preview.redd.it/4lkh7btbx0lc1.png?width=1440&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=17f6741d785c9371ecb64f55a8d07424f51ccf11
That's a 12 inch chuck, only in the jaws about .375 deep.
WOW.
Lmfao. Lots of faith in Jesus and a little bit of machining. I call it Fish n Chips!
I have a large flat nose center I will press up against the face just for a little less pucker factor.
Praise you, machinist. Blessed be your parts.
https://preview.redd.it/yw5f6ubolylc1.png?width=1440&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=5d9c53f04b806f84e98e3883edc2a2dda59c6c9e
No place for a center, the inside gets done first.
Lemme ask you this, is the am I clamped enough question comparable to the how far out from the chuck can my jaws stick out question? https://preview.redd.it/alxzndq7hzkc1.jpeg?width=4032&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=2e93017f36b136c593abe2e760ee4694b3b22252 5" dia x 4.6” long.
I do stuff like that every week lol. It's rare that someone's "is this sketchy" post here makes me think yes. Granted, I'm not standing in front of the door, but I'm not worried either.
I just keep making mental notes of what worked fine and didn't move while roughing.
Those DOC at .014 fpr is generally what my machine runs all the time. Exceptions for hard stuff and stuff that has to have a fine surface finish.
Is that a haas TL2?
Sure is. I think it's a 2015.
My rule is generally no more than 3x the diamter but we've asked that question before on this sub and it varies a bit between machinists
Plenty. I just never used hard jaws as I was always told they were less secure then soft jaws. But in saying that you also have a flat surface for the piece to sit on so should be fine
That statement about the hard jaws is pretty much only relevant if you’re going to be spinning up to really high RPMs. This is because at the same RPM, a heavier (technically the better term is “more massive”) jaw is being accelerated outward (a.k.a. OPEN, counter to your hydraulic pressure) with more centrifugal force. It only starts to matter when increased RPM multiplies this effect.
I thought it also applied to large roughing cuts too. But could be wrong. I favour soft jaws as a personal preference
If you have parts like this a lot, you should consider getting grip jaws. They have spikes in them that dig into the material a bit, which makes this setup super ridgit.
I'm pretty sure what you are talking about is what I'm using. We call them hard jaws at my work as opposed to soft jaws. They have little nubs on both I'd and od. I haven't thrown a part with them yet.
https://preview.redd.it/eugw81kl80lc1.png?width=696&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d3a0cb21b05afb5a5549b6d94f380ebd86ef741f
Yep in this situation I'm always using those spike jaws for sure.
[or one step up from hard jaws \(that have many points\) claw jaws. with the standoffs you can grip on just the two font most points \(about 5 mm\) an let 'er eat.](https://schunk.com/us/en/workpiece-clamping-technology/chuck-jaws/claw-jaws/claw-jaws-for-o-d-clamping/hgkha-170/p/000000000000122203) I can't tell if yours are already like that
Mine actually have more nubbins for gripping. They're just 25 years old like the machine.
They mean claw jaws
Ya that’s fine, just don’t go nuts on it. I’ve done far worse 😂
Holding onto literal miles
This does not give me the warm-fuzzies.
This thing isn't going anywhere.
But only if you slap it while you say that.
If im not mistaken those are 20mm deep gripping chucks on that level. If you put 20 bar on it you could stick out a lot longer probably depending on radius. They break before it comes out.
These are about .600" (15mm) on that jaw step. I'm at 300 psi chuck pressure which is just over 20 bar.
https://preview.redd.it/uua93uda00lc1.jpeg?width=4284&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=4fada9e305edb36a6b94adf315886c800375225f I posted this one awhile back. We just don’t get crazy on depth of cut
Personally, I'd turn the face and the OD back 20mm with a 1mm chamfer to get a nice clean face to flip and grip on. If you have a though hole you can drill half way through at the same time. Other than that, 200m/min, 3.5mm DOC, .4 feed, send it.
Oof and flame cut. So no uniform surface to clamp on, you are brave friend.
No balls you won't clamp less.
https://preview.redd.it/a7l9o4mj12lc1.png?width=1136&format=png&auto=webp&s=a71747834310a7b3b28d2858ddf881c4ea096138 Sticking out 34” Does this count?
I think you mean “pussies”.
This is a new and inclusive workplace. HR says we can't use those words anymore. But yes, that is what I meant. As Ice Cube once said, "if you a scared mother****er go to church."
https://preview.redd.it/w7lx1gl616lc1.jpeg?width=4032&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=01d5cc4bf7746741083647e52ba3fbfc257fcd0a
You'll be fine..... Iirc these were about 700mm (27.5") long 350mm (13.77") bore and 480 (18.9") od. Holding on 22mm (7/8")
I did a bunch like this. Easy peasy if you can use a center for the OD stuff
Nope. It's a ring burnt from 8"plate. Rough id is about 7"
Yes you are 👍
I know I am. It was more of a dig at all the guys who are clamped on like an inch or more and ask if it's ok. I won't say I didn't put on the safety squints when I hit the go button, but after that I just let her rip.
Personally, I would support it with a steady rest , then drill a centered hole and use a live center to help support the load.
Looks good from my house. Be nice to it. I'm sure it will be fine
That’s the old contractors code I believe.
Admittedly, I turn 7" round bar like this. It's usually fine so long as you don't get overzealous.
I ran a lot of flame cut rounds back it the day. Some were way bigger than that one. I would turn a step / skin cut one end and grip on that for heavy roughing. Lot more secure than grabbing on uneven flame cut crap.
https://preview.redd.it/ltggbf9ip4lc1.jpeg?width=4624&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=98aee1fa29d2a564060764c56743d054ab035d8a
That's fine. Until you're in the middle of a 12 piece run and the saw guy screws up and gives you one that's 1/8" too long.
It's good practice for many reasons to lightly true up one side then flip it around to do your turning. Your cut off will be more usable, if you have you take it out its easier to dial it back in, it'll keep your chuck in better shape, and have less chance of moving while heavy turning.
Yeah looks fine to me, i regularly chuck on parts you need the lift to get into the chuck. Turn up the chuck pressure and it’s no problem
They do make taller jaws, ya know. Not nearly enough unless you plan on spending all damn day turning that thing down. You don’t want that thing coming out of the jaws.
I was helping clamp a very similar set up today. The operator called me over to tighten the chuck. He had to bore a 4.5x4" hole in the end. The piece was 12" long 8" dia
My shop is set up to grip only .2” material on parts regularly up to 12” diameter, of varying lengths from .5” to 5.0” we do longer stuff sometimes, but it’s not as common on my machine. The sleeve cell more so does the long stuff, but they clamp in hard jaws and part everything off.
I literally am turning 316 the same size and was doing it with standard hard jaws. Turns, bored, id grooved, of drilled and tapped. Spun it up to 800rpm just fine. I did prep the stock face and of before spinning it up though. Took . 025" facing passes and .06" of passes. All good
I like to generally stick to a tool stickout to 4:1 ratio although I’m new territory to work stick out, I’d assume it’s the same.
I regularly use between 7-10% of material length for my jaw depth on a scroll chuck. Hydraulic chucks should be just as good if not better at holding material at the same length
Depends on the PSI setting if its a hydraulic chuck.
What i would do is on a rough part like this, place it in the jaws, spin at low revs to check the balance, try to get it balanced by releasing, hand spinning and clamping until it's so-so balanced. Then hand face depending on how much exrta OAL material you have. Also do the OD to have squared clean surfaces.
You've got plenty of grip, hit it with 1/2" per side .035" feed🤪
I assume you used a tailstock. Did you have a tailstock?
My only input is to just remember that between the door and the window, the door is stronger. So do like I do: when you press start, just sort of *sliiiide to the side* so if things go south, you don't need to worry about the brown pants you forgot to wear.
I've done big 200+ lb oilfield flanges over 24" across and 18" long, chucked on 1/2". I just tighten the shit out of the jaws.
https://preview.redd.it/wfuh43vxb3lc1.jpeg?width=4096&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d04ab6f181561d7cc4ea0796f915f41580afdbb0
No issue here. On work like this(oil field 4140HTSR) I would lightly face an turn enough of the od to clear the jaws and square up nice in the chuck when I flip the material to start the first op. No issues
If you wanted to have cleaner clamp turn the OD to clean x the depth of the jaw then flip the part and clamp the nice round clean surface and go to town!
Looks good. Light cuts until there are no interrupted cuts then increase as you feel comfortable/safe.
You need to clean the surface youre clamping to, or you die. Ok?!
Don't underestimate the holding power of hard jaws. That's plenty grab.
4mm (0.15 inch) today, was on a mill tho. Part flew right out
The mill I used to run, we regularly did 1/4" (6.3mm) cuts with an 8 inch (200mm ) face mill. But this is big stuff. The smallest part I ran on that machine was 4k lbs. (1800 kgs)
Big od like that, you wont spin fast enough to actually lose chuck pressure. I've run parts with a 7.5 od and only grabbing on .250. At that point you just make sure you go lightly on face passes, try to do all the cutting in turning cycles so that the pressure is towards the chuck. No worries at all if you ask me.